Paradox Interactive Thread: V2 The cartographers nightmare. - Games

[IMG]http://gamersgate.http.internapcdn.net/gamersgate/screenshots_img/DLC-CK2OG/367497_crusaderkings_theoldgods_screen_13_medium.jpg[/IMG] Anybody else think that the Pagans will be incredibly OP.. The 1st Caliphate will also be interesting.

[QUOTE=Rangergxi;40544149] Anybody else think that the Pagans will be incredibly OP.. The 1st Caliphate will also be interesting.[/QUOTE]The first two already collapsed a few centuries before TOG's start date though, Abbasid dynasty is the third caliphate you're thinking of.

I'm not worried that they'll be OP, I just think they should be pretty underpowered and in for a bit of strife. It should be an oddity and an accomplishment for the player to have Pagan nations succeed, like playing in the Caucuses or Anatolia and staying Christian, not something that's as easy as blobbing in EU3. Early game I can understand them being powerful but as tech moves forward they should fall behind, same as with the Hordes, and encounter all kinds of problems with the option to convert seeming like a damn good choice.

With their update to how technology spreading works, I suspect it will spread mainly between those of the same culture and then religion, allowing for christians and muslims to get and stay ahead tech wise when compared to pagans.

I just hope that the English kingdoms survive against the pagans in most games. Even if they are forced to convert, I don't want all of the British Isles to be of Norse culture in every game. But if they don't nerf republics a lot more I'll probably never play vanilla again. I'm sick of seeing Pisa owning all of the North African coast and Genoa owning half of Iberia.

[QUOTE=Kljunas;40545237]I just hope that the English kingdoms survive against the pagans in most games. Even if they are forced to convert, I don't want all of the British Isles to be of Norse culture in every game. But if they don't nerf republics a lot more I'll probably never play vanilla again. I'm sick of seeing Pisa owning all of the North African coast and Genoa owning half of Iberia.[/QUOTE] Bear in mind that the Saxons came in and did basically that, turning england into mostly saxon culture when the normans arrived. The nerf of the number of trade posts is pretty big, another nerf would be to change the way retinues work in general, making them half as big would be another step. However, they then would stand no real chance of lasting too long against the larger kingdoms around them.

[QUOTE=Kljunas;40545237]I just hope that the English kingdoms survive against the pagans in most games. Even if they are forced to convert, I don't want all of the British Isles to be of Norse culture in every game.[/QUOTE] I don't think Pagan nations actually conquest over-sea provinces. They just loot. Maybe I'm wrong.

[QUOTE=NicoleEmilid;40545436]I don't think Pagan nations actually conquest over-sea provinces. They just loot. Maybe I'm wrong.[/QUOTE] They've said they can conquer in the way that they did on Normandy historically, take a bit of land and gain it in exchange for swearing fealty to it's old liege. Since you're a vassal of that King now, he'll probably demand you convert so it may not be very effective at spreading Paganism.

[QUOTE=NicoleEmilid;40545436]I don't think Pagan nations actually conquest over-sea provinces. They just loot. Maybe I'm wrong.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?686849-Ulm-plays-Crusader-Kings-II-The-Old-Gods-as-Someone-Chapter-IV"]They do[/URL] (scroll down a bit, Wessex is the only Saxon kingdom left). Even if they couldn't, Jorvik/York is already Norse pagan when the game starts. EDIT: Apparently Wessex was actually the only Saxon kingdom that wasn't invaded by the great heathen army in real life. I didn't know the Danish invasions were that successful.

Converted my CK2 game finally. Aside from some oddballs like Wurttemberg in Norway and some other obscure country in Scotland (rebelling dukes), the conversion went smooth. Oh, there's a Ottoman Empire in the smack middle of Europe and Switzerland far off in the lands of Russia, but nothing can be perfect. [t]http://i.imgur.com/P7U71sw.jpg[/t]

[QUOTE=kamikaze470;40566967]Converted my CK2 game finally. Aside from some oddballs like Wurttemberg in Norway and some other obscure country in Scotland (rebelling dukes), the conversion went smooth. Oh, there's a Ottoman Empire in the smack middle of Europe and Switzerland far off in the lands of Russia, but nothing can be perfect. [t]http://i.imgur.com/P7U71sw.jpg[/t][/QUOTE] Zaporozhie in Iberia and Algeria. :v: Also what's the condition in Holy Roman Empire? Usually gets packed with oddballs on my end.

[QUOTE=croguy;40570442]Zaporozhie in Iberia and Algeria. :v: Also what's the condition in Holy Roman Empire? Usually gets packed with oddballs on my end.[/QUOTE]It's not too bizarre. Right off the bat I noticed Greek countries like Greece and Athens in there. Along with Nejd, Ethiopia (!), Portugal and Gotland being totally out of place. Where Ethopia should be, it's a weird combination of Yemen, Mazovia and Naxos instead, heh. [editline]8th May 2013[/editline] Hundred Years War, and not a moment too soon. [img]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7536024/vidya%20gaymes/bruns1.png[/img] Shit England, get it together. [img]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7536024/vidya%20gaymes/bruns2.png[/img]

I'm playing EU3 as England. Is inflation at 10.1 bad? I have it reduced by 0.02 every year.

[QUOTE=vizard38;40579303]I'm playing EU3 as England. Is inflation at 10.1 bad? I have it reduced by 0.02 every year.[/QUOTE]Yes very bad. Trim down your army and naval maintenance and hire the best Master of Mint you can. Get the National bank NI as well. It's not [I]too[/I] late to save yourself from awful doom. [editline]8th May 2013[/editline] Thirty Years War happened in my game, 200 years early. Too many x Years' Wars happening already, man.

[QUOTE=vizard38;40579303]I'm playing EU3 as England. Is inflation at 10.1 bad? I have it reduced by 0.02 every year.[/QUOTE] You should never get your inflation higher than 2.0. (And that 2.0 would only be received from an event)

Inflation has been handled really weirdly in Paradox games. IRL, your income should rise with inflation, but for some bizarre reason, this doesn't happen. Instead all the AI nations get poorer and poorer.

I object to this. Everything costs more because you are making your money/income less worth. You mint things and that costs inflation thus causing everything to become more expensieve. Like zimbabwe, 1 bread costs so much but this only means your money is worth less.

[QUOTE=Valiantttt;40580888]I object to this. Everything costs more because you are making your money/income less worth. You mint things and that costs inflation thus causing everything to become more expensieve. Like zimbabwe, 1 bread costs so much but this only means your money is worth less.[/QUOTE] Yes but when more money is flowing around the economy, everything increases in prices. This includes wages, more revenue from taxes, etc. Getting paid by the wheelbarrow in notes (literally).

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;40580997]Yes but when more money is flowing around the economy, everything increases in prices. This includes wages, more revenue from taxes, etc. Getting paid by the wheelbarrow in notes (literally).[/QUOTE] Robert Mugabe is a genius. Everybody in his country used to be poor working under the brutal white people but now they're all millionaires. It takes a brilliant man to change so much in 20 years. The Old Gods is look good so far but Venice seems to die off pretty fast from all of the Dev video's.

At least the paper makers and printers are doing well in Zimbabwe.

[QUOTE=Rangergxi;40581698]Robert Mugabe is a genius. Everybody in his country used to be poor working under the brutal white people but now they're all millionaires. It takes a brilliant man to change so much in 20 years. The Old Gods is look good so far but Venice seems to die off pretty fast from all of the Dev video's.[/QUOTE] People were whining so much about republics being OP that they made sure they wouldn't complain about it anymore.

But the complaints are legitimate, republics are OP. Hopefully this update/DLC will fix a lot of the balance issues. Baltic and Finnic pagans won't get annihilated instantly and the holy site mechanic will help the Sunni moral authority not to drop. Maybe the pagans will be somewhat OP in 867 but it looks like 1066 is going to be more balanced than it is right now.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;40580871]Inflation has been handled really weirdly in Paradox games. IRL, your income should rise with inflation, but for some bizarre reason, this doesn't happen. Instead all the AI nations get poorer and poorer.[/QUOTE]You have to draw the line where the realism factor stops, or else your fanbase wouldn't find the game very fun if they got inflation no matter what they did.

Did I ever tell you guys about the one EU3 game I was playing and how within ten years after starting, Austria inherited both ENGLAND AND HUNGARY

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;40580997]Yes but when more money is flowing around the economy, everything increases in prices. This includes wages, more revenue from taxes, etc. Getting paid by the wheelbarrow in notes (literally).[/QUOTE] that's not totally true. in cases of hyperinflation the wages don't rise as fast as prices generally which causes serious problems. also, inflation is a marker of other economic "disasters" which lower the ability of people to procure goods and services. if everything stayed consistent then inflation, hyperinflation, and deflation wouldn't be a problem at all.

I've actually never seen the Muslims do terribly well in most games. They generally get killed due to religious authority issues and then heresies divide them and destroy their empires. At best they invade Sicily and then are expelled by the HRE.

[QUOTE=Paul McCartney;40585029]Did I ever tell you guys about the one EU3 game I was playing and how within ten years after starting, Austria inherited both ENGLAND AND HUNGARY[/QUOTE] Ever seen Russia inherit Austria?

[QUOTE=Kljunas;40584052]But the complaints are legitimate, republics are OP. [/QUOTE] Have you played a Republic since the giant nerfing patch? Republics are not OP, historically Republics were incredibly powerful and influencial politically in Europe. The Lombard League defeated the HRE at the height of it's power and Venice basically took over huge chunks of the Byzantine Empire after the third crusades.

[QUOTE=Rangergxi;40587703]Have you played a Republic since the giant nerfing patch? Republics are not OP, historically Republics were incredibly powerful and influencial politically in Europe. The Lombard League defeated the HRE at the height of it's power and Venice basically took over huge chunks of the Byzantine Empire after the third crusades.[/QUOTE]I wouldn't exactly say Venice took over large parts of Byzantine territory, however most of the Latin Empire and various Crusader states comprised of the broken Eastern Roman Empire after the Crusade. Venice's Stato da Mar mainly consisted of some coastal areas along the Adriatic sea (some cities in Greece proper) and various island chains (notably the hub of the empire, Cyprus). But yeah Paradox did a somewhat good job modeling republics on their historical counterparts. They can still bully smaller kingdoms with moderate results and hold their ground for a while against the HRE for the first few legs of the game.

[QUOTE=Angus725;40587419]Ever seen Russia inherit Austria?[/QUOTE]I've seen Russia inherit the Mayans, but Austria? That's just crazy.