[QUOTE=Alice3173;45186743]Is there even any actual advantages to modding Ultimate Doom over Doom II? Doom II has the super shotgun and has a full 32 maps instead of 9 map episodes and a couple new enemies iirc.[/QUOTE]
doom 1 allows for proper episodes
Vanilla Doom 2 is just grimy and blah when it comes to level design. Every map just seems to be over saturated with brown and green and the actual architecture is just not really memorable at all, but the actual game has all new enemies and the super shotgun, so it's the best for modding.
Ultimate Doom is inverse. Great map design, all the maps being pretty engraved into my memory. I can find most of the secrets with no problem, and the actual color pallet is a lot more diverse. However, doesn't have any of the cool new stuff, so it balances out.
I prefer Doom 1 over 2 solely for the superior map design. Doom 2 is good for the super shotgun and new enemies, but I honestly hate fighting mancubi and revenants. I'd take fighting hordes of zombie men and sergeants over a handful of meat brick enemies any day.
I don't mind the new monsters, except the arch-vile and pain elementals.
However I still prefer Doom 1's level design. It's far more atmospheric.
Hacx's level design is good in general but the quality fluctuates along the spectrum from "better than Doom" to abysmal. The [sp]cyberspace[/sp] levels were the worst. Map10 hurt my eyes.
One thing I hate about a lot of fan-made wads is that a good chunk of them LOVE to use loads of hit scanners in one area, rendering you helpless to just get pot-shot to death. It's usually an area full of commandos too.
The stuff people do architecturally with the older Doom games makes me never want to get anywhere in mapping, it just doesn't even seem fair. :v:
[t]http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/692/sundermap083.jpg[/t][t]http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/5093/sundermap064.jpg[/t]
[t]http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/4898/sundermap053.jpg[/t][t]http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/9350/sunderhagsnew1.jpg[/t]
[t]http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/4572/sundermap111.jpg[/t][t]http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/5157/sundermap121e.jpg[/t]
[t]http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/6830/sundermap143.jpg[/t][t]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y8WoJeZ-J4c/TQb2jyq7RoI/AAAAAAAAB8o/blFBIw03shU/s640/Screenshot_Doom_20101213_232431.png[/t]
(All of those except the last green-ish one taken from Sunder.wad.)
[t][/t][t][/t]
[QUOTE=Doom14;45188075]The stuff people do architecturally with the older Doom games makes me never want to get anywhere in mapping, it just doesn't even seem fair. :v:
-images-
(All of those except the last green-ish one taken from Sunder.wad.)
[/QUOTE]
There are a lot of really good Doom mappers out there that make some really awesome architecture for their maps that make my maps look like piles of shit in comparison.
[url]https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLE0AE2E576F2AD08E[/url]
Fucking doom mappers man. I can map for a 3d engine and make pretty nice and detailed geometry for something like Quake, but there's no way in hell i'd be able to achieve the same for doom. It's amazing what those guys do with a 2.5d engine.
[QUOTE=Xubs;45188011]
Nothing official has ever surpassed the level design of the mods that have been made for Doom, especially Doom 2. Not even the newer games.[/QUOTE]
To be fair, we have more capable versions of the engine and better tools than what id had to work with 20 years ago.
I really want Romero to get over his worries and learn to use the custom stuff for doom and make some maps for it
I don't care if they don't turn out great, that would be so cool
[QUOTE=Doom14;45188075]The stuff people do architecturally with the older Doom games makes me never want to get anywhere in mapping, it just doesn't even seem fair. :v:[/QUOTE]
While I do think this sort of stuff is impressive, I personally can't stand playing wads that jam pack as much architectural detail into their maps as they can. When I'm playing doom I want simple spaces that are both easy on the eyes and easy to run around in. I know most people would disagree with this since most people think the original doom maps have aged poorly and look ugly compared to what modders are doing nowadays, but I just strongly prefer that original style of mapping. ( Speaking purely about Ultimate Doom, not Doom 2. )
I can't speak for the wad you posted pics of in particular, but I've played plenty before that really choke out their maps with unnecessary details and trims and you're constantly clipping into shit and it really just ruins the run and gun gameplay.
I enjoy the more detailed levels. They don't have to be super detailed, but I like enough detail that I can tell what the map is trying to be, like Hellbound does. Doom 1 has a pretty good balance between simple and still being able to identify what the hell you're inside; I never liked Doom 2's maps because they were too abstract and weird.
i never expected people to praise doom64. ight be an issue with skipping it completely back in the day.
[QUOTE=Mysterious;45167891]The Doom 3 shotgun was the least satisfying FPS shotgun in existence. That's my main gripe :v:[/QUOTE]
You cant find more castrated (in every manner) shotgun from any game.
[QUOTE=Mysterious;45188010]It's usually an area full of commandos too.[/QUOTE]
Who the hell is a commando? Do you mean the Sergeant?
Speaking of community levels, am I the only one who hates Scythe 2?
[QUOTE=ZeroTimesCookie;45191042]Who the hell is a commando? Do you mean the Sergeant?[/QUOTE]
No, I'm pretty sure he means the heavy weapon dude, aka, those big red bastards with chainguns.
[QUOTE=Fuxed;45191051]No, I'm pretty sure he means the heavy weapon dude, aka, those big red bastards with chainguns.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure they're called "Heavy Weapons Dude", at least according to Doom 2's ending screen.
[QUOTE=ZeroTimesCookie;45191095]I'm pretty sure they're called "Heavy Weapons Dude", at least according to Doom 2's ending screen.[/QUOTE]
In the Doom 2's manual they are referred to as Former commandos, so he does mean the chaingunners.
[QUOTE=OffTheRoad;45191116]In the Doom 2's manual they are referred to as Former commandos, so he does mean the chaingunners.[/QUOTE]
That's weird and inconsistent. Ah well.
Still, I don't get why people like Scythe 2.
Can anyone tell me of some decent map packs for use with brutal doom?
Look for the easier stuff - bdoom buffs the enemies, makes 'em faster and deadlier, so the stuff you could consider normal difficulty or kinda hard but manageable in vanilla Doom can be downright unbeatable with bdoom. avoid stuff like deus vult, basically
[QUOTE=Jebediah;45191270]Can anyone tell me of some decent map packs for use with brutal doom?[/QUOTE]
Alien Vendetta on ultra-violence. It was... challenging.
Community Chest 4 is p good with brutal.
[QUOTE=ZeroTimesCookie;45191120]That's weird and inconsistent. Ah well.
Still, I don't get why people like Scythe 2.[/QUOTE]
scythe 2 is the shit! i cant get why you dont like it if you dont like slaughter, but if you do its so good
[QUOTE=OffTheRoad;45191116]In the Doom 2's manual they are referred to as Former commandos, so he does mean the chaingunners.[/QUOTE]
I like to call em snipers, cuz they will fucking pop you from clean across the map.
[editline]23rd June 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Jebediah;45191270]Can anyone tell me of some decent map packs for use with brutal doom?[/QUOTE]
You oughta try brutalized doom if you haven't. It's a complete overhaul of the Doom 1 episodes and Doom 2, really hard though. I'm talkin like 350 monsters on e1m1. Doom 2 the way Id did also plays pretty well with bdoom.
[QUOTE=Mike Tyson;45191918]scythe 2 is the shit! i cant get why you dont like it if you dont like slaughter, but if you do its so good[/QUOTE]
It's just borderline bullshit. I had this argument on YouTube and apparently I'm a "noob" (cringe) because I find TEN FUCKING ARCH-VILLES IN ONE ROOM difficult.
Seriously. What the fuck. I always play Doom on Ultra-Violence btw, so yeah.
Hell, I even did it on COOP a second time, and we STILL couldn't do it. The maps though are really good, they are just ruined by the bullshit difficulty.
[QUOTE=CountChocula651;45192024]You oughta try [B]brutalized doom[/B] if you haven't.[/QUOTE]
Oh god, this shit completely destroyed my nerves.
[QUOTE=ZeroTimesCookie;45192101]It's just borderline bullshit. I had this argument on YouTube and apparently I'm a "noob" (cringe) because I find TEN FUCKING ARCH-VILLES IN ONE ROOM difficult.
Seriously. What the fuck. I always play Doom on Ultra-Violence btw, so yeah.
Hell, I even did it on COOP a second time, and we STILL couldn't do it. The maps though are really good, they are just ruined by the bullshit difficulty.[/QUOTE]
thats the whole point, theyre slaughter maps
they wouldnt be a slaughter map if they didnt have monsters everywhere lol
[QUOTE=Mike Tyson;45192164]thats the whole point, theyre slaughter maps
they wouldnt be a slaughter map if they didnt have monsters everywhere lol[/QUOTE]
I guess me and my friend just don't like those kind of maps.
Which is a shame because I really wanted to beat it legit because the design is oh so good.
It's become a joke between my friend and I actually. Whenever my friend says that something is bullshit in terms of difficulty, I just put my mouth real close to the microphone and whisper "SCYTHE2.WAD."
He always replies "We don't talk about SCYTHE2.WAD."
[QUOTE=Mike Tyson;45192164]thats the whole point, theyre slaughter maps
they wouldnt be a slaughter map if they didnt have monsters everywhere lol[/QUOTE]
Even for a slaughter map, 10 arch-viles in one room is a bit too much
How do you even deal with that
You think Scythe's bad, I cry myself to sleep every night over CHILLAX.WAD.
It's a little bit much even with Russian Overkill.
There's slaughtermaps, and then there's Chillax.
If your idea of mapping is "plagiarizing from other WADs and just cramming as many cyberdemons and archviles and revenants into one place as possible," it's the WAD for you.
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