[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47767368]
[url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/alternate-classes/ninja]Oh fuck[/url][/QUOTE]
There's only two [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/arcanist]real[/url] [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/brawler]choices[/url] in PF
[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;47767368]It's also worth noting that pretty much all stuff for Pathfinder (which is similar to D&D's 3rd edition) can be found here:
[url]www.d20pfsrd.com[/url]
[editline]20th May 2015[/editline]
[url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/alternate-classes/ninja]Oh fuck[/url][/QUOTE]
more like:
useless underpowered playerclass
Okay so the first arc of our M&M game Trooper ran ended recently and I made some things
I linked them because they're kinda big
[url]http://puu.sh/hJeJB/b0b74f2556.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2TA/c99ddf4533.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2SI/c38073f04e.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2T5/48c508d347.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ35A/0042ad18e2.png[/url]
[QUOTE=Rents;47767654]There's only two [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/arcanist]real[/url] [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/brawler]choices[/url] in PF[/QUOTE]
[url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/slayer]Slayer[/url] is better, more versatile and mechanically effective too.
so
ran a 52 spaceship battle in Rogue Trader
and actually finished it in only a single session
probably because I pre-rolled all the NPC on NPC combat (which was about half)
[QUOTE=FetchingToaster;47768472]Okay so the first arc of our M&M game Trooper ran ended recently and I made some things
I linked them because they're kinda big
[url]http://puu.sh/hJeJB/b0b74f2556.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2TA/c99ddf4533.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2SI/c38073f04e.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ2T5/48c508d347.png[/url]
[url]http://puu.sh/hJ35A/0042ad18e2.png[/url][/QUOTE]
Can't forget the beautiful title screen and logo I'm still proud of to this day. All in the spirit of JJBA.
[thumb]http://puu.sh/hUR09/58d08a6fd2.png[/thumb]
[QUOTE=cdr248;47768303]more like:
useless underpowered playerclass[/QUOTE]
who gives a shit about being underpowered
really being intentionally OP is so fucking overrated it's unreal
I enjoy it from just a nerdy designing perspective but in actual play it's boring as shit
So, I got a D&D Basic Book from 1991. And it includes classes of Thief, Magic User, and Dwarf.
Yes.
[QUOTE=SiberysTranq;47768668]who gives a shit about being underpowered
really being intentionally OP is so fucking overrated it's unreal
I enjoy it from just a nerdy designing perspective but in actual play it's boring as shit[/QUOTE]
From my experience, other PF players are probably going to be playing "efficient" builds while you end up as the dead weight. Unless you got a party that's on the same level of power or you got a radical GM, you're not going to have a fun time mechanics wise.
[QUOTE=cdr248;47768851]From my experience, other PF players are probably going to be playing "efficient" builds while you end up as the dead weight. Unless you got a party that's on the same level of power or you got a radical GM, you're not going to have a fun time mechanics wise.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely this, I'm playing an intentionally underpowered Cavalier in a party of tight, optimized builds and lemme tell you, the novelty of a "intentionally underpowered" character wears off before the end of Session 1.
It's not even an issue of the other characters being better than yours, it's an issue with pulling your weight when a bandit or demon finally decides it's time to smack you around a bit.
Besides, throwing a 7 in Charisma or Intelligence is just an opportunity to explain why your character's dumb or very unapproachable/boorish.
So I got Apocalypse World and about two other people want to actually play it with me. Would anybody be interested? Probably looking for about 2-3 more people. Dunno where we'd play it.
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;47768615][url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/slayer]Slayer[/url] is better, more versatile and mechanically effective too.[/QUOTE]
Or you could punch people, like a real man.
[QUOTE=cdr248;47768851]From my experience, other PF players are probably going to be playing "efficient" builds while you end up as the dead weight. Unless you got a party that's on the same level of power or you got a radical GM, you're not going to have a fun time mechanics wise.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, PF's main mechanical issue is that it's made for people who played 3.5, which means the monster manual and adventure paths all assume you have a good idea of what you're doing, which means even in homebrew games people who play PF a lot aim for that level of power.
If you're new to the game it is very easy to make bad choices and have a character who's worse than someone else in the party at everything.
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;47768906]Absolutely this, I'm playing an intentionally underpowered Cavalier in a party of tight, optimized builds and lemme tell you, the novelty of a "intentionally underpowered" character wears off before the end of Session 1.
It's not even an issue of the other characters being better than yours, it's an issue with pulling your weight when a bandit or demon finally decides it's time to smack you around a bit.
Besides, throwing a 7 in Charisma or Intelligence is just an opportunity to explain why your character's dumb or very unapproachable/boorish.[/QUOTE]
one issue I have is when there's a clear imbalance of experience levels in a party. Like, you have 3 people who it's their first time ever playing d&d, 2 who are semi experienced, and then you have the 1 master d&d campaign player who min maxes their build with maximum points in CHA and CON giving him more health than our paladin, and I'm just sat here thinking [I]"what?"[/I]
Yeah, you need a GM that'll tell people to tone it down or give pointers to less experienced players as needed when making characters, PF isn't really a game where people can just show up with sheets and play, party balance is important to make sure everyone has a niche and can contribute.
[QUOTE=gufu;47768676]So, I got a D&D Basic Book from 1991. And it includes classes of Thief, Magic User, and Dwarf.
Yes.[/QUOTE]
Tring to remeber which of the old book had the very in depth and well characterized class of "Fighting Man"
[QUOTE=thisguy123;47770570]Tring to remeber which of the old book had the very in depth and well characterized class of "Fighting Man"[/QUOTE]
That was the very original D&D from way back in the mid seventies.
Fighting Man, Magic User and Cleric were the three playable classes in the basic set.
[QUOTE=elowin;47770670]That was the very original D&D from way back in the mid seventies.
Fighting Man, Magic User and Cleric were the three playable classes in the basic set.[/QUOTE]
To which they later added Elf who could choose to act as a FIGHTING MAN or a MAGIC USER during a session, and could do both but would then gain no xp. Then PRIESTS and HALFLINGS and DWARVES. The best class, Dwarves.
[QUOTE=ThatSprite;47770082]one issue I have is when there's a clear imbalance of experience levels in a party. Like, you have 3 people who it's their first time ever playing d&d, 2 who are semi experienced, and then you have the 1 master d&d campaign player who min maxes their build with maximum points in CHA and CON giving him more health than our paladin, and I'm just sat here thinking [I]"what?"[/I][/QUOTE]
You wanna see some inexperience and party imbalance?
[QUOTE]Male half-elf paladin 1
LG Medium humanoid (elf, human)
[b]Hero Points [/b]1
[b]Init [/b]-6; [b]Senses [/b]low-light vision; Perception +1
--------------------
[b]Defense[/b]
--------------------
[b]AC [/b]23, touch 10, flat-footed 23 (+8 armor, +5 shield)
[b]hp [/b]33 (1d10+3)
[b]Fort [/b]+7, [b]Ref [/b]+1, [b]Will [/b]+1; +2 vs. enchantments
[b]DR [/b]Armor Focus, Heavy; [b]Immune [/b]sleep
--------------------
[b]Offense[/b]
--------------------
[b]Speed [/b]20 ft. (10 ft. in armor)
[b]Melee [/b]cold iron masterwork longsword +4 (1d8+4/19-20) or
. . gauntlet (from armor) +3 (1d3+4) or
. . unarmed strike +3 (1d3+4 nonlethal)
[b]Special Attacks [/b]smite evil 1/day (+4 attack and AC, +1 damage)
[b]Paladin Spell-Like Abilities[/b] (CL 0th; concentration +4)
. . At will—detect evil
--------------------
[b]Statistics[/b]
--------------------
[b]Str [/b]18, [b]Dex [/b]10, [b]Con [/b]18, [b]Int [/b]10, [b]Wis [/b]8, [b]Cha [/b]18
[b]Base Atk [/b]+1; [b]CMB [/b]+5; [b]CMD [/b]15
[b]Feats [/b]Additional Traits, Armor Focus, Heavy, Channel Smite, Extra Channel, Shield Focus, Skill Focus, Tower Shield Proficiency
[b]Traits [/b]deft dodger, forlorn, resilient, sacred touch
[b]Flaws [/b]Frail, Inattentive, Shaky, Slow, Unreactive
[b]Skills [/b]Acrobatics -10 (-18 to jump), Diplomacy +8, Heal +3, Perception +1, Spellcraft +4, Survival -1 (+1 to avoid becoming lost when using this);[b] Racial Modifiers [/b]+2 Perception
[b]Languages [/b]Common, Elven
[b]SQ [/b]elf blood, hero points
[b]Other Gear [/b]half-plate, tower shield, cold iron masterwork longsword, backpack, belt pouch, blanket, bullseye lantern, chain (10 ft.), compass, flint and steel, torch, masterwork, trail rations (8)
--------------------
[b]Tracked Resources[/b]
--------------------
Action Points 1d6 (5/level) - 0/5
Extra Channel (2/day) - 0/2
Smite Evil (1/day) (Su) - 0/1
Trail rations - 0/8
--------------------
[b]Special Abilities[/b]
--------------------
[b]Armor Focus, Heavy[/b] Gain DR 2/– in heavy armor.
[b]Channel Smite[/b] Channel energy can be delivered through a Smite attack.
[b]Compass[/b] +2 circumstance for Survival or Knowledge (Dungeoneering) to avoid becoming lost.
[b]Detect Evil (At will) (Sp)[/b] You can use detect evil at will (as the spell).
[b]Elf Blood[/b] Half-elves count as both elves and humans for any effect related to race.
[b]Elven Immunities - Sleep[/b] You are immune to magic sleep effects.
[b]Hero Points[/b] Hero Points can be spent at any time to grant a variety of bonuses.
[b]Low-Light Vision[/b] See twice as far as a human in low light, distinguishing color and detail.
[b]Sacred Touch[/b] You were exposed to a potent source of positive energy as a child, perhaps by being born under the right cosmic sign, or maybe because one of your parents was a gifted healer. As a standard action, you may automatically stabilize a dying creature merely by touching it.
[b]Shield Focus[/b] +1 Shield AC
[b]Smite Evil (1/day) (Su)[/b] +4 to hit, +1 to damage, +4 deflection bonus to AC when used.[/QUOTE]
He also took a [I]stacking[/I] -4 attack penalty when
1) Attacking/being-attacked-by obviously female opponents
2) Attacking/being-attacked-by opponents without weapons (Unarmed and Natural Attacks do not count as a weapon for this purpose -- meaning he takes the penalty against these)
3) Attacking/being-attacked-by opponents that have not formally challenged him to a duel
4) Attacking/being-attacked-by more than one opponent at a time
5) Attacking/being-attacked-by opponents that aren't using honorable weapons (Longsword and pretty much nothing else)
6) Using any weapon other than his personal Longsword
He also:
1) Could not Withdraw from combat, ever
2) Had an effective [B]movement speed of 5ft[/B] in almost every circumstance
By the end of everything he had somewhere close to -20 to attack in most circumstances. I have never seen someone fuck up their Flaws so bad. And that's still not as bad as the first Paladin he brought, which literally had nothing but a sword and armor in a pitch black environment, teamed up with Darkvision users.
He lost over 3 characters in one dungeon before finally quitting. I tried to help him along, but there's only so much GM Fiat I can give when your character is that subpar. The worst part is he knows the rules, he clearly just wasn't paying any attention and rushed his characters. Still irritates me that it took two characters before he finally brought a torch for the same damn dungeon after I explained he wouldn't be finding any inside and his party makeup were using Darkvision.
Found this amusing. The Shadowrun 4e Core Rulebook has an example Matrix Game by the name of "Killing Floor." Not sure if this was before or after the video game.
[QUOTE=Alxnotorious;47779722]Found this amusing. The Shadowrun 4e Core Rulebook has an example Matrix Game by the name of "Killing Floor." Not sure if this was before or after the video game.[/QUOTE]
it was way before the game, about the same time as the mod
I've been inflicted with some major hype for future miniarcs in my Magical Burst game. I'm planning on breaking away from the main cast of PCs for a session or two at some point and jumping them over to some random grunts from the private military of a big name guy they're well aware of and have dealt with before.
It'll basically be a break from RP in place of some sweet room clearing scenarios. They'll be the magical equivalent of a FEAR team. The MAGI - Magical Assault General Interceptors.
Just imagine a SWAT team going room to room shooting monsters and shit. It'll be awesome. I'm gonna write up a bunch of stats, numbers, items and other stuff soon as I get home from work.
Do most people nowadays RP over the internet via Roll20? That's the impression I get since when I get back with my RP buddies we just mostly talk about doing it over the net instead of meeting somewhere.
[QUOTE=Black;47782816]Do most people nowadays RP over the internet via Roll20? That's the impression I get since when I get back with my RP buddies we just mostly talk about doing it over the net instead of meeting somewhere.[/QUOTE]
It's a lot easier to get time to be at your home for 4+ hours than to arrange a good day to go to somewhere else to host a game for a while. I like in-person games but neither I nor any of my friends have the time to actually do an in-person game anymore.
I want to run a game. However most of my friends are busy, and I don't want to get randoms off the internet because I'm a terrible GM and I can't give them the experience they deserve. :(
[QUOTE=Black;47782816]Do most people nowadays RP over the internet via Roll20? That's the impression I get since when I get back with my RP buddies we just mostly talk about doing it over the net instead of meeting somewhere.[/QUOTE]
I almost exclusively do Paper and Pencil games at a table in person, as the internet alternatives really limit expressiveness and proper roleplaying in many ways.
I do however do some Roll20 stuff with people who I know, but I would always recommend voice chat being the main method of communication rather than typing for the aforementioned reasons.
Also you can't bum pizza and beer off of people over the internet, so that sucks.
[QUOTE=Axznma;47773013]You wanna see some inexperience and party imbalance?
[B]Feats Additional Traits, Armor Focus, Heavy, Channel Smite, Extra Channel, Shield Focus, Skill Focus, Tower Shield Proficiency[/B][/QUOTE]
How does he have so many feats? he's lvl 1 right?
[QUOTE=Zernbrog;47784601]How does he have so many feats? he's lvl 1 right?[/QUOTE]
Probably from all those flaws.
[QUOTE=Zernbrog;47784601]How does he have so many feats? he's lvl 1 right?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Axznma;47773013]I have never seen someone fuck up their Flaws so bad.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/characterFlaws.htm"]Flaws[/URL].
1 Flaw = 1 feat
I don't limit the amount of flaws they can take, as far as I'm concerned if they want to gimp the shit out of something to get the feats than that's their tax. He's an exception but my other players use their Flaws to fund Feats for their flavor usually. We also have 2000+ feats to pick from and they'd never get used if I stuck with the standard rules on it. In addition to that, with a front loaded number of Feats they can experiment in a less restrictive environment without having to wait a dozen levels to see how their concept might turn out -- something I'm always in favor of.
We tend to stay in the same level for a very long time too and they need to be capable of doing [I]something[/I] at level 1. My primary party has been level 1 since 2013 just about, although some of that was due to stretches of time without play. They're soon to be level 2 though! I promised them after their current adventure the levels would come quicker, not that they've ever complained anyway.
They also probably wouldn't survive to their next level with standard feat allowances. :v:
But as to my mentioned player, he went extreme with his Flaw selection and ended up with that gimp character. I've since changed most of the Flaws (which were originally taken from another source) since they were so bad that no one could ever justify taking them.
An example of common Flaws, usually used for characters that won't use something by design (like a caster that refuses to engage in melee; take Flaws that reduce your melee attack rolls to get Feats to support the casting):
[t]http://i.imgur.com/Jszshnd.png[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/tq7Akgj.png[/t]
Flavor Flaws are generally less used because they're much more indirect in consequences (more far reaching most of the time too). These are the ones I've had to rework the most because they were too punishing.
Like this Flaw for example:
[t]http://i.imgur.com/Sob8K8V.png[/t]
Originally this Flaw simply stated if you drank any kind of potion, any at all, you would become nauseated for the rest of the day and the potion would fail. It had no real reason for it and specifically stated even positive effect potions would fail to work (and still make you sick). No one ever took this Flaw. The long term implications of it are ridiculous, and it's just a boring Flaw to begin with. Might've been different if it had some kind of "wild" mechanics to it, like rolling on a table to see what the potion does to you with a very small chance of the positive effect occurring.
It was a shit Flaw that no one was ever going to take so I just changed it to the current version. In fact I still need to do a pass over on some of them, and finish making the other half I already had listed. Just too lazy to bother. Been trying to work away from straight Flaws and more toward exchanges anyways, like these:
[t]http://i.imgur.com/hyUg40U.png[/t]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/lLEPw2h.png[/t]
Those two have been used quite a lot recently with a lot of characters coming from desert backgrounds. Haven't had much of a chance to make use of those modifiers but my players have been using them as an excuse to role play discomfort and ineffectiveness in their currently frosty environment -- some of them have even requested additional penalties to reflect this. Mechanics feeding roleplay feeding mechanics, it always makes me happy.
I've also just now noticed that those last two are written like dog shit. There should at least be "the" before cold at the end (possibly heat too, though it's passable as-is), and even that reads like garbage. The modifier values are also reversed order, with heat having the heat modifier on top and cold having the heat modifier on the bottom. That's inconstant and might cause confusion when reading. Ugh, really do need to get on that pass over.
[editline]23rd May 2015[/editline]
On another note, I never gave thought to level 1200 dragons being "low tier" in D&D but apparently [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?268666-3-5E-Nehaschimic-Dragons"]that's a thing[/URL] for some groups.
[QUOTE=Axznma;47785472]We tend to stay in the same level for a very long time too and they need to be capable of doing [I]something[/I] at level 1. My primary party has been level 1 since 2013 just about, although some of that was due to stretches of time without play. They're soon to be level 2 though! I promised them after their current adventure the levels would come quicker, not that they've ever complained anyway.[/QUOTE]
not to insult the way you play the game or anything, but OH GODS WHY
i can understand keeping the players at roughly the same level of power for most of the game... just not in Dungeons and Dragons, where you can't progress at all without becoming straight up more powerful
no progression at all for that long is just awful
[QUOTE=Axznma;47785472]On another note, I never gave thought to level 1200 dragons being "low tier" in D&D but apparently [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?268666-3-5E-Nehaschimic-Dragons"]that's a thing[/URL] for some groups.[/QUOTE]
and oh god please never mention anything related to the Immortals Handbook again or i'll get a permanent aneurysm from the sheer stupidity that it is
[QUOTE=elowin;47785787]
and oh god please never mention anything related to the Immortals Handbook again or i'll get a permanent aneurysm from the sheer stupidity that it is[/QUOTE]
[url]http://www.somethingawful.com/dungeons-and-dragons/epic-level-insanity/1/[/url]
what is this i don't even
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