The Elder Scrolls Megathread XV: A Song of Ice and Draugr - Games

[QUOTE=Cypher_09;41440930]please no guns, I fucking love bows and arrows[/QUOTE] Oh look, what is this? It appears to a in-period sketch of mercenaries during the mid-1600's using bows [I]alongside firearms[/I] during a time when matchlock firearms were the mainstay of many armies. [t]http://www.slightlyoffkilter.net/kilthistory/files/Scottish_mercenaries_in_the_Thirty_Years_War.jpg[/t] Could it be that maybe, contrary to popular uninformed opinion, bows, crossbows and matchlocks were all used alongside each other for the first 400 years of firearm technology? Maybe, just maybe it's possible to intelligently implement early firearms into the fantasy genre without causing a disaster? They did it in real life after all, all the trained and skilled archers and crossbowmen didn't seem to have a problem with their own superior rate of fire and greater degree of reliability

Seen as overhaul mods can't be combined and I'm about to start a new playthrough after my 187 hours of playtime without the DLC as I purchased them in the steam sale. What overhaul mod would you recommend I utilize?

-snip for a post made in god knows what state of mind I was in-

[QUOTE=hypno-toad;41443401]Oh look, what is this? It appears to a in-period sketch of mercenaries during the mid-1600's using bows [I]alongside firearms[/I] during a time when matchlock firearms were the mainstay of many armies. [t]http://www.slightlyoffkilter.net/kilthistory/files/Scottish_mercenaries_in_the_Thirty_Years_War.jpg[/t] Could it be that maybe, contrary to popular uninformed opinion, bows, crossbows and matchlocks were all used alongside each other for the first 400 years of firearm technology? Maybe, just maybe it's possible to intelligently implement early firearms into the fantasy genre without causing a disaster? They did it in real life after all, all the trained and skilled archers and crossbowmen didn't seem to have a problem with their own superior rate of fire and greater degree of reliability[/QUOTE] When the gun was introduced, bows and crossbows became very obsolete within a hundred years. The only nations who still used them were generally poor and could not afford them on mass for their peasantry or professional military. The reason being as you probably know, using a crossbow and bow took considerable arm strength and training to use, a musket was easy to load, aim and shoot accurately without any major training required. But as you have been saying, I'd like to see gun powder weapons in an advanced Elder scrolls game, even the introduction of them.

Can't get any more steampunk than dwarven ruins anyway

[QUOTE=Vasili;41444501]When the gun was introduced, bows and crossbows became very obsolete within a hundred years. The only nations who still used them were generally poor and could not afford them on mass for their peasantry or professional military. The reason being as you probably know, using a crossbow and bow took considerable arm strength and training to use, a musket was easy to load, aim and shoot accurately without any major training required. But as you have been saying, I'd like to see gun powder weapons in an advanced Elder scrolls game, even the introduction of them.[/QUOTE] Well, early firearms were very inaccurate, unreliable and unpredictable. The matchlock relied on a burning piece of rope which a bit of rain or a strong gust of wind would put out and if the user put in just a put a bit too much powder it could explode. I'd say if it was implemented, it would have to be a bargain of a powerful shot which can go through armour easily but slow to reload, wouldn't fire in certain conditions and possibility of exploding (A perk to negate that would be cool actually)

[QUOTE=crazycombine;41444672]Well, early firearms were very inaccurate, unreliable and unpredictable.[/quote] That's always been a bit of a myth. The typical short range scenarios people fought made them decent, but they had long reload times and only useful in volley fire formations. However what made them popular was just how easy they were to use compared to bows or crossbows; [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-DGGS202HQ[/media]

Well, i look at old muskets and think they must be fucking awful to use. Slower than crossbows, messier than crossbows, less reliable than crossbows, Unable to be used in all weathers... Maybe people only used them because they liked the feel of them and loud noises? Cannons seem like an upgrade over the giant siege/ship crossbows. Unless of course those large bows pierce pretty well...does anyone know the piercing power of a big ballista?

Anybody else find Skyrim's volume really low? I have my windows volume maxed, all sliders in skyrim maxed, and the dial on my headset is all the way up, and yet it sounds like other games do at half volume.

[QUOTE=The Jack;41445018]Well, i look at old muskets and think they must be fucking awful to use. Slower than crossbows, messier than crossbows, less reliable than crossbows, Unable to be used in all weathers... Maybe people only used them because they liked the feel of them and loud noises? Cannons seem like an upgrade over the giant siege/ship crossbows. Unless of course those large bows pierce pretty well...does anyone know the piercing power of a big ballista?[/QUOTE] Ballista's were meant to be used on foot soldiers really, even against ships they didn't do much, a bow and arrow with arrows on fire was what they used until cannons. I'm pretty sure lore-wise they'd just use fire spells on ships... Actually I don't think its ever been mentioned how naval battles work in TES Lore

[QUOTE=Bloodshot12;41445065]Anybody else find Skyrim's volume really low? I have my windows volume maxed, all sliders in skyrim maxed, and the dial on my headset is all the way up, and yet it sounds like other games do at half volume.[/QUOTE] Yeah, open \Documents\My Games\Skyrim\SkyrimPrefs.ini , find fAudioMasterVolume and change it to 2 or higher. Then you can use the other sliders in game to change the volume more precisely

[QUOTE=Bloodshot12;41445065]Anybody else find Skyrim's volume really low? I have my windows volume maxed, all sliders in skyrim maxed, and the dial on my headset is all the way up, and yet it sounds like other games do at half volume.[/QUOTE] Go to your speakers' properties and tick (or untick, basically make it the opposite) the Loudness Equalization [img]http://i.imgur.com/IgQFkaj.png[/img] [editline]14th July 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Thunderbolt;41445225]Yeah, open \Documents\My Games\Skyrim\SkyrimPrefs.ini , find fAudioMasterVolume and change it to 2 or higher. Then you can use the other sliders in game to change the volume more precisely[/QUOTE] or this? Never knew about this trick :v:

[QUOTE=The Jack;41445018]Well, i look at old muskets and think they must be fucking awful to use. Slower than crossbows, messier than crossbows, less reliable than crossbows, Unable to be used in all weathers... Maybe people only used them because they liked the feel of them and loud noises? Cannons seem like an upgrade over the giant siege/ship crossbows. Unless of course those large bows pierce pretty well...does anyone know the piercing power of a big ballista?[/QUOTE] Because a round ball of lead travelling 350 meters per second fucking fucks you up. They shattered bones, caused massive trauma to more than just the immediate area of penetration, masked you in smoke for as long as it took to reload, and required less practice to use effectively. Also lead is soft, cheaply smelted, and the shape was easier to produce in large quantities relative to arrows.

[QUOTE=Vasili;41444501]When the gun was introduced, bows and crossbows became very obsolete within a hundred years. The only nations who still used them were generally poor and could not afford them on mass for their peasantry or professional military.[/QUOTE] And...? Gustavus Adolphus was hiring Scottish mercenaries by the thousands, many of whom were skirmishers and archers. and he kicked the shit out of the continental armies of Europe. As well as that, Crossbowmen were frequent among Scandinavian mercenaries on both sides of the thirty years war. It wasn't until 1700 that flintlocks became reliable and affordable enough to actually make bows and crossbows obsolete, at which point gun and cannon had been around for over 300 years on the European battlefield. [editline]13th July 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Kommodore;41445474]Because a round ball of lead travelling 350 meters per second fucking fucks you up. They shattered bones, caused massive trauma to more than just the immediate area of penetration, masked you in smoke for as long as it took to reload, and required less practice to use effectively. Also lead is soft, cheaply smelted, and the shape was easier to produce in large quantities relative to arrows.[/QUOTE] Despite popular believe it's rare to survive being hit with an arrow or crossbow bolt. Most arrows were barbed or broadhead and they create grievous wounds almost on parallel with the wounds caused by musket fire. Really the only advantage muskets posses was their ability to scare people and horses when fired en-mass, and they can realibly pierce gambeson/jack/aketon (which often stop lower velocity arrows and bolts) most breatsplates of the time were composite-welded and were actually capable of stopping musket fire at combat ranges.

It really all depends on what the time in question is.

That skyrimprefs method worked for sound, thanks. Also does anybody know what Bethesda's problem with edge detection is? Arena had no slopes so it didn't matter, but Daggerfall had slopes but no detection so you could walk up anything that wasn't above 90 degrees, and morrowind, oblivion, and skyrim all have this problem where as soon as you hit a certain slope angle you just stop moving and get stuck, then you can stand on that ridiculously slanted edge that no human could possibly stand on and get slowly pushed off, and as such you can climb the weirdest of places with some jumping and a lot of frustration. I don't really get it, it's like they've been stumped from just this stuff for almost 20 years.

[QUOTE=Kommodore;41445595]It really all depends on what the time in question is.[/QUOTE] Like I said, they were only invalidated around 1700, give or take a few decades. Anywhere before that bows and crossbows would have been of varying usefulness and would have been used differently than muskets. Once muskets became more common, archers and crossbowmen liekly would have taken the role of skirmishers for their tactical value; harassing enemy formations and causing injuries and deaths, whereas the pike and shot formations would have been the mainstay of the army because of their formidable strategical value. At any rate, a matchlock musket would have been almost useless in single combat (maybe good for one kill) with that in mind I don't see why muskets and fantasy can't get along. It's a matter of choice, do I want to be bogged down with a musket to get the occasional kill, or do I want to stick to a more reliable weapon platform like a bow or a crossbow? With all that said though I still don't trust Bethesda enough to handle a concept as sensitive and volatile as fantasy firearms, but the core concept could be possible in a TES: adventures game :v:

[QUOTE=Vasili;41444859]That's always been a bit of a myth.[/QUOTE] While I can't speak about accuracy (and a video that doesn't even tell the distance at which they are shooting is not going to change my mind) muskets are still far more unreliable than crossbows, all it takes is getting the powder a little wet and you can forget about firing, aswell as firearms require both more maintenance unless you want it to blow up in your face and the reloading is not just longer but also way more clumsy. The idea of bows and crossbows being used contemporarily to firearms is not far-fetched at all, and it belongs to history in fact. It was an age of change undoubtedly, but it still happened.

[QUOTE=Bloodshot12;41445664]That skyrimprefs method worked for sound, thanks. Also does anybody know what Bethesda's problem with edge detection is? Arena had no slopes so it didn't matter, but Daggerfall had slopes but no detection so you could walk up anything that wasn't above 90 degrees, and morrowind, oblivion, and skyrim all have this problem where as soon as you hit a certain slope angle you just stop moving and get stuck, then you can stand on that ridiculously slanted edge that no human could possibly stand on and get slowly pushed off, and as such you can climb the weirdest of places with some jumping and a lot of frustration. I don't really get it, it's like they've been stumped from just this stuff for almost 20 years.[/QUOTE] It's because the way Bethesda handles physics. Jump up in Skyrim while holding forward, then stop holding forward in the middle of the jump. You instantly stop moving. You have 100% air control. The physics engine is really simple in the TES games simply because Beth hasn't bothered to add proper physics.

How many people here know TES5Edit well? Is there a way to copy all settings from one weather and apply it to another weather? For example: I made changes to weather "SkyrimClear (81a)", and want to quickly copy and paste the exact same settings into "SkyrimClearCO (10a234)" without having to manually input each individual setting all over again. 'cause that would save me hours of work if I could do that.

[QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;41446214]It's because the way Bethesda handles physics. Jump up in Skyrim while holding forward, then stop holding forward in the middle of the jump. You instantly stop moving. You have 100% air control. The physics engine is really simple in the TES games simply because Beth hasn't bothered to add proper physics.[/QUOTE] They did finally add havok physics, which makes the items that spazz across the room at high velocities hurt you and most likely kill you instantly on impact.

[QUOTE=DrasarSalman;41446368]They did finally add havok physics, which makes the items that spazz across the room at high velocities hurt you and most likely kill you instantly on impact.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but not proper physics applied onto the player or NPCs for that matter. In Skyrim, people just seem to float around. The only game that I have played that 'realistically' does that is GTA IV.

ENB is about to get a little more optimized (for higher end cards) [quote=Boris Vorontsov]The Elder Scrolls Skyrim (TES Skyrim, Скурим Свитки) Graphic mod ENBSeries 13.7.13 This version is the latest which have optimizations for old videocards of dx9/10 generation (GeForce 8xxx, 9xxx, 2xx, 3xx; radeon 2xxx, 3xxx, 4xxx), all newest will be optimized for dx11 generation and performance with old videocards will be slower. Small performance improvement of ssao effect for videocard with low memory bandwidth. Did workaround for NVidia 320.xx drivers to fix sun visibility and some other issues, now it work on Win7. Replaced ldr mask texture by hdr texture for enbsunsprite.fx shader, also it's now use color of sun (masked by clouds).[/quote]

There is a fine line between realism and playability. I mean, in GTA IV, you can get thrown through your windscreen or fall flat on your ass if running into something, both include ragdollizing the player, taking all or most control of the player character away for a couple of seconds.

[QUOTE=DrasarSalman;41446456]There is a fine line between realism and playability. I mean, in GTA IV, you can get thrown through your windscreen or fall flat on your ass if running into something, both include ragdollizing the player, taking all or most control of the player character away for a couple of seconds.[/QUOTE] pretty sure if you run into a pole going fast enough to eject you out of the car you're not going to have any control over your body

[QUOTE=DrasarSalman;41446456]There is a fine line between realism and playability. I mean, in GTA IV, you can get thrown through your windscreen or fall flat on your ass if running into something, both include ragdollizing the player, taking all or most control of the player character away for a couple of seconds.[/QUOTE] Reworded my post. I don't want to make it seem like I want all games to have that kind of physics, but I want it to be realistic in a way that I can't climb 70-80 degree sloped mountains and have total air control with no air resistance. I don't want that kind of physics applied onto the player.

in a game like saints row however you can do the exact same thing but can control yourself in mid-air while ragdolling about, i prefer GTA IV physics .

[QUOTE=Pandamox;41446506]pretty sure if you run into a pole going fast enough to eject you out of the car you're not going to have any control over your body[/QUOTE] Oddly enough you do have control, albiet not as much as saints row. GTA was good, it gave you control enough to flail around a bit, but not much more.

I like how Far Cry 3 handled slopes.

[QUOTE=hypno-toad;41443401]Oh look, what is this? It appears to a in-period sketch of mercenaries during the mid-1600's using bows [I]alongside firearms[/I] during a time when matchlock firearms were the mainstay of many armies. [t]http://www.slightlyoffkilter.net/kilthistory/files/Scottish_mercenaries_in_the_Thirty_Years_War.jpg[/t] Could it be that maybe, contrary to popular uninformed opinion, bows, crossbows and matchlocks were all used alongside each other for the first 400 years of firearm technology? Maybe, just maybe it's possible to intelligently implement early firearms into the fantasy genre without causing a disaster? They did it in real life after all, all the trained and skilled archers and crossbowmen didn't seem to have a problem with their own superior rate of fire and greater degree of reliability[/QUOTE] guns in tes would suck because the guns you are talking about could only fire a couple of shots a minute. that would be boring as hell. yea, bows and guns were used alongside each other. yea, it might make sense in the lore to have guns. it just wouldn't be a fun gameplay mechanic. it would either be too weak, or it would be too strong and completely get rid of any incentive to use a bow/crossbow.