The Super Smash Bros. Discussion and HEY join this idiots http://steamcommunity.com/groups/Smashpunc - Games

So I guess that also confirms Lucarios' alternate form as a final smash.

[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;44796409]So I guess that also confirms Lucarios' alternate form as a final smash.[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure it was in the trailer. [t]http://i.imgur.com/RfX8qiH.png[/t] Also wasn't it a Pic of the Day at one point?

[QUOTE=Sift;44795165]It's funny because she's done the exact same things as Waluigi and more[/QUOTE] Aside from set herself at all apart from being an obvious palette swap of another character.

[QUOTE=Steel & Iron;44796826]I'm pretty sure it was in the trailer. [t]http://i.imgur.com/RfX8qiH.png[/t] Also wasn't it a Pic of the Day at one point?[/QUOTE] Lucario's final smash was in the trailer, but it wasn't explicitly confirmed as a Final Smash. Same with Charizard X, it wasn't established that it was a Final Smash and people were speculating if there was some way to activate it.

[QUOTE=Mr_Awesome;44792946]Waluigi isn't established as a character yet, so he doesn't really need a slot where a 100 different more interesting characters could be put.[/QUOTE] And that's the key phrase: "isn't established yet." Seriously, the Mario series has a whole bunch of major characters and they ignore half of them. I'm sure all of them could become good characters if they were fleshed out more, even if they did just remain in the "animated actors" role Nintendo uses them as. Look at what the RPGs did for Bowser and Peach's personalities, or the subtle stuff they did with Luigi in the Mansion games.

[QUOTE=VinLAURiA;44796987]And that's the key phrase: "isn't established yet." Seriously, the Mario series has a whole bunch of major characters and they ignore half of them. I'm sure all of them could become good characters if they were fleshed out more, even if they did just remain in the "animated actors" role Nintendo uses them as. Look at what the RPGs did for Bowser and Peach's personalities, or the subtle stuff they did with Luigi in the Mansion games.[/QUOTE] luigis personality on luigis mansion 2 was one of the many reason that game was so good

Waluigi has plenty to work with; he's as obsessed with winning as Wario is with treasure. While Wario gets what he wants with brute strength, Waluigi resorts to cheating. "He has no personality" is a terrible excuse. Hell, Wario was a shallow Mario knock-off in his first appearance. Then he got his own series, and that was popular enough to spawn yet another series. The difference between Wario and Daisy or Waluigi is that Wario went beyond being a one-off. Had Gunpei Yokoi decided to make Daisy a prominent character in SML2/WL, she might be a more important character nowadays. Likewise, if someone bothered to do something with Waluigi, he might be an actual character and not just a roster filler. And it's not like one-off characters getting expanded roles is exclusive to Wario. Look at Rosalina. She appeared in Mario Galaxy 1 as a NPC, a cameo in Mario Galaxy 2, and a bunch of spin-off appearances in the Kart/Tennis/whatever series. Then she appeared in 3D World AND Smash Bros. Now people can't get enough of her.

[QUOTE=PSI Guy;44797235]Waluigi has plenty to work with; he's as obsessed with winning as Wario is with treasure. While Wario gets what he wants with brute strength, Waluigi resorts to cheating. "He has no personality" is a terrible excuse. Hell, Wario was a shallow Mario knock-off in his first appearance. Then he got his own series, and that was popular enough to spawn yet another series. The difference between Wario and Daisy or Waluigi is that Wario went beyond being a one-off. Had Gunpei Yokoi decided to make Daisy a prominent character in SML2/WL, she might be a more important character nowadays. Likewise, if someone bothered to do something with Waluigi, he might be an actual character and not just a roster filler. And it's not like one-off characters getting expanded roles is exclusive to Wario. Look at Rosalina. She appeared in Mario Galaxy 1 as a NPC, a cameo in Mario Galaxy 2, and a bunch of spin-off appearances in the Kart/Tennis/whatever series. Then she appeared in 3D World AND Smash Bros. Now people can't get enough of her.[/QUOTE] On paper Waluigi has a way stronger personality than basically any other mario character besides Wario, who's well-executed for the same reasons. His design, voice and movement lend themselves to a crude, comical nemesis archetype that you can easily understand despite the sparse dialogue and story in the Mario games (if any at all). Compare that to, say, Yoshi. Yoshi's personality extends as far as, well... being Yoshi.

Camelot did create Waluigi with a personality, Nintendo's just ignoring the poor guy [img]http://24.media.tumblr.com/0cdd58b3c3b474100c860fed3034cc07/tumblr_n56l83JMJt1qkkwv6o1_400.gif[/img] [img]http://37.media.tumblr.com/57ac3c49fd4ebbac3d03032b400fd07a/tumblr_n54315ZDtN1s9gp6yo1_400.gif[/img]

can we stop with the waluigi talk ? he isn't even gonna be playable Waluigi is a character created by Nintendo, his personality is designed by the community. Nintendo never gave Waluigi an official personality, he is no one, he is that purple long legged guy that appears to Mario's birthday parties, we don't know if he likes to go wa, we don't know if he enjoys beating up people and being an ass, we know nothing. Waluigi isn't an interesting character, the community made him interesting, expecting Waluigi to be an interesting fighter would be a total mistake.

[QUOTE=Maruhai;44797446]can we stop with the waluigi talk ? he isn't even gonna be playable Waluigi is a character created by Nintendo, his personality is designed by the community. Nintendo never gave Waluigi an official personality, he is no one, he is that purple long legged guy that appears to Mario's birthday parties, we don't know if he likes to go wa, we don't know if he enjoys beating up people and being an ass, we know nothing. Waluigi isn't an interesting character, the community made him interesting, expecting Waluigi to be an interesting fighter would be a total mistake.[/QUOTE] You can say that about any Mario character, in fact Waluigi and Wario are the characters with the strongest inherent personality because of their striking design. Mario, Luigi, Bowser, Toad, Peach, Daisy, Donkey Kong, Yoshi, not to mention the minor minor characters.. what are their personalities? What are their thoughts? How do they react to their situation? Whatever. I know he's not playable, you're right. I'm just sick of people acting like he's 'only wanted because people built a personality around him' because that's bullshit and you could say the same for Mario himself.

[QUOTE=Nibwoddle;44797557]You can say that about any Mario character, in fact Waluigi and Wario are the characters with the strongest inherent personality because of their striking design. Mario, Luigi, Bowser, Toad, Peach, Daisy, Donkey Kong, Yoshi, not to mention the minor minor characters.. what are their personalities? What are their thoughts? How do they react to their situation? Whatever. I know he's not playable, you're right. I'm just sick of people acting like he's 'only wanted because people built a personality around him' because that's bullshit and you could say the same for Mario himself.[/QUOTE] Mario and Luigi have pretty defined personalities thanks to the RPG games. I think the worst thing about the whole Waluigi thing is that he has so much potential to have a personality but it is wasted on shitty sports games.

[QUOTE=Nibwoddle;44797557]You can say that about any Mario character, in fact Waluigi and Wario are the characters with the strongest inherent personality because of their striking design. Mario, Luigi, Bowser, Toad, Peach, Daisy, Donkey Kong, Yoshi, not to mention the minor minor characters.. what are their personalities? What are their thoughts? How do they react to their situation? Whatever. I know he's not playable, you're right. I'm just sick of people acting like he's 'only wanted because people built a personality around him' because that's bullshit and you could say the same for Mario himself.[/QUOTE] Uh, Interesting design =/= Interesting personality. He tags along with Wario in the sports games when Wario's up to no good and that's about it. Daisy has been turned into a tomboy princess who doesn't get kidnapped because she can protect herself and that's why she's visiting another kingdom for sports events and whatnot all the time, that's just as much development as Waluigi who is a single sentence of "That guy that cheats around Wario"

I'm still bracing myself for Mega Charizard Y appearing in some sort of way. Also, expecting Charizard X to be an insane buff to contact moves. After all, that is what Charizard X is.

[QUOTE=Fangz;44790806]One of the creators of Project M on the Japan Time podcast has made it clear several times he hates Waluigi as a character and thinks anyone who wants him playable is a moron.[/QUOTE] he's right though he's a skinny wario who existed very suddenly for literally no reason [editline]14th May 2014[/editline] at least wario has a purpose, he was the evil sibling (who is sometimes an anti-hero) waluigi literally made his debut in mario tennis fuck that character

On a bit of a tangent, I kinda noticed that Mario kinda goes in Pokémon-like generations that are kicked off by each flagship game and loosely correspond with actual console generations. But rather than a clear-cut new region and a hundred or so new Pokémon, Mario generations are... a bit harder to define. They still generally have a new setting and characters introduced, but there tends to be a bit of bleed and overlap. Basically, every generation Mario gets a new "flavor." Forgive my ramblings, but I've been thinking about this for a while. [b]"Zero" Era[/b] (Gen2) Everything before Super Mario Bros., basically. Back when Mario wasn't exclusive to Nintendo systems as there weren't really any Nintendo systems to be exclusive to just yet. All the arcade stuff and Gen2 ports. [b]Classic Era[/b] (Gen3) Pretty much everything from SMB to SMB3. As the series was still finding its identity, there was a lot of abstract theming and tone flux in the main games, while the sports spin-offs and such focused on real-world settings and generally didn't actually [i]star[/i] Mario. Things like Famicom Grand-Prix and NES Open Tournament Golf. [b]Land and World Eras[/b] (Gen4) These ran concurrent. The Land era was somewhat a continuation of the Classic era and focused on everything that wasn't affected by SMW's theming, mostly portable works. A lot of focus on Wario and more experimental settings, and pretty much everything that was on the Virtual Boy falls here. Pretty much spun-off into the Wario Land series proper. The World era focused on Yoshi and the Dinosaur Land setting, with a lot of lush environments with food-based names. Some of the weirder spin-offs like that one Mario FPS fell here, and this would eventually branch into the Yoshi's Island games. [b]N64 Era[/b] (Gen5) This is where the setting and theme finally started to solidify and stop experimenting so much, with the introduction of Peach's castle as a "seed" that the Mushroom Kingdom started cementing itself as a real location around. Character-wise, we saw a lot of SML/Wario elements merge back in, with a slew of spin-offs around the turn of the millennium. Daisy got her big comeback and Waluigi was introduced here, and there was a lot of emphasis on the Camelot sports games and Mario Party series. You pretty much couldn't look anywhere in Nintendo material without finding Mario stuff, and this is pretty much the epitome of Mario as a omni-present mascot that they just threw into everything. [b]Delfino Era[/b] (Gen6) Got its start in Luigi's Mansion, but didn't kick off in full until Sunshine (which LM could be considered a prologue to, as both focused heavily on E. Gadd's inventions.) Lots of focus on the characters this time, and trying to cram the whole cast in back before it got too big. There was experimentation with full dialogue and a good amount of effort in actually fleshing out everyone's personalities. We got the debut of E. Gadd and Bowser Jr., and the settings tended to focus on tropical locations with a lot of Pianta and Noki appearances. [b]Galaxy Era[/b] (Gen7) This one was kinda short-lived as the predominant era although its effects are still felt, especially with Rosalina's big comeback lately. This is when they started experimenting again, with a lot of abstract and dream-like locations that got their start in Sunshine's "secret" courses. Space was a predominant setting, we got Rosalina and the Lumas as new characters, and aesthetics-wise we started getting a lot of orchestrated music and playing around with lighting and refraction effects. This is when they also started bringing back elements from previous eras, like remixes of older games' theme songs and a whole bunch of retro sprites everywhere. [b]"New" Era[/b] (Gen7-Gen8) This one's actually been building since the very beginning of Gen7 (as NSMB1 took a lot of cues from SM64DS) before even the Galaxy era started, and has slowly been overtaking it. For a while it was just limited to the portable side of things like MKDS. It kept a couple Delfino elements as well as bringing back a few N64 era ones thanks to SM64DS's influence, although it slowly phased the Delfino stuff out over time. It really starting becoming prominent with NSMBWii that game's influence on SMG2, and is now full-tilt as of the "shiny logo" NSMB games and the "Super Mario 3D Whatever" series. For a while it's been pretty bland thematically, relying a lot on the retro references started in the Galaxy era, generic environments, and "bah" music as has often been complained about (Sticker Star in particular suffered from this lack of identity), although as of the Wii U games it's slowly starting to find an identity with a lot of jazz music, slick UI elements (especially in the Mario Kart games), new characters like the Sprixies and Nabbit, and bringing back side characters like Rosalina in a big way. I bet with this E3, we'll see all these recent seeds finally mutate into something with its own identity and break off from the earlier "New" era. Especially with these rumors of a Galaxy successor.

[QUOTE=Rusty100;44797842]he's right though he's a skinny wario who existed very suddenly for literally no reason [editline]14th May 2014[/editline] at least wario has a purpose, he was the evil sibling (who is sometimes an anti-hero) waluigi literally made his debut in mario tennis fuck that character[/QUOTE] I don't think Wario and Mario are siblings.

i thought they were supposed to be cousins or something

[QUOTE=Maruhai;44797446]can we stop with the waluigi talk ? he isn't even gonna be playable[/QUOTE] that's never stopped people talking about characters before [B]COUGHCOUGHBAYONETTARAIDENWONDERREDCOUGHCOUGH[/B] [QUOTE=Maruihai;44797446]Waluigi isn't an interesting character, the community made him interesting, expecting Waluigi to be an interesting fighter would be a total mistake.[/QUOTE] like half the characters in smash bros are blank slates that never say anything and had their personalities filled in by the players. waluigi has enough of a "character" to formulate a moveset around. if we can get a moveset for a guy who literally only punches, or for characters who have never shown any combat experience in their games, saying we couldn't get an interesting moveset for waluigi is just stupid. inb4 "FUCKING WALUIGIFAGS ARE JUST AS BAD AS RIDLEYFAGS/WONDERREDFAGS/SOME-CHARACTER-I-DON'T-LIKE-PEOPLE-TALKING-ABOUTFAGS"

either way, waluigi is still a terrible character

[QUOTE=Eriorguez;44797831]I'm still bracing myself for Mega Charizard Y appearing in some sort of way. Also, expecting Charizard X to be an insane buff to contact moves. After all, that is what Charizard X is.[/QUOTE] Hold L bumper for X and R bumper for Y maybe? Doubt it, though.

[QUOTE=Rusty100;44797916]either way, waluigi is still a terrible character[/QUOTE] I for one relate to Waluigi on deeper levels of emotional dogma.

What is this "Waluigi has no personality" bullshit ? Has any of you guys ever saw this ? [video=youtube;TsSnTT3p-ns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsSnTT3p-ns[/video] This character has so much potential. I love what Camelot tried to do with him.

[QUOTE=X-tra;44798477]What is this "Waluigi has no personality" bullshit ? Has any of you guys ever saw this ? This character has so much potential. I love what Camelot tried to do with him.[/QUOTE] It just seems to me that some people don't like the character (which is fine on it's own) and are therefore trying to find reasons to call him objectively bad. This is something that has happened before. For whatever reason the Smash Bros community seems to get really upset when people like a character that they don't.

It's a fighting game. If you dislike a character so much why not make it a point to royally beat their ass?

[QUOTE=Rufia;44798727]It just seems to me that some people don't like the character (which is fine on it's own) and are therefore trying to find reasons to call him objectively bad. This is something that has happened before. For whatever reason the Smash Bros community seems to get really upset when people like a character that they don't.[/QUOTE] I'm not saying anyone who likes Waluigi is a bad person or it's wrong to like him. I'm just saying he's a cardboard cutout taped to Wario in the sports games that has a horribly inconstant "character" to him because nobody knows what to do with him. Someone posted the Power Tennis opening which is funny but watching it all the way through literally says nothing about his character- it's a great intro and the bloopers that weren't posted are great but once again a 5 minute video of him just following Wario around while hijinks happen doesn't equate to much. I repeat, there's nothing wrong with liking him, but saying that he's got HIDDEN DEPTHS and TONS OF POTENTIAL is wrong. He's once again, Daisy tier in terms of potential. Also somewhat unrelated but I remember reading that Miyamoto or some of the bigwigs hate him because they didn't create him, anyone know if that's true?

[QUOTE=Sift;44799038]I'm not saying anyone who likes Waluigi is a bad person or it's wrong to like him. I'm just saying he's a cardboard cutout taped to Wario in the sports games that has a horribly inconstant "character" to him because nobody knows what to do with him.[/QUOTE] Isn't Luigi's personality prone to changing on a per series basis.

a character has potential if a cool moveset for them can be created which is relatively close 2 their personality does waluigi?

[QUOTE=Durrsly;44799047]Isn't Luigi's personality prone to changing on a per series basis.[/QUOTE] Nah, he's been pretty solid all the way through, there was a weird period where he was suddenly afraid of ghost and a big softy but other then that they've kept him pretty in line.

I don't care what other people think about Waluigi. I only care about how it's extremely unprofessional for one of the Project M devs to call a large group of people morons simply because they like a character he doesn't.