The castle looks really empty with all the residents working. I'll probably use the grape mentats + CHR clothing trick to try and get another eight or nine settlers that'll be able to properly populate the place.
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;49575489]I don't remember anyone disliking OWB, except for the odd few who got into a fit because the game [I]dared[/I] to open with dialogue[/QUOTE]
OWB was praised as hell, even by people that hated base NV, because it was "more like fallout 3"
i don't really get why butre's saying it was hated too
[QUOTE=butre;49575388]people hated owb when it came out though[/QUOTE]
it came out after sierra madre and before honest hearts, so people were expecting something to top the narrative of the first dlc, but hadn't seen how bad the 3rd dlc would be
OWB is quirky in its own ways, people that didn't like it at first were mostly critical of its lack of story, you can really run through that DLC in less than an hour if you're leveled enough and know exactly where to go, otherwise its a great exploration dlc because every building tells a story
[QUOTE=DiscoInferno;49573127]There was a 'Timmy in the well' joke in Fallout New Vegas, with Wild Wasteland.[/QUOTE]
Even then, it amounted to [sp]Timmy is a skeleton and his trusty BB Gun is worse for wear, but still usable[/sp] as opposed to "[sp]Turned into a ghoul and still living despite no food or water, and "conveniently" his home is still standing and as if that isn't lucky enough, his parents are alive 'cause they're ghouls too! [/sp].
There's a difference between "fluid, yet somewhat morbid wackiness" and "OMG, CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS! ITS WACKY!!!!1"
I read on Reddit that the new patch fixes the issue where if you put items down on the ground, when you come back they won't have phased through the geometry?
[QUOTE=SteakStyles;49575765]Even then, it amounted to [sp]Timmy is a skeleton and his trusty BB Gun is worse for wear, but still usable[/sp] as opposed to "[sp]Turned into a ghoul and still living despite no food or water, and "conveniently" his home is still standing and as if that isn't lucky enough, his parents are alive 'cause they're ghouls too! [/sp].
There's a difference between "fluid, yet somewhat morbid wackiness" and "OMG, CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS! ITS WACKY!!!!1"[/QUOTE]
seeing as ghouls heal from radiation, don't see hpw that's really implausible with the no food thing but ok
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;49575489]I don't remember anyone disliking OWB, except for the odd few who got into a fit because the game [I]dared[/I] to open with dialogue[/QUOTE]
Don't get me wrong, but to be fair that opening conversation with the think tank is like 40 minutes.
Obsidian's pacing sometimes just shits the bed and you end up with stuff like OWB's 40 minute long intro instead of having that dialogue spread across a larger period of time a bit more equally.
As far as I've noticed it happens in almost all the DLC, honest hearts being the exception because the few times it happens you end up talking to Joshua and he isn't one for long speeches.
[QUOTE=Ardosos;49575878]Don't get me wrong, but to be fair that opening conversation with the think tank is like 40 minutes.[/QUOTE]
An entertaining 40 minutes nonetheless.
[QUOTE=Sableye;49575618]it came out after sierra madre and before honest hearts, so people were expecting something to top the narrative of the first dlc, but hadn't seen how bad the 3rd dlc would be
OWB is quirky in its own ways, people that didn't like it at first were mostly critical of its lack of story, you can really run through that DLC in less than an hour if you're leveled enough and know exactly where to go, otherwise its a great exploration dlc because every building tells a story[/QUOTE]
uhh no?
OWB is the third DLC, Honest Hearts was the second.
That intro exchange is one of the only times I have ever full-on laughed out loud at RPG dialog.
What I wouldn't give to see footage of the VA cast recording those lines. I bet they were barely keeping their composure.
[I]"If it attempts to insert them, activate vivisectors!"[/I]
[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49576312]and then the best part was [URL="https://youtu.be/_3cTpUtnP-I?t=2m58s"]it could even be downright touching and depressed at times[/URL] throughout all the dark humor. old world blues never fails to amaze me.
"why, yes. gabe..."[/QUOTE]
well that got unexpectedly dark
Hidden behind all the goofy-ass humor in OWB is a really depressing story.
[editline]21st January 2016[/editline]
STOP FUCKING RUNNING INTO TRAPS DOGMEAT UUUUGH
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576024]Obsidian's pacing sometimes just shits the bed and you end up with stuff like OWB's 40 minute long intro instead of having that dialogue spread across a larger period of time a bit more equally.
As far as I've noticed it happens in almost all the DLC, honest hearts being the exception because the few times it happens you end up talking to Joshua and he isn't one for long speeches.[/QUOTE]
There you go again with the terrible Obsidian pacing of OWB and.... OWB and........ OWB
An one time mistake that they learned from, and that people wildly exaggerate about the length (you can exit it in less than 10 minutes if you don't bother asking for more information about anything)
You keep complaining about it and you never give another example.
I already adressed your (unjustified) complaints about the pacing in DM in the last thread which was the only other you ever bothered mentioning and the problem with LR are engine limitations and design choices about how to handle Ulysses expositions, not pacing.
There's another solid example in the form of Lonesome Road and Ulysses' endless speeches. He never stops talking, it's not that interesting for the most part, and the novelty quickly wears off when he does it for the third time with no additional information to give.
It would have worked fine if spread evenly across the DLC in the form of passing comments and not by locking you in conversation, but instead they went for these unending tirades. That's bad pacing.
He never stops talking if you keep asking him about things. If you don't, it's quick enough.
And you know well enough the engine couldn't handle conversations without locking you on them. Don't play dumb.
Complaining about long speeches when you keep asking about things is incredibly silly. LR is far from perfect and in fact is my least favourite DLC, but the problem with it is not pacing
But you only get one opportunity to hear these lines and it's through these specific points of dialogue. If there is any important information in that dialogue (something a player who's never experienced the DLC would be inclined to think), you'd risk missing it by cutting the discussion short.
"You can skip the dialogue" is not a good excuse for the dialogue being lengthy. You either pace your dialogue well so that the player may be able to experience the entirety of it without having to fight their own attention span, or you don't bother putting in so much dialogue in the first place, because past a certain point the quality of the writing takes an inevitable hit when too much is exposed all at once.
The long conversation you're complaining happens right in the end of the DLC and its mostly Ulysses personal views and feelings about the subjects you're asking him about. There's no "information players can't miss", just added flavour for those interested in hearing about it. If you're not, don't ask. You miss nothing and the game won't punish you for it.
The excuse is not "you can skip the dialogue"
The point is "you're not forced to listen anything you don't want to, just don't ask about them". Which is the problem with OWB and the long intro, regardless of what you feel you still have to sit through a lot of text, which was a pacing problem (and only happens during the intro)
Also seeing how you keep being the only complaining about it maybe people are not so bothered with having a ton of dialogue options when the dialogue is interesting enough. Just food for your thoughts.
Ulysses interrupts you several times throughout the DLC to talk to you about random shit. There's even an achievement for passing the survival checks on each and every single one of these conversations.
And even though these conversations have no valuable information crucial to playing the DLC in hindsight, that's not something a new player would know. When a character stops me right as I'm about to enter a series of tunnels and starts talking about tunnelers, my first thought is that somewhere in that dialogue there must be some form of clue or indication of how to fight tunnelers or info about the incoming area, especially since Ulysses is built up to be such a hardass survivalist who's been through there before you.
Yes, after you play the DLC, it becomes apparent all this dialogue is only pointless flavor text. The first time around it's not so obvious. If you pay ten bucks for DLC and then play it you're not going to want to skip through the dialogue haphazardly at the risk of missing crucial information.
[editline]a[/editline]
Also important to point out that this issue solely exists with the DLC of the game, the vanilla experience is well paced - characters don't immediately pour all information on you the instant you meet them, the few who do that typically don't have a lot to say otherwise, and companions are built in the same fashion as Mass Effect where you need to take them around with you and actually do things before they talk about new subjects.
That one point in Lonesome Road where Ulysses takes over ED-E and he flies away is also total bullshit.
Especially since he unloads all the things you made him carry on you. I was something like 150 lbs overencumbered the first time that happened.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576514]Ulysses interrupts you several times throughout the DLC to talk to you about random shit. There's even an achievement for passing the survival checks on each and every single one of these conversations.
[/QUOTE]
None are forced and long enough to justify complaining about the pacing. They're not that interesting, but that's another problem
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576514]And even though these conversations have no valuable information crucial to playing the DLC in hindsight, that's not something a new player would know. When a character stops me right as I'm about to enter a series of tunnels and starts talking about tunnelers, my first thought is that somewhere in that dialogue there must be some form of clue or indication of how to fight tunnelers or info about the incoming area, especially since Ulysses is built up to be such a hardass survivalist who's been through there before you.[/QUOTE]
Ulysses don't want to tell you shit. It's not out of character for him.
Again, you're complaining about different matters, as in the quality of what its being said and not the pacing, which is a different matter
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576514]Yes, after you play the DLC, it becomes apparent all this dialogue is only pointless flavor text. The first time around it's not so obvious. If you pay ten bucks for DLC and then play it you're not going to want to skip through the dialogue haphazardly at the risk of missing crucial information.[/QUOTE]
It's clear enough by the end of the DLC that Ulysses is a madman that will ramble on if you give him the chance to. You don't need to be playing the DLC for the fifth time to realize what will actually be important or not during that point of the game. Not exhausting all the dialogue options from a NPC when you're not interested =/= skipping dialogue, stop pretending they're the same
You're complaining about the overall quality and characterization of Ulysses in the DLC and you're entitled to it, i don't like it very much either. But that's[B] not [/B]a pacing problem which is what you keep blaming Obsidian of being so guilty of.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576514]Also important to point out that this issue solely exists with the DLC of the game, the vanilla experience is well paced - characters don't immediately pour all information on you the instant you meet them, the few who do that typically don't have a lot to say otherwise, and companions are built in the same fashion as Mass Effect where you need to take them around with you and actually do things before they talk about new subjects.
[/QUOTE]
Don't make me go after that long post from the previous thread that you conveniently ignored. Long story short, DM has no pacing problems. You have several encounters and chances to be exposed to the plot and personal story from all companions during the DLC. Not once you're forced to take it all in one sitting - in fact, most aspects of their tales will only get addressed if you keep engaging them in conversation every chance you have and asking them about it - something that it's never forced onto the player and if you don't want to know or save any of your companions, you're free to do so. And this is good game design, not a flaw.
Honest Hearts don't have this problem and LR was already talked about. "Obsidian shits the bed all over the DLCs" again resumes to the intro scene from OWB (the pacing is good enough for the entire rest of it) alone.
C'mon.
I said it happens in [I]almost[/I] all the dlc, Honest Hearts being the exception.
Ulysses loves to hear himself talk but the way he stops you regularly to talk about it in large chunks instead of spreading all of that info over all that time the player spends doing nothing but walk forward in Lonesome Road means it's poorly paced.
MacCready: y'know if you ever want me to carry any of that valuable gear you're lugging, let me know
me: hey maccready I wanna trade some stuff
MacCready: oh I see, all I'm good for is hauling your crap :/
me: ?????????
[QUOTE=LolzMan1325;49576603]MacCready: y'know if you ever want me to carry any of that valuable gear you're lugging, let me know
me: hey maccready I wanna trade some stuff
MacCready: oh I see, all I'm good for is hauling your crap :/
me: ?????????[/QUOTE]
so tsudere
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49576602]I said it happens in [I]almost[/I] all the dlc, Honest Hearts being the exception.
Ulysses loves to hear himself talk but the way he stops you regularly to talk about it in large chunks instead of spreading all of that info over all that time the player spends doing nothing but walk forward in Lonesome Road means it's poorly paced.[/QUOTE]
You know how conversations in the NV engine work, if they had Ulysses stop time to talk with you every single new place you entered in LR you would be complaining about that instead.
Ulysses was a poorly handled character and didn't matched up the expectations hyped by all the previous DLC about the confrontation with him, which in turn made LR a disappointing DLC. That's not a strictly pacing problem though.
And i'm still curious about all the other pacing problems with DM and OWB if HH is the only exception.
All this talk of Ulysses is springing up ancient nightmares of mine. Good god did I hate that character.
[QUOTE=DeEz;49576649]All this talk of Ulysses is springing up ancient nightmares of mine. Good god did I hate that character.[/QUOTE]
Which is a shame, if LR never existed he would remain an intriguing character just by what is said in the base game and the DLCs before it.
But then we meet the man behind the mystery and oh boy ain't he boring as hell
It's not like Obsidian couldn't pull hyping a character and then putting a good show when you meet them. Joshua is the second best thing about HH. Couldn't get the lightning to hit the same spot twice though.
Playing New Vegas again, got almost immediately greeted with this old glitch
[img]http://i.imgur.com/xNTmE40.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=HazzaHardie;49576678]Playing New Vegas again, got almost immediately greeted with this old glitch
[img]http://i.imgur.com/xNTmE40.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
I've seen so many people having this problem that i'm inclined to believe the normal Cheyenne is the glitched one
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
