[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;49613449]Which you'd only know to do if you looked up a guide on how to exploit the system. If you played naturally, you'd only stumble across enough of these situations to activate their quest over a very long time with them, if ever. Fallout 4's system is just as easy to exploit.[/QUOTE]
I think it is impossible to reach their quest in the same playtrough without exploiting them. If you hadnt traveled to the 4 places I mentioned with Arcade, you would not have any reason at all to return to them once they have been cleared.
Sure, in future playtroughs you might go to these places with the companions by chance, and discover that they like you going there, however, unless you spent the entire playthrough with that companion it would be extremely unlikely that you discovered every factor that make the quest trigger.
So naturaly, after you do a lot of playthroughs, you would discover the places each companion likes, so when you made a new one, you would go to teshe places so that you could unlock their quests, resulting in an exploiment of the system either way.
I had a dream about a crysis nanosuit power armor mod. While I like the crysis 1 nanosuit more, the nanosuit 2 model would probably fit in better with fallout 4's bulky power armor.
[QUOTE=Ctrl;49613413]The locks by themselves wont make you reach more affinity faster, you would need to pick a very good ammount of them just to trigger the first conversation.
And like I said, since you do things like they would, they start to trust you more, the approval system makes more sense than the systems in the other games.[/QUOTE]
To get each companion's perk, you need to reach max affinity with them, which is 1000 affinity points. Actions which they like generate 15 points as opposed to actions they love, which generate 30 points. Going solely off of actions which they like and not love, you'd have to perform 67 liked actions to get them to reveal their whole life story. That's 67 locked containers, which you find loads of in every lootable location, 67 hackable terminals, which are rarer, but can generally be found anywhere where there are automated defenses--so most places with raiders or gunners, 67 weapon mods, which are easy to churn out once you get the scrap economy running, 67 picked pockets, in a world where there are hundreds of NPCs with pockets to pick, 67 uses of chems where chems are some of the most common loot items to get, 67 corpses to eat, of which you'll generate thousands across a long playthrough, and 67 instances of entering a suit of power armor, which you can do over and over again once you have a suit of power armor, which you will after 20 minutes into the game.
[QUOTE=Atlascore;49613528]Marcus.. one of the worst.. are you insane?
Skynet and Cassidy are [I]okay[/I], nothing to write home about, but the rest you listed are just trash, Myron, Vic, and Lenny are just useless in combat, and as characters they're honestly pretty mediocre, especially Myron who is just an annoying brat. Pariah? Hahaha wow when is the last time you played Fallout 2? Pariah is just a dog, except he has a fuck ton of HP, does nothing but run away in combat, and upon joining you absolutely wrecks your Luck and gives you one of the worst traits in the game, the only thing memorable about him is how much of an annoyance he is.[/QUOTE]
Good characters =/= good characters in combat
[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;49613551]To get each companion's perk, you need to reach max affinity with them, which is 1000 affinity points. Actions which they like generate 15 points as opposed to actions they love, which generate 30 points. Going solely off of actions which they like and not love, you'd have to perform 67 liked actions to get them to reveal their whole life story. That's 67 locked containers, which you find loads of in every lootable location, 67 hackable terminals, which are rarer, but can generally be found anywhere where there are automated defenses--so most places with raiders or gunners, and 67 weapon mods, which are easy to churn out once you get the scrap economy running, 67 picked pockets, in a world where there are hundreds of NPCs with pockets to pick, 67 uses of chems where chems are some of the most common loot items to get, 67 corpses to eat, of which you'll generate thousands across a long playthrough, and 67 instances of entering a suit of power armor, which you can do over and over again once you have a suit of power armor, which you will after 20 minutes into the game.[/QUOTE]
The point of the system is not to do what you say,
1, because it would be extremely tedious, considering for example chems addictions, and how long the animations for eating and entering power armor are.
2, you would be contradicting yourself, since you said the point of the system is not to exploit it.
3, the game prevents you from doing this, since you cant perfom those actions in a row, since you will only get the "X liked that" message when an interval has passed since the previous one.
[QUOTE=Ctrl;49613523]I think it is impossible to reach their quest in the same playtrough without exploiting them. If you hadnt traveled to the 4 places I mentioned with Arcade, you would not have any reason at all to return to them once they have been cleared.
Sure, in future playtroughs you might go to these places with the companions by chance, and discover that they like you going there, however, unless you spent the entire playthrough with that companion it would be extremely unlikely that you discovered every factor that make the quest trigger.
So naturaly, after you do a lot of playthroughs, you would discover the places each companion likes, so when you made a new one, you would go to teshe places so that you could unlock their quests, resulting in an exploiment of the system either way.[/QUOTE]
the only one that fits your description is raul because the game is bugged and meeting the old guys after you talked with them will not properly count towards his quest
still you could wander towards black mountain in a first game and get him before novac. unlikely, but possible. i'm conceding obsidian fucked up with him though, specially because he's the best companion to me.
the others are mostly nipticking of your part. ED-E is the first companion you can get and the triggers always work anyway whenever you get to the places you need to be and you go through them a lot. you get boone early and you have PLENTY of chances to get points with him all around. hell just go to town on legion dudes and he'll be happy enough after a while. most people rush to vegas and meet arcade early anyway, and you still have plenty of locations around to get points with him even if you explored around (specially around outer vegas regions). also, the fort is the great opportunity to trigger For Auld Lang Syne and most people don't go there till mid to endgame (which gives plenty of opportunity to have Arcade around if you liked him)
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;49613392]they're both gamey, but
"hey blue, you've picked a lot of locks. How do you feel about my sister's life choices?"[/QUOTE]
not really, fallout 4 did improve on the companion quests quite a bit, it never felt too hard to get afinity but it also didn't feel like i had to take them to a specific place, the one thing is there are some quests that pretty much should never be completed without a companion present because of the affinity bonus, like vault 81's quest will make pretty much any of the good companions love you
[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49613595]the only one that fits your description is raul because the game is bugged and meeting the old guys after you talked with them will not properly count towards his quest
still you could wander towards black mountain in a first game and get him before novac. unlikely, but possible. i'm conceding obsidian fucked up with him though, specially because he's the best companion to me.
the others are mostly nipticking of your part. ED-E is the first companion you can get and the triggers always work anyway whenever you get to the places you need to be and you go through them a lot. you get boone early and you have PLENTY of chances to get points with him all around. hell just go to town on legion dudes and he'll be happy enough after a while. most people rush to vegas and meet arcade early anyway, and you still have plenty of locations around to get points with him even if you explored around (specially around outer vegas regions). also, the fort is the great opportunity to trigger For Auld Lang Syne and most people don't go there till mid to endgame (which gives plenty of opportunity to have Arcade around if you liked him)[/QUOTE]
You do make some good points there, but I suppose its up to how people play the game, I usualy explore everything I can as soon as I have the option to, and don´t swap characters until I have finished their quest, so I can get deep with them, that is, of course, when I´m not just traveling alone.
But like I said, it´s up to how you play, thanks for your input.
[QUOTE=Atlascore;49613559]You didn't even read the rest of my post, I was talking about more than just combat.[/QUOTE]
What's the point? I can't change your personal opinions on those characters and i don't intend to either.
But the only real argument you're using is "wow character x sucks in combat lolz". Myron has a lot of intriguing and funny dialogue about a lot of things and it's always fun to push him around with a female character, i don't give a crap if he's shitty in combat, i'm not listing BEST BUDS TO DESTROY ENCLAVE here. Same with Vic which surprisingly gets more than enough development all around the world map and an own family subplot (which is more than most companions in all game can say they had - Vic did companion quests before they were cool). Pariah is interesting exactly for being a nuisance that you can't get rid of (easily at least) - i'm not praising the riveting dialogue here, i'm praising the idea. Cassidy is great, and not too shabby with the right stuff too - and he has the best message popups in the game. Lenny is useful anywhere but in combat - again, combat is not all that it takes for a companion to be good or not.
Sulik is strong tribal dude with melee and Marcus is strong mutant dude with big guns. After Broken Hills Marcus became mostly a big bodyguard than anything else and Sulik's content was cut anyway. But sure, they're the only interesting ones (what a coincidence that they are the strongest ones too, right?) in F2, happy? I'm still disagreeing with you though.
[QUOTE=Ctrl;49613523]I think it is impossible to reach their quest in the same playtrough without exploiting them. If you hadnt traveled to the 4 places I mentioned with Arcade, you would not have any reason at all to return to them once they have been cleared.
Sure, in future playtroughs you might go to these places with the companions by chance, and discover that they like you going there, however, unless you spent the entire playthrough with that companion it would be extremely unlikely that you discovered every factor that make the quest trigger.
So naturaly, after you do a lot of playthroughs, you would discover the places each companion likes, so when you made a new one, you would go to teshe places so that you could unlock their quests, resulting in an exploiment of the system either way.[/QUOTE]
yeah you're not really supposed to hang out with every single companion during a single playthrough
stick with like 2-3ish max
[QUOTE=Ctrl;49613578]The point of the system is not to do what you say,
1, because it would be extremely tedious, considering for example chems addictions, and how long the animations for eating and entering power armor are.
2, you would be contradicting yourself, since you said the point of the system is not to exploit it.
3, the game prevents you from doing this, since you cant perfom those actions in a row, since you will only get the "X liked that" message when an interval has passed since the previous one.[/QUOTE]
There was a reason I pointed out how common those situations naturally arise over the course of normal play. My point isn't that they can be exploited at all, my point is that they're so easy to exploit that you wouldn't actually have to be deliberately trying to exploit the system in order to trigger those kinds of dumb micro events constantly. That's why I said it feels like a system built to be min-maxed, because [I]the systems of the game itself can easily lead you to min-max them in a way that breaks the verisimilitude of your relationship with your companions without any out-of-game knowledge whatsoever.[/I]
[QUOTE=elowin;49613659]yeah you're not really supposed to hang out with every single companion during a single playthrough
stick with like 2-3ish max[/QUOTE]
But then, what´s the point of having more than 2-3 companions in the game? One of the aspects I like more about games is the narrative and lore, and personally I believe everyone should try to explore other companions appart from the ones they like the most at first glance.
[editline]27th January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;49613667]There was a reason I pointed out how common those situations naturally arise over the course of normal play. My point isn't that they can be exploited at all, my point is that they're so easy to exploit that you wouldn't actually have to be deliberately trying to exploit the system in order to trigger those kinds of dumb micro events constantly. That's why I said it feels like a system built to be min-maxed, because [I]the systems of the game itself can easily lead you to min-max them in a way that breaks the verisimilitude of your relationship with your companions without any out-of-game knowledge whatsoever.[/I][/QUOTE]
But the point of the system is that you can follow it without having to look outside of the game. The Fallou 4 approval is build so that the [B]relationship builds over time[/B], so it feels more realistic and correct. And sure, of course they are common, but that does not mean they make things go faster. A lot of time would pass by before you had the need to get in your power armor or take drugs a total of 67 times with the same companion. Lastly, some companions don´t even have these little triggers, and in some cases, they completely turn around [sp]For example, once Cait goes clean, she will dislike it if you take chems.[/sp]
Also, sorry if you awnser my post and it takes 16 hours +/- for me to awnser you, but Im going to bed.
[QUOTE=Ctrl;49613675]But then, what´s the point of having more than 2-3 companions in the game? One of the aspects I like more about games is the narrative and lore, and personally I believe everyone should try to explore other companions appart from the ones they like the most at first glance.[/QUOTE]
Same point as having multiple routes to go through the game? Replayability, variety, all that jazz.
[QUOTE=Atlascore;49613842]Marcus and Sulik aren't even that interesting, they're just on top of the trash heap.
My point here is that companions were not a respectable part of the Fallout series' features until New Vegas. Most of them were forgettable at best in F1 & F2, and their usefulness in combat does matter, a lot, because they're expected to be with you at all times, which includes combat, if you they're not going to be worth a damn in a fight then just save yourself the trouble of making them a companion and focus all your efforts on making them a regular, but good, character. F3 had it the worst, they were barely a step above Bethesda's regular companion setup.[/QUOTE]
Fallout 3 was the first Bethesda game to have companions at all.
[QUOTE=ElectricSquid;49613480]200 posts since I last visited... was it just an argument, or was there news of the GECK?[/QUOTE]
just the same people incessantly arguing about the games flaws and their opinions on them.
i don't expect it to change anytime soon until some news of the GECK/DLC gets released to the public.
On the topic of companion approval, let me say this. I have Piper at max affinity, and decided to try and get that affinity down. So I took a copious amount of drugs in front of her, stole a good amount of items in diamond city, and murdered some of my settlements and some of vault 81. She still hasn't gotten upset with me to the point of activating a disapproval conversation, so I would say the system is definitely flawed. I would add that it was a good idea, but what triggers approval and disapproval needs to be better tailored to the companion and more sensitive.
I expected murdering a few innocent people would lead me to the brink of Piper leaving forever, but it didn't even stop her from offering me gum.
[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49614018]guess you could say
[I]war
war never changes[/I]
[sp]finally non cliché usage[/sp][/QUOTE]
It all makes perfect sense now.
It's too bad that the ranger gear has gloves built into it, Now i have to make the horrible choice between my cybernetic hand and the ranger coat.
Also i found a mod that made facial tattoos into the kind of designs people actually get tattooed on their faces, only fallout themed, so im p happy with that too.
[t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/543049909423805645/5EC22F3731DB641AF79EFC1AA521516179E264E0/[/t]
[video=youtube;Wcze7EGorOk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wcze7EGorOk[/video]
One of the best additions to There's More Where That Came From.
[QUOTE=MissingGlitch;49613028]He looked better in the art book.
Then again what didn't.[/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/ES30ZvQ.jpg[/t]
Well, at least the art book was honest about who's actually in charge of the Minutemen.
The "wears coats looted from Revolutionary War Museum" bit also gives me the impression that Garvey was originally the only one who really bothered with the colonial aesthetic, instead of every Minuteman going for laser muskets and vaguely tricorne-looking hats
[img_thumb]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/608351653791371664/9D9846D55CEC76FCCCEB2DE38799374CE34E70A4/[/img_thumb]
Man, I love the way your character sits on couches in this game, makes them look so suave.
Also very much so loving the [url=http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4865/?]custom combat armor mod[/url].
[QUOTE=Mr. Jelly;49614325][t]http://i.imgur.com/ES30ZvQ.jpg[/t]
Well, at least the art book was honest about who's actually in charge of the Minutemen.
The "wears coats looted from Revolutionary War Museum" bit also gives me the impression that Garvey was originally the only one who really bothered with the colonial aesthetic, instead of every Minuteman going for laser muskets and vaguely tricorne-looking hats[/QUOTE]
It's funny how the laser musket handle's on the right side instead of the left.
Also in other news, Dogmeat is our cutest new recruit.
[img_thumb]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/608351653795036629/E25FD3BC7672DD47FD33AB9039B6CA71CB078317/[/img_thumb]
[B]"Protecting the Commonwealth is the responsibility of every living creature!"[/B]
This is personally what I thought when I first saw the laser musket.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tNJeS6O6ds[/media]
[QUOTE=Dantz Bolrew;49614354]It's funny how the laser musket handle's on the right side instead of the left.[/QUOTE]
I did always find it weird how the laser musket seems to never actually be reloaded, just cranked without replacing the cells.
[QUOTE=QueenSasha24;49614398]I did always find it weird how the laser musket seems to never actually be reloaded, just cranked without replacing the cells.[/QUOTE]
when i first saw it i was sure it was going to be a hand-cranked recharger-type weapon, not requiring cells, which would make it clutch for low level players. it's also strange to me that you have to upgrade its capacitor in order to turn the crank any more than twice.
Well, [url=http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/9057/?]this mod[/url] should please people that miss the ammo types from New Vegas. All of this without the GECK, too!
I'm still mainly using pipe weapons on my current game thanks to this mod.
[url]http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/7556/?[/url]
I've got a pipe gun for every caliber except 12 gauge because I have an incendiary auto shotgun.
[QUOTE=DChapsfield;49614421]when i first saw it i was sure it was going to be a hand-cranked recharger-type weapon, not requiring cells, which would make it clutch for low level players. it's also strange to me that you have to upgrade its capacitor in order to turn the crank any more than twice.[/QUOTE]
Pretty sure in-universe you can keep cranking it for as long as you want, it's just that the capacitor isn't capable of holding a charge that's too high.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49614508]Pretty sure in-universe you can keep cranking it for as long as you want, it's just that the capacitor isn't capable of holding a charge that's too high.[/QUOTE]
That's what i thought, Someone should make a mod that lets you over charge it, at risk of it exploding in your face 40k plasma gun style.
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