Dark Souls + Demon's Souls + Bloodborne Megathread VII. Now Only Embers Remain - Games

[QUOTE=Nidhogg;49644678]The only thing that really bugs me about DS2 is how disconnected everything is, which is totally against DS1's level design philosophy. Take a look at this as an example. [img]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7835823/DS1MOD_dukesarchives.jpg[/img] I opened up the map for Duke's Archives in DSMODT; notice how the map has LODs for both the Undead Parish and Anor Londo. These LODs are in the same exact position as the real map versions of these locations, and vice versa for Duke's Archives. That way when you transition from one area to another it feels almost seamless. It's obvious a lot of attention and care went into how every location fits into the world without different areas clipping into each other. Meanwhile in DS2 you get shit like this. [img]http://24.media.tumblr.com/a4566e5973dc991511d9a1583f01e493/tumblr_n4je7xh8Z81r0r8nyo1_500.jpg[/img][/QUOTE] I honestly like that because DS2 always felt very surreal and dreamlike to me. In DS1 they tell you the history of how things came to be in the opening, whereas in DS2 the history of the world is more ambiguous and strange, like dream logic. Thats just my take on it anyway

I hate what they did to iron keep in sotfs, it's even worse than before and there's no way to rush through all the alonne knights straight to smelter demon

[QUOTE=Wulfram;49644748]I honestly like that because DS2 always felt very surreal and dreamlike to me. In DS1 they tell you the history of how things came to be in the opening, whereas in DS2 the history of the world is more ambiguous and strange, like dream logic. Thats just my take on it anyway[/QUOTE] This, I absolutely loved how interconnected Lordran is, but Drangleic always felt very surreal and dreamlike. The nonsensical level placement really helped emphasize that feeling, it's very different than Dark Souls 1.

nah it's just a shitty level design job sorry

[QUOTE=Nidhogg;49644678]The only thing that really bugs me about DS2 is how disconnected everything is, which is totally against DS1's level design philosophy.[/QUOTE] Aw, come on. We know you love that elevator to Iron Keep. [sp]<3[/sp]

DS2's overworld made no sense because it was originally meant to be fully open-world but it seems was cut down to a linear one much later in development, meaning connecting areas had to be cut out and stitched back together and everything was shifted out of place massively. so basically it's the same reason everything post-lordvessel sucks ass

The biggest difference in the level design is that Dark Souls 1 built a world, and Dark Souls 2 built levels. You could look up from Blighttown and see Firelink Shrine, then look down and see the goddamn plague dog on a running wheel making the elevator work. It was all very plausible, like some group of people could actually in theory build that place and live there. Then you have Dark Souls 2, where the elevator works because it's what brings you to the next area. The implication seemed to be that you were traveling all around the entire country, which is awesome, but the sense of scale really wasn't there. I thought the level design itself was pretty solid, with a few exceptions, and they really nailed it with the DLCs. Personally I think both schools of design are appealing for different reasons. DS1 really pulled me in because it felt like it could be a real place, whereas I just wanted to see what was next in DS2. The latter approach is definitely more "gamey" but I don't think that's an inherently bad or flawed thing. It certainly manages to pull it off better than a lot of games out there.

[QUOTE=DS_;49644751]I hate what they did to iron keep in sotfs, it's even worse than before and there's no way to rush through all the alonne knights straight to smelter demon[/QUOTE] Just do what I did and be so shit that you've killed them too many times and they just stop spawning in. It's the only way I'm able to measure progress in that fight; "are the knights still spawning?".

Even with the separated level feel, they took the lazy route for a lot of levels, Iron keep is tiny, Lost Bastille is forgettable stone rooms, the ruins part of the Shaded Ruins legit looks like an alpha version of the level, with like two textures, two types of enemies and a boss that is basically creatively bankrupt, all in one more or less empty level. And somehow they didn't give a shit about the primal bonfires, the main focus of the first half of that game, yet once you beat the boss? Shitty textured rectangle room with nothing but a bonfire in them.

It's not like DS2's level design is bad, it's just nonsensical. Imagine trying to watch a TV series, like Breaking Bad, with the intro and outro scenes completely cut out. What's the context? What's going on? Where am I? Who are you? It's just silly. It's still pretty good, but it's kinda not at the same time.

[QUOTE=MrHeadHopper;49645350]It's not like DS2's level design is bad, it's just nonsensical. Imagine trying to watch a TV series, like Breaking Bad, with the intro and outro scenes completely cut out. What's the context? What's going on? Where am I? Who are you? It's just silly. It's still pretty good, but it's kinda not at the same time.[/QUOTE] People try to use the "time is convoluted" term to justify it. Meaning, "See the castle? Walk through the tunnel and it's suddenly moved somewhere else. Why? Because your journey to the new location is convoluted!" If that were the case, then how come you didn't warp around to different locations in Dark Souls, the origin of "Time is convoluted"? Regardless, I have much higher expectations of DaS3, I just hope it still has a lot of variety, Bloodborne seemed lacking in the equipment department in that regard.

I don't think there was a problem with Bloodborne's equipment variety if you have The Old Hunters.

[QUOTE=BANNED USER;49645393]People try to use the "time is convoluted" term to justify it. Meaning, "See the castle? Walk through the tunnel and it's suddenly moved somewhere else. Why? Because your journey to the new location is convoluted!" If that were the case, then how come you didn't warp around to different locations in Dark Souls, the origin of "Time is convoluted"? Regardless, I have much higher expectations of DaS3, I just hope it still has a lot of variety, Bloodborne seemed lacking in the equipment department in that regard.[/QUOTE] Bloodborne had various blades, a stake weapon, a giant pizza cutter, a flaming hammer, a bow, a scythe, a giant stone hammer, daggers, katanas, all kinds of shit. There weren't many items total, but diversity never felt like a problem to me.

Artorias' screams of agony haunt my dreams.

Regarding a DS3 quality build, do you guys think it'd be better to go 40STR/40DEX so that I can use all weapons completely or to go around 27/40 so that I can maybe be a bit more beefy and less of a glass cannon, but only being able to 2 hand some weapons.

[QUOTE=Bathtub;49645825]Bloodborne had various blades, a stake weapon, a giant pizza cutter, a flaming hammer, a bow, a scythe, a giant stone hammer, daggers, katanas, all kinds of shit. There weren't many items total, but diversity never felt like a problem to me.[/QUOTE] I guess I did mean "quantity" my bad, since variety has never been a problem with Souls games. You're absolutely right.

[QUOTE=OzzyCockroach;49645993]Regarding a DS3 quality build, do you guys think it'd be better to go 40STR/40DEX so that I can use all weapons completely or to go around 27/40 so that I can maybe be a bit more beefy and less of a glass cannon, but only being able to 2 hand some weapons.[/QUOTE] We don't know the softcaps yet, nor the meta weapons. Don't concern yourself on an optimal build on your first playthrough.

[QUOTE=Bathtub;49645825]Bloodborne had various blades, a stake weapon, a giant pizza cutter, a flaming hammer, a bow, a scythe, a giant stone hammer, daggers, katanas, all kinds of shit. There weren't many items total, but diversity never felt like a problem to me.[/QUOTE] can't you transform your weapons, anyways? you're basically getting double of what it says on the tin

[QUOTE=BANNED USER;49646008]I guess I did mean "quantity" my bad, since variety has never been a problem with Souls games. You're absolutely right.[/QUOTE] That is true, but I think I'm okay with the smaller amount of weapons. Dark Souls 2 had a shit ton of weapons but many of them were very similar.

Also the DLC [I]doubled[/I] the amount of weapons, and the vast majority of those are unlike any other weapon in the game

I've forgotten how much fun it is invading earlygame as a Bellkeeper. :v:

I got the rakuyo without using the shaman blade and it wasn't all that difficult since my visceral attacks do a lot of damage. I don't like it. It just feels like the BoM but slower and the reach doesn't make up for the speed IMO. Bowblade seems really useful but only for co-op since most fights I'll never be out of range and behind the enemy to take advantage of the long range backstabs. For a quick backstab, I can just use the augur of ebrietas.

[QUOTE=BANNED USER;49645393]People try to use the "time is convoluted" term to justify it. Meaning, "See the castle? Walk through the tunnel and it's suddenly moved somewhere else. Why? Because your journey to the new location is convoluted!" If that were the case, then how come you didn't warp around to different locations in Dark Souls, the origin of "Time is convoluted"? Regardless, I have much higher expectations of DaS3, I just hope it still has a lot of variety, Bloodborne seemed lacking in the equipment department in that regard.[/QUOTE] Technically, you do travel to 3 "convoluted" locations. Number 1 is the Painted World...in a painting. 2 is getting dragged back in time to when Artorias was still alive. Via a portal too! And 3 is wherever the hell the Kiln of the First Flame is (the final level, place covered in ash, you traverse a weird-ass hall of light to reach it.) Also, travel back and forth from the Asylum is a bit weird since nothing ever changes back in lordran/firelink/wherever that place is, no matter how much time you spend at the Asylum. There's also traveling via the Lordvessel, too. You just pick a place and POOF, you're there, no time difference, its just like you had been there all along and just then decided to move about the area.

[t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CaGfvEZUkAA2xxN.jpg:large[/t] Felt like drawing my dragonbro. :v:

Boy, he sure has a big ole' club. And a nice hard board.

[QUOTE=Eva-1337;49647645]Boy, he sure has a big ole' club. And a nice hard board.[/QUOTE] :rrerr:

Haha, holy shit. Been wandering around Forbidden Wood for a couple of years (the place is a bloody labyrinth) fighting sneks and crazed villagers only to stumbled upon a ravine full of [sp]ayy lmaos.[/sp] Probably the hardest I've laughed in a Souls game, watching these goofy things attempt to claw at me. What the fuck is going on in this area.

[QUOTE=kobalt;49648065]Haha, holy shit. Been wandering around Forbidden Wood for a couple of years (the place is a bloody labyrinth) fighting sneks and crazed villagers only to stumbled upon a ravine full of [sp]ayy lmaos.[/sp] Probably the hardest I've laughed in a Souls game, watching these goofy things attempt to claw at me. What the fuck is going on in this area.[/QUOTE] Now find the hidden path with the pool of poison and discover something special ;)

[QUOTE=Cryomundus;49647482] And 3 is wherever the hell the Kiln of the First Flame is (the final level, place covered in ash, you traverse a weird-ass hall of light to reach it.) [/QUOTE] Don't insult the Kiln of the First Flame

[QUOTE=EliaMoroes;49648098]Don't insult the Kiln of the First Flame[/QUOTE] Man, the Throne of Want is such a disappointment compared to the Kiln. The Kiln looks like a god damn nuclear bomb formed a tornado in it, that entire area is there to contain the flame. The Throne is just a stone chair with a little bit of ash piled up around it.