Space Station 13 v11 - Admiral Hippie does bad videos - Games

[QUOTE=Cassord;47660486] I guess this just means that hippiestation is forever doomed to be a containment server.[/QUOTE] Honestly, it really is. All the medium and heavy RP servers are already fully established and working and there is [I]barely[/I] any chance for a new medium RP server to get a foothold and get popular unless they have something special such as a good new codebase. I was babysitter on Eden for 2 years and just like some Hippie babysitters know, tons and tons of the shitfesting players are banned on pretty much every single server with proper rules.

[QUOTE=pip12345;47660483]Hearing what the situation at Hippie is like it seems to be a copy of the problems that Eden had and ultimately caused its downfall. The light RP mixed with a lax admin interaction seems like a good concept at first but the absolute toxic playerbase of SS13 turns it from a somewhat open rp game mixed with gamemodes into a giant PVP valid hunting shitfest where nobody does their jobs and everyone is just looking for ways to fuck shit up and bend the rules. Nobody does their roles even in the slightest and just abuses the roles's access and equipment to be more "robust". It's either a cockwaving robustness contest or troll feeding grounds. These EXACT things plus some extra naming rules killed New Eden, when we switched from shitfest into somewhat more organized shitfest with proper rules the entire player base revolted and went to Hippie. You have to deal with the player base and try to get the best out of it because the chance that it will change without destroying the player count are very slim.[/QUOTE] i'd rather a tiny server over a shitty server

[QUOTE=Pigbear;47660718]i'd rather a tiny server over a shitty server[/QUOTE] It's pretty much the only reason why d20 still works with its very flexible ruleset; highest player count we ever hit was around 35, and most the time we're lucky to have 10 people on.

Had an excellent shadowling round on hippie. All my thralls and my fellow ling(mad props to you banana lizard) were at the top of their game rounding me up guys to convert and I ascended no problem only to step in my own rift tear thanks to lag. Still got green text though.

Now here's the thing, I remember playing trouble in terrorist town and the Karma system of that game tended to keep people in check without the need for admins. A suggestion for SS13 would work as follows. Every player has a karma value, only that player can see his own karma value, whilst karma might not be grounds for a ban on it's own, low karma would indicate to admins that this guy is a shitler and should be dealt with accordingly. You would get karma by finishing a round with no "karma infractions" and doing good things like giving dying people CPR, healing other people, possibly setting up the sing but I'm not sure if that's easily trackable. Perhaps all non antag engineers gain small amounts of karma as long as APC's on the station are fully charged/charging, security officers would gain karma as long as people are not attacking people and for stunning and cuffing someone who has recently attacked someone unprovoked. Scientists would gain karma for every person borged, every done shell that gains sentience, every time a non-harmful slime core is used etc. You loose karma by killing people as a non antag, provided they have not attacked you first or didn't pull out a traitor item weapon in your vicinity. In order to discourage valid hunting you do not GAIN karma for killing antags you only gain karma for doing jobs and only if you end the game cleanly. Now what's so good about karma you ask? Well aside from admin's being able to use it as a rough judge of a player Karma would mean players are more likely to get their chosen jobs. It would work on a roll under system. Say the "maximum" karma is 150, the game would choose a random number between 200 and 1, if that number is less than your karma you stay on the list for that job. If your number is under that, you get removed from the list, the dice is re-rolled over and over till someone is declared the winner. In case of people with the same karma rank, they get randomly assigned. Remember, just having bad karma should not be grounds for an immediate ban, however if you have low karma you could be assumed to have already been warned and them move straight to ban on your next offence.

Also just pointing out to sec officers. During my shadowling round It took me a while to get my first thrall until I picked a sec belt just lying around. The belt contained cuffs and A baton which basically allowed me to subdue my thralls. Mind your gear officers

[QUOTE=thisguy123;47660830]Now here's the thing, I remember playing trouble in terrorist town and the Karma system of that game tended to keep people in check without the need for admins. A suggestion for SS13 would work as follows. Every player has a karma value, only that player can see his own karma value, whilst karma might not be grounds for a ban on it's own, low karma would indicate to admins that this guy is a shitler and should be dealt with accordingly. You would get karma by finishing a round with no "karma infractions" and doing good things like giving dying people CPR, healing other people, possibly setting up the sing but I'm not sure if that's easily trackable. Perhaps all non antag engineers gain small amounts of karma as long as APC's on the station are fully charged/charging, security officers would gain karma as long as people are not attacking people and for stunning and cuffing someone who has recently attacked someone unprovoked. Scientists would gain karma for every person borged, every done shell that gains sentience, every time a non-harmful slime core is used etc. You loose karma by killing people as a non antag, provided they have not attacked you first or didn't pull out a traitor item weapon in your vicinity. In order to discourage valid hunting you do not GAIN karma for killing antags you only gain karma for doing jobs and only if you end the game cleanly. Now what's so good about karma you ask? Well aside from admin's being able to use it as a rough judge of a player Karma would mean players are more likely to get their chosen jobs. It would work on a roll under system. Say the "maximum" karma is 150, the game would choose a random number between 200 and 1, if that number is less than your karma you stay on the list for that job. If your number is under that, you get removed from the list, the dice is re-rolled over and over till someone is declared the winner. In case of people with the same karma rank, they get randomly assigned. Remember, just having bad karma should not be grounds for an immediate ban, however if you have low karma you could be assumed to have already been warned and them move straight to ban on your next offence.[/QUOTE] I had a similar idea where low karma could start you in the brig, or give you debuffs like being permanently clumsy, retarded, or mute.

Not sure how I feel about Karma. SS13 is a VERY situational game. For example, what happens if a non-antag pulls out a traitor weapon and gets killed? Should the person that killed them lose karma for it? Or should the person who died lose karma for having an antag weapon? Or should they both go unpunished? Imo not a sound system for SS13.

[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;47661057]Not sure how I feel about Karma. SS13 is a VERY situational game. For example, what happens if a non-antag pulls out a traitor weapon and gets killed? Should the person that killed them lose karma for it? Or should the person who died lose karma for having an antag weapon? Or should they both go unpunished? Imo not a sound system for SS13.[/QUOTE] The point is that it doesn't have to be perfect. Even if the system (or the players) makes mistakes constantly, anyone can make up for it by being good for a round or two. Punishments would only be dealt for the people who fail to make up for their bad karma over many rounds, regardless if they were mistakes.

[QUOTE=Naelstrom;47661097]The point is that it doesn't have to be perfect. Even if the system (or the players) makes mistakes constantly, anyone can make up for it by being good for a round or two. Punishments would only be dealt for the people who fail to make up for their bad karma over many rounds, regardless if they were mistakes.[/QUOTE] So your failsafe for the system is that I have to work to remove the punishment I shouldn't have received in the first place? Doesn't sound like a very good system to me.

there is no way that sec could ever get good karma and/or not game the fuck outta it ie if people in cells gives karma they will have fucking everyone on the station rotating through all those cells one of the silliest ideas, there's going to be so many ways to abuse it to earn karma and we haven't even talked about all the edge cases and strange shit that is literally the single best part of ss13

The only way any sort of karma system could work is if you had the admins watch players like hawks and add notes for every single thing they do that falls under shitlery. But I imagine that said admins would probably lose their minds after a while of that.

Earn Karma? What the fuck is this, no I want to play space station 13 not earn karma where does this kind of stuff even come from

[QUOTE=Smasher 006;47661366]The only way any sort of karma system could work is if you had the admins watch players like hawks and add notes for every single thing they do that falls under shitlery. But I imagine that said admins would probably lose their minds after a while of that.[/QUOTE] Don't they do that anyway? I've had admins who though I was metagaming because of a series of coincidences which is retrospect is understandable when you take into account Hippie's crowd.

[QUOTE=Pigbear;47660718]i'd rather a tiny server over a shitty server[/QUOTE] at the risk of sounding like a shill, Atlas sits at 15ish during prime hours and runs on Hippie code and the all the old coders from there

Just spent 20 minutes of downtime watching a team of 2-3 syndicate fail to open the wall safe to get the nuke disk. [I]20 minutes[/I] I'll give /tg/ one thing, people there actually know what the fuck they're doing. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] Now they're using the station nuke and managed to forget the codes. 10/10 [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] They set up the nukes, but someone turned the nuke off and then took the disk. One of the two final syndies killed the other out of spite. They also never turned the safety off. It took about 5 minutes for the last guy to realize the nuke wasn't even counting down. God damn these nuke ops are a new level of incompetent. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] Shuttle got called, final nuke ops said fuck it and is going to blend in and try to escape. This could have been over 30 minutes ago. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] To top it off, the syndies only used 27 TC. An emag would have ended the round about 30-40 minutes earlier.

[QUOTE=The freeman;47661796]Just spent 20 minutes of downtime watching a team of 2-3 syndicate fail to open the wall safe to get the nuke disk. [I]20 minutes[/I] I'll give /tg/ one thing, people there actually know what the fuck they're doing. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] Now they're using the station nuke and managed to forget the codes. 10/10 [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] They set up the nukes, but someone turned the nuke off and then took the disk. One of the two final syndies killed the other out of spite. They also never turned the safety off. It took about 5 minutes for the last guy to realize the nuke wasn't even counting down. God damn these nuke ops are a new level of incompetent. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] Shuttle got called, final nuke ops said fuck it and is going to blend in and try to escape. This could have been over 30 minutes ago.[/QUOTE] Not only did the person take the disk, but the person managed to hurl the disk into the supermatter reactor: [t]http://i.imgur.com/XEIvfK5.jpg[/t]

I once had the nuke disk in a wallet in a box inside a captain access locker in the testing lab toxin chamber filled with plasma, guarded by adult slimes, with explosives and unopened plasma containers wired around it.

Can you deepfry the disk? Having the chef do that, then have someone eat the disk might be the most hilarious 'Fuck you' to Nuke Ops possible.

[QUOTE=Dwarfy77;47662042]Can you deepfry the disk? Having the chef do that, then have someone eat the disk might be the most hilarious 'Fuck you' to Nuke Ops possible.[/QUOTE] If the disk is destroyed or unusable it respawns elsewhere on the station I think

that round was some serious shit wow i even had to go and play the gonk during it, wow

[QUOTE=The freeman;47662073]If the disk is destroyed or unusable it respawns elsewhere on the station I think[/QUOTE] Even then it won't let you deepfry it so it would need to be destroyed in a different way

[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;47661275]So your failsafe for the system is that I have to work to remove the punishment I shouldn't have received in the first place? Doesn't sound like a very good system to me.[/QUOTE] How is this worse than admins mistakenly banning people, or dealing inappropriate punishments? Neither system is perfect, but really I think all I want is for bans to not be the [I]only [/I]punishment. It's pretty obtuse, in tgstation, to get banned for 15 minutes just for saying "ayy lmao" in chat without warning; effectively ruining the round for you. Instead, saying memes or netspeak in IC, for /tg/, should make you retarded and hurt you or something. (Ironically there's a chance to say memes while you're retarded.) Maybe instead of banning people for IC in OOC, they could be forcibly ghosted and muted for the rest of the round. Instead of banning people in general you could perma-brig them at round start for every round of the duration of the ban. There could be miscellaneous punishments for various crimes, like being permanently blinded, slowed, fat, bald, you name it. Some of these are bad ideas, but the point is that it's dumb to just blanket all punishments with bans. Especially when bans are easily avoided anyway.

[QUOTE=Naelstrom;47662529]How is this worse than admins mistakenly banning people, or dealing inappropriate punishments? Neither system is perfect, but really I think all I want is for bans to not be the [I]only [/I]punishment. It's pretty obtuse, in tgstation, to get banned for 15 minutes just for saying "ayy lmao" in chat without warning; effectively ruining the round for you. Instead, saying memes or netspeak in IC, for /tg/, should make you retarded and hurt you or something. (Ironically there's a chance to say memes while you're retarded.) Maybe instead of banning people for IC in OOC, they could be forcibly ghosted and muted for the rest of the round. Instead of banning people in general you could perma-brig them at round start for every round of the duration of the ban. There could be miscellaneous punishments for various crimes, like being permanently blinded, slowed, fat, bald, you name it. Some of these are bad ideas, but the point is that it's dumb to just blanket all punishments with bans. Especially when bans are easily avoided anyway.[/QUOTE] Because you aren't looking at it from an admin perspective. You're looking at it from a player perspective. Not only that, but a computer can't draw the line in morals, literally what is defined as "good" and "bad". Your definition of good is different than my definition of good. I like to hack doors and break into stuff on occasion while someone else might think that should be bannable because it can cause mass griefing. I get what you're trying to do, but it's literally not possible to have a computer determine this. That's why ban appeals / admin complaints exist. And, eventually, should the appeal not go through then there are other servers.

Sorry, I didn't make it clear enough that I agree with you that karma system won't work perfectly. In the last post I'm just saying admins should have other punishment options. I've also never said that the karma system should replace admins. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;47662578] but it's literally not possible to have a computer determine this. [/QUOTE] Although this was pretty dumb of you to say given the fact that it's already been done with TTT in Garry's mod, and that it works quite well. Don't use shitty buzzwords and logic to push your agenda and "I'm always right" attitude on someone. That's not cool, man.

[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;47662578]Because you aren't looking at it from an admin perspective. You're looking at it from a player perspective. Not only that, but a computer can't draw the line in morals, literally what is defined as "good" and "bad". Your definition of good is different than my definition of good. I like to hack doors and break into stuff on occasion while someone else might think that should be bannable because it can cause mass griefing. I get what you're trying to do, but it's literally not possible to have a computer determine this. That's why ban appeals / admin complaints exist. And, eventually, should the appeal not go through then there are other servers.[/QUOTE] Perhaps 2AM me should not have been the one to express the idea, and thinking back having ways to "gain" karma is probably a bad idea. The whole point was that in TTT the karma number actually does a very good job at keeping people in line, all the karma number does is that when it gets low players deal less damage by a miniscule percentage, as far as I rember it never gets low enough that you have to shoot someone more times to kill them. The idea behind wanting to put a karma system or good behaviour reward method in SS13 was along a similar line, except that it would be mentioned that people with good karma will stand a better chance at getting the jobs they want... however assistants being uncapped makes this a moot point but the fact that a supposed punishment is there tends to stop people going balls to the wall retard mode. Yes, the computer should not be judge jury and executioner, rather a karma system should be an aid to admins. Karma should be there to punish shitlery behaviour that is definatly grade A1 faggotry. Slipping a guy or breaking in is hard to measure, killing random people might be possible. As I mentioned there should not be any form of automatic "hard punishment" in the end only an admin should be able to ban someone. What karma can be used for is a very rough judge of character, the karma vlues should be balanced in such a way that if you have remarkably low karma you had to really try to get it that low, an admin can then look at a players karma level and it might help in deciding if this guy just made a few mistakes or is a shitler in the making. And again, just knowing there is some mystical number attached to you that tracks how much of a dick you've been tends to discourage casual shitlery, yes people can just not give a shit and griff the place up anyway but those people tend to get found out and dealt with by admins anywho.

All this talk of a karma system is reminding me of how shit and prone to erroneous punishment FP's smartness system was

[QUOTE=Askaris;47664216]All this talk of a karma system is reminding me of how shit and prone to erroneous punishment FP's smartness system was[/QUOTE] It's because low enough smartness got you an autoban... and it became defunct after everyone and their mothers got a spell checker for a web browser. Even then there were words you just HAD to take the smartness hit on, for example shadowling would net you negative smartness.

[QUOTE=Askaris;47664216]All this talk of a karma system is reminding me of how shit and prone to erroneous punishment FP's smartness system was[/QUOTE] Only because of very obvious, very fixable flaws and an automated ban system. [editline]5th May 2015[/editline] Ninja'd, fuck.

There was an Infamous thread a while back when a guy wanted a bigger hard drive and was asking where good place to get one was. He accidentally pressed N instead of B and got instantly permabanned.