Dark Souls + Demon's Souls + Bloodborne Megathread VIII. At The End - Games

Wouldn't agree, strength wins out in DS2 because many strength weapons have very wide swings as well as doing a lot of staggering, but even then, it's not unheard of for a dex weapon to have huge sweeps. Strength is easier (mastodon halberd behind havel's shield, anyone?), but if you know what you're doing, dex is more effective. In DS1, strength weapons in PvE were good for virtue of staggering, which was great for individual enemies, and things like the zweihander made a lot of the game easy because many enemies were pancaked by its R2. The thing is, the slow swings became very hard to work with for some bosses. O&S are considerably more challenging if you try to take them on with a weapon that swings slowly, especially if you're trying to get Smough first, because Ornstein can pop in from nowhere while you're mid-swing. I would also argue the DLC bosses (which are the most challenging in the game) are made much harder when fought with strength weapons because of how much they like moving around, as well as how fast and unpredictable their windups can be. I don't think there's a single person who believes that it is easier to kill Artorias with something like great club or the demon's great machete than the great scythe or even the washing pole. In BB, I'd say strength is only comparable to skill because the whirligig exists. That thing is pretty much the best PvE weapon in the game. Aside from the whirligig, though, the other strength weapons have their uses, tend to lose out against the top skill weapons, especially since many enemies in PvE actually don't tend to have a lot of health. It is more efficient to quickly slice through them with something like the saif or the rakuyo or burial blade or whatever than use the heavy forms of things like the kirkhammer or the amygdalan arm. The fact that viscerals scale off skill also doesn't help. A build with 50 skill and the clawmark runes can do something like 4k damage in a single visceral, which is a burst that strength builds can't hope to match.

[QUOTE=PotatoArmada;49675842]And now that the greatsword comes with a "Guts stance" there's no way that anyone should use anything but that sword.[/QUOTE] is this true i need to see this? [editline]5th February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Samiam22;49676161]Wouldn't agree, strength wins out in DS2 because many strength weapons have very wide swings as well as doing a lot of staggering, but even then, it's not unheard of for a dex weapon to have huge sweeps. Strength is easier (mastodon halberd behind havel's shield, anyone?), but if you know what you're doing, dex is more effective. In DS1, strength weapons in PvE were good for virtue of staggering, which was great for individual enemies, and things like the zweihander made a lot of the game easy because many enemies were pancaked by its R2. The thing is, the slow swings became very hard to work with for some bosses. O&S are considerably more challenging if you try to take them on with a weapon that swings slowly, especially if you're trying to get Smough first, because Ornstein can pop in from nowhere while you're mid-swing. I would also argue the DLC bosses (which are the most challenging in the game) are made much harder when fought with strength weapons because of how much they like moving around, as well as how fast and unpredictable their windups can be. I don't think there's a single person who believes that it is easier to kill Artorias with something like great club or the demon's great machete than the great scythe or even the washing pole. In BB, I'd say strength is only comparable to skill because the whirligig exists. That thing is pretty much the best PvE weapon in the game. Aside from the whirligig, though, the other strength weapons have their uses, tend to lose out against the top skill weapons, especially since many enemies in PvE actually don't tend to have a lot of health. It is more efficient to quickly slice through them with something like the saif or the rakuyo or burial blade or whatever than use the heavy forms of things like the kirkhammer or the amygdalan arm. The fact that viscerals scale off skill also doesn't help. A build with 50 skill and the clawmark runes can do something like 4k damage in a single visceral, which is a burst that strength builds can't hope to match.[/QUOTE] two +10 great gyrm hammers powerstance in ds2 > literally anything else watch your invaders cower once they see you attack

You only need to get one hit in with str weapon and will still kill bosses quicker than weapons that can get 3-4 hits in. O&S are super easy with a str weapon because the first phase lasts for maybe a minute since you don't need to whittle their health away. I can also still get 3-4 hits in with the zwei on either Ornstein and Smough due to positioning and proper dodging. And Artorias is a chump with a str weapon. Dodge one attack then do a jump attack and he loses like 1/7th of his health. He's a fantastic boss, but he's super easy due to how open he is after most of his attacks. [editline]4th February 2016[/editline] Haven't finished my dex playthrough for Bloodborne yet though, so can't comment on that. The threaded cane is pretty neat.

BoM makes PvE really easy once you figure out the right combos, still I think stuff like Ludwig's, whirligig makes it easier imo

[url=https://youtu.be/eDWbZDWbnpI?t=3m37s]This is what I'm talking about when I talk about dex weapons[/url]. 7 hits on Artorias, would have been 6 if it he didn't hit him while he was buffing. There is also no world in which one hit with a strength weapon equates to four hits with a dex weapon, especially when you factor in weapon buffs because it adds a flat amount. That is the reason ENB's CMW balder side sword and oroboro's DMB falchion builds are as potent as they are. And if you ask me, the threaded cane is probably the lowest tier of skill weapons in BB. It looks cool and has good range for how fast it is, but the damage potential is low and its "master of none" nature really doesn't do it any favours.

[media]https://twitter.com/exploresque/status/695412665678598144[/media]

Really tempted to buy the Japanese version of DaS3 just to get it a month early. [editline]5th February 2016[/editline] Thanks From, how'd you know I love being gangbanged by an infinite number of spiders. [editline]5th February 2016[/editline] Oh God, send help. Everything is terrible and it's all my fault.

Dark Souls II has so many more moments of "Jesus Christ that damage was unfair," but it's still [I]fun.[/I] Currently cruising on past the Lost Sinner. I'm probably going to try and get to Iron Keep next, since I need the ember there.

STR weapons aren't that bad for PvP either. In the first game they deal massive damage at all times and will break your poise with ease. Don't get me started on criticals, either. In the second game it seems as if they are the most efficient weapons as stunlocking someone reliably is not a thing, making the increased damage per hit is a godsend. The new swing animations do hamper them a bit, though (especially since most UGS don't have wide swing arcs anymore)

[QUOTE=PotatoArmada;49675915]For maximum effectiveness str wins over dex in nearly all the games (idk about DeS haven't done enough playtrhoughs). You can drop bosses much more quickly. From do hate str for pvp though. I'm still sour that they got rid of the golfing mechanic for the zwei.[/QUOTE] If we're talking DS2 all you have to do for dex weapons to be 110% better than STR weapons in PvE is put on Stone Ring. Say you have a katana; instant stagger extremely fast 150 counter damage hits? Straight up unbeatable, this legit staggers as much as a goddamn UGS and during bosses you hit dudes while they're whiffing for crazytown damage. STR has never been very good in DS2 IMO unless you're using strike weapons, but this doesn't stop me from running around like an idiot with a Zweihander or some Greataxe and getting hit before I swing 9/10 times. STR in DS1 was actually really good and always fun to use, but you had to keep two weapons; standard Ultra prefix weapon for slow zones & bosses and a fast sidearm like a Claymore or something for O&S, DLC bosses, non-cheese Gwyn, etc.

[QUOTE=MrHeadHopper;49677365]Greataxe[/QUOTE] [I]Someone[/i] isn't offhand powerstancing one with a regular axe. [Editline]djfhd[/editline] Unless they changed it in SoftS, i haven't had the patience to mess around with that one much.

4/5 giant souls and Vendrick is only taking 60 damage per hit, he's fucking tough for a lanky old corpse.

And as Freja jumps on me twice and then immediately lasers me as i run away instead of attacking any of the three phantoma and her Spiderlings being more aggressive than they ever have been in any attempt ever, and having an annoying time getting to the boss to begin with, i can confidently say i'm uninstalling SotfS and never reinstalling it.

[QUOTE=Creeper;49677417]4/5 giant souls and Vendrick is only taking 60 damage per hit, he's fucking tough for a lanky old corpse.[/QUOTE] are you in NG? What weapon are you using? At 4 souls I did 175 damage a pop with a +10 Longsword

[QUOTE=Creeper;49677417]4/5 giant souls and Vendrick is only taking 60 damage per hit, he's fucking tough for a lanky old corpse.[/QUOTE] Next time do it ng+ with broken cestus and no souls

I am thoroughly enjoying my +10 club and large club. Apart from the large club swinging like shit and taking durability damage from fucking everything. Gotta smash dudes in armour. Str builds are sub-optimal. But quite fun when you enter pancacke town.

If the channeler's trident makes it back a third time would it's blade arts be break dancing so hard your enemy breaks their ankles trying to keep up

I hope Power Within comes back. Also, apparently there was an Overkill feature in Dark Souls that I never noticed until today reading the Wiki on Power Within. I hope that comes back too.

[QUOTE=Daemon White;49678166]I hope Power Within comes back. Also, apparently there was an Overkill feature in Dark Souls that I never noticed until today reading the Wiki on Power Within. I hope that comes back too.[/QUOTE] I just looked that up. So if you do 1.5x or more of the enemy's whole health bar in one hit, it would give you bonus souls? And it makes a different "soul absorb" sound, too. Well, that explains a mystery I never really wondered about :v:

[QUOTE=Lunik;49678204]I just looked that up. So if you do 1.5x or more of the enemy's whole health bar in one hit, it would give you bonus souls? And it makes a different "soul absorb" sound, too. Well, that explains a mystery I never really wondered about :v:[/QUOTE] Yep. It obviously mostly happens on the initial hollows you fight. The absorption effect becomes much brighter and the noise encompasses a slightly wider range of tones whilst being a bit more loud and drawn out

[QUOTE=KaptonJack;49677105]Dark Souls II has so many more moments of "Jesus Christ that damage was unfair," but it's still [I]fun.[/I] Currently cruising on past the Lost Sinner. I'm probably going to try and get to Iron Keep next, since I need the ember there.[/QUOTE] This is late but I honestly felt this was more prominent in Bloodborne, at least in NG+. Basically every boss does half my health with each attack. This is negated by being able to whack my health back and what not, but seriously, some enemies do insane damage.

[QUOTE=Lunik;49678204]I just looked that up. So if you do 1.5x or more of the enemy's whole health bar in one hit, it would give you bonus souls? And it makes a different "soul absorb" sound, too. Well, that explains a mystery I never really wondered about :v:[/QUOTE] Yep. And that 1.5x does not include whether they were full health or not. So they could have 1hp and then you do a back stab that would originally do a little over half their full health and it would count (51 damage to an enemy that has 1 / 100 health would count.)

[QUOTE=Bathtub;49679450]This is late but I honestly felt this was more prominent in Bloodborne, at least in NG+. Basically every boss does half my health with each attack. This is negated by being able to whack my health back and what not, but seriously, some enemies do insane damage.[/QUOTE] On the other side of the spectrum, normal enemies and bosses alike recive fucktons of hit points

I'm honestly having more trouble with the first vicar than I did with OoK.

[QUOTE=EliaMoroes;49679889]On the other side of the spectrum, normal enemies and bosses alike recive fucktons of hit points[/QUOTE] NG+ seems like it assumes you at least get a handful of decent chalice dungeon gems, or at least have good stats +18% gems. Plus, counter damage seems far more prominent than in previous Fromsoft games, so you stand to get punished harder for poor dodging. But like bathtub said, it's somewhat negated by the regain mechanic as well as being able to carry 20 healing items at a time. By NG+ you get so many echoes that you can stock up to the point you'll never really run out.

[QUOTE=Bathtub;49679450]This is late but I honestly felt this was more prominent in Bloodborne, at least in NG+. Basically every boss does half my health with each attack. This is negated by being able to whack my health back and what not, but seriously, some enemies do insane damage.[/QUOTE] Bloodborne's NG+ is pretty trash, all things considered.

Bloodborne's NG+ is literally "you die more they die less," unlike all of the previous games where the NG+ mode adds things, DS2 did it especially right, even adding stuff in later NG cycles.

DS2 was the only one to add things. DS1 added Gwyn's stuff to Domnhall's inventory and you could get his sword, but aside from that, it did not add anything new.

[QUOTE=Zeos;49680098]Bloodborne's NG+ is pretty trash, all things considered.[/QUOTE] I will honestly say that Dark Souls 2's NG+ was handled very well. I love that things actually [I]changed[/I], enemies weren't just twice as hard.

[QUOTE=Bathtub;49680381]I will honestly say that Dark Souls 2's NG+ was handled very well. I love that things actually [I]changed[/I], enemies weren't just twice as hard.[/QUOTE] If only the balance on later NG+ wasn't as bad, it'd be a total bonus, but even that after a certain point becomes just stupidly unfairly balanced