Star Citizen Megathread - Fly FREE thru Dec 14th! Link in OP - Games

More leak stuff [video=youtube;sg_kjRjAoCA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=sg_kjRjAoCA[/video]

more more leak stuff, album of the current whiteboxing for the pegasus escort carrier. long bugger [url]http://imgur.com/gallery/4OIcG[/url]

[QUOTE=dai;47833538]more more leak stuff, album of the current whiteboxing for the pegasus escort carrier. long bugger [url]http://imgur.com/gallery/4OIcG[/url][/QUOTE] holy hell that is a neat design. Seems fun to fly out of and land in too, bit of a challenge but thats part of the fun :D I keep forgetting that the scale of this game is quite impressive. Is this ship going to be seeded for player use in any fashion as well?

Considering its on the Bengal end of the spectrum its unlikely players will ever be able to just buy one of these. The only way to "fly" something like that is to capture it from the UEE yourself and have a crew to fly it and watch it because it's persistant and can't land anywhere.

[QUOTE=Why485;47834316]Considering its on the Bengal end of the spectrum its unlikely players will ever be able to just buy one of these. The only way to "fly" something like that is to capture it from the UEE yourself and have a crew to fly it and watch it because it's persistant and can't land anywhere.[/QUOTE] Landing is for chumps. Take a big ship and turn it into a flying trading port and hive of black market activity :v: Never set foot on the ground again and build your own landing zone. In space. With blackjack and space-hookers

It's unlikely that you're going to be able to buy or easily steal any of the military's really big toys (>1km-long capitals like the Bengal and Pegasus), but with the Bengal at least there will be derelict Bengals out there, abandoned, for players to find and repair to a flyable state. I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't any abandoned Pegs out there. Of course, if you bring a rogue Bengal into Terra system the UEE is probably going to want to ask you a lot of questions about where and how you came to own it, at gunpoint. Either that or they already know how you got it and you're essentially declaring war on the UEE by bringing the bagel to Terra. The Reliant Q&As are up. [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14742-Reliant-Q-A"]Part 1[/URL], [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14743-Reliant-Q-A"]Part 2[/URL], 3 is still to come. [QUOTE]“We took the newly revealed Reliant Model 0 for a test flight, and what we found was a genuine surprise! Beneath the sleek lines and the high-tech moving cockpit, the Reliant is a sturdy, dependable ship capable of any number of flight operations. We’re so confident with what we’ve seen that we’re offering the ship our prestigious One to Watch award as one of the top new spacecraft of the upcoming model year… Now let’s cross our fingers and hope MISC starts making final deliveries of the production model so we can start converting one for racing!” - “A Hauler You Can ‘Reli’ On,” Ship and Pilot, September 2945[/QUOTE] Guys, the lore posts are coming from the future-now future... (the game's "clock" is 960 years ahead of now; it's May 2945) If I ever end up making a pirate character, I want to form a band of gallant highwaymen, where we swoop in and disable a ship, throw in a smoke grenade and then board it, and then, at gunpoint, negotiate trading the pilot's ship for an Aurora so that he can fly home, or he can resist and die there on the floor. If he agrees to trade, he's ordered aboard the docked ship and flown to some neutral third location, where someone back at base has flown out a working, fuelled-up Aurora (with a jump drive if there are no safe places in-system; good luck in the jump point with whatever nav data was loaded in, you poor bastard). While his ship's being flown to base to have the numbers scraped off, the boarding ship docks to the Aurora and the delivery pilot and victim swap places. The new Aurora owner is peacefully left to decide his own fate from there. I'd even give them a Mustang or something if they surrendered right away. I just think it'd just be funny to be "ethical" shipjackers, where we aren't interested in killing you and breaking your wife and kids' hearts and ruining their source of income... we just want your ship and we're willing to leave you with more than nothing if you cooperate. I'd even let them take personal decorative items and stuff out, as long as it didn't afford them an opportunity to hit the self-destruct. Only one firm rule: Golden Ticket holders (if there's any way of detecting that in-game in space) are off-limits--you address them as sir or ma'am and allow them to go about their spacing business unless they're trying to kill you. If you have to go to the site and look up someone's profile, though, fuck this part, it'd make things tedious. [URL="http://imperialnews.network/2015/05/reverse-the-verse-episode-49/"]First post-leak RtV happened[/URL], I haven't watched it yet and I'm only skimming the notes because I have shit to do soon, but a few things: [QUOTE]A lot of builds aren’t suitable for PTU because they have tons of bugs that are very obvious and if they released it publicly, they would just get a lot of bug reports on things they already know about.[/QUOTE] This says to me that they hate it when people report things that are in the patch notes' known issues section, because it happens a lot. [QUOTE]CIG has talked to LEGO about the Hornet.[/QUOTE] Iiiiiiiiiiiinteresting... [QUOTE]- [Any big blockers?] Yes, but they’re feature-locked. - [Can you list major blockers?] Game crashes when you join it. - Feature locked – a new branch structure has been moved to. Main sits in the middle (its the one that leaked). Once a outside branch is ‘feature locked’, it moves to the main branch, so things can be worked on there. Below main, there’s the game dev and feature streams, and those are worked on daily. - FPS is in main branch, so it’s feature-locked, but now it’s getting bug fixed and fine tuned.[/QUOTE] That confirms why Gold Horizon/Astro Arena work more or less perfectly (less trying to recreate the parameters of Star Marine on a single leak client with rcon), but ArcCorp's buggy and Terra just doesn't even load.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;47834591]It's unlikely that you're going to be able to buy or easily steal any of the military's really big toys (>1km-long capitals like the Bengal and Pegasus), but with the Bengal at least there will be derelict Bengals out there, abandoned, for players to find and repair to a flyable state. I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't any abandoned Pegs out there. Of course, if you bring a rogue Bengal into Terra system the UEE is probably going to want to ask you a lot of questions about where and how you came to own it, at gunpoint. Either that or they already know how you got it and you're essentially declaring war on the UEE by bringing the bagel to Terra. The Reliant Q&As are up. [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14742-Reliant-Q-A"]Part 1[/URL], [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14743-Reliant-Q-A"]Part 2[/URL], 3 is still to come. Guys, the lore posts are coming from the future-now future... (the game's "clock" is 960 years ahead of now; it's May 2945) If I ever end up making a pirate character, I want to form a band of gallant highwaymen, where we swoop in and disable a ship, throw in a smoke grenade and then board it, and then, at gunpoint, negotiate trading the pilot's ship for an Aurora so that he can fly home, or he can resist and die there on the floor. If he agrees to trade, he's ordered aboard the docked ship and flown to some neutral third location, where someone back at base has flown out a working, fuelled-up Aurora (with a jump drive if there are no safe places in-system; good luck in the jump point with whatever nav data was loaded in, you poor bastard). While his ship's being flown to base to have the numbers scraped off, the boarding ship docks to the Aurora and the delivery pilot and victim swap places. The new Aurora owner is peacefully left to decide his own fate from there. I'd even give them a Mustang or something if they surrendered right away. I just think it'd just be funny to be "ethical" shipjackers, where we aren't interested in killing you and breaking your wife and kids' hearts and ruining their source of income... we just want your ship and we're willing to leave you with more than nothing if you cooperate. I'd even let them take personal decorative items and stuff out, as long as it didn't afford them an opportunity to hit the self-destruct. Only one firm rule: Golden Ticket holders (if there's any way of detecting that in-game in space) are off-limits--you address them as sir or ma'am and allow them to go about their spacing business unless they're trying to kill you. If you have to go to the site and look up someone's profile, though, fuck this part, it'd make things tedious. [URL="http://imperialnews.network/2015/05/reverse-the-verse-episode-49/"]First post-leak RtV happened[/URL], I haven't watched it yet and I'm only skimming the notes because I have shit to do soon, but a few things: This says to me that they hate it when people report things that are in the patch notes' known issues section, because it happens a lot. Iiiiiiiiiiiinteresting... That confirms why Gold Horizon/Astro Arena work more or less perfectly (less trying to recreate the parameters of Star Marine on a single leak client with rcon), but ArcCorp's buggy and Terra just doesn't even load.[/QUOTE] Ethical shipjacking sounds fun. But you need something big in which to store those ships. :v:

[QUOTE=paindoc;47834760]Ethical shipjacking sounds fun. But you need something big in which to store those ships. :v:[/QUOTE] just... fly the ship back? also- [quote]as long as it didn't afford them an opportunity to hit the self-destruct.[/quote] haven't they said something like none of the insurance would cover an intentional self destruct? Like, they really seem to be taking a lot of measures to prevent griefing, down to these two major cheap-shot things people would do: kill-on-sight pirating/grief killing, and self-destructing/logging out at the slightest hint you're not the one who's gonna be taking your goods to port

People'll still do it to spite you. I mean, you are very literally making them the guy who gets his face punched so hard he falls out of his car when Franklin needs a ride to the next mission.

added it to my previous post but since you replied already I'll just move it down here- (ideally) pirates don't want to get killed, because to them, getting shot in boarding action has way more consequence than the guy getting boarded and injured (this was mentioned to be balanced to make it a [I]serious [/I]risk/reward thing), so pirates would likely be courteous in the way elix described. Offer only to take a portion, offer that the person won't be totally SOL/killed. Plus, killing the dude they're raiding will likely get a seriously high mark-up on their own bounties and get them hunted much harder, much sooner than otherwise. this brings up a serious question though, what will they do about people who haul stuff with insurance, get "pirated" on purpose, and the pirates share a portion of the cash they earn from the stolen goods to pay the insurance premiums on everything AND give the dude a bonus? I don't think that'd be common, but I'm [i]sure[/i] someone's gonna be good enough with the economics of it all to figure out what products yield the highest profit vs their cargo insurance and such, then go about these rackets

[QUOTE=dai;47834831]just... fly the ship back? also- haven't they said something like none of the insurance would cover an intentional self destruct? Like, they really seem to be taking a lot of measures to prevent griefing, down to these two major cheap-shot things people would do: kill-on-sight pirating/grief killing, and self-destructing/logging out at the slightest hint you're not the one who's gonna be taking your goods to port[/QUOTE] I have a ship collection problem in games where that becomes possible. My hangars in EvE are full of ships that I'd mke or buy then never fly. Any game where I can do that, I do. Why sell them when I can build a collection for the hell of it? [editline]29th May 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=dai;47834863]added it to my previous post but since you replied already I'll just move it down here- (ideally) pirates don't want to get killed, because to them, getting shot in boarding action has way more consequence than the guy getting boarded and injured (this was mentioned to be balanced to make it a [I]serious [/I]risk/reward thing), so pirates would likely be courteous in the way elix described. Offer only to take a portion, offer that the person won't be totally SOL/killed. Plus, killing the dude they're raiding will likely get a seriously high mark-up on their own bounties and get them hunted much harder, much sooner than otherwise. this brings up a serious question though, what will they do about people who haul stuff with insurance, get "pirated" on purpose, and the pirates share a portion of the cash they earn from the stolen goods to pay the insurance premiums on everything AND give the dude a bonus? I don't think that'd be common, but I'm [i]sure[/i] someone's gonna be good enough with the [B]economics of it all to figure out what products yield the highest profit vs their cargo insurance and such, then go about these rackets[/B][/QUOTE] I'll bring my spreadsheets

I thought insurances only returned your ship for free. Cargo is gone if ship is gone. [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] Unless they will make it more inside box thing. Like flagging your lost cargo as stolen property and it would eventually return to you if pirate is caught.

[QUOTE=dai;47834863]people who haul stuff with insurance, get "pirated" on purpose, and the pirates share a portion of the cash they earn from the stolen goods to pay the insurance premiums on everything AND give the dude a bonus[/QUOTE] This becomes a game of hiding your transactions from CIG's anti-fraud algorithms/observations through chains of alts, and if it doesn't, you'll get caught as it rapidly becomes a pattern that Haulerbro X keeps getting attacked by the Blarg gang and surrendering with incredible speed and compliance, so much so that 80% of the time no damage to even shields is detected, and then there's a credits transaction to Haulerbro X from the guy known to handle the banking for Blarg gang. Same sort of thing as abusing LTI by arranging for it to be conveniently "stolen" from you as fast as you can cycle through insurance and stay below the cooldown-penalty rate (where ships start taking exponentially longer to deliver because you're claiming too fast). If you make the transfers naked, it's trivial. After that, it becomes a game of having to make sure you never taint certain accounts with accesses from certain IP addresses in order to maintain the illusion of multiple independent parties working without knowledge of a greater conspiracy--and this means VPNing your connection to the [I]game[/I] if you're going to try and do this yourself. Basically, in order to successfully pull off long-term fraud on the game's economy, you will need to act like a real-world criminal syndicate in order to make it worth your while and remain nominally undetected -- all for cheatin' in a video game. It'd be much more efficient to just own as many accounts as you need to hit the needed daily/total bought-UEC caps to sustain your in-universe consumption habit if you're that nuts. :v: [QUOTE=creec;47834889]I thought insurances only returned your ship for free. Cargo is gone if ship is gone. [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] Unless they will make it more inside box thing. Like flagging your lost cargo as stolen property and it would eventually return to you if pirate is caught.[/QUOTE] Hull insurance replaces your ship and is dirt cheap/what LTI gives you. Upgrade insurance will cover your aftermarket upgrades and will be considerably more expensive than hull insurance. However, you could also spend 10x the hull cost of a ship gearing it up with high-end equipment, so this fits. Cargo insurance is separate from both of the above and insures your load. We don't know how it'll work, exactly, yet. Also, hangars, at least on the ground, will have "Japanese parking garage" platter storage for ships beyond what your hangar is able to hold (and it does have a limit, and will continue to). You can rotate them out, but only so many will be visible at one time. Keep in mind you'll be paying hangar fees, unless you backed early enough to get in before the "free hangar fees on your starting planet" stretch goal was hit.

they're employing in-game fraud detection? nuts, but cool [QUOTE=creec;47834889]I thought insurances only returned your ship for free. Cargo is gone if ship is gone. [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] Unless they will make it more inside box thing. Like flagging your lost cargo as stolen property and it would eventually return to you if pirate is caught.[/QUOTE] so long as you pay the insurance, your ship is replaced (so long as new ships of the make are available) by the insurance company for a small fee (the "premium"). I know ships will have one insurance, the equipment is separately insured (otherwise you get just the stock ship back), and though I haven't heard if it's the case in SC, I know real products are insured in some capacity for transit due to the risks of damage/misplacement

They've warned us for months/years that they will take LTI away if they detect you abusing it to commit insurance fraud, and I have to imagine that Ben isn't going to be sitting there scrolling through a 20GB spreadsheet of the last 36 hours' transactions looking for fraudulent claims. There's gotta be something going into the economy system to monitor and detect oddities. I imagine that the decision to strip LTI from a ship a backer is abusing for fraudulent claims will be made by a human examining the data, of course.

I'm re-downloading all of the stuff for this. What new ships are testable? I've been getting e-mails for months about new ships being both available and on sale.

I guess we will have to put dashcams on our ships to prove our innocence to get insurance. Just like in russia! [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] I actually never liked the idea of insurances. This only brings more problems into game. It should just be like in EVE (which i have not played but believe its done right), if you die thats it. Kaput and no refunds. It is your fault getting into a fight. I see lots of problems regarding insurances. [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] Especially i see problems with lifetime insurances. Players with LTI will do risky stuff knowing that they don't lose much in worst case.

[QUOTE=creec;47835879]I guess we will have to put dashcams on our ships to prove our innocence to get insurance. Just like in russia! [editline]30th May 2015[/editline] I actually never liked the idea of insurances. This only brings more problems into game. It should just be like in EVE (which i have not played but believe its done right), if you die thats it. Kaput and no refunds. It is your fault getting into a fight. I see lots of problems regarding insurances.[/QUOTE] EvE vessel insurance is based on the cost of minerals used to produce the ship, and becomes rapidly worthless on T2 ships or stuff with funky market prices. It never refunds back the full price of the ship, usually about 70% at the highest level. It is a onetime purchase as well. Its nice for newer players but once you get to a high enough level of play losing the ship hull price is the least of your worries, and EvE focuses more on disposable ships than this game ever will (in EvE, losing a ship shouldn't even register at all).

CIG said that abusing the LTI to grief people etc will eventually cancel the policy

I say remove insurances completely, or do them similarly like in EVE. For example: One time purchase for the stuff you CURRENTLY HAVE, which will refund a % of the price if you lose it. Everything you get after insurance is not covered by it. This includes wares you got/ minerals you mined etc. So every time you get something new, you would have to renew insurance. This will make game more high rish high reward. And actually punishes you if you die. Please dont make this a deathmatch in space like elite dangerous is.

Please think of the people that are reselling LTI packages with stupidly high prices that would equal a scam anywhere else before saying remove LTI completly. :smile:

Yeah, they should never created such system to begin with. Causes tons of problems and doesn't really make game any more fun. It simply diminishes high risk high reward gameplay.

Yeah, but there is a balance I think. Part of EvE is just how [I]easy[/I] it is to throw ships away, but thats because you are an immortal super-rich damn near god-like capsuleer who doesn't get attached to his ship or crew. With Star Citizen, you are a normal human being in a much more personable starship that you most likely will get attached to for everything you've been through. Losing a ship should hurt, I think. But at the same time, it shouldn't be able to completely knock you down on your ass financially. A balance would be nice.

[QUOTE=creec;47836002]I say remove insurances completely, or do them similarly like in EVE. For example: One time purchase for the stuff you CURRENTLY HAVE, which will refund a % of the price if you lose it. Everything you get after insurance is not covered by it. This includes wares you got/ minerals you mined etc. So every time you get something new, you would have to renew insurance. This will make game more high rish high reward. And actually punishes you if you die. Please dont make this a deathmatch in space like elite dangerous is.[/QUOTE] consider that it's going to take roughly 50 hours to get a constellation now it's like eve where you can't use it for fear of losing it?

[QUOTE=krail9;47836120]consider that it's going to take roughly 50 hours to get a constellation now it's like eve where you can't use it for fear of losing it?[/QUOTE] Yeah, thats the thing. It doesn't scale like this in SC. EvE has easily disposable ships due to a number of fundamental differences on the gameplay/game-theory level between the two. And EvE's insurance doesn't hold up or scale linearly with really small or really big ships either. SC involves a lot more personal involvement with your ships; instead of having one disposable ship for a short period, each ship should feel like it gets well used and becomes a part of what you do. I also don't think its going to be a straight upgrade to bigger and bigger and bigger either. Its a weird debate and I don't think many of us have the right answers. For one, we don't really have enough experience with Star Citizen as a large universe yet to think of an informed opinion and its something that is going to most likely have to come about through trial and error during full release, if you ask me.

You want punishment for dying? How about being told about the real-life two-week delay while your new Idris gets built and sent to you as replacement under insurance? (May not actually be two weeks, but some extended period of time.) Insurance isn't some sort of magic bullet that solves everything. Besides, in EVE there's a culture of blowing people up; it's all there is to do if you don't want to mine or stare at spreadseets until your eyes glaze over. SC will have so much more. We don't need to develop SC like it's a successor to EVE.

essentially, you simply don't lose your ship when you die. because insurance is so cheap and ubiquitous, functionally it's exactly the same as freelancer or any other game, where there's no risk of losing your ship, aside from niche cases (stolen ships, null sec?) the concept of insurance and 'ship-permadeath' is just there to satisfy the question of "why do you still have your ship after you die?" for immersion, and will wont actually have impact apart from disguising normal gameplay aspects eg. getting a new ship from the factory = respawn delay, insurance payments = economy currency sinks

I think CIG have to ask and solve the question if we really need Hull and Equipment insurance because it hinders the very idea of a personalised ship and favours the default setups more. Cargo insurance I can see, because cargo is mainly for profit and you can't say the same for parts of the ship and most people hate permanent death. In relation to equipment some parts might be very rare , as for the hull hardly anyone likes the idea of permanent death requiring you to buy a new ship from scratch, so why have insurance on those in the first place? The freelancer death penalty is the best still and simple, no time-limits just cargo loss and distance travelled from your last save point which is a station.

[QUOTE=Toyokunari;47837626]I think CIG have to ask and solve the question if we really need Hull and Equipment insurance because it hinders the very idea of a personalised ship and favours the default setups more. Cargo insurance I can see, because cargo is mainly for profit and you can't say the same for parts of the ship and most people hate permanent death. In relation to equipment some parts might be very rare , as for the hull hardly anyone likes the idea of permanent death requiring you to buy a new ship from scratch, so why have insurance on those in the first place? The freelancer death penalty is the best still and simple, no time-limits just cargo loss and distance travelled from your last save point which is a station.[/QUOTE] It's a game that's all about immersion and trying to make it seem like it's not just a video game - so things like instant respawns, no consequences etc are not going to happen. There are plenty of features in the game that aren't 'fun' as such but they add to the overall gameplay experience. Permanent ship destruction and the ability to lose ships is a significant gameplay addition, it's a good thing. The ship insurance is there so there is some explanation for getting your ship back in some form if it's destroyed, and so you don't just end up losing everything all the time. It still gives you a choice and has meaningful gameplay implications - for example, a ship you've taken from another player may not be able to be insured. If you just got things back with no waiting and not much lost, that would break immersion and there wouldn't be much of a risk in certain situations. It's not going to be the sort of game where things can never go badly. Insurance and permanent ship destruction gives a reason to try to not get your ship destroyed and to be more cautious about what you do with it. It means you can't just go "My ship got destroyed, oh well". I think it actually adds to the idea of a personalized ship, if you just use a default ship because you're worried about losing it then that's your own choice, but having a specific ship that has survived for a while and that has been added to over time will hopefully make it more appreciated and feel more like your own.

I think Chris Roberts would like nothing more than for players to start to form attachments to long-time, trusty ships the way they form attachments to their car. "Come on, old girl, just give me enough shields to take two more of those hits and I'll have us into quantum drive and away from these dirtbags." [I]-bzapbzwapbap [B]Shields Offline[/B]-[/I] "COME ON, GIRL, YOU CAN DOOOO IIIIIIITTTTTTTRRUURRRRRGGGGGGGG oh god I made it out... I [I]really[/I] need to upgrade the power plant so I can get into warp faster..." It's not just a loadout and a set of stats and gameplay performance envelopes, it's a ship that's gotten you into, and out of, a lot of trouble, and has been the host to some thrilling rides you thought were definitely going to end in a sudden fireball and then the chill of vacuum. You've used it and abused it, but you've also repaired it and upgraded it, and as you and your character have grown over time in the 'Verse, your ship's grown with you. You won't want it to blow up, and the half a million creds in uninsured components won't sting as much as the shiny, new replacement ship missing all of the characteristic dings and dents of your old ship that remind you of all the good times you had in it. Sure, it's a brand new Mustang Beta and you've repainted it in your usual scheme, but it's not [I]your[/I] Beta; yeah, you own it, but it's not the one you flew for two years and that got you through all those jump points by the hair of your neck. It's not the one you had all of those experiences in. If it helps, imagine my post has the Freelancer commercial's music playing behind it. [video=youtube;vO7RxsZpcKc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vO7RxsZpcKc[/video]