Star Citizen Megathread - Fly FREE thru Dec 14th! Link in OP - Games

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;48287056] Also, [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14857-Star-Marine-Status-Update"]weekly FPS update.[/URL][/QUOTE] [QUOTE]And it wouldn’t be game development if we weren’t causing more problems for ourselves once in a while: we managed to break (AND FIX) weapon hand placement while firing.[/QUOTE] There better be a bug where the 3D model doesn't change when swapping weapons, so you end up holding a four-foot-long sniper rifle like a pistol. It happens in a few games and it doesn't get any less funny when it happens.

[QUOTE=ScottyWired;48292317]There better be a bug where the 3D model doesn't change when swapping weapons, so you end up holding a four-foot-long sniper rifle like a pistol. It happens in a few games and it doesn't get any less funny when it happens.[/QUOTE] You see, Ivan, in space you never shoot the inaccurate for fear of recoil breaking neck off.

[QUOTE=archangel125;48292145]When I read posts like this I feel really dumb, because I don't fully understand what makes some of the ships badly designed. I'm definitely aware that the 'rule of cool' is a bigger factor in Star Citizen ship design than actual practicality, as evidenced by weirdly off balance ships like the Mustang, and the bad design of the Hornet's maneuvering thrusters. Or the fact that there are ships that don't have an interior living space, which you'd think would be the baseline requirement for all ships in a space sim. But aside from that, I don't know what exactly makes the design of a ship, stylistically, better or worse than another by any measure that isn't subjective.[/QUOTE] The closest you get to 'objectiveness' when it comes to visual aesthetics comes down to "How well does this design express what it's meant to be/do?" The Constellation is arguably really poor at this, because there is no real evident idea behind it beyond "let's make a shape and then completely break up that shape". In my opinion, it does a poor job of conveying what it's meant to be because it's not a very readable design, as Why485 put it. Conversely, the Scythe is arguably a poor design because, despite how obvious it makes it that it's meant to be an asymmetrical fighter, it overdoes it. It looks imbalanced as a result, as if someone forgot the other half of the ship at the shipyards it was built. Good examples of asymmetry would stem from Homeworld (Vaygr [url=http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/homeworld/images/9/9d/Vaygr_destroyer.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20070518174342]destroyer[/url]) or FreeSpace (Shivan [url=http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/images/Sfdragon-old.jpg]Dragon fighter[/url] or Terran [url=https://p3d.in/IGlFO]Orion destroyer[/url]). They're asymmetrical, but they don't overdo the distinction from one side to another so far as to make it look like they'd be completely unable to fly straightwards in space, unlike the Scythe. This is of course all subjective. That's what ship aesthetics are purely, subjective/perception based. e: To be honest, I could probably go through the entire SC shipline and explain exactly what I don't like about each and every ship but that'd be super TL:DR and I'm bad with words so I've kept it fairly short.

[QUOTE=archangel125;48292145]When I read posts like this I feel really dumb, because I don't fully understand what makes some of the ships badly designed. I'm definitely aware that the 'rule of cool' is a bigger factor in Star Citizen ship design than actual practicality, as evidenced by weirdly off balance ships like the Mustang, and the bad design of the Hornet's maneuvering thrusters. Or the fact that there are ships that don't have an interior living space, which you'd think would be the baseline requirement for all ships in a space sim. But aside from that, I don't know what exactly makes the design of a ship, stylistically, better or worse than another by any measure that isn't subjective.[/QUOTE] A lot of the ships are visually overdesigned; they have no real distinct profile silhouette. It's just a mashing of random greeble. As an example, here's Batman in the Dark Knight, and here's a reimagining by the guy behind Kingdom Hearts. [t]http://i.imgur.com/8TwTebV.jpg[/t][t]http://i.imgur.com/A7Jp5Tx.jpg[/t] There's so much [I]shit[/I] going on in the reimagined version that it just blends into a slurry of black greeble to the point where he doesn't even look like Batman anymore. Ditch the bat ears and he'd look like he just stepped out of Metal Gear Rising. A similar problem plagues many of SC's ships, particularly those built by RSI, where they have no clear profile and greeble exists for the sake of greebling. Ships like the 300i and the Merlin are a nice change because while they have detail, they have clean silhouettes. Then there's the ships that are just stupidly designed like the Mustang and the upcoming Herald, which are incapable of flying in a straight line without firing their maneuvering thrusters to counter the main drive's moment.

the new damage system is awesome [t]http://i.imgur.com/sbb53d6.jpg[/t] (not my screenshot) [editline]25th July 2015[/editline] also boneitis

Has the new damage system been implemented in any of the other ships yet?

the herald looks cozy as fuck [t]https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/utioaauhgxfk2r/source/Herald-Pass05-Render01.jpg[/t] its also pretty roomy on the inside. i like it.

I really like it. Cozy is a nice description of why I think.

who doesn't want a seat strapped to the biggest engines you can find and as far as the center of mass talk on that thing goes, visual massing =/= physical mass distribution. The cockpit and interior are pretty much empty, the majority of weight is quite literally just the engines, they mostly just have to compensate for themselves. You could come up with a ton of lore-friendly details to explain it away. Like, it could be the most cost-effective setup because those two different engines generate JUST enough push to reach the desired speed, because if they're overpowered they're generating [otherwise avoidable] excess signatures that could compromise your position in sensitive situations. At that point, the heavy engine does more work and the majority of the ship's functions are built into the upper half, while it's most convenient for a pilot to perform landing/docking maneuvers at a low perspective, so the offset of the cockpit placement was done knowing the lower thruster contributed enough thrust to balance it out. or maybe we could just say the engines adjust vertical tilt to ensure center of mass is going 'forward' so there's little need to use adjustment boosters

[del]If anyone's patched and available, me and Jono are going to start a 1.1.5 freeflight to fuck about in ~10 minutes; he's got Scythe tokens. TS3 at pfrn.se as usual.[/del] There are some reported matchmaking issues, and Jono and I managed to get into a lobby together once but I couldn't ready up, and after that invitations stopped being delivered. Wheeeeeeeee [t]http://i.imgur.com/r9EISLI.jpg[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/i9iwRvb.jpg[/t] Hey, Warlord, whatcha doin'? Oh, [B]now[/B] you see them. (Warlord's radar couldn't detect the Vanduul so his ship sat idle until they came into sensor range, then his AI reactivated.) [t]http://i.imgur.com/OyI5mbi.jpg[/t] AI Scythes are also now flying blade-retracted. I guess nobody told the AI about the deploy-blade button. :v: [t]http://i.imgur.com/ihErPHw.jpg[/t] Sitting normally in buggies is broken. Again. [t]http://i.imgur.com/yq9eigv.jpg[/t] hnnnnnngggggggggg that detail A reminder that the Merlin is the first flyable ship to be made start-to-finish in the current pipeline and is essentially a demonstration of the quality level CIG wants uniformly across the ship pipeline's output. Existing ships will be given facelifts to catch up, as we see with the Connie and Freelancer rework due to finish with or ASAP after AC2.0 drops (which is, in theory, for real happening in [I]September[/I]). [QUOTE=archangel125;48292674]Has the new damage system been implemented in any of the other ships yet?[/QUOTE] The Gladius, only it was kind of buggy there last time I checked, where the Gladius went from fine to this at the first missile explosion, and that's pretty much all that it ever did. [t]http://i.imgur.com/OUupSB2.jpg[/t] The Connie and Freelancer are being upgraded to the new damage tech as part of their rework, and the other existing ships will be brought in line eventually. New ships should roll out with the procdamage skin as part of the ship pipeline.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;48294015]after AC2.0 drops (which is, in theory, for real happening in [I]September[/I]).[/QUOTE] [img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img][img]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/ratings/rainbow.png[/img]

So now that I've played Arena Commander in multiplayer for a fair amount of time, I don't think the changes to the flight model really affected [I]too[/I] much in the grand scheme of things. Dogfights between anything more maneuverable than a Hornet is still really annoying and not terribly fun, but it [I]is[/I] unequivocally better than it used to be. I like that everything slides around more, and I like that boost is now only used in emergencies. I'm fairly certain Star Citizen will never play like what I hope it will. Not in PVP, anyway. Hopefully once the bigger ships become flyable, there'll be less hyperactive gnats flying around being annoying to shoot down. It's worth mentioning (to me anyway) that this patch was [B]not[/B] intended to balance mouse versus keyboard in any real way. The gimbal versus fixed balance changes were mostly to address gimbals and fixed weapons. I still need to buy some more weapons and experiment on the Hornet, because it has the biggest hardpoints on all the ships I own. At least for the time being, I still think gimbals are better due to their amazing accuracy, especially when used with a mouse. Fixed weapons should in theory come into their own once bigger ships show up and your only choice of targets with your triple Mantis loadout aren't Gladii, Mustangs, and Avengers.

I'd say it's too early to judge the whole game based on single-pilot fighters in enclosed spaces. It'd be like judging all of WoW on the Barrens. A lot of the universe is going to be big ships. Also, [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/14853-Star-Citizen-Audio-Update"]the sound team has finished converting everything to Wwise, and the results are actually kinda impressive.[/URL] I linked it before, but it bears repeating. [URL="https://player.vimeo.com/video/134431811"]Like this session of tweaking the Gladius thruster sounds in real time and using in-game variables in keying effects.[/URL]

I think engine trails would go a long way in making the game not feel so... hunt the hypermaneuverable target box. At least with trails you can visualize where the ships are and what they're doing. The combat distances are so large in this game because the guns are so accurate (with mouse+gimbal) and the speeds so high that you can't really close distance and keep it that way unless somebody is doing something very stupid. The Hornet has an engine trail, but it's extremely faint and the only ship I can think of with one.

Wasnt feeling that Quantum Drive sound at all. Far too 80's sci-fi bleep bloop. Needs more raw sounds in there, like E:D's frame shift buildup sound!

[QUOTE=Sweeney;48294435]Wasnt feeling that Quantum Drive sound at all. Far too 80's sci-fi bleep bloop. Needs more raw sounds in there, like E:D's frame shift buildup sound![/QUOTE] idk, i loved it. sounded really "fuck physics, we're gonna break it". i kinda feel like a spooky droning "aahhhhhhh" noise should be present though. i don't know why, it had a bit of it in the first seconds of the sound clip and it might benefit from more.

Eeeh, wasn't feeling the quantum drive either, was too much noise and disarray going on, there was no clear buildup of energy, just random spikes everywhere. Also too much beep boop.

[QUOTE=dai;48293127]who doesn't want a seat strapped to the biggest engines you can find [/QUOTE] there are billions of billions of ways that this concept could have been executed and this is how they chose to do it [t]http://i.imgur.com/dpKMslv.jpg[/t]

The Herald is both a good example of Bad Ugly and forced asymmetry, assuming that image is anywhere near updated :v:

[URL="https://player.vimeo.com/video/133801690"]This is our most recent look at the Herald, and it's being made hangar-ready.[/URL] That video was at the bottom of the most recent Letter from the Chairman.

wow, they managed somehow to make it look worse. [editline]25th July 2015[/editline] like i'm not even going to talk shit, i love how much work they put into the game; that's seriously impressive.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;48295337][URL="https://player.vimeo.com/video/133801690"]This is our most recent look at the Herald, and it's being made hangar-ready.[/URL] That video was at the bottom of the most recent Letter from the Chairman.[/QUOTE] I wish they would shift the cockpit to be in the middle or top of the hull instead of the bottom

I think it'll probably look better when put in proper context and scale, like these earlier WIP renders from the Vault: [t]https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/rfr68t0xbcr84r/source/Herald-Pass07render01.jpg[/t] [t]https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/fa5btcbniuii5r/source/Herald-Mark02-Render05.jpg[/t] [t]https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/6vddva94ym8ckr/source/Herald-Interior_01.jpg[/t] I liked my ugly datajammer being asymmetrical, but I think I can live with this -- it's certainly distinctive, and hopefully those two big fuckoff engines on the back will make it nimble and quick at jumping to Quantum Drive. [QUOTE=Killdozer;48295368]I wish they would shift the cockpit to be in the middle or top of the hull instead of the bottom[/QUOTE] Keep in mind that the cockpit has an internal cabin, as shown above. The Herald has a crew of two.

[QUOTE=Mbbird;48295340]wow, they managed somehow to make it look worse. [editline]25th July 2015[/editline] like i'm not even going to talk shit, i love how much work they put into the game; that's seriously impressive.[/QUOTE] I think it's a lot more refined, like the various shapes and lines flow better, but damn they fucked up the cockpit placement, at least in the old one it looked kinda centred with that intake underneath

The issue is this motherfucker [t]http://puu.sh/jcZuy.jpg[/t] that curve... that shitty, broken, inconsistent curve, murders everything and makes sure that every single element in the ship plays terribly with every other element, because NOTHING flows with that silhouette. [t]http://puu.sh/jcZzG.jpg[/t] The engine is [B]WAY[/B] too big given how long they're [I]not[/I] willing to make the ship as a whole. It needs a much higher length:width ratio to work.

I'd do something like this (shitty photoshop warning) [t]http://puu.sh/jd2j1.jpg[/t]

[QUOTE=krail9;48295734]I'd do something like this (shitty photoshop warning) [t]http://puu.sh/jd2j1.jpg[/t][/QUOTE] The only problem there is finding a place to stow the 35-foot ladder needed to board it. If anyone doesn't have a package yet and wants to try a Hornet out, your magic word is QCFREEFLIGHT2K15 because there's [URL="https://robertsspaceindustries.com/promotions/quakecon2015"]a free flight until the end of the month for Quakecon[/URL]. Expect some technical problems, especially if your computer is not above average to beastly. I'm pretty sure that you will only get offline access with this code, but it's a chance to try it out.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;48295379]I think it'll probably look better when put in proper context and scale, like these earlier WIP renders from the Vault: [hidey ho imagerino] I liked my ugly datajammer being asymmetrical, but I think I can live with this -- it's certainly distinctive, and hopefully those two big fuckoff engines on the back will make it nimble and quick at jumping to Quantum Drive. Keep in mind that the cockpit has an internal cabin, as shown above. The Herald has a crew of two.[/QUOTE] i really, REALLY want there to be a way to make a chop-shop ship from this. like, rip out all the sensors and communications warfare shit and replace the power plant with something twice as big. bigger engine. then, you use the remaining space to fit two future equivalents of GAU-8s (but bigger, 30mm is so last millennium. 60mm self-propelled HESH rounds will do). i went and made a nifty traveller-style lineart of what i mean [img]http://i.imgur.com/XX6oAYx.jpg[/img] also if you run out of fuel before you run out of ammo, you still have a way to get home. [img]https://what-if.xkcd.com/imgs/a/21/jetpack_speeding.png[/img]

[QUOTE=Killdozer;48295368]I wish they would shift the cockpit to be in the middle or top of the hull instead of the bottom[/QUOTE] Yeah. Visibility would be worse but it would look so much better. The cabin could be accessed via ladder or some sort of elevator chair. Doesn't the Gladius or one of the newer ships have the pilot enter the ship via elevator instead of just opening the canopy? Give the Herald that, but for transitioning between the cockpit and cabin. [editline]25th July 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;48295743]The only problem there is finding a place to stow the 35-foot ladder needed to board it. [/QUOTE] Stowing the ladder would be the least of the Herald's issues when it would immediately topple end-over-end in atmosphere and then plummet because it has neither lift surfaces nor - as far as I can tell - any meaningful ventral thrusters. You could land vertically like those old 1950s scifi rockets, but then the ladder problem would be ten times worse. :v:

FWIW this is the structure of the interior cabin as of the time it still looked like this. [t]https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/xc66s47w95xozr/source/Herald-Pass06-Render11.jpg[/t]