[QUOTE=ASIC;49910088]How useful is the buying aghs for another hero from alchemist?[/QUOTE]
Situationally it can be devastating. Imagine a QoP with either orchid or bkb and aghs at ~15 minutes. That's just terror incarnate. Either it's off the charts burst/gank potential, or a teamfight god with burst that's still quite high. Some heroes like puck, or any other blink initiator with a decent aghs upgrade, will sometimes really appreciate the extra item slot it offers, since many blink initiators tend to build cheaper items like euls, on top of saccing a slot to blink, meaning they get soft six slotted much earlier.
Generally it's something you do later in the game though. Alch farming up a storm and giving someone aghs typically isn't as good as just some mid-high level farm on Alch himself. The hero is not ultra item dependent when played in a supportive style, but he sacrifices a lot if he isn't farming. Many farming items (radiance/bf/maelstrom) are enhanced even more by his passive, so skipping them to rush a buff on someone else severely slows down his lategame impact. It comes down to a game by game basis. Have a high impact hero with a good aghs upgrade, and the rest of your lineup can end the game fast? Probably not terrible to get them an aghs relatively early after one or two small items for yourself. Don't have that? Unlikely to be worth rushing aghs for other people.
[t]http://puu.sh/nCxo2/d9585fe8f9.jpg[/t]
[t]http://puu.sh/nCxk3/64b7ec7fdf.jpg[/t][t]http://puu.sh/nCxkj/d39e6df272.jpg[/t]
[t]http://puu.sh/nCxkQ/a485ac412e.jpg[/t]
[t]http://puu.sh/nCxl7/a554b8cc9c.jpg[/t]
[t]http://puu.sh/nCxlu/60a2a1e11e.jpg[/t]
they just keep coming
Abbadaddon without phase boots. :disgust:
And Slardar with phase boots.. which is not as bad, but pretty bad still
Can I get some serious, intellectual discussion on how this stupid shit is winning me games?
[url]https://imgur.com/Ae7FTaz[/url]
Talk about leveling Slar, I don't think it's necessary to max out Sprint over Bash.
So, you can go like 2-4-2-1, then 2-4-4-2. However, to benefit from maxing Bash at all, you're going to need Treads, but also a Hyperstone ASAP (with Moonshard following soon after) and the utmost determination to seek out for ganks and lone targets constantly (especially at Night time) with your Blink Dagger, which helps with Sprint being at rank 1-2.
And only as the side business, you will clear a camp or a wave using ult and/or aoe spell. Regen you get from Wand, Lifesteal and Fountain, much like an LC would, rinsing and repeating.
[QUOTE=mochisushi;49911078]Can I get some serious, intellectual discussion on how this stupid shit is winning me games?
[url]https://imgur.com/Ae7FTaz[/url][/QUOTE]
dude i've been on the receiving end of a utility kunkka player before
it was an absolute nightmare. that shit tears pubs apart if you can pull it off
[QUOTE=Bat-shit;49911110]Talk about leveling Slar, I don't think it's necessary to max out Sprint over Bash.
So, you can go like 2-4-2-1, then 2-4-4-2. However, to benefit from maxing Bash at all, you're going to need Treads, but also a Hyperstone ASAP (with Moonshard following soon after) and the utmost determination to seek out for ganks and lone targets constantly (especially at Night time) with your Blink Dagger, which helps with Sprint being at rank 1-2.
And only as the side business, you will clear a camp or a wave using ult and/or aoe spell. Regen you get from Wand, Lifesteal and Fountain, much like an LC would, rinsing and repeating.[/QUOTE]
No bkb on core Slardar? That's just going to get you killed a lot more often than needed.
Also worth noting that Slardar is used as a utility in higher level play and often gets tranquils/force, leveling bash last. Core obviously goes treads still.
[QUOTE=Bat-shit;49911014]Abbadaddon without phase boots. :disgust:[/QUOTE]
Abbadon should generally be getting tranquils because they help you tremendously when it comes to sitting in the back and spamming coil. Abbadon is generally not the person you want on the absolute front line. He should be behind the carry, ready to negate any initiation with aphotic, and continuously healing chip damage with coil. Tranquils let you more or less ignore the health cost of coil because you aren't in combat at all when you do this, so they never break. You effectively become a mini fountain with legs.
It's extremely irritating to play against that style of play because it lets his carry overextend far more than is typically possible. It's an excellent way to push highground because of that. It get's even better when you are protecting ranged heroes because you can sit entirely outside of sight range at night, or hide in trees during the day. How is the enemy team going to initiate when you negate nearly anything thrown at your carry, and they can't even see you?
Yeah, in that picture, tranquils into AC is pretty stupid, but phase is near the bottom as far as boot choices for him go, unless you are playing him as a core. Thing is, there are far better core heroes to be playing.
[QUOTE=SgtWoodsy;49909796]so maybe I should try a support instead.[/QUOTE]Well, that didn't work either. I'm boned.
[QUOTE=SgtWoodsy;49911234]Well, that didn't work either. I'm boned.[/QUOTE]
Why don't you just play with a buddy?
don't forget arcane boots abaddon to build into aether lens, that item is nasty on him
Am I the only one who prefers Arcanes on support Abaddon? Being able to Shield everybody almost literally whenever you need the first 20-25 minutes is insanely strong.
Oh god why
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KCAPhSf.png[/IMG]
He threw the game
Phase Boots mostly when and if you are getting some solo exp/farm on offlane.
And to be honest, Abba doesn't work as a 5th posi support with lower than average exp gain.
He will need more than just the boots to be able to keep casting, or to be otherwise useful like baiting/forcing the enemy etc., and also healing/buffing team mates constantly, and applying slow to enemies.
And nevermind that, but Phase Boots do work well with his auto-attacking passive as well. They are the cheapest option after Tranquils anyway.
@Zephyrs, and generally.. And yeah you will need BKB on Slar, or in most cases.
[T]http://pre10.deviantart.net/e46a/th/pre/f/2016/071/6/f/zet_and_his_army__dota2__by_phsueh-d9uspsd.jpg[/T]
[editline]11th March 2016[/editline]
[T]http://pre10.deviantart.net/855b/th/pre/i/2016/071/2/2/zeus_____arcana________dota_2_by_ang_angg-d9usnwe.jpg[/T]
[QUOTE=leonthefox;49910350]Yeah no shit, still I don't like the hero since for a hero with farming aids, it scales like garbage, and I see very few people farming efficiently then going to fight, instead of farming all game.[/QUOTE]
Don't judge heroes by bad players. Alchemist is in a fine spot right now but has timings that you need to hit
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;49910174]Gonna play Devil's Advocate here for a minute. There are actually some situations where getting 2-3 points in reactive first is justified.
If you are against a solo/duo lane that can't really man fight, it just lets you waddle into the middle of the lane dragging your massive dick around. Typically this is gonna be some uber passive lane with a hero like spectre. In the trench, there are plenty of dual carry lanes that can't do anything. Killing a timber with 3 reactive and a stout (maybe with a basi as well) is functionally impossible for some hero lineups, particularly dual melees without reliable burst/disables. So what if you wave cut? The fuck are they gonna do about it? Fly out some extra tangoes and bop some clowns in the face.
Itemization wise that build is beyond stupid since there's no value survival items like stout, ring, stick, etc, but there's nothing intrinsically wrong with multiple early levels in reactive. Just going off the items alone, it's extremely unlikely that that timber was thinking along these lines, but again, Devil's Advocate. There are at least [i]some[/i] situations where that skill build isn't utterly retarded, particularly in the trench where lineups that cannot punish you for it are far from uncommon.
Same philosophy applies with tidehunter too. Waddle into things with lots of regen and just out value them because you can almost always trade more efficiently (if they even have enough regen to prevent you from just sending them back to base/killing them in the first place).[/QUOTE]
I see what you're saying, but you are majorly gimping yourself if you go more than 2 levels early on. You offer no pressure on the lane with level one chain, and while you may be tanky vs autos at level 7, you will have no escape when the supports or mid lane come in.
Wave cutting is also pointless as you won't clear that shit , you'll just be sitting there slowly autoing since level 1 chain vs creeps is a waste and Q isn't super spammy.
Tidehunter has the benefit of being impactful in team fights only maxing his W & E because of ravage, it also let's him farm really well since ancients won't hurt him. A timber fighting with 1 in chain and 1 in q is super worthless, unless he's just sitting back spamming chakram, which is not efficient and hardly effective. And if you're playing for late with this build, you've already gimped your farming.
Atos is such a good item on any int hero, be it carry or support.
[QUOTE=Rarara;49893257]The CM arcana was stupid as hell.[/QUOTE]
Legion Commander arcana was stupid as hell.
No pun intended
[QUOTE=TeamEnternode;49912026]Atos is such a good item on any int hero, be it carry or support.[/QUOTE]
It's good on anyone who might need health and mana. Easy to build, pretty cheap and is overall just amazing bang for your buck.
the only arcana i would care about is the wk arcana, turning him back into boney king
Just take old model, edit bone textures to make them looks like ghosty and transparent thing, attach demonic flashy horns to explain connection with pitlord release and here we go. And recycle old voicepack to make everything rad.
[QUOTE=VeLlix;49912549]the only arcana i would care about is the wk arcana, turning him back into boney king
Just take old model, edit bone textures to make them looks like ghosty and transparent thing, attach demonic flashy horns to explain connection with pitlord release and here we go. And recycle old voicepack to make everything rad.[/QUOTE]
It's just fitting that a basic hero has a basic theme. He was a skeleton who happened to be a king. Rip in pieces bonemancer.
[QUOTE=KillRay;49911812]I see what you're saying, but you are majorly gimping yourself if you go more than 2 levels early on. You offer no pressure on the lane with level one chain, and while you may be tanky vs autos at level 7, you will have no escape when the supports or mid lane come in.
Wave cutting is also pointless as you won't clear that shit , you'll just be sitting there slowly autoing since level 1 chain vs creeps is a waste and Q isn't super spammy.[/QUOTE]
I'd tend to agree that more than 2 levels is very rarely a good idea. You can still cut and drag their wave around. Nothing forces you to stay between their T1 and T2 towers. Even with just 2 levels in reactive at level 3, a ring of protection, and a stout, you can get up to ~11 hp regen, and have about 13 armor. Call it ~18 with a tango active. That is already invulnerable vs a surprising number of lineups.
It comes down to a case of "Is it worth partially screwing myself over to majorly screw with 2 other heroes." Sometimes the answer is yes. Not often, but it does happen.
[QUOTE=Totenkreuz;49910009]What's with that CK texture?[/QUOTE]
A grievous fatality of low texture/shader quality.
Of the heroes, CK suffers the most from having low texture settings, as he ends up turning into some cardboard white instead of an iron grey.
[QUOTE=MaxisOp;49912981]A grievous fatality of low texture/shader quality.
Of the heroes, CK suffers the most from having low texture settings, as he ends up turning into some cardboard white instead of an iron grey.[/QUOTE]
jakiro looks like a fucking ps2 model on low settings
and im talking ps2 shovelware here
[QUOTE=ThatSprite;49913353]jakiro looks like a fucking ps2 model on low settings
and im talking ps2 shovelware here[/QUOTE]
To be fair he looks like a ps2 model on any settings.
Don't worry Jakiro is gonna get a remodel and arcana with the first actually new hero to release
alch is a cunt
[QUOTE=jp_rsardeto;49914548]alch is a cunt[/QUOTE]
alch is -25 everytime, it never fails
I don't think I have ever lost to alchemist, or won with one on my team
it's literally the 0% win rate hero :v:
I got to participate in Dirtmaul and won! I was in the "sub 3k mmr trash" game.
[QUOTE=Arktomys;49914764]alch is -25 everytime, it never fails
I don't think I have ever lost to alchemist, or won with one on my team
it's literally the 0% win rate hero :v:[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=KillRay;49911812]Don't judge heroes by bad players. Alchemist is in a fine spot right now but has timings that you need to hit[/QUOTE]
Literally on this same page
[QUOTE=devon_wargod;49914932]Literally on this same page[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure the only way you make Alch look like a bad hero is if you do any build that ignores acid spray as a skill.
It's his saving grace skill for laning.
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