Fallout 4 V24: You're Tied to This Thread Kid, Your Energy - Games

[QUOTE=overwatch pvt;49369019]No, I don't. I don't think about how my character sounds. I think about why he's saying it, and what his angle is. My character's story is the important thing for me.[/QUOTE] Well, a lot of us do imagine how our characters sound as part of roleplaying. I would be cooler with a voiced protag if it was handled better but it's not. It's an awkward middle ground between past Fallout games and Mass Effect (for example) and the character isn't particularly compelling.

[QUOTE=overwatch pvt;49369019]No, I don't. I don't think about how my character sounds. I think about why he's saying it, and what his angle is. My character's story is the important thing for me.[/QUOTE] Right. That's fine. But some people think about that, and their experience will be harmed. This is a fact, and it's what I've been saying from the very beginning. Is that really so hard to understand?

[QUOTE=elowin;49368605]No, you really can't. The moment you introduce voice acting, roleplaying potential is killed. This is simply how it is. You can introduce a lot of different voice actors each with their own personality, but it will never cover the full spectrum. Ever. You can argue that simple text based dialogue doesn't either, and you would be correct, but it is much, much closer. And even having, say, 3 voice actors for either gender? That's going to take ridiculous amounts of voice acting, if the responses and the amount of responses are fleshed out in the least. Like, if you took Fallout: New Vegas, and made every single line the PC says voiced, with 6 different possible voice actors, that would multiply the amount of lines they'd have to record by a factor of about 3 or 4. Skyrim has multiple races and voices, but not nearly that amount of lines for each.[/QUOTE] Wait yeah, in Skyrim the main protag doesn't even speak at all really. So.. what the hell was I even saying when I made the Skyrim comparison? And yes I agree, if you made New Vegas, with all of its different player dialogues, with voice acting on top of it, then it would be Absurd. Simply absurd. And probably wouldn't work. However, in some fucked up theoretical physicist sense, I see the muted protagonist as sort of an outdated thing. A thing that people couldn't do right before due to resources. It's not necessary, but surely it can be done right. Now, the single "mono-toned" voiced protagonist [I]is[/I] one of my main few gripes about Fallout 4, makes a unique looking characters break down in immersion.. but I don't mind exploring the possibility of voiced protagonist, even in Fallout. In Fallout 4 as it currently stands? How NOT to do it.

[QUOTE=elowin;49369114]Right. That's fine. But some people think about that, and their experience will be harmed. This is a fact, and it's what I've been saying from the very beginning. Is that really so hard to understand?[/QUOTE] Alright, I get where you're coming from.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49369193]Stop saying that these things are facts, they aren't, they're just your opinions.[/QUOTE] Preferring to roleplay by imagining your character's voice is a matter of opinion, but saying a voiced protagonist can be harmful for those that like to is a fact.

Has anyone else had this problem? Im a level 3 gun nut, and I have the required items, but I cant craft this receiver. This happens with all my guns and their mods needing over level 2. [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/362902762339483396/5C66E10E9B583F469758BA062434DFEFB3762DF6/[/t]

It's almost abhorrent how Bethesda thought that, "Hey, let's give the players a really awesome character & face creation to make really distinctive-looking characters, but a single voice and not enough room to actually define their characters through different approaches and choices in the game!"

[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;49369373]Preferring to roleplay by imagining your character's voice is a matter of opinion, but saying a voiced protagonist can be harmful for those that like to is a fact.[/QUOTE] My first time playing FO:NV I roleplayed a psychotic mexican with the voice of Salvador from Borderlands. It got daft quickly.

Oh my god fuck these settlement missions that give you another settlement to take care of.

Personally, I think that the having fully-voiced dialogue become the standard for RPGs has done a lot of harm for the genre. Voice acting isn't like graphics, where the standards of graphical fidelity scale with the power of the tools at our disposal, voice acting is just as costly now as it was in the 90s, and that means that only huge companies or small companies willing to really shave down the dialogue have the resources to make RPGs that can survive in the mainstream market, and any RPG that isn't fully voiced has to be some kind of indie or AA throwback. I miss the days when it was acceptable for characters to only have their introductory lines voiced so you had a voice to hear in your head while you read the rest of their dialogue.

[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;49369479]Personally, I think that the having fully-voiced dialogue become the standard for RPGs has done a lot of harm for the genre. Voice acting isn't like graphics, where the standards of graphical fidelity scale with the power of the tools at our disposal, voice acting is just as costly now as it was in the 90s, and that means that only huge companies or small companies willing to really shave down the dialogue have the resources to make RPGs that can survive in the mainstream market, and any RPG that isn't fully voiced has to be some kind of indie or AA throwback. I miss the days when it was acceptable for characters to only have their introductory lines voiced so you had a voice to hear in your head while you read the rest of their dialogue.[/QUOTE] your own character perhaps, but I'd hate for the NPCs of the game to not actually make sound, that'd be awful

[QUOTE=Shirky;49369388]Has anyone else had this problem? Im a level 3 gun nut, and I have the required items, but I cant craft this receiver. This happens with all my guns and their mods needing over level 2. [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/362902762339483396/5C66E10E9B583F469758BA062434DFEFB3762DF6/[/t][/QUOTE] It's not showing all of the materials, for some reason. I don't remember if there was an easy way to check what the other requirements were, but if you get them then you can make it.

[QUOTE=Glent;49369554]It's not showing all of the materials, for some reason. I don't remember if there was an easy way to check what the other requirements were, but if you get them then you can make it.[/QUOTE] [url]http://fallout4.wiki.fextralife.com/Combat+Shotgun+Calibrated+Powerful+Receiver[/url] Seems all there [editline]22nd December 2015[/editline] Did you try having all the materials in your inventory

I know it doesn't fit the Fallout atmosphere, but god dammit it would have been hilarious to hear one song from Boston in the game. Or even a reference. Something. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGRrOEbY3pI[/media]

[QUOTE=Hamaflavian;49369479]Personally, I think that the having fully-voiced dialogue become the standard for RPGs has done a lot of harm for the genre. Voice acting isn't like graphics, where the standards of graphical fidelity scale with the power of the tools at our disposal, voice acting is just as costly now as it was in the 90s, and that means that only huge companies or small companies willing to really shave down the dialogue have the resources to make RPGs that can survive in the mainstream market, and any RPG that isn't fully voiced has to be some kind of indie or AA throwback. I miss the days when it was acceptable for characters to only have their introductory lines voiced so you had a voice to hear in your head while you read the rest of their dialogue.[/QUOTE] That's not to say it doesn't have its place though. Games like Mass Effect, The Witcher, Alpha Protocol etc are fine because you play a developed character and aren't supposed to make your own.

I've said it before, the problem with Fallout 4's voiced protag is that Bethesda didn't want to go all the way with the concept so it just kind of sits in an awkward spot where it can't quite accomplish its desired effect. There's nothing wrong with a voiced protag in a RPG but it requires specific writing which Bethesda clearly isn't used to.

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49369745]I've said it before, the problem with Fallout 4's voiced protag is that [B]Bethesda didn't want to go all the way with the concept so it just kind of sits in an awkward spot where it can't quite accomplish its desired effect.[/B][/QUOTE] That is literally everything in Fallout 4, it is there it is ok but it doesn't stand out as anything expectional.

[QUOTE=Combine 177;49369751]That is literally everything in Fallout 4, it is there it is ok but it doesn't stand out as anything expectional.[/QUOTE] Welcome to Bethesda's sense of game design since 2006.

[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;49369716]That's not to say it doesn't have its place though. Games like Mass Effect, The Witcher, Alpha Protocol etc are fine because you play a developed character and aren't supposed to make your own.[/QUOTE] That's pretty much my instance too. Voiced protags work fine when youre just playing a pre made character like Shepard or Gerard. Not so much for any game with any kind of customization system and non-defined, self-insert protagonist, specially if the voices (or in F4 case voice) are not nearly as customizable as the bodies The voice acting hurts your immersion not only because it gives your character a "default" voice but also because the tones and reactions will never, ever change, regardless of the character you're playing. That's not an issue in games like ME because you know that your shepard might be short and fat or tall and blonde, but he's still Shepard, but in a second and more playthroughs of Fallout 4 it gets really difficult to not be bothered by this fact and the limited choices just make this problem even more evident.

The set voice actor thing is part of the reason ive completely dropped fallout 4 after one and a bit play-throughs. This is the quickest ive ever had my fill of an open world rpg game, because why would you start over? After you do one [sp] pro institute and one anti institute [/sp] play through, you are going to have the exact same experience over and over at the price of losing all the intricate settlements you spend forever building. Why would i trade my mega settlements for a chance at seeing how a few main characters react to me saying yes slightly sarcastically this time around?.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49369836]It really sucks when you pick a dialogue option you think is calm, but the voice actor/script writer had different plans. [/QUOTE] "Sarcastic" is the most egregious violation here. You never know what the fuck that's going to be, sometimes it will be a positive joke, other time it'll be a thinly veiled "fuck you" or "no" response.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49369941]None of this is because of the voice actors, the problem here is that Bethesda's games are getting more linear with each new release, Skyrim had the same problem, 95% of the game plays out the exact same every time.[/QUOTE] that's why i said part of the reason. Having one set voice actor definitely makes the games replayability stagnate faster, because now it's not just the same set of lines, it's the same set of lines spoken by the same voice, with the same inflection, streamlined even further to fit a voice actor budget.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49369836]It really sucks when you pick a dialogue option you think is calm, but the voice actor/script writer had different plans. [sp] Like when talking to Nick about finding the Institute, an option is "you're one of them" I thought it would calmly be "Hey, you're a synth, maybe you can get us in?" but instead it was "YOU'RE a sythn SCUM" or something along those lines.[/sp] Like calm the fuck down dude, you just rescued this guy, it makes ZERO sense to act like an enraged gorilla all of a sudden.[/QUOTE] And on the other end of the spectrum the protagonist doesn't really react to huge events either (early spoilers). [sp]S/he's runs to a nuclear shelter, helplessly watches his/her spouse being murdered and child being kidnapped, then walks out into a wasteland to be told 200 years have passed and now America's a nuclear wasteland. The character experiences all of this in a few minutes but their reaction is just "Codsworth, I need to find Shaun :'(" or "Codsworth, they killed my wife >:(" and then they're back to normal.[/sp] There's no sense of trauma, they act as if they're trying to recover a stolen car.

[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;49370071]And on the other end of the spectrum the protagonist doesn't really react to huge events either (early spoilers). [sp]S/he's runs to a nuclear shelter, helplessly watches his/her spouse being murdered and child being kidnapped, then walks out into a wasteland to be told 200 years have passed and now America's a nuclear wasteland. The character experiences all of this in a few minutes but their reaction is just "Codsworth, I need to find Shaun :'(" or "Codsworth, they killed my wife >:(" and then they're back to normal.[/sp] There's no sense of trauma, they act as if they're trying to recover a stolen car.[/QUOTE] [sp]"Dude, where's my Shaun"[/sp]

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49369836]It really sucks when you pick a dialogue option you think is calm, but the voice actor/script writer had different plans.[/QUOTE] I dunno, sometimes it's pretty spot-on. [t]http://i.imgur.com/bBmknn1.jpg[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/9bA4Lf7.jpg[/t]

[QUOTE=Shirky;49369388]Has anyone else had this problem? Im a level 3 gun nut, and I have the required items, but I cant craft this receiver. This happens with all my guns and their mods needing over level 2. [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/362902762339483396/5C66E10E9B583F469758BA062434DFEFB3762DF6/[/t][/QUOTE] Are you sure you don't have that mod installed already?

It's not exactly surprising that people are getting burned out after playing the game for hundreds of hours. [editline]22nd December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Atlascore;49370143]A lack of choice and consequence is the real killer of replayability, especially in a game that takes dozens of hours to complete. New Vegas is still going to have great replayability a decade from now because of all the different ways the story and quests can play out. But Fallout 4? One playthrough and you're practically done, voices or not.[/QUOTE] People said the same thing about Skyrim and it's still one of the most played games on Steam

[QUOTE=Bread_Baron;49370071]And on the other end of the spectrum the protagonist doesn't really react to huge events either (early spoilers). [sp]S/he's runs to a nuclear shelter, helplessly watches his/her spouse being murdered and child being kidnapped, then walks out into a wasteland to be told 200 years have passed and now America's a nuclear wasteland. The character experiences all of this in a few minutes but their reaction is just "Codsworth, I need to find Shaun :'(" or "Codsworth, they killed my wife >:(" and then they're back to normal.[/sp] There's no sense of trauma, they act as if they're trying to recover a stolen car.[/QUOTE] Yeah, it also breaks immersion massively when you are feeling one emotion and your character expresses another. I just got done reading a pretty morbid terminal diary about the experiences of a little girl from a Chinese family hiding from US soldiers who were trying to send them to camps. So obviously i was in a sombre mood as i stepped away from the terminal, but apparently my character was slightly less bothered by the events of the past because he proceeded to yell [B]"NICE!!!!"[/B] when i unlocked the desk the terminal was sat on about 3 seconds later.

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49370162]Yeah because of mods, the core game still has the replayability of a toaster manual.[/QUOTE] That doesn't really invalidate my point. I got bored of vanilla Skyrim relatively fast as well and mods make me go back to it regularly to the point where I have 800 hours on the game.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49370178]It does, the vanilla game is as exciting as boiling an egg.[/QUOTE] My game's still vanilla with the exception of very minor mods (nothing that drastically changes gameplay to any extent) and I have 200 hours into the game, still counting. I'm not forcing myself to play it, I just get drawn back into the game frequently. A lot of people who visit this thread are still actively posting pics of their characters, some of which have been the same since release. I think it's a pretty solid indication that the game has stuff to, judging by the fact people have been playing it steadily for two months.