Fallout 4 V24: You're Tied to This Thread Kid, Your Energy - Games

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399209]What's the point of having skill points act like ranks? That's not like how the old system worked. To make the system work you need to step off the idea that skills are ranked perks, and make it a totally separate system that fills up the gaps where the skill perk things came into picture. I honestly don't get what you mean with "fucking shit up" and "fucking mess" because as long as it's implemented correctly there are no problems?[/QUOTE] You have to make the skill system behave like perk ranks because it's very doubtful any of the values that were once used for skills are still present in the game, so unless you plan on emulating them with new scripts and values (which would be taxing and slow down the game), you'd have to essentially mimic the old system with perks. Also, modding's still modding. Script-heavy mods are notorious for being very resource intensive and even after four years some of the more expansive mods for Skyrim are still incredibly heavy on your CPU and tend to create save bloating because of all the values and scripts they throw in. Changing already existing systems (the way you get XP, what perks you level up and what they do) is completely different and far less resource heavy than implement a brand new system which is what you want to see in Fallout 4.

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399209]What's the point of having skill points act like ranks? That's not like how the old system worked. To make the system work you need to step off the idea that skills are ranked perks, and make it a totally separate system that fills up the gaps where the skill perk things came into picture. I honestly don't get what you mean with "fucking shit up" and "fucking mess" because as long as it's implemented correctly there are no problems?[/QUOTE] The creation kit isn't nearly powerful enough to straight up add something like that. For how much Bethsoft games are lauded for their modability, they really are extremely limited. The actual effects of each individual rank in a skill would most likely have to be represented through a dummy perk, or a status condition.

Saying that TES/Fallout modding is "massively limited" is a pretty big exaggeration but the system has its limits when it comes to addition of new scripts, and even more limits when it comes to actual compatibility between mods.

I just want the ability to get better at a mundane skill and get cool ability at the same time

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49399241]Saying that TES/Fallout modding is "massively limited" is a pretty big exaggeration but the system has its limits when it comes to addition of new scripts, and even more limits when it comes to actual compatibility between mods.[/QUOTE] No, it really is extremely limited. For instance, in Skyrim it was not even possible to, say, add a new weapon type with it's own animations. It was simply not possible, you couldn't do it. It was also entirely impossible to add a new skill to the game. You could modify the old ones, even completely change them, but never add a new one. And one thing in particular that always bugged me was that the simple fact that you cannot attack while in the air or underwater was hardcoded into the game. Many, many things are hardcoded into their games. Bethsoft games aren't considered highly modable because you can change just about everything, but because most of the things you can change are easy to change.

Because you can't add new animations used only for a certain weapon or new skill trees (despite being able to edit [I]everything within the existing trees[/I] doesn't mean the entire system is limited. There's still a fucking ton you can do.

[QUOTE=elowin;49399273]No, it really is extremely limited. [B]For instance, in Skyrim it was not even possible to, say, add a new weapon type with it's own animations. It was simply not possible, you couldn't do it.[/B] It was also entirely impossible to add a new skill to the game. You could modify the old ones, even completely change them, but never add a new one. And one thing in particular that always bugged me was that the simple fact that you cannot attack while in the air or underwater was hardcoded into the game. Many, many things are hardcoded into their games. Bethsoft games aren't considered highly modable because you can change just about everything, but because most of the things you can change are easy to change.[/QUOTE] Not strictly true, but it took [URL="http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/62609/?"]4 years to figure it out.[/URL] The newest version of Frostfall kind of adds new skills, but it's definitely a workaround.

at least, fallout 4 added jump shooting i think they've really managed to pull off some great shooting controls this time around, i don't really see anything that needs to be modded out or in this time around (well, except for the fact that you can't jump and melee for whatever the fuck reason god damn why)

Anyone know why using either Alternate Settlements or Industrial Bridges causes my game to crash when I open the settlement menu? Either mod does it, it only works if both are disabled. Did I miss something?

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49399282]Because you can't add new animations used only for a certain weapon or new skill trees (despite being able to edit [I]everything within the existing trees[/I] doesn't mean the entire system is limited. There's still a fucking ton you can do.[/QUOTE] There's a fuckton that you cannot do, that is the definition of limited. The fact that you can add new scripts is a pretty big deal, I'll give you that, but pretty much everything else? Adding new items or actors, or new areas? It's not really a big deal. The big deal is that the creation kit is a relatively easy to use tool. [QUOTE=IrishBandit;49399303]Not strictly true, but it took [URL="http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/62609/?"]4 years to figure it out.[/URL] The newest version of Frostfall kind of adds new skills, but it's definitely a workaround.[/QUOTE] So is that. If I remember correctly, that mod doesn't work in first person. The reason for that is, it's not actually adding a new type of weapon, it's essentially using the idle animation system to play the "weapon" animations whenever you have a spear equipped or attack with it and so on. For this reason, it can only be used in 3rd person, and the animations are buggy as all hell. It's trying to work around the hard limits of the engine. That's why it took so long to make, and that's why even now that it's around, after so many years of fans clamoring for spears to get added, it's still not that massively popular, because it's a patch job. It does as good a job as it could have with the tools provided, but the tools just aren't good enough for the job.

[QUOTE=elowin;49399344] So is that. If I remember correctly, that mod doesn't work in first person. The reason for that is, it's not actually adding a new type of weapon, it's essentially using the idle animation system to play the "weapon" animations whenever you have a spear equipped or attack with it and so on. For this reason, it can only be used in 3rd person, and the animations are buggy as all hell. It's trying to work around the hard limits of the engine. That's why it took so long to make, and that's why even now that it's around, after so many years of fans clamoring for spears to get added, it's still not that massively popular, because it's a patch job.[/QUOTE] Yea, and I doubt adding weapon classes to Fallout 4 will be any easier, so no pump-actions until a dlc adds them. Like how Dawnguard added crossbows.

[QUOTE=IrishBandit;49399355]Yea, and I doubt adding weapon classes to Fallout 4 will be any easier, so no pump-actions until a dlc adds them. Like how Dawnguard added crossbows.[/QUOTE] We'll see when the creation kit comes around. Either way, hopefully Bethesda does decide to add pump-action Shotguns in a DLC. Pump-action and break-action shotguns are the way to go, automatics are for little baby men.

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399373]Wait there are no pump-action weapons in Fallout 4? I haven't explored the types of weapons so much but that's pretty disappointing. Does anyone know if things like spears are still a thing though? Loved playing like a fucking tribal.[/QUOTE] [url]http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_4_weapons[/url] There is a serious lack of weapon variety in the game.

[QUOTE=elowin;49399374]We'll see when the creation kit comes around. Either way, hopefully Bethesda does decide to add pump-action Shotguns in a DLC. Pump-action and break-action shotguns are the way to go, automatics are for little baby men.[/QUOTE] [img]http://www.iacshotguns.com/dev/images/1887RGBsm.png[/img] I want my lever-action back.

[QUOTE=QueenSasha24;49399394][img]http://www.iacshotguns.com/dev/images/1887RGBsm.png[/img] I want my lever-action back.[/QUOTE] That special one from Point Lookout was the best.

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399373]Wait there are no pump-action weapons in Fallout 4? I haven't explored the types of weapons so much but that's pretty disappointing. Does anyone know if things like spears are still a thing though? Loved playing like a fucking tribal.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=IrishBandit;49399380][url]http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_4_weapons[/url] There is a serious lack of weapon variety in the game.[/QUOTE] Yeah I'm disappointed about no pump shotguns and no foregrip mod for the submachine gun. I also dislike how it's called "Submachine Gun" implying it's the only one in the game... I vaguely remember there being a wider array of weapons in a Fallout game, then I remember that game was New Vegas.

[QUOTE=LolzMan1325;49399404]Yeah I'm disappointed about no pump shotguns and no foregrip mod for the submachine gun. I also dislike how it's called "Submachine Gun" implying it's the only one in the game... I vaguely remember there being a wider array of weapons in a Fallout game, then I remember that game was New Vegas.[/QUOTE] Actually that game was every game other than Fallout 3 and 4. Even [i]that[/i] game. [img]http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/0/0e/BoxArt_FOB.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/270?cb=20141022004533[/img]

Important to keep in mind that the weapon modding system means there are less guns total because base guns can be modified into more things. There's actually more guns than Fallout 3 for that matter. [editline]27th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399438]Also no Plasma Caster. [I]THIS CANNOT BE JUSTIFIED[/I][/QUOTE] It's justified in the same sense as the absence of Wattz laser pistols.

I did a quick count: Fallout 3 - 53 weapons Fallout NV - 106 weapons Fallout 4 -81 weapons [I] *Not including unique weapons[/I] Also in Fallout 4 a majority of weapons are melee weapons or explosives, so that's where most of that 81 comes from.

I want my Incinerator back Also please Todd patch these in I want my dirtgrub barnyard shotgun [t]https://a.pomf.cat/xgzdgj.jpg[/t][t]https://a.pomf.cat/ptzaqh.jpg[/t]

[QUOTE=LolzMan1325;49399457]I did a quick count: Fallout 3 - 53 weapons Fallout NV - 106 weapons Fallout 4 -81 weapons [I] *Not including unique weapons[/I] Also in Fallout 4 a majority of weapons are melee weapons, so that's where most of that 81 comes from.[/QUOTE] Do the 106 weapons from NV count the returning weapons from Fallout 3 ? [editline]27th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49399463]A pistol with added glow-in-the-dark sights is not a new gun.[/QUOTE] A pistol turned into a rifle turned into a shotgun turned into a flamethrower counts as four different guns.

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49399445]Important to keep in mind that the weapon modding system means there are less guns total because base guns can be modified into more things. There's actually more guns than Fallout 3 for that matter.[/QUOTE] Eh, most of the mods are pretty minor. Just little things like changing a stock or barrel, or adding a scope. There's really only a few here and there that are especially unique. And quite a few weapons have barely any mods whatsoever. Like every melee, unarmed and heavy weapon, for instance.

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49399445]Important to keep in mind that the weapon modding system means there are less guns total because base guns can be modified into more things. There's actually more guns than Fallout 3 for that matter. [editline]27th December 2015[/editline] It's justified in the same sense as the absence of Wattz laser pistols.[/QUOTE] I don't think he means it's unjustified lorewise; it's unjustified in that the Plasma Caster is just too cool not to include. Also the X-01 feels so lonely without it. [sp]also where is my tesla cannon, they better be saving it for DLC also gauss weapons other than the rifle would be nice, I was really hoping we could mod it into a pistol or an assault rifle[/sp]

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49399467]Do the 106 weapons from NV count the returning weapons from Fallout 3 ? [/QUOTE] Yes, though without it's probably give-or-take half what I said. Most weapons did come back from Fallout 3.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49399471]When has that happened ever lol[/QUOTE] The Plasma gun can be turned into any other type of ranged weapon in the game. The Pipe gun, pipe bolt action and pipe revolvers can be switched between pistol and rifle, with one of these three also being changeable between semi auto and automatic. The Laser gun can be changed between a pistol and a rifle and on top of this can also become an automatic weapon and can be turned into a shotgun, most of those things being compatible with one another (meaning you get new types of laser guns that weren't in previous versions, such as a one handed laser shotgun). The Minigun can be turned into a variety of different models and can even practically be turned into a reaper.

[QUOTE=McTbone;49399459]I want my Incinerator back Also please Todd patch these in I want my dirtgrub barnyard shotgun [t]https://a.pomf.cat/xgzdgj.jpg[/t][t]https://a.pomf.cat/ptzaqh.jpg[/t][/QUOTE] Seeing as the model for the coloured Pipe Shotgun there is in the game files, it wouldn't be too hard for modders to add it in once all the modding tools are out. There aren't any textures for it currently, but that picture would definitely help people get it close to how Bethesda would have done it. I wouldn't be surprised if people end up remaking a lot of the cut content that exists in the art book too.

[QUOTE=TheRealRudy;49399497]Where do people find all of these artbook pages on the web? I'd love to have a peek myself.[/QUOTE] I find mine in the Fallout /vg/ threads

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49399501]So there isn't a shotgun you can turn into a flamethrower? Now I'm disappointed again.[/QUOTE] Technically there is since you can find legendary shotguns that shoot fire. Oh and you can put elemental/energy effects on some weapons.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/8NQOYss.png[/img] Each of these weapons having a different model to some extent, and having a different playstyle/being affected by different perks as well. I think Fallout 4 has pretty good weapon variety.

Lol, any idea what's going on when suddenly your game gets these 5-10 FPS drops, with sounds getting distorted for a second, where just [I]yesterday[/I] everything was rocksteady 60 fps, never happened before?