Half-life 2 Cut Content - Is it me or dose the cut content look better than what we got? - Games

I'm glad that the 2046 team re-implemented the error signs, Valve never gave those the attention they deserve

I want to bring back the "PENIS" error model replacements we had in GabeN HL2 to MI.

[QUOTE=Mech Bgum;48665595]Oh well, this looks like if someone been exploring all the textures and models and prefabs he can use while messing around in Hammer for the first time. And the lighting is so flat it could as well be compiled with fullbright. Virtually none would notice it. It's a shame those people can't use their time productively to actually learn the basics of good level design and content creation instead doing monkeys work.[/QUOTE] wait that isn't fullbright?

[QUOTE=Pigbear;48665608]wait that isn't fullbright?[/QUOTE] Looks to me like fullbright with fog.

[QUOTE=Mech Bgum;48665595]Oh well, this looks like if someone been exploring all the textures and models and prefabs he can use [B]while messing around in Hammer for the first time[/B].[/QUOTE] The author claims to have been mapping for at least four years! Also. Wanna know what's going to happen now? Someone will read these posts and then the author will start saying how these maps aren't in the mod, as if that changes anything. The recent screenshots are just as nonsensical. There is a windmill in the Airex, soviet trucks all over... well, everything, ridiculous cluttering of the Terminal plaza, etc. NervenHolle-team sees FFCM as the pinnacle of level design art, 'learns' from it how to 'detail' the environment. The result is always "let's put everything we can find in STALKER and Metro into the level so there's no extra square meter of empty space". It's what they call "enchancing and improving the maps". [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/12f0a/drbzki1bTZ8.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138c3/pDnrLc-IoMI.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138b9/OjLHvTzpM1Y.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/13873/oRthp00uL9Q.jpg[/url]

I just read a few previous pages, about all that drama and nazi shit... Holy hell, that was a huge trip to 2009, when I was heavily involved with this (and I think I still have my account on hl-beta.spb). I am surprised Doomlord was involved heavily in AGNMI, as he seemed a good fellow back then... Brb, gotta wipe those nostalgic feeltears.

[QUOTE=MI_Junk;48665706]Looks to me like fullbright with fog.[/QUOTE] It's not, look closely at the tower. At one point it was the intended lighting. [editline]12th September 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=MI_Junk;48665525] And this is the team that steals MI's maps and models and calls our mod shit at the same time. They're pretty much calling their own mod shit! [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqeMrJmiHiY[/url] "Let's decompile MI's Borealis, change all the textures and lighting to look horrible, fuck up all the gameplay, and make a general mess of things! No one will ever know!"[/QUOTE] Hilarious how there's stuff that was in MI but doesn't work in this mod. E. g. the flare rounds. Or another example, their Industrial is a "remastered" d1_fabrication and it has npc_childworker entities but of course they're unknown to the engine, after all they were only implemented in MI. The author didn't even bother to clean the 'junk' entities. Now, what's the most shocking thing is how SINCERE the author is about being all innocent and us here being "haters". But how can one expect all this to go unnoticed?! Alas they can't see the bigger picture and interpret this as animosity towards poor innocent modmakers, as MI being overprotective about screenshots and insignificant pieces of content. Again, it's that sincere belief in our wrongdoing that's most saddening. People are sincirely protective about their very weak attempts at creating something which involved stealing other's content, but suddenly we're the haters and we're wrong and patronizing. Wtf. Or what may be even worse, [I]there's plenty of people who support "double lighthouses in the Airex" and don't see anything wrong with this mod[/I]. Now, THAT is a sign of something wrong about the community. How about the fact that there's too many people, right here, who say there's something wrong with your work? Why, they're all haters, of course! [editline]12th September 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=MI_Junk;48665222]What measures would you suggest we use? No matter what someone is going to crack it. We already have our binaries set to only work if the current mod folder [..][/QUOTE] I'm already unwilling to let someone play Dark Interval because of all that. I suppose I shouldn't let smaller minds control my work that way. If we could have had access to encrypted VPKs that would save us from a lot of trouble but that only works with non-moddable Source branch. Great job Valve, once again.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48665906]The author claims to have been mapping for at least four years! Also. Wanna know what's going to happen now? Someone will read these posts and then the author will start saying how these maps aren't in the mod, as if that changes anything. The recent screenshots are just as nonsensical. There is a windmill in the Airex, soviet trucks all over... well, everything, ridiculous cluttering of the Terminal plaza, etc. NervenHolle-team sees FFCM as the pinnacle of level design art, 'learns' from it how to 'detail' the environment. The result is always "let's put everything we can find in STALKER and Metro into the level so there's no extra square meter of empty space". It's what they call "enchancing and improving the maps". [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/12f0a/drbzki1bTZ8.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138c3/pDnrLc-IoMI.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138b9/OjLHvTzpM1Y.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/13873/oRthp00uL9Q.jpg[/url][/QUOTE] Hahaha, I was kind of hoping you'd post these screenshots. Don't mind if I mirror them on imgur in case they go down. Okay, let's see what we got... [IMG]http://imgur.com/KT3uaDa.jpg[/IMG] Man, where do I even begin with this screenshot? This is the "farm ambience" Airex map I was referring to a few pages earlier. I guess the biggest criticism I have is the mapper has put a Ravenholm windmill propeller on an antenna array. This combined with the broken down truck, backwoods style water tower, cobblestone ground, and what appears to be a wooden shack on the far left, all make this look like some bizarre hybrid of an industrial control complex and a third world farming operation. This map is practically begging for someone to put a bullet between its eyes and free it from its tortured existence. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/O61PbCl.jpg[/IMG] Oh, Terminal, what happened to you? I am guessing that all these foreign props are from Metro. I haven't played Metro, but I don't recognize them from STALKER. Anyway, criticism number one is the oversized oak tree between the columns. I'm not sure if the author is trying to go for a Halloween theme for this map, but it sure doesn't look like a tree you'd find in any large city I've been to, and it certainly does not fit here at all. Actually, I'm not sure if the tree should be my number one criticism, or the inexplicable wooden scaffolding someone decided to construct over the plaza. What the hell is it doing there? I really can't think of any explanation other than the mapper felt that more "detail" was needed. Also, check out the apartment building that just happens to be on fire. Stuff like that should be a focal point of a map, not just an incidental detail. Road signs hanging from those out-of-place street lamps denote intersections that aren't there. I'm not really sure what is going on with the street textures, but it sure doesn't look good. It also looks like the mapper made a bet with a friend to see how many car models he could cram into it while still leaving a minimal number of square footage for the player to move freely. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/cfSz7Ju.jpg[/IMG] Another angle of this regrettable map reveals more bad decisions. I want to talk about these truck models which I assume are either from STALKER or Metro. These do not fit with HL2's art style at all. It just looks exactly like what it is, an asset from a different game entirely. Sure, City 17 is supposed to be a eclectic Eastern European city, but there's more to Eastern Europe than derelict Soviet military equipment. I do not understand the appeal of using these props. Also, check out the textures on the brush based Citadel. Most mappers with a shred of critical thinking ability have already figured out that Valve overwrote some of their old materials between 2002 and the time of the leak, and that is why these old brush based Citadels and other Combine tech have that off-putting clay colored corrugated aluminum siding texture or the glass window texture, among other oddities found in those older maps. However, that memo clearly never reached this mapper because he seems to have taken this side-effect of game development as gospel. Look at the weird dip in the road in front of the Cremator. I also just realized that the plaza is on fire. Fire is a detail, and more detail means more points, right? I do like the citizen who is scratching his itchy ass on the side of that building. Did the Combine turn off the hot water in his apartment? We may never know. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Sx62nHK.jpg[/IMG] Not much to say about this one because it looks just about identical to the original map, apart from the textures and props. There's nothing spectacularly bad about it like the first three shots, it just looks uninspired. Man that felt good.

So, I talked to a friend now and he made a point "don't mess with these guys, they're just tring to pretend to be succesfull mod-makers, they're trying to create something and their friends seems to enjoy it. They don't need your objective criticism" and that is a legitimate point, however, that would apply if 1) they'd stop stealing content and apologised 2) if you make a trash mod, and want success, no criticism, then present it as a trash mod. These guys seriously believe in what they're doing is good looking. That's my problem with them. [QUOTE]Not much to say about this one because it looks just about identical to the original map, apart from the textures and props. There's nothing spectacularly bad about it like the first three shots, it just looks uninspired.[/QUOTE] That and the fact that the Arcade runs on Borealis's computers.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48665923] Or what may be even worse, [I]there's plenty of people who support "double lighthouses in the Airex" and don't see anything wrong with this mod[/I]. Now, THAT is a sign of something wrong about the community. [/QUOTE] I think I find this more offensive than the entire AGNMI fiasco. [editline]12th September 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48666069]So, I talked to a friend now and he made a point "don't mess with these guys, they're just tring to pretend to be succesfull mod-makers, they're trying to create something and their friends seems to enjoy it. They don't need your objective criticism"[/QUOTE] Yeah, well they can suck my balls. You can do all of this without stepping on our toes in the process.

[QUOTE=MI_Junk;48666050]Hahaha, I was kind of hoping you'd post these screenshots. Don't mind if I mirror them on imgur in case they go down. Okay, let's see what we got... [...]what appears to be a wooden shack on the far left[/QUOTE] Worse, that's a garage from STALKER! In the Terminal level, the cars are from STALKER, so are the burning barrels in the center of the Plaza, the dumbsters and a large number of other pieces. I have acute visual memory so I can point out every foreign object in Build/Scwarzen Nebel levels. It's not that I'm even trying to, they're all very obvious. As someone who played the game for a decade and played a lot of leak mods I can easily distinguish every stolen map starting with MI ones, down do Airex maps from Insolence. Naturally the author claims it's all OK because the maps were "remastered" and all that nonsense. [editline]12th September 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=MI_Junk;48666050] [...] Actually, I'm not sure if the tree should be my number one criticism, or the inexplicable wooden scaffolding someone decided to construct over the plaza. What the hell is it doing there? I really can't think of any explanation other than the mapper felt that more "detail" was needed. Also, check out the apartment building that just happens to be on fire. [/QUOTE] See, they way GOOD MAPPING works is as follows. Trying to build someting from scratch, or find references, or build something that makes sense is TOO HARD. Instead you should save your time and put something that looks complex and misterious (i. e. has no explanation of being present), and voila you're done, the level is now detailed and [I]enhanced![/I] That building over there isn't on fire, but it has a leaking gas pipe with flame coming out from it. I guess the Combine don't really need the fuel and burn it right there so we don't get any and the air gets polluted! Also I believe I made a video of the Terminal level? The one in Build 2046 is basically the same as the "updated" one, give or take a soviet truck. [video=youtube;kVOezKOs7IE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVOezKOs7IE[/video] It ends abruptly because I had some glitches with Raptr but what's there is surely enough to do the level justice. Oh and Junk, you missed something. Look at the first Terminal screenshot and try to find the "hidden" fire truck and the bus that probably shouldn't be where they are. [editline]12th September 2015[/editline] Here's some more pics in case you want to continue your analysis (which I thoroughly enjoy!) [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138cd/pcyg3lH-CYI.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138af/zQTdIl1ffXw.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138ff/O43_2pAmQzs.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/143b5/SVmbQvU5FQc.jpg[/url]

I saw the firetruck, it falls under my "too many vehicles" criticism.

There are vehicles everywhere in the mod, indeed. I won't be surprised if I find some in the Citadel, given they get to it at some point. Perhaps someone should release a Citadel map pack so they have something to work on! I also just realised that those barriers and parts of Arcade machines are the same stonebrick texture as the walls. It's good when there's the same texture everywhere, right? Lessens GPU usage and all that?

That corrugated metal Citadel physically hurts.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48666096]Worse, that's a garage from STALKER! Here's some more pics in case you want to continue your analysis (which I thoroughly enjoy!) [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138cd/pcyg3lH-CYI.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138af/zQTdIl1ffXw.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/138ff/O43_2pAmQzs.jpg[/url] [url]http://cs628728.vk.me/v628728563/143b5/SVmbQvU5FQc.jpg[/url][/QUOTE] I'll just do the first two because I want to go to bed soon. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/2Uh2luL.jpg[/IMG] Boy, nothing reminds me of a transit station like having a giant rusted steel pipe belch flames at me while I'm trying to enter it! Hope those flames don't reach that wooden barrel. Also the red hazard light by the ladder really reminds me a lot of the Quake 3 mapping scene from nearly 2 decades ago. If you thought Source mapping was a competition for who could include the most props, back then it was who could include the most colored lighting. The rickety wooden overhead walkways contribute to the identity crisis this map is suffering from. There is nothing grounded about these choices at all. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/zZ6IzPR.jpg[/IMG] "Oh honey, I'm so glad we moved to City 17." "Why is that, sweetie?" "I just love how scenic the roads are in the factory district. The trees are such a nice bright green this time of year" "It is picturesque, isn't it my sweet? And look at how the rainforest ferns grow from the cracks of the oily cobblestone streets. They really take my mind off of the carcinogens the Combine are pumping into our lungs." "Let's warm our hands by the perpetually burning pile of fruit crates and think of our future together in this insipid source mod!"

Sometimes simpler looks better.

I'm just sad I never figured out who made this fantastic error sign. [img]http://scart.slkandy.com/images/modelling/ep2_outland_020176.jpg[/img] As for protecting content. Obsidian Conflict use a bunch of Romkas models (still does I guess) which were encrypted and had to be decrypted and loaded into memory, this is a way of doing it but its extremely hacky and unreliable since you'd have to superseed the main engine functions which is a terrible idea. It crashed once in a while as far as I've been told (Hyperjag3 or Skidz made it). I don't even know what to say about the Build 2036 maps. Ugh. I do feel like there's a lot of misinformation being cleared up with Missing Information/Team GabeN and that feels nice. I'm working a bit on the rooftop map for our next update, but its such a shitty map that I'm having a hardtime figuring what could make it better. Any ideas?

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48665923]If we could have had access to encrypted VPKs that would save us from a lot of trouble but that only works with non-moddable Source branch. Great job Valve, once again.[/QUOTE]If only they had encrypted VPKs in 2003, eh?

[QUOTE=The Kins;48666437]If only they had encrypted VPKs in 2003, eh?[/QUOTE] The password would still be "gaben".

[QUOTE=ProZak;48666326]As for protecting content. Obsidian Conflict use a bunch of Romkas models (still does I guess) which were encrypted and had to be decrypted and loaded into memory, this is a way of doing it but its extremely hacky and unreliable since you'd have to superseed the main engine functions which is a terrible idea. It crashed once in a while as far as I've been told (Hyperjag3 or Skidz made it).[/QUOTE] It gave so many problems that at the end everyone agreed on release them for the public and getting rid of the encryptation system for the reasons you said. I have seen their code for that and god, I'm surprised it didn't gave more problems. TBH, there's no real way to protect something on Source, not even maps. The most you can do, is show every WIP image from the stolen content, and publicly denounce them. [QUOTE=SageJFox;48664616] [t]http://orig13.deviantart.net/5318/f/2010/024/6/f/source_model_attempt_success_by_sagejfox.jpg[/t] (And this was with a tutorial.) :v:[/QUOTE] Oh wait I remember this model. You followed that "learn to model with Milkshape!" tutorial that is at ModDB, right? Ah, the memories...

[QUOTE=Maestro Fenix;48666855]It gave so many problems that at the end everyone agreed on release them for the public and getting rid of the encryptation system for the reasons you said. I have seen their code for that and god, I'm surprised it didn't gave more problems. TBH, there's no real way to protect something on Source, not even maps. The most you can do, is show every WIP image from the stolen content, and publicly denounce them.[/QUOTE] What if I separate an NPC model into several pieces - a separate model for a right leg, a left arm, etc. - and then every time this NPC is spawned the code rearragnes the parts? Would that work? At least that would make extracting models harder. Models and textures are basically text (in its own language) that describes polygons and pixels. Is there a way to store that somewhere in the code? "Hide" the assets inside the engine? Like those tiny games that rebuild everyting on the fly?

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48666920]What if I separate an NPC model into several pieces - a separate model for a right leg, a left arm, etc. - and then every time this NPC is spawned the code rearragnes the parts? Would that work? At least that would make extracting models harder. Models and textures are basically text (in its own language) that describes polygons and pixels. Is there a way to store that somewhere in the code? "Hide" the assets inside the engine? Like those tiny games that rebuild everyting on the fly?[/QUOTE] Yeah sure that's possible but extremely impractical for various reasons. The system that assembles the NPCs would be best because they'd have to replicate the system in their codebase however I'd rather spend my efforts on something else because in the end the system is pointless. A lot of the Missing Information files got watermarks so we'd know if they're taken from our builds.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48666096] [video=youtube;kVOezKOs7IE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVOezKOs7IE[/video] [/QUOTE] This is what happens when you try to imagine what could your shithole in Russia look after combine invasion.

[QUOTE=ProZak;48666959]Yeah sure that's possible but extremely impractical for various reasons. The system that assembles the NPCs would be best because they'd have to replicate the system in their codebase however I'd rather spend my efforts on something else because in the end the system is pointless. A lot of the Missing Information files got watermarks so we'd know if they're taken from our builds.[/QUOTE] That's impractical in its own way. In case of Build 2046 you'd had to download 20 gigabytes of this nonsens to get to your models. Or have someone who'd notice them. Even the author didn't know the models and the levels were from MI, and it says something about their attention and devotion to the community. Funny how it basically could have been over if they'd just acknowledge everything and apologise, as civilised people do.

Which is really strange because a lot of models are in Missing Information specific folders so they're easier to find among all the crap Valve got. Something we've been thinking about is putting Missing Information on Steam with Greenlight. What are people opinion on that? Right now we're holding it off a bit since €90 is a relatively big investment for something we're not sure is possible or not.

eeeh i decided to recreate the sniper_029 and it got fucking short and dark got clusterfuck of messy brush detalisation friends say it succ [IMG]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/429321685573419786/DD47927AFA16B94D03AB5B6F129D25BDDEC71D4D/[/IMG] [IMG]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/429321685573418984/0A53ED5C6F9FD477A00A701EB60463D2CB3EB7D2/[/IMG] [IMG]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/429321685573417181/8B452F0CA5736897FFAF371BA3BEC8DE44947A19/[/IMG] vmf here: [url]http://www.mediafire.com/download/q8l77v8koc1848x/ghettoyo.vmf[/url] i didnt felt like working on lighting and proppin' so i scrapped it

[QUOTE=PwnGModer;48666972]This is what happens when you try to imagine what could your shithole in Russia look after combine invasion.[/QUOTE] Eh The first things i thought of were moscow suburbs or vyborg [IMG]http://cs625817.vk.me/v625817761/2bbce/kUWs3Bbm5eI.jpg[/IMG] my house is next to this beauty

[QUOTE=ProZak;48667081]Which is really strange because a lot of models are in Missing Information specific folders so they're easier to find among all the crap Valve got. Something we've been thinking about is putting Missing Information on Steam with Greenlight. What are people opinion on that? Right now we're holding it off a bit since €90 is a relatively big investment for something we're not sure is possible or not.[/QUOTE] I'd suggest you finish it first unless you mean just the borealis chapter that is. Then... I'd normally say that's a bit too short of a thing to put on steam, but seeing that HL: Before got in I don't think it would make too much of a difference

[QUOTE=Mattscreab;48668467]Eh The first things i thought of were moscow suburbs or vyborg [IMG]http://cs625817.vk.me/v625817761/2bbce/kUWs3Bbm5eI.jpg[/IMG] my house is next to this beauty[/QUOTE] It lacks firetrucks on the roofs, though.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;48668540]It lacks firetrucks on the roofs, though.[/QUOTE] Yes, but theres vent that leads from a building to the sewers. Finnish builders are best.