Half-life 2 Cut Content - Is it me or dose the cut content look better than what we got? - Games

[QUOTE=Blade Rx69;50436030]Oh man I attempted something similar way back in the day. But if you're basing it on beta then that means you lose that backalley right before the apartments, which I thought was one of the coolest areas. In my approach I opted to change the road where you run across the rooftops instead. I'll have to comb over my files to see if I still have it tonight. [editline]1st June 2016[/editline] Oh right, how did you approach the issue where the elevator you take with Alyx clearly goes below ground, but the lab is on the third floor?[/QUOTE] The map I was working with had a slanted road that was cut off by the skybox, so I just moved the original path farther down, as seen here. A checkpoint would rest between the white and gray buildings to block access. [t]http://i.imgur.com/8DPnUfc.png[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/H3v4u35.png[/t] This would direct the player away from the lab, though, so they'd need to get back on track through exiting the apartment, passing through several other buildings (haven't put one where the red arrow crosses the strip of nodraw) [t]http://i.imgur.com/LEGzEMr.png[/t] and wind up back here, where they enter the attic through the connected buildings. A bit more convoluted than the actual route, but this might allow for more scenes of citizens reacting to the raid or helping the player along. [t]http://i.imgur.com/9aNuOGp.png[/t] As for the elevator issue, I'm going to connect the elevator room below ground with this new room with the ramp, then either install a new elevator in the shaft to the right or a staircase. [t]http://i.imgur.com/kvpxLeQ.png[/t] [editline]2nd June 2016[/editline] Two other notes: I'm on a 1-2 week trip, so even though I have a few more reference pictures stored on a thumb drive, no new ones for now. Secondly, would this discussion fit better in a different thread, such as mapping or the half life/portal sections?

Can we confirm which maps are made during the Goldsrc-era (or at least, when it was more Goldsrc than Source) of HL2? Hyperborea and Citytest levels are the obvious ones since Hyperborea is the game's original starting point and Citytest because of the Free TV screenshot. Vertigo might be too since it was the Skyscraper from the same draft as the Hyperborea start, and maybe Nova Prospekt too since the unproofed version of RtB labeled a [URL="http://puu.sh/oqOQV/95a35da0a0.png"]screenshot[/URL] featuring orange-prison as the first HL2 screenshot taken (but the book has a lot of errors too, and the screenshot doesn't look as Goldsrc-y as Free TV; but then again, 007: Nightfire ran on Goldsrc too [URL="https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Z-kYM3LKbak/U8jD1s0hsRI/AAAAAAAAI-s/duSylaH46Z4/s1600/James+Bond+007+Nightfire+pc+game+2.jpg"]and it looked pretty good[/URL]). I'm guessing the maps made during this era would be full of brushes instead of models, hence the brush APCs (but it seems like model support was one of the first things to be added to the engine because citizens running with TVs and ideas with Brickbat). How would these early levels look like in HL1? I've only seen people porting Citytest and [URL="http://www.moddb.com/games/half-life/addons/dm-borealis-for-half-life-deathmatch"]Borealis[/URL] to HL1.

[QUOTE=PikaCommando;50441952]Can we confirm which maps are made during the Goldsrc-era (or at least, when it was more Goldsrc than Source) of HL2? Hyperborea and Citytest levels are the obvious ones since Hyperborea is the game's original starting point and Citytest because of the Free TV screenshot. Vertigo might be too since it was the Skyscraper from the same draft as the Hyperborea start, and maybe Nova Prospekt too since the unproofed version of RtB labeled a [URL="http://puu.sh/oqOQV/95a35da0a0.png"]screenshot[/URL] featuring orange-prison as the first HL2 screenshot taken (but the book has a lot of errors too, and the screenshot doesn't look as Goldsrc-y as Free TV; but then again, 007: Nightfire ran on Goldsrc too [URL="https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Z-kYM3LKbak/U8jD1s0hsRI/AAAAAAAAI-s/duSylaH46Z4/s1600/James+Bond+007+Nightfire+pc+game+2.jpg"]and it looked pretty good[/URL]). I'm guessing the maps made during this era would be full of brushes instead of models, hence the brush APCs (but it seems like model support was one of the first things to be added to the engine because citizens running with TVs and ideas with Brickbat). How would these early levels look like in HL1? I've only seen people porting Citytest and [URL="http://www.moddb.com/games/half-life/addons/dm-borealis-for-half-life-deathmatch"]Borealis[/URL] to HL1.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://i.playground.ru/i/07/77/87/00/pix/image.jpg"]I once ported (more like, remade) Consul's office in HL1[/URL]. It's an easy process but the idea didn't seem too fun to me so I never bothered with porting things like Airex or Vertigo on GldSrc. Speaking of which, Vertigo and streetwars were probably among the first maps of that early era when Source was very much like GldSrc (what was dubbed Src already existed during the end of HL1 development, so I think HL2 was always on Source, it's just that the engine itself was very much like GldSrc initially, before it got all advanced model support and facial animations and lighting and physics). Those maps just seem so HL1-like, so brushy and a lot of older entities. Also, the book, the UP version, says that Uplink was a tech demo for HL2 made by Kelly Bailey, which just sounds too weird.

I remember seeing a youtube video of a mod with a few e3 maps on goldsrc. Even had models and ai.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;50442560] Also, the book, the UP version, says that Uplink was a tech demo for HL2 made by Kelly Bailey, which just sounds too weird. [/QUOTE] Well you gotta remember its an uncorrected proof, so it has a lot of false info. You can see stuff like that (along with spelling errors and placeholder text) all throughout that copy.

[QUOTE=PikaCommando;50441952]Can we confirm which maps are made during the Goldsrc-era (or at least, when it was more Goldsrc than Source) of HL2?[/QUOTE] According to RtB UP the first prototype of Source engine was made half year after start of game's development. That means it was ready by the end of 1999. Get your free TVs demo was at March 2001, so I doubt it was made on GoldSrc. The fact there was HL1 HUD doesn't mean it was GoldSrc. Also this prison screenshot with orange textures was first that was released on public, not first HL2 screenshot ever made.

[QUOTE=BuTou;50444248]According to RtB UP the first prototype of Source engine was made half year after start of game's development. That means it was ready by the end of 1999. Get your free TVs demo was at March 2001, so I doubt it was made on GoldSrc. The fact there was HL1 HUD doesn't mean it was GoldSrc. Also this prison screenshot with orange textures was first that was released on public, not first HL2 screenshot ever made.[/QUOTE] That information is incorrect or incomplete. Gold Source and Source are one and the same engine. What happened is, during production of Half-Life, the team had a lot of engine ideas they could not implement prior to release. So, they split the code into two branches. The one that was still being actively worked on was src, and the one to be released with HL1 (Which was about to or had gone gold) was goldsrc; hence the engine names. Source was most likely still quite similar to GoldSource by 2001, albeit with some flashy new features added. This is why the older content in the leak contains brush based assets and very simple geometry, and why the version of hammer found in the leak is more compatible with HL1 content than the one we got at release.

This is what happens on the Cut Content Discord late at night: [T]https://images-1.discordapp.net/.eJwVyEEOwiAQAMC_cHdhKVDobwgltAYKwprYGv-uXuYwb_bsmS1sI2pj4XzdR6h9hUG1-xQh1Zpy9G0fEGrhnsiHrcSDBkdrtHRO69kqJbWa5a8sGkSFZpJCWHQTL1eGnM-zX48DUEj1-nMzGu4tsc8Xpx4nrg.2syR5zAZp4qHsGxwnCwtafKRNMo.jpg[/T]

[QUOTE=BuTou;50444248] Also this prison screenshot with orange textures was first that was released on public, not first HL2 screenshot ever made.[/QUOTE] Where is that screenshot first released, then? I thought it was the E3 screenshots that were the first ones because HL2 was officially revealed on E3. Also, isn't it a pretty odd choice to release [del]cp_orange[/del] that as the first screenshot of the game shown to the public rather than some cool ones? [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50447283] Source was most likely still quite similar to GoldSource by 2001, albeit with some flashy new features added. This is why the older content in the leak contains brush based assets and very simple geometry, and why the version of hammer found in the leak is more compatible with HL1 content than the one we got at release.[/QUOTE] Hmm, what are the earliest Wasteland map then? I'd like to see how the Goldsrc/Goldsrc-like Source handle wide open terrain. What happens if you port the Depot maps to HL1?

[QUOTE=PikaCommando;50447712]Where is that screenshot first released, then? I thought it was the E3 screenshots that were the first ones because HL2 was officially revealed on E3. Also, isn't it a pretty odd choice to release [del]cp_orange[/del] that as the first screenshot of the game shown to the public rather than some cool ones? Hmm, what are the earliest Wasteland map then? I'd like to see how the Goldsrc/Goldsrc-like Source handle wide open terrain. What happens if you port the Depot maps to HL1?[/QUOTE] If there's any older than 2002 that'd be interesting to look at. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7woRcoSiqSk[/media] Here's one of the older maps in the leak. Notice how virtually everything is a brush? Even better: "[The VMF] contained HL1 era entities, showing that the Source engine still contained many GoldSrc elements back then" from the description.

[QUOTE=PikaCommando;50447712]Where is that screenshot first released, then? I thought it was the E3 screenshots that were the first ones because HL2 was officially revealed on E3. Also, isn't it a pretty odd choice to release [del]cp_orange[/del] that as the first screenshot of the game shown to the public rather than some cool ones?[/QUOTE] This is probably wrong (someone else please correct me if it is) but I was under the impression that the orange room screenshot and several others all come from a PC Gamer magazine article featured in their June 2003 issue. All things considered they were probably part of a press kits from around that time. If nothing else that article was the first place I saw them all those years ago. For those who don't know what issue or article I'm talking about, here's a couple of pictures: [t]http://i.imgur.com/BnowZD6.jpg[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/MxjTWMj.jpg[/t] Yeah, I actually kept the whole issue and several others from 2003-2006 that really caught my fancy. They've got a nice home in a spiffy box in the bottom of my closet. Of note; due to how magazine publishing works this issue was on store shelves and being mailed out around early May 2003, roughly a week or two before E3 2003. Fun times.

Some early criticism: [url]http://web.archive.org/web/20030513183446/http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=10&t=30955&st=0[/url] It's interesting to read the OP and other comments when we now know that all those shitty maps were just shitty unfinished maps. We're used to seeing more finished and polished parts of the game in media, even the early one. But Valve never cared about that for some reason.

[QUOTE=Spor;50449125]Some early criticism: [url]http://web.archive.org/web/20030513183446/http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=10&t=30955&st=0[/url] It's interesting to read the OP and other comments when we now know that all those shitty maps were just shitty unfinished maps. We're used to seeing more finished and polished parts of the game in media, even the early one. But Valve never cared about that for some reason.[/QUOTE] To be fair, the quality of Half-Life 2 was all over the place. The game got real frigging ugly around the end of Ravenholm and didn't recover for a while after.

It's true that the unfinished maps were pretty shitty, but are there any redeeming qualities design-wise for the WC maps/HL1 alpha? I mean, the HL1 alpha was a demo sent to journalists (because all the official screenshots released up until that point are taken from the levels featured in the alpha/earlier versions iirc), so surely Valve must have thought they were good enough at the time (keep in mind that it's before any of the other "Quake-Killers" were released), to win good opinions, right? Personally I think that the HL1 alpha levels had pretty confusing layouts and too non-linear with no way of telling which way is the right way to go (because it's unfinished, I guess). I mean, at least some WC maps had a clear sense of direction. And yet, game journalists were pretty happy with it, seeing as how they keep raving about it in their 1997 previews?

What year do you guys think HL2 converted to the Source engine? [B][I]Vote 'Agree' for 1999 Vote 'Disagree' for 2000 Vote 'Useful' for 2001 Vote 'Dumb' for 2002[/I][/B]

[QUOTE=bw1119;50451542]What year do you guys think HL2 converted to the Source engine? [B][I]Vote 'Agree' for 1999 Vote 'Disagree' for 2000 Vote 'Useful' for 2001 Vote 'Dumb' for 2002[/I][/B][/QUOTE] Your question is literally: "What year do you think our ape-like ancestors became man?" There's simply no answer to your question. It's malformed. Source and GoldSource are the same engine, and Half-Life 2 was never on anything other than Source. Source had a smooth and gradual transition from being exactly equal to GoldSource, to being GoldSource-like, to being what we got at Half-Life 2's release, and then finally becoming the Source Engine we have today with phong, projection lights, and HDR. There was even a point in the middle of all of that where Source had a physics engine that wasn't in GoldSource, and wasn't the VPhysics system we have today. If you want to go back in time a bit, the most-likely first feature that separated Source from GoldSource was RTT shadows ([URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEZWrAbSGsA"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0nOhiUZyuU[/URL]) Primitive stencil shadows were present in the HL1 leak, but removed from GoldSource due to issues with them (And most likely time constraints.) You also must not forget that Source had DirectX 6.0 support (Released August 1998), which is clearly a hold-over.

What was that physics engine that wasn't Vphysics?

[QUOTE=Exploders;50451743]What was that physics engine that wasn't Vphysics?[/QUOTE] Ipion Virtual Physics (2001), which was later purchased by Havok and incorporated into Havok 1. VPhysics is based off of Havok 2.

The first thing I have ever contributed to the community, what I believe is billboard002a. This file is missing from the leak files, but this page is in RTB: Uncorrected Proof: [IMG]https://i.imgur.com/DclNMCR.png[/IMG] That texture isn't in the leak files, so I took a photo of it and came along with this: [IMG]https://i.imgur.com/LZGShFa.png[/IMG] So I converted it to VTF, and it's up for download [URL="https://www.dropbox.com/s/it4upcxshvyeiak/billboard002a.rar?dl=0"]Here[/URL] on Dropbox. Enjoy! It's not perfect, but it's something I thought I would give you guys. Texture res is 512x1024.

The "when HL2 got ported to Source" is the new standard question along with "why don't every modder combine their efforts and make perfect leak mod/hl3". [I]The first thing made by Valve when HL2 was ported to Source, was of course the Beta soundtrack.[/I]

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50449268]To be fair, the quality of Half-Life 2 was all over the place. The game got real frigging ugly around the end of Ravenholm and didn't recover for a while after.[/QUOTE] [img]http://i.imgur.com/vvE5Ff4.jpg[/img] Ouch

I don't think they could've afforded to make more detailed destruction in 2004. Roughly pre-2007 Valve also seemed very keen on optimizing everything, even if it meant downgrading the scenery.

Then they shouldn't have pit this exact spot in the background map. There are much more pleasant angles in this chapter.

I dont really think we should expect no more from a 2004 game, dont you think? Valve wanted a game that posessed both groundbreaking visuals and could run safely on even the most basic hardware. Needless to say, they suceeded.

[QUOTE=HGrunt;50453984]I don't think they could've afforded to make more detailed destruction in 2004.[/QUOTE] Look through the Aaron folder in the leak, you will find some amazing brush-based destruction of which the world has never seen since. Some examples being the burned basement in some garage maps, the c17 ruins maps, and the early canals maps. I couldn't find any pictures offhand, but believe me, they're worth checking out.

[QUOTE=crazeeweegeman4;50454405]Look through the Aaron folder in the leak, you will find some amazing brush-based destruction of which the world has never seen since. Some examples being the burned basement in some garage maps, the c17 ruins maps, and the early canals maps. I couldn't find any pictures offhand, but believe me, they're worth checking out.[/QUOTE] And now I want pics of these VMFs. By the way, they are all VMFs, or maybe someone is a RMF? How functional they are (after replacing the missing content)?

[QUOTE=Maestro Fenix;50454471]And now I want pics of these VMFs. By the way, they are all VMFs, or maybe someone is a RMF? How functional they are (after replacing the missing content)?[/QUOTE] Usually they're fairly functional, bar a few that would need more fixing than just replacing the missing content and outdated entities. [editline]4th June 2016[/editline] And others you'll need to do a helluva lot of optimizing to even get them to compile properly

In the playable beta there's some weirdness going on after the last streetwars map (d3_c17_14). First there's d3_park_01, which most likely would have a climactic battle occur in some sort of a city park, but it's slightly odd to give the map an unique name. Then it abruptly follows into prototype canals (d3_canals_01/02) where the player can drive a jeep, and 02 has no continuation. Any thoughts on what was supposed to happen in those maps?

[QUOTE=HGrunt;50453984]I don't think they could've afforded to make more detailed destruction in 2004. Roughly pre-2007 Valve also seemed very keen on optimizing everything, even if it meant downgrading the scenery.[/QUOTE] It's not about the amount of detail, it's about cobbling together bunch of models and brushes that have very different textures, creating a ton of ugly seams.

[QUOTE=crazeeweegeman4;50454405]Look through the Aaron folder in the leak, you will find some amazing brush-based destruction of which the world has never seen since. Some examples being the burned basement in some garage maps, the c17 ruins maps, and the early canals maps. I couldn't find any pictures offhand, but believe me, they're worth checking out.[/QUOTE] Here's a couple pics I just took from ruins12: [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/258208743753068699/6BB8436F8240304C932B2558D8863EE78A2EA815/[/t] [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/258208743753068826/EE172F6BB93646799746246ED360280EA0ABD4F2/[/t]