Half-life 2 Cut Content - Is it me or dose the cut content look better than what we got? - Games

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;45648441]An easy method to get away without answering, without proving anything. Predictable. I'm glad it became clear that you're one of those incredibly gullable people when it comes to evaluating and comparing EA and Valve, or Valve against anyone else, to that matter. Yes, EA are my favourite publisher. They directed and published most of my favourite games. Valve made and published one such game, very long time ago.[/QUOTE] EA is a shit publisher. Everything they do in-house recently has been rushed to shit causing it to be buggy and generally awful. [editline]10th August 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Cvoxalury;45648934]Lol, of course it doesn't say why were the two cut, because there was no normal reason to do so! Apart from reasons we may deduce if we look at the whole Hydra experience when a monster with great potential was ruined by incompetent playtesters.[/QUOTE] oh my god shut the fuck up

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45648954]I believe the strong point of the Beta is really not the new videogame concepts it creates or can create, its the MIX of them. This is really what I love about the Beta. In one full game, we have Arctic enviromnents, Industrial Facilities, Wasteland Deserts, a Ship, an abandoned Town, a Dystopian City enviromnent and potentially tons more. Am I the only one who thinks this is absolutely amazing? Most games today offer you little to no variety in locations. That what I believe a full Beta project will excel at: variety.[/QUOTE] Good luck with finding/founding such project. I'm out of the game.

Guys, don't start this. We can be doing something a lot more productive right now.

[QUOTE=KillerKo4565;45648953]Please stop. We know sometimes playtesters are annoying but they are really useful toward the gaming industry.[/QUOTE] As stupid as they may seem based on the stories, I still have a few of my own stories just as bad as theirs. Except the jet-ski motion sickness guy, screw that guy. Jet-skis are cool.

[QUOTE=Cvoxalury;45648808] So it's not the Hydra alone, oh no. Your "finished product" also lacked areas like Air Exchanger, the ship, the actual Depot, [B]the City that looks dystopian and not just like Riga or Saint-Petersburg minus the Citadel[/B]. If those would be finished 'fucking amazing to play' wouldn't HL2 be better than it is? Plus, having increased variety in enemies, it wouldn't hurt, why the hell did they need to cut enemies like bullsquids and houndeyes? They were ready, they worked well in HL. Or cremators, well if you're not happy with them performing in combat, just leave them in the city, for the atmosphere. They don't ask to feed them or whatnot.[/QUOTE] Ever heard of subtlety? It's precisely BECAUSE the city looks "just like Riga or Saint-Petersburg minus the Citadel" that it feels so dystopian and oppressive. In the finished game, the oppressiveness and dystopian mood is accomplished by contrasting familiar elements with the unfamiliar. Hence you have the alien-looking Citadel looming over a familiar-looking normal city, among other things. It may not immediately pop out as dark/dystopian/whatever, but that's the brilliance of it: It may look like things aren't that far gone, but when you really, [I]really[/I] think about it, you realise how fucked the humanity really is. The retail world feels real and familiar, and as such, the havoc brought into it feels emotionally relateable. The original setting is far too "out there" to provoke a similiar reaction, mostly because videogame graphics were - and still are - too primitive to fully do that world justice: Rather than looking like a ruined version of our world, it would have looked like Gotham City was transplanted on a rocky alien planet with a funky disco sky. The fact that the original concept of the city "looks" dark/dystopian/whatever is beside the point, because that's setting, not something the Combine cause through their actions (Those "oppressive skyscrapers" are merely emotional manipulation when you really get into it). There's a sense of maturity about the retail game's presentation of it's darkness, while the cut storyline's way of achieving this goal is, in contrast, extremely heavy-handed and emotionally manipulative: [B]"Let's make the player [I]REALLY[/I] hate the Combine! Look at the obvious and very unsubtle environmental devastation! Look at our Blade Runner rip-off city! Those skyscrapers sure look oppressive, don't they? Look at how the Combine sadistically trick the citizens into killing each other through a cheesy videogame Doctor Evil might have dreamed up! And there's MORE! Not only are they replacing our air with murky gases, but they also utilise child slave labour! THOSE BASTARDS! OMFGZ TEH DARKNEZZ!!!!1111"[/B]. While we're at it, why not also make the Combine devil worshippers who eat human flesh, since that's supposedly "dark" and thus better? The crux of the evilness of The Combine is not in cheesy comic book villain cruelties like the Manhack Arcade, but in their ultimate goals. It's fine to demonstrate that they use evil methods to accomplish those goals, but subtlety is important. To use an analogy, the original storyline is the equivalent of a horror movie that thinks it's scary because it has a gazillion gory murder scenes in it. The cliched over-the-top seediness of the original storyline would ultimately have served to make the game overtly pulpish, even something that's vaguely self-parodic of the dystopic genre it belongs to. It might have been good on it's own terms perhaps, but much, [I]much[/I] inferior to what we got in the end.

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Someone just shat on the old storyline in its own thread, and its getting winners and agrees?

I think I prefer comic book villain approach, the world in HL2 felt really... Shit's-not-happening-like. Hey look a beautiful normal city, has some aliens in it and people are being oppressed, but what does it matter? Mmmm here have some metrocops to kill. EP1 fixed that a bit when the beautiful city got raped by striders and the Citadel shat all over the sky.

I'm pretty damn glad TF2 isn't a Battlefield clone, thank you.

[QUOTE=Drury;45650891]I think I prefer comic book villain approach, the world in HL2 felt really... Shit's-not-happening-like. Hey look a beautiful normal city, has some aliens in it and people are being oppressed, but what does it matter? Mmmm here have some metrocops to kill. EP1 fixed that a bit when the beautiful city got raped by striders and the Citadel shat all over the sky.[/QUOTE] I kinda liked the not bleak look. It's still Earth, the sun still rises and falls, clouds go by and birds sing. Just because there's an alien oppressive state in control doesn't ruin what a beautiful day is outside. I doubt the Soviet Union had a dark overcast skies for the entirety of its existence.

[QUOTE=juhana;45650055]Ever heard of subtlety? It's precisely BECAUSE the city looks "just like Riga or Saint-Petersburg minus the Citadel" that it feels so dystopian and oppressive. In the finished game, the oppressiveness and dystopian mood is accomplished by contrasting familiar elements with the unfamiliar. Hence you have the alien-looking Citadel looming over a familiar-looking normal city, among other things. It may not immediately pop out as dark/dystopian/whatever, but that's the brilliance of it: It may look like things aren't that far gone, but when you really, [I]really[/I] think about it, you realise how fucked the humanity really is. The retail world feels real and familiar, and as such, the havoc brought into it feels emotionally relateable. The original setting is far too "out there" to provoke a similiar reaction, mostly because videogame graphics were - and still are - too primitive to fully do that world justice: Rather than looking like a ruined version of our world, it would have looked like Gotham City was transplanted on a rocky alien planet with a funky disco sky. The fact that the original concept of the city "looks" dark/dystopian/whatever is beside the point, because that's setting, not something the Combine cause through their actions (Those "oppressive skyscrapers" are merely emotional manipulation when you really get into it). There's a sense of maturity about the retail game's presentation of it's darkness, while the cut storyline's way of achieving this goal is, in contrast, extremely heavy-handed and emotionally manipulative: [B]"Let's make the player [I]REALLY[/I] hate the Combine! Look at the obvious and very unsubtle environmental devastation! Look at our Blade Runner rip-off city! Those skyscrapers sure look oppressive, don't they? Look at how the Combine sadistically trick the citizens into killing each other through a cheesy videogame Doctor Evil might have dreamed up! And there's MORE! Not only are they replacing our air with murky gases, but they also utilise child slave labour! THOSE BASTARDS! OMFGZ TEH DARKNEZZ!!!!1111"[/B]. While we're at it, why not also make the Combine devil worshippers who eat human flesh, since that's supposedly "dark" and thus better? The crux of the evilness of The Combine is not in cheesy comic book villain cruelties like the Manhack Arcade, but in their ultimate goals. It's fine to demonstrate that they use evil methods to accomplish those goals, but subtlety is important. To use an analogy, the original storyline is the equivalent of a horror movie that thinks it's scary because it has a gazillion gory murder scenes in it. The cliched over-the-top seediness of the original storyline would ultimately have served to make the game overtly pulpish, even something that's vaguely self-parodic of the dystopic genre it belongs to. It might have been good on it's own terms perhaps, but much, [I]much[/I] inferior to what we got in the end.[/QUOTE] In the end, I think its really subjective; its all about what people like to see in their entertainment. I personally disagree with you, for example. While HL2 was indeed a masterpiece, I think, using the Beta concepts, we can make our own masterpiece as well. Why such a lack of faith here suddenly? If you people have such opinions on the very concepts we are trying to recreate here, perhaps this thread is not your place. [QUOTE=Mech Bgum;45650973]People usually don't think critically about this stuff. They see pretty pictures and nice ideas and they use their imagination to make something fascinating in their minds. That's what dooms all these beta-related projects, childish mentality doesn't allow them to think critically and realistically. The only team that actually released a working playable mod (Missing Information) were getting so much shit from the beta community over the years, it's amazing.[/QUOTE] MI's rendition of the Borealis ship didnt displayed even a fraction of the potential for mood and atmosphere these concepts have in them. Just my opinion, of course.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45651836]MI's rendition of the Borealis ship didnt displayed even a fraction of the potential for mood and atmosphere these concepts have in them. Just my opinion, of course.[/QUOTE] How would you achieve this? Could you find one or two concept images of the Borealis and let me know how you'd do it so it fulfilled the concepts rendition?

[QUOTE=ProZak;45652031]How would you achieve this? Could you find one or two concept images of the Borealis and let me know how you'd do it so it fulfilled the concepts rendition?[/QUOTE] While it may appear so, Im not bashing your work, quite the opposite. I think the way you fixed and detailed the maps was done masterfully, considering the state theyre in fresh out the WC mappack. I just think if the MI team had acess to more resources, things like the storyline and Odell's character could be more developed, more fleshed out. These are things I myself prioritize a big deal in my work, and things that I feel were lacking in your Hyper. It kinda boiled down the mod to just shooter galleries set in a ship. I would also like to see a more... scarier, Aliens-ish atmosphere to the ship, relying more on the Stalker's behaviour and appearance and less on generic, retail soldier slaughter. Anyway, these are things Im trying to achieve in my work. Again, not dismissing MI's fantastic job in porting the maps and bringing the visual quality they deserve.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45652239]While it may appear so, Im not bashing your work, quite the opposite. I think the way you fixed and detailed the maps was done masterfully, considering the state theyre in fresh out the WC mappack. I just think if the MI team had acess to more resources, things like the storyline and Odell's character could be more developed, more fleshed out. These are things I myself prioritize a big deal in my work, and things that I feel were lacking in your Hyper. It kinda boiled down the mod to just shooter galleries set in a ship. I would also like to see a more... scarier, Aliens-ish atmosphere to the ship, relying more on the Stalker's behaviour and appearance and less on generic, retail soldier slaughter. Anyway, these are things Im trying to achieve in my work. Again, not dismissing MI's fantastic job in porting the maps and bringing the visual quality they deserve.[/QUOTE] I'm certainly not taking as bashing but I'm just wondering what you'd do. I certainly agree there's plenty of things we could do to improve the Borealis overall (Odell's animations, have him follow you through the ship etc.). We did what we could at the time. We spend a lot of time on the levels and content. By the end of the release the entire team was just burned out. We had postponed the release for almost a year or more (I don't even remember). From working with Source mostly. We wanted to introduce the Sacktick on the Borealis but we didn't have the manpower to implement it fully at the time, so we had to scrap that idea.

[QUOTE=ProZak;45652321]I'm certainly not taking as bashing but I'm just wondering what you'd do. I certainly agree there's plenty of things we could do to improve the Borealis overall (Odell's animations, have him follow you through the ship etc.). We did what we could at the time. We spend a lot of time on the levels and content. By the end of the release the entire team was just burned out. We had postponed the release for almost a year or more (I don't even remember). From working with Source mostly. We wanted to introduce the Sacktick on the Borealis but we didn't have the manpower to implement it fully at the time, so we had to scrap that idea.[/QUOTE] Yea I absolutely understand that. I read once you guys had to remake the whole hull from scratch, I think... so its obvious the maps were quite a labour.

Guys, stop it. This is going to tear us apart if we don't.

[QUOTE=Thevaultkid;45652406]Guys, stop it. This is going to tear us apart if we don't.[/QUOTE] Ok we stop.

I read up until the 41st page, and then from the 54th page to here. I don't think anyone's asked this but if someone has please flame the fuck out of me. Has anyone tried importing the WC Map Pack VMFs into the Dota 2 Workshop Tools? I'd do it if I wasn't a lazy fuck who didn't feel like finding the WC Map Pack again.

Has anybody tried to port the citizen command system from the beta? (load up the map "trainingroom" in the beta for an example)

What the Borealis really needed was movement. A little bobbing & swaying would make it feel like a boat, not a boat-shaped building.

[QUOTE=DONOTWANT;45654310]What the Borealis really needed was movement. A little bobbing & swaying would make it feel like a boat, not a boat-shaped building.[/QUOTE] You writing this down, 95? *Hand slowly sinks in a pool of dumbs*

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45651836]In the end, I think its really subjective; its all about what people like to see in their entertainment. I personally disagree with you, for example. While HL2 was indeed a masterpiece, I think, using the Beta concepts, we can make our own masterpiece as well. Why such a lack of faith here suddenly? If you people have such opinions on the very concepts we are trying to recreate here, perhaps this thread is not your place. [/QUOTE] As I said, "it might have been good on it's own terms". I'm actually very interested in seeing what the leak community could do with the cut concepts. I merely expressed the reasons why I think Valve made the right choice to change direction like they did.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45652378]Yea I absolutely understand that. I read once you guys had to remake the whole hull from scratch, I think... so its obvious the maps were quite a labour.[/QUOTE] The hull is actually a 3d model in certain maps now (no the ones on the inside). I kinda want to improve on the Borealis when I'm bored but I realize people might be tired of seeing the same chapter updated instead of release of a new one. [QUOTE=MilkBiscuit;45653143]I read up until the 41st page, and then from the 54th page to here. I don't think anyone's asked this but if someone has please flame the fuck out of me. Has anyone tried importing the WC Map Pack VMFs into the Dota 2 Workshop Tools? I'd do it if I wasn't a lazy fuck who didn't feel like finding the WC Map Pack again.[/QUOTE] Nobody has said anything here. I haven't checked out the new tools yet, so I obviously haven't tried. [QUOTE=Jackathan;45653486]Has anybody tried to port the citizen command system from the beta? (load up the map "trainingroom" in the beta for an example)[/QUOTE] As far as I know its basically just the same as retail but I haven't messed around with it for ages. [QUOTE=DONOTWANT;45654310]What the Borealis really needed was movement. A little bobbing & swaying would make it feel like a boat, not a boat-shaped building.[/QUOTE] Not sure there's an easy way of doing this in Source. You could fake it using screen shakes but that'd be terrible. The Borealis is stuck in the ice so personally I don't see it swaying much.

[QUOTE=DONOTWANT;45654310]What the Borealis really needed was movement. A little bobbing & swaying would make it feel like a boat, not a boat-shaped building.[/QUOTE] This could actually be done... some violent shakes of the ship trying to free itself from the ice... not a bad idea!

[QUOTE=95Navigator;45652239]It kinda boiled down the mod to just shooter galleries set in a ship.[/QUOTE] I think it's more the lack of a goal in the chapter. You basically make a circle around the ship and meet Odell again to quickly escape. What was the point in walking around?

[QUOTE=HGrunt;45657091]I think it's more the lack of a goal in the chapter. You basically make a circle around the ship and meet Odell again to quickly escape. What was the point in walking around?[/QUOTE] To find the crew?

Maybe adding a sequence were you have to activate an auxiliary power source to the crane that lowers the sub into the ocean, or setting charges in the hold to scuttle the ship, or both. [editline]August 11, 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Jackathan;45619826]I took some other tile textures, and set them to tilebreak002 and tilebreak003, (with the b versions and all the vmt parameters) and this is what happened [img_thumb]http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/568896871441139138/E617BDFBC8EABA993278F09A0EADAA26FA41C20F/[/img_thumb] How do I fix this?[/QUOTE] Try using the intended "tilebreak001c" base texture instead of a random one.

[QUOTE=Kyle v2;45657194] Try using the intended "tilebreak001c" base texture instead of a random one.[/QUOTE] I took the vmt parameters out of the original tilebreak textures, and added them to those textures.

Did you try putting this texture behind the tiles? [img]http://oi62.tinypic.com/5jxroj.jpg[/img]

[QUOTE=HGrunt;45657091]I think it's more the lack of a goal in the chapter. You basically make a circle around the ship and meet Odell again to quickly escape. What was the point in walking around?[/QUOTE] To find the submarine, actually, and use it to get to Kraken Base. Here's a quote from Odell's intro speech:"We'd better get to the sub and get the hell out of here."