Dota 2 General Chat XXXII - 6.88 will make the ancient summon robot miners and TPs will be free
5,001 replies, posted
where's the techies changes
What was the centaur illusions vs tower thing? How did it work and how did I miss that?
[QUOTE=Clovis;51222829]i fucking hate when patches say "fixed" when return damage working on towers was a thing for literally years? im not sure what im missing either[/QUOTE]
It got used to win twice in a pro game. Clearly a broken mechanic that needs to be fixed.
Wasn't that actually mentioned in the alt-text of Return that it damages towers? Jeez. :v:
snip
[QUOTE=Clovis;51222829]i fucking hate when patches say "fixed" when return damage working on towers was a thing for literally years? im not sure what im missing either[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=aurum481;51223142]It got used to win twice in a pro game. Clearly a broken mechanic that needs to be fixed.[/QUOTE]
you guys know how dragon knights ult damages towers, but the poison doesnt carry over to the illusions even tho its not an orb?
a lot of passives dont carry over to illusions. they dont bash, they dont lifesteal. the ones that do are here:
[QUOTE]Evasion
Critical Strike (it should be noted that the red number is before the illusion reduction)
Feedback (only works on melee illusions) (think this was changed)
Movement speed (flat and percentage)
Attribute bonus (Strength, agility and intelligence)
Flat HP or mana
True Sight
Radiance burn aura (the aura still will not affect units already affected by a different Radiance aura)
Endurance Aura
Spell resistance from abilities, and base spell resistance[/QUOTE]
plus the change was * Fixed Return working on Centaur [B]Illusions[/B]
the real hero still does it.
[editline]18th October 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Yahnich;51220386]some of these nerfs make no sense to me to be honest; od's laning is supposed to be good it's like what makes the hero relevant at all; sure imprison is still good when its off cooldown but od has jackshit power outside of it
[/QUOTE]
have you played against OD with W max recently
its the most annoying lane in the game its worst than the old OD W
he still will dominate his lane by merit of that skill until his Q is online so he can just steal his shit
[QUOTE=Clovis;51225814]oh woe is dota 2. something thats in the game for years is now a problem. if people started picking it every game then you just get a lion or something on the enemy team to mana drain/hex the illusions. or draft a rhasta. or buy sheepsticks. maybe if they didnt pointlessly nerf sheepstick from not breaking people eould actually remember its still an item you can buy on heroes other than int mids
fuck this game
[editline]19th October 2016[/editline]
dont forget the fact centaur actually needs farm and levels for this?? like why remove somethimg that actually rewards farm on centaur when the hero doesnt farm exceptionally fast early on. removing it now after years of it being there is one thing (cause wow this is SO OP that a farmed centaur can siege) but falling it a fix is a fucking atrocity[/QUOTE]
The reason it got changed is more because of SD illusions of cent being spammable. You don't need farm as centaur to throw a million SD illusions at a tower
[editline]19th October 2016[/editline]
Getting farm is the harder route, but makes the seige smoother. SD illusions have less health early on obviously but you only have to throw a couple rounds of his disrupt illusions
[img]http://puu.sh/rOnkZ/d42d05d2ce.png[/img]
Top RNG. Now to feed hard.
You need to calm down over this Clovis it's pretty obvious that building killing passives isn't something they want on illus with the only exception being "demolish" based abilities. They've been nerfing illusions strats for awhile and having one hero who can do double damage to towers with return and the hero damage isn't in line with the others
You don't even "need farm" since return on illus Is flat damage regardless of stats and isn't reduced by reduced illusion damage (only applies to attacks separating it from demolish) and the hero still right clicks decently due to his scaling so the illusions aren't just worthless. Opinion: it says fixed because it was out of line with other illusion passives because it was unreduced damage
Is the fact it says fixed really that big of an issue for you to be going "fuck this game reee"
Yeah I have to think there was better ways like not making it affect towers but w.e.
If I had to guess why they did it this way is that coding the passive to work differently on illusions was difficult
The fix could have been the tower asking politely the illusions to leave it alone and using hurricane pike on them while refusing to shoot at them.
As someone who enjoyed playing roaming PA, this patch pains me on a spiritual level
[QUOTE=Clovis;51227917]I presume you're aware of the 75% scaling when maxed, but really 22 physical damage per tower hit to a centaur illusion when you compare it to a level 25 6 slotted centaur's return scaling is probably giving him at least 8x what the base non-scaling damage is when maxed.
It is a very fair point to say the return damage not being reduced compared to hero right clicks is a reason to nerf it (which im open to discussing whether it should be removed or not, my knickers are more in a twist the fact they called it a fucking fix) but either theres 2 possibilities here:
You misworded and the illusions DO count for strength scaling on return (which i was almost certain they did)
Or a centaur illusion hits a tower for 22 physical damage per tower hit, which is probably actually less than the illusion's right click damage after reduction anyways
Also I know you guys are probably tired of my bs but I have another point to make to defend it NOT being broken;
by the time youre going to be "abusing" this strat, youve probably already taken the tier 1s and probably already the tier 2s. But once you get past the tier 3s, then what? barracks dont hit you so you wont get to knock them faster with return damage. throne as well. yes it would be strong taking tier 4s if you aggro both of them to the one illusion but my point still stands
[editline]19th October 2016[/editline]
yea most of these, PA one too, parity changes are fucking triggering tbh. i dont think this game needs stagnation
[editline]19th October 2016[/editline]
stop being inventive guys :((([/QUOTE]
The thing is that professionally people farm a shit ton and would have the items necessary to take t2s and maybe some t1s with the strat. It doesn't matter if they aren't farmed either if they have a SD who can provide infinite illusions anyway. It's jist a bullshit illusion strat that gave a false boost in play for a hero that is totally fine
Return should have just been made to count as an autoattack, so that it suffers illusion attack damage reduction as well as does only 70% damage to towers.
Then a Centaur manta illusion's Returns would only do 23.1% of Centaur's normal Return damage to towers.
every patch and this game gets worse and worse
i've been so disappointed with dota it's ridiculous
[QUOTE=Arktomys;51228865]every patch and this game gets worse and worse
i've been so disappointed with dota it's ridiculous[/QUOTE]
techies should be deleted and gardevoir is a garbage pokemon, hth
[QUOTE=Quq;51229271]techies should be deleted and gardevoir is a garbage pokemon, hth[/QUOTE]
fuck you
[QUOTE=Clovis;51227917]
You misworded and the illusions DO count for strength scaling on return (which i was almost certain they did)
Or a centaur illusion hits a tower for 22 physical damage per tower hit, which is probably actually less than the illusion's right click damage after reduction anyways
[/QUOTE]
the illusion return damage did not scale at all, it was a flat damage based on the level of return, it does NOT get the bonus from strength
but the tower took the full base damage
meaning it took 22 damage per hit, you could see it in the video posted last page as every tower took 22 damage a shot when hitting the heart centaur
thats why the farm on the centaur didnt matter
also i think the patches have been fine this patch hasnt been stagnant at all even in these past few WEEKS picks like luna, magnus and puck to name a few have been showing up more and more
To be honest, I don't care about the Centaur change.
Like stated in the patches, it was a [I]fix.[/I]
At the very beginning of this patch, a similar gimmick with Underlord going the Alchemist Radiance/Manta build was squashed.
Why? Because it was a bug.
This Centaur change is no different, really.
[QUOTE=MaxisOp;51230040]To be honest, I don't care about the Centaur change.
Like stated in the patches, it was a [I]fix.[/I]
At the very beginning of this patch, [B]a similar gimmick with Underlord going the Alchemist Radiance/Manta build was squashed.[/B]
Why? Because it was a bug.
This Centaur change is no different, really.[/QUOTE]
That build still exists lol
The change made it so that if Morphling makes a Replicate or Hybrid or SD makes Disruption illusions of an Underlord, and the created illusion is within 900 units of a dying enemy unit, the Atrophy Aura damage goes to the Morphling/SD instead of Underlord for some reason.
[QUOTE=Arktomys;51228865]every patch and this game gets worse and worse
i've been so disappointed with dota it's ridiculous[/QUOTE]
In what, exactly?
I say this because once again, a varied cast of heroes are pickable and usable.
I get that you're still upset that your hero main was nerfed 3 patchnotes ago, but that's no way to judge the state of the game.
[editline]scldlsls[/editline]
You haven't even played a game of Dota in 3 months, and I highly doubt you've watched or analyzed any Dota games in the past 3 months, either.
Are you really [I][U]qualified[/U][/I] to talk about the balance of this game at hand?
[QUOTE=MaxisOp;51230074]In what, exactly?
I say this because once again, a varied cast of heroes are pickable and usable.
I get that you're still upset that your hero main was nerfed 3 patchnotes ago, but that's no way to judge the state of the game.[/QUOTE]
maybe i just had enough of the game
i don't know. just watching or playing dota just isn't the same for me anymore. i'm not having fun, basically. and this sort of "anyone can do anything" thing bothers me a LOT
there's just something for example about "support PA" that just doesn't click me right. it goes against everything i learned
it feels like this is a completely different game from the one that i got hooked back in 2013
[editline]20th October 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=MaxisOp;51230074]You haven't even played a game of Dota in 3 months, and I highly doubt you've watched or analyzed any Dota games in the past 3 months, either.
Are you really [I][U]qualified[/U][/I] to talk about the balance of this game at hand?[/QUOTE]
i watch pro dota games and rtc strims (when he's online lol) pretty much every day, hoping that maybe my interest in the game sparks again
i just don't want to dislike a game that i spent thousands of hours on
if you dont like support PA why dont you like a nerf/patch that reduces the strength of support PA
the strengths of core PA are still the same
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