New 3DS Megathread v6 - Games

[QUOTE=Man in the Moon;47118164]Except you're wrong, It has the longest intro in possibly any of the zelda games, going through tutorial after tutorial or small village quest after small village quest, Zant was a joke, he would have made a fine Final boss but for some reason or another nintendo didn't think we could handle not ganon, also this unnecessary bullshit. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKYyh8zi3aI[/media][/QUOTE] So just one cutscene makes all the cutscenes "Dark"? And I thought Zant was a great villain, he was just really insane by the end of the game. And the tutorial was fine, it didn't last long at all. It was just like one or two missions, some cutscenes and that is about it. Around 1 hour. If you compare that to most recent games, that is not long at all. Also so what if the intro is long? It's called story. Something a lot of games have trouble explaining without giving us DLC. I will admit, Twilight Princess is far from being a 10/10 Zelda game, and it does need fixing. But I really enjoyed it, and if they wanted to cut some stuff down then go ahead. But if I see them including more Hand holding, then I will be fucking pissed. I hate hand holding, which is why I dislike the changes in MM3D, since it makes the game easier by holding your hand. I am not saying that the game is horrible, or that the remake is going to be fucking horrible and no one should buy it. I am sure it will be a good remake which will introduce new Zelda players to Majora's Mask, and bringing back old MM fans to see their favorite game remade. But I played Majora's Mask and enjoyed it for the difficulty, the crazy dance Odolwa Does, the ability to explore with Ice Arrows, going so fast as Goron Link and swimming around as Zora Link. That is what made the game amazing to me. And honestly, I am really disappointed and pissed off that they removed it and made it easier. It just takes away the stuff I liked and a lot of others liked as well. Heck, I was still going to buy the game since I could still play it like the original, cause I thought you could still save by Song of Time. I loved the part of MM3D. You can either go around and save at Owl Statue's, or go back in time and save before so. But the only way you can save is by Owl Statues and Feathers. Half the time in Majora's Mask I saved via SoT, I hardly used the Owl Statue unless I am doing a temple or doing a side quest. It just saved time to use SoT, but they removed it which was the final straw for me. I am sorry if I came off as intense but I just really love Majora's Mask, it's in my top 3. And to see it based around and changed to be easier really annoys me since I was really excited for a Remake. And I was really excited for the remake. You guys are right though, maybe I am over exaggerating. I shouldn't of canceled my pre-order so soon since I am starting to really just think about it. So I plan to re-pre order it tomorrow. And while it is stupid for me to pre-order it despite the fact I dislike the changes, I prefer to pre-order it so I get it by early next week. Besides, I am not going to wait months for it to become cheaper. I'd rather pay full price than wait and dislike the game without trying. I should be allowed to have an opinion before release, but I should also play the game before having a solid opinion, just like you guys said. Besides, if I don't like it then I'll just trade it in.

That's awesome man! I'm glad to hear that. Now there's one more person that also gets to tag along on the remade adventure.

Too be honest, each time I see MM3D, I get all excited inside. So there is still hope for me liking MM3D. And while I don't go into detail about it, there is tons of stuff I like about MM3D.

[QUOTE=Man in the Moon;47118164]Except you're wrong, It has the longest intro in possibly any of the zelda games, going through tutorial after tutorial or small village quest after small village quest, Zant was a joke, he would have made a fine Final boss but for some reason or another nintendo didn't think we could handle not ganon, also this unnecessary bullshit. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKYyh8zi3aI[/media][/QUOTE] Longest intro is an understatement. In Link to the Past, you're in a castle dungeon in five minutes or less, and the first dungeon follows shortly after in upwards from half an hour to an hour depending on how much you explore, with gameplay being mostly unexplained besides new items because it's so simple. Ocarina of Time, you can get to the first dungeon in ten minutes or less from a fresh game, with the time raised understandably to account for optional new-for-the-time 3D control tutorials. Majora's Mask barely bothers with any sort of tutorials, instead forcing you to go through a three day cycle to familiarize yourself with Clock Town and then dropping the primary game mechanic bombshell on you as everything you do after that is mostly of your own accord - so dungeon time is hard to scale, what with sidequests and heart pieces opening up immediately after that. Wind Waker takes something closer to half an hour to get to the castle dungeon equivalent, as it forces you to go through more story than previously as well as learn the new sword mechanics, but also introduces various new and fresh mechanics as things go along with adequate pacing before you reach the first proper dungeon in a couple of hours. Twilight Princess has you forcibly go through a series of tutorials, even doing goat herding twice with only more goats the second time around, makes you learn how to swing a sword with various attacks, shoot a slingshot, fish, summon eagles, and such. Then you get turned into Wolf Link, do a small 10-20 minute mini-dungeon of linearity, have to kill the light bugs and wander the village to get a shield, turn back to normal Link, finally head for the first dungeon, get the first required in a number of otherwise-optional special moves for your sword, and then [i]finally[/i] set foot in the first dungeon proper where the game stops holding your hand with linearity and plays more like an average Zelda title. This can take up to 2-3 hours or more by itself, basically almost every single thing you do is to put players into a cycle for the first chunk or so of the game. And I probably missed a couple things. They say the developers wanted to make sure the players knew all of the game mechanics thoroughly before truly starting the adventure, but the mass of frontloaded tutorials and sheer "string the player along by the nose to do as we want them to" is insane compared to every other game before it. Probably the biggest contender for longest intro ties with Skyward Sword in terms of the main games on consoles, and even that game gets the ball rolling a lot faster despite its own handholding notoriety.

[QUOTE=Xonax;47118203]So just one cutscene makes all the cutscenes "Dark"? And I thought Zant was a great villain, he was just really insane by the end of the game. And the tutorial was fine, it didn't last long at all. It was just like one or two missions, some cutscenes and that is about it. Around 1 hour. If you compare that to most recent games, that is not long at all. Also so what if the intro is long? It's called story. Something a lot of games have trouble explaining without giving us DLC. [/QUOTE] Like you said, it takes maybe an hour, Within the first ten minutes of Windwaker you've already gotten your sword and are on tetra's ship, Thirty minutes you're at the first dungeon. But for Twilight princess, within thirty minutes you're at the first wolf section if you're speeding through, Honestly the beginning of that game is probably the biggest reason I haven't replayed it. Also there's more dark and edgy cutscenes than just the one, I can provide more if you like. I'm also not saying it's bad, Hell I sat in a wal-mart for 32 hours for that game, and if it was bad, I'd totally hate on it. But it isn't bad it's just got it's flaws like all of the games. [editline]10th February 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=RikohZX;47118240]Longest intro is an understatement. In Link to the Past, you're in a castle dungeon in five minutes or less, and the first dungeon follows shortly after in upwards from half an hour to an hour depending on how much you explore, with gameplay being mostly unexplained besides new items because it's so simple. Ocarina of Time, you can get to the first dungeon in ten minutes or less from a fresh game, with the time raised understandably to account for optional new-for-the-time 3D control tutorials. Majora's Mask barely bothers with any sort of tutorials, instead forcing you to go through a three day cycle to familiarize yourself with Clock Town and then dropping the primary game mechanic bombshell on you as everything you do after that is mostly of your own accord - so dungeon time is hard to scale, what with sidequests and heart pieces opening up immediately after that. Wind Waker takes something closer to half an hour to get to the castle dungeon equivalent, as it forces you to go through more story than previously as well as learn the new sword mechanics, but also introduces various new and fresh mechanics as things go along with adequate pacing before you reach the first proper dungeon in a couple of hours. Twilight Princess has you forcibly go through a series of tutorials, even doing goat herding twice with only more goats the second time around, makes you learn how to swing a sword with various attacks, shoot a slingshot, fish, summon eagles, and such. Then you get turned into Wolf Link, do a small 10-20 minute mini-dungeon of linearity, have to kill the light bugs and wander the village to get a shield, turn back to normal Link, finally head for the first dungeon, get the first required in a number of otherwise-optional special moves for your sword, and then [i]finally[/i] set foot in the first dungeon proper where the game stops holding your hand with linearity and plays more like an average Zelda title. This can take up to 2-3 hours or more by itself, basically almost every single thing you do is to put players into a cycle for the first chunk or so of the game. And I probably missed a couple things. They say the developers wanted to make sure the players knew all of the game mechanics thoroughly before truly starting the adventure, but the mass of frontloaded tutorials and sheer "string the player along by the nose to do as we want them to" is insane compared to every other game before it.[/QUOTE] Fuck I forgot about the light bugs.

I'm kind of glad that they're making MM3D more accessible. Hopefully I don't have to have my face glued in a guide the whole time I'm playing, like when I was a kid.

I still don't know how I was able to get all but two heart pieces without a guide as a kid. 100% on masks too, my old file had the fierce deity on it without cheating. How the fuck did I complete the Anju/Kafei quest when I was twelve years old

Are the people in the page before seriously complaining that some Zelda games fleshed out the lore a bit more? Because I think Zelda was in seriously need of just that. Being in a castle dungeon in Link to the Past in 5 mins is fine and all but I'd rather have a climatic, crescendo approach to an actual story other than - "Oh yeah go look for Tri-Force, kill bad guys, save world" - A decent narrative is fine in a Zelda game if you ask me.

Hmm, should I buy MM3D on the eShop on release so I can play it day 1? Or pre-order it and get it physically sometime next week. I am thinking about going via eShop but I am not sure.

[QUOTE=Bugga12;47118423]Are the people in the page before seriously complaining that some Zelda games fleshed out the lore a bit more? Because I think Zelda was in seriously need of just that. Being in a castle dungeon in Link to the Past in 5 mins is fine and all but I'd rather have a climatic, crescendo approach to an actual story other than - "Oh yeah go look for Tri-Force, kill bad guys, save world" - A decent narrative is fine in a Zelda game if you ask me.[/QUOTE] I focused more on the gameplay side of things in terms of describing general timelengths rather than the story side. Story's never inherently a bad thing unless the plot itself is bad or it gets in the way of the game, and in terms of Twilight Princess its plot still somehow has more brevity than Skyward Sword but it does like to steal the spotlight. A good case is, if i'm remembering this right, when the spirit of Ordon tells you upon first meeting it as Wolf Link about the Twilight invading the land when Midna and Zelda basically told you the exact same thing, except now it's in really slow text that'd make the Great Deku Tree proud, and that's just one case early on. I'm not so much complaining about plot or lore, but rather the game taking forever with itself to teach the player most of the gameplay factors of the entire game in a couple of hours. The plot's slow as molasses obviously, but it's practically a liberation from herding goats twice over or hunting light bugs.

[QUOTE=Xonax;47118428]Hmm, should I buy MM3D on the eShop on release so I can play it day 1? Or pre-order it and get it physically sometime next week. I am thinking about going via eShop but I am not sure.[/QUOTE] Physical since if you don't like it you can trade it in.

[QUOTE=ryfry99;47118455]Physical since if you don't like it you can trade it in.[/QUOTE] I was a dumb fool, of course I will like it.

[QUOTE=Bugga12;47118423]Are the people in the page before seriously complaining that some Zelda games fleshed out the lore a bit more? Because I think Zelda was in seriously need of just that. Being in a castle dungeon in Link to the Past in 5 mins is fine and all but I'd rather have a climatic, crescendo approach to an actual story other than - "Oh yeah go look for Tri-Force, kill bad guys, save world" - A decent narrative is fine in a Zelda game if you ask me.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but then you try a bit too hard like Skyward Sword, and wind up not only conflicting your own story with tons of plotholes, but you [I]accidentally retcon at least one other game out of existence.[/I] If you don't think I'm being serious, consider the following: In Minish Cap, the story was about why all the incarnations of Link have that hat - because of Ezlo. In the opening scene, it showed a previous incarnation without a hat. However, Skyward Sword is set before Minish Cap, and inexplicably, LINK HAS THE HAT THAT WAS INSPIRED BY EZLO WHO WOULDN'T EXIST FOR ANOTHER THOUSAND YEARS. [editline]11th February 2015[/editline] Seriously, Skyward Sword can go fuck right off to non-canon land until they can explain that somehow.

Groose was the only good thing about Skyward Sword

[QUOTE=Everything;47118497]Yeah, but then you try a bit too hard like Skyward Sword, and wind up not only conflicting your own story with tons of plotholes, but you [I]accidentally retcon at least one other game out of existence.[/I] If you don't think I'm being serious, consider the following: In Minish Cap, the story was about why all the incarnations of Link have that hat - because of Ezlo. In the opening scene, it showed a previous incarnation without a hat. However, Skyward Sword is set before Minish Cap, and inexplicably, LINK HAS THE HAT THAT WAS INSPIRED BY EZLO WHO WOULDN'T EXIST FOR ANOTHER THOUSAND YEARS. [editline]11th February 2015[/editline] Seriously, Skyward Sword can go fuck right off to non-canon land until they can explain that somehow.[/QUOTE] But was it ever stated that he got the cap from Ezlo? Maybe the other Link just didn't wear the cap at all.

[QUOTE=Xonax;47118661]But was it ever stated that he got the cap from Ezlo? Maybe the other Link just didn't wear the cap at all.[/QUOTE] But the point is that it quite plainly lays out in Minish Cap that no incarnation of the hero before then had a hat. This is what the last Link looked like, according to the opening cinematic and several other sources within the game: [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/uqMOuTe.png[/IMG] Prominent flowing gold locks, a little green headband, and most notably, nothing else. In every other game in the series, the previous incarnation is shown wearing the trademark goofy green hat, with this being the sole exception, ever. Someone on the Skyward Sword story team either forgot Minish Cap comes after it, or that it exists altogether. Either way, I'd sooner argue Skyward Sword is not canon than Minish Cap, simply because even disregarding such a huge oversight, the latter is far more internally consistent and doesn't conflict itself with convoluted and hackneyed time travel.

[QUOTE=RikohZX;47116738]I'm a Kirby 64 kind of guy but that game didn't age badly at all really. If it weren't for being nostalgia'd to in just about every Kirby game and the fact that it lacks a lot of overall content compared to its successors, i'd almost say the original Kirby's Adventure would be worth a remaster/remake.[/QUOTE] I kinda agree for 64. it had somewhat of a new starting point for the Kirby series in general as it attempted to move to 3D. the series lore has expanded to an extent but is underutilized except for the fans. i think I'd want something to connect 0² (Zero Squared) to Squeak Squad since somehow Dedede got a chunk of Dark Matter, would at least make SS slightly less of an excuse plot. No idea wherever to suggest a Meta Knight mode or a Dedede mode as the norm; certainly needs a new world. And a fightable Nova! just to connect lore to Magolor and as a general all-round throwback. Maybe a semi-noncanon time-lapse to after the game's plot where remnants of 0² fused with displaced shards of Nova due to him altering the time-space continuum summoning Galacta Knight (during the events of Meta Knightmare Ultra), said Shards being the intact remains that Marx absorbed before transforming into Marx Soul. the defeat would be the reason to that tiny bit of Dark Matter Dedede gets before Squeak Squad. Just seems that 64 would be more easier to produce than an AM remake, just because the game is 2.5D, it'll feel a bit more closer to modern standards, and besides [sp]Dedede fighting against Dark Meta Knight, and destroying the Amazing Mirror again...from the INSIDE[/sp] how would they add value to the experience? the game was pretty wide open anyway, whilst obtaining Crystal Shards themselves would feel a little too similar to other things like Mario 3D World's stars, it's just gameplay that's familiar and would make nice use of the 3DS's graphics.

one thing with the Wii U Zelda i wouldn't mind if the clothing we have seen Link wear thus far was the default suit I know the green tunic will likely come out of the woodwork sooner or later. just saying I'm digging this new suit

[QUOTE=Everything;47118716]But the point is that it quite plainly lays out in Minish Cap that no incarnation of the hero before then had a hat. This is what the last Link looked like, according to the opening cinematic and several other sources within the game: [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/uqMOuTe.png[/IMG] Prominent flowing gold locks, a little green headband, and most notably, nothing else. In every other game in the series, the previous incarnation is shown wearing the trademark goofy green hat, with this being the sole exception, ever. Someone on the Skyward Sword story team either forgot Minish Cap comes after it, or that it exists altogether.[/QUOTE] But there is also stuff that Minish Cap retconned that Skyward Sword put into place. And SS didn't retcon the entirety of Minish Cap, just the hat part.

Just the most notable part? The part the story is based on? The entire reason for that game's helper character to exist? Yeah, sure. Skyward Sword self-importantly came into the room and sat in a chair before even checking to make sure there wasn't anyone already occupying it. [editline]t[/editline] Don't get me wrong, there are some parts of SS I thought were genuinely interesting twists/reveals, but the rest just brought it all down for me. And let's not even get started on [URL="http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/weird-time-paradox-major-spoilers.208083616/"]the Sealed Grounds paradox[/URL]; possibly the most egregious internal consistency oversight Nintendo has ever made.

[QUOTE=Bugga12;47118423]Are the people in the page before seriously complaining that some Zelda games fleshed out the lore a bit more? Because I think Zelda was in seriously need of just that. Being in a castle dungeon in Link to the Past in 5 mins is fine and all but I'd rather have a climatic, crescendo approach to an actual story other than - "Oh yeah go look for Tri-Force, kill bad guys, save world" - A decent narrative is fine in a Zelda game if you ask me.[/QUOTE] I agree with you to an extent, but where possible you should be playing the story. Link Between Worlds had a good story and that game throws you straight the fuck in. You watch the narrative unfold through the action.

[QUOTE=Everything;47118751]And let's not even get started on [URL="http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/weird-time-paradox-major-spoilers.208083616/"]the Sealed Grounds paradox[/URL]; possibly the most egregious internal consistency oversight Nintendo has ever made.[/QUOTE] Funny, Ocarina of Time had something similar too in the Windmill Hut for the Song of Storm song. When you meet the windmill guy, he was angry that a boy with a ocarina came to him and play the song, which turns out to be you, but when in point did you actually learned that song to play it to the windmill guy to begin with?

[QUOTE=Everything;47118751]Just the most notable part? The part the story is based on? The entire reason for that game's helper character to exist? Yeah, sure. Skyward Sword self-importantly came into the room and sat in a chair before even checking to make sure there wasn't anyone already occupying it. [editline]t[/editline] Don't get me wrong, there are some parts of SS I thought were genuinely interesting twists/reveals, but the rest just brought it all down for me. And let's not even get started on [URL="http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/weird-time-paradox-major-spoilers.208083616/"]the Sealed Grounds paradox[/URL]; possibly the most egregious internal consistency oversight Nintendo has ever made.[/QUOTE] I am having trouble understanding that, care to explain? Also, MM3D, eShop or Physical? [editline]11th February 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=KnightRider25;47118811]Funny, Ocarina of Time had something similar too in the Windmill Hut for the Song of Storm song. When you meet the windmill guy, he was angry that a boy with a ocarina came to him and play the song, which turns out to be you, but when in point did you actually learned that song to play it to the windmill guy to begin with?[/QUOTE] Well the Windmill plays the song in the background. Link probably learnt it from that, then since he has the Ocarina, it created a storm. He then went and played it to the Windmill guy, it unblocked the Mini-Dungeon, then Later in life the Windmill guy teaches it to Adult Link, who then goes back in time and plays it for the Windmill guy. Only problem is that there would be two links who played it to him.

[QUOTE=Xonax;47118741]But there is also stuff that Minish Cap retconned that Skyward Sword put into place. And SS didn't retcon the entirety of Minish Cap, just the hat part.[/QUOTE] You're missing a key factor, the word "Legend" in the title. A legend will be changed as time passes, or perhaps the stained glass was made with a misunderstanding of what the Hero looked like, because if you look he has a goatee.

I don't see a lot of people bring up the "Master Sword sleeps again FOREVER" in LTTP and let that shit slide in ALBW

[QUOTE=EditOutJ;47118971]I don't see a lot of people bring up the "Master Sword sleeps again FOREVER" in LTTP and let that shit slide in ALBW[/QUOTE] Forever doesn't necessarily mean forever, it could be a figure of speech.

i think the zelda timeline being canonized as a thing in hyrule historia is the stupidest thing to ever happen to the series the games clearly weren't made to fit together in any particular order, they can all be seen to be some variation on the same basic tale like how the same myth or piece of folklore changes slightly as you travel the country of it's origin. trying to make them seem like they all tie together is like cutting up a bunch of paintings to try make them into a jigsaw puzzle.

[QUOTE=KnightRider25;47118811]Funny, Ocarina of Time had something similar too in the Windmill Hut for the Song of Storm song. When you meet the windmill guy, he was angry that a boy with a ocarina came to him and play the song, which turns out to be you, but when in point did you actually learned that song to play it to the windmill guy to begin with?[/QUOTE] He says: [QUOTE=Guru Guru]What?! You've got an ocarina!! What the heck! That reminds me of that time, seven years ago! Back then a mean kid came here and played a strange song. It messed up this windmill! I'll never forget this song![/QUOTE] He says kid, not boy. What if Zelda played a prank on him with the Ocarina? Seeing how Impa is the founder of Kakariko, she could have brought the princess with her at some point. Plus, it's canon that OoT Zelda is a tomboy (the Gossip Stone in Hyrule Castle tells you that), so she could love playing pranks on people, hence why her father might not believe everything she says or her premonitions as she does not behave as she should. This may be stretching it but it could work. As for Skyward Sword, yeah, they messed a few bits here and there... Again time travel stuff is complicated and avoiding paradoxes seems hard. I remember fucking myself up when writing a story and I ended up with paradoxes all over the altered future.

Say I'm considering getting a New 3DS XL when they come out. What the hell am I expected to do for the charger?

[QUOTE=Protocol7;47119499]Say I'm considering getting a New 3DS XL when they come out. What the hell am I expected to do for the charger?[/QUOTE] Buy one separately?