PAYDAY 2 V9 - 900% More Chromatic Aberration and Lens dirt Edition - Games

Wow, the NGBTO mod is pure cancer. It has options to auto-kick people for using individual perk decks, deployables, armor types, and the amount of hours a player has in [I]just loud heists.[/I] I get wanting to keep low level players out of Deathwish, but god damn is this shit ridiculous. I've been kicked twice today for using the sociopath perk deck.

[QUOTE=spekter;50651182]I want more logical balancing with cops. A shield should not be able to accurately snipe you from across the map regardless of difficulty.[/QUOTE] Or the superfast twirling when you try to flank the fucker.

[QUOTE=Finale;50651644]I have a massive (~90 pages) design doc for what I'd like to see in a higher difficulty, mostly focused on qualitative differences to heists and enemies. I'll post the general concept and an example heist this evening when I have access to it.[/QUOTE] If you post it I'll feel forced to also post my Payday 2 improvement guide. And then the internet will be flooded with ideas and the world will ravel dreamily in a vision of what Payday 2 could be if modders ruled the universe.

[QUOTE=Loadingue;50652153] And then the internet will be flooded with ideas and the world will ravel dreamily in a vision of what Payday 2 could be if modders ruled the universe.[/QUOTE] Probably this [video=youtube;31Oqckq1BRc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31Oqckq1BRc[/video]

[QUOTE=Super Muffin;50651962]Wow, the NGBTO mod is pure cancer. It has options to auto-kick people for using individual perk decks, deployables, armor types, and the amount of hours a player has in [I]just loud heists.[/I] I get wanting to keep low level players out of Deathwish, but god damn is this shit rediculous. I've been kicked twice today for using the sociopath perk deck.[/QUOTE] NGBTO is a great way of finding out which lobbies you probably wouldn't have wanted to play in anyway. My favorite is the one I found where you would be kicked from using Two Piece of LWBV, despite the fact that you can kick insane amounts of ass using either. Also this was in Alesso, which isn't even remotely a hard death wish by anyone's standards

[QUOTE=doommarine23;50651356]I think its a really big thing to do, honestly. Like every difficulty below Overkill is pretty much worthless and Overkill once you know what you're doing is just the norm. Deathwish is slightly difficult but it depends on the heist and what you're doing, its more involved but I wouldn't say its super super hard like it used to be. But at the same time, its not something I can see drastically changing, difficulty in Payday is always artificial like more enemy health, more enemy units, stronger units are more common, more bags required. Part of me wonders if its just best to leave it as it is, beyond fixing issues like how flashbangs are dumb gimmicks, it seems like a difficulty overhaul would be a huge game change which while sounds appealing, you have to question the return on investment of it.[/QUOTE] Goat sim on DW is retarded almost entirely because enemies can mark you from any range. Any map where range is a factor fucking sucks because even a Dozer or Shield can hit you consistently even if they're miles away. Also the issue of cops just randomly snapping their aim or their animations not representing where they're actually aiming.

[QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652227]NGBTO is a great way of finding out which lobbies you probably wouldn't have wanted to play in anyway. My favorite is the one I found where you would be kicked from using Two Piece of LWBV, despite the fact that you can kick insane amounts of ass using either. Also this was in Alesso, which isn't even remotely a hard death wish by anyone's standards[/QUOTE] I'm finding the people with NGBTO tend to be =[T$C]= or =TM$=, and generally terrible players all around. I'll sit in the lobby watching people get kicked endlessly. [t]http://i.cubeupload.com/AMfE0R.png[/t] [QUOTE=spekter;50652319]Goat sim on DW is retarded almost entirely (...)[/QUOTE] I like it just because I can yell "GET OUT OF THE MURDER BARN" in chat.

Honestly this is why I just play with better bots and maybe a friend or two. I can do Overkill just fine with BB alone and I'm sure I can handle Deathwish with my boyfriend. People don't realize that this game's community is only going to get smaller and its already fairly small as is. I really don't mind the people here and I don't mind most people in general and I won't get into a rant about it, but for some reason Payday 2 has one of the most aggressive and angry communities I seen in a co-op game. I respect entirely that its "your" server. But you also must understand your server is just a P2P connection of a game where you're only important because it has no host migration. Beyond this? You're not any more important than any other player on the team. You may or may not have bought the heist but that is about it. Until (aka never) Payday 2 has a server system set up most source games where there is actual time and money involved, typically from an actual community and everything? Than honestly I couldn't care less about you and the fact its "your" server. Server hosting in Payday takes less effort and commitment than it does for me to take a dump. I don't care what individual people do, its entirely your right to kick people and use auto-kick plugins and get all high about it, but I also got the right to critique it. Its a terrible practice and it makes me very sad for this game because the fact that numerous lobbies exist where you'll be auto-kicked for playing certain armors, skills, perks, weapons, characters, and I am sure much more? Is just pathetic.

I once got called a cheater for using Better Bots. I was the host. The lobby filled up soon enough, making that accusation completely nullified. Is using Better Bots cheating?

[QUOTE=brenz;50652356]I once got called a cheater for using Better Bots. I was the host. The lobby filled up soon enough, making that accusation completely nullified. Is using Better Bots cheating?[/QUOTE] "Cheating" in a literal sense of gaining an advantage, sure. But does it matter? Does Overkill care? No, they do not and it does not matter. The bots in this game already do not play to the skill of an average player to begin with. Keep it and keep enjoying your game, OVK has made it clear that they are okay with gameplay mods that do not hurt other people's game and honestly, someone has serious problems if a Dallas bot not dying 24/7 is damaging their game.

[QUOTE=Loadingue;50652153]If you post it I'll feel forced to also post my Payday 2 improvement guide. And then the internet will be flooded with ideas and the world will ravel dreamily in a vision of what Payday 2 could be if modders ruled the universe.[/QUOTE] As you wish! [B]General notes on Finale's "Black Ops" difficulty:[/B] 1. Enemies and damage/health are at a point only slightly above DW. Difficulty mostly comes from different enemy behavior, changes to mechanics, and qualitative changes to heists. 3. Generally assume that cop and sniper spawns are added or moved on maps to make the usual holdout positions less viable. 4. The basic plot idea of Black Ops is that some shadowy authority figure, a “G-man”, has hacked crimenet, and more generally, everything is going wrong. The police know you’re coming, the assets never arrived, the chopper pilot is Alex, and Bain isn't letting you leave until you got that one last bag. 5. Black Ops is not supposed to be stupid hard. The whole idea is to design surprising challenges that reward new tactics and thought, in contrast to DW. It's not "everything is Titan lined with C4". There's sadism, but it's parcelled out slowly and is meant to be beatable. Clearing BO heists should feel like an accomplishment, as opposed to DW, where failures can feel like bad luck giving you bad enemy spawns. 6. Basic enemy damage normalization is partially reversed. What this means is that normal enemy tiers hit harder at higher tiers, rather than giving you glass cannon street cops and blue FBI (these units only appear in scripted cases anyways). [B]General Loud changes:[/B] BO loud generally gives you one additional advantage in that Bain will intercept the hacker’s communications with police. What this means from a gameplay perspective is that, like in Payday 1, you will get warning of certain scripted events before they happen. Black Ops introduces a new basic enemy type, the Black Ops enemy. They have similar weapons and stats when compared with Gensec elites. I wouldn't really change their behavior much (largely relying on the Gensec elite AI, which spawns them in teams of four that try to concentrate fire and stay together). [I]Unlike[/I] Gensec elites, they can't be dominated. This may seem to make dominate/joker even weaker, but other high-level police will still spawn on BO, and in many cases there won't be any civilians to use as hostages, making those skills essential. Black Ops enemies have another nasty feature in loud- they use flashbangs and smoke grenades frequently, but instead of normal smoke, their grenades emit tear gas. This is meant to make camping much less viable. This is meant to reduce the viability of camping on some maps, and increase the likelihood of a return of the smokescreen push effect seen in payday 1. [B]Black Ops guards[/B] are security guards sent by the G-man that appear in some stealth settings. They generally look like more intimidating, professional versions of the suited guards that appear on, e.g., Framing Frame 3. Black Ops guards have different idle animations, but otherwise are not mechanically different in stealth than normal guards. Pagers are answered by the G-man himself, but are part of the same pool of 4. When alerted, their guns pack a much stronger punch, equivalent to a DW bronco cop. Black Ops guards are effectively a sign that the G-man is personally monitoring the location you’re hitting. As such, they only appear on some stealth maps. [B]Snipers[/B] only spawn using the greenish “murky” model. They have the same health and damage as Overkill snipers. Snipers can spawn in between assault waves, particularly in something that Bain or the intercepted police comms would call an "overwatch", which basically translates to a large set of sniper positions spawning at once. Sniper positions are generally changed to nastier or less predictable locations on BO maps. [B]Shields[/B] will, when not scripted to defend a position, generally attempt to close with and melee players. The time to loss of focus will also be increased, meaning breaking line of sight to make them turn away will take longer. These changes incentivize Iron Man, but can cause problems if you need to deal with a Shield combined with other enemies. [B]Bulldozers[/B] can, like in Payday 1, run. They’re also completely immune to explosive damage, their health is increased and their crit/headshot multiplier is reduced. No LMGs, though, and no other major changes. The Thanatos will still work great on Bulldozers, but I'm hoping to create more situations where players are forced to confront them up close. -On loud maps involving a thermal drill, Bain will sometimes announce that a "Demo Team" is going for the drill. This means a differently colored Bulldozer is going to spawn (with some escort, usually shields and blops). singlemindedly path to, and attempt to plant C4 on, the thermal drill. If they do so, and if the C4 isn't immediately defused (a hard thing to do with the Bully right there), the drill is destroyed and Bain will have to have another one flown/driven to the location, usually in an exposed place. This restarts progress on the drill. Demo Dozers have about twice as much health as normal dozers, but cannot run. Demo Teams are scripted such that their time of appearance is somewhat random, but the number of times they can spawn is fixed. You’ll never be inundated with 40 of them in a heist. With these enemies I'm hoping to change up player priorities on the fly, as with Winters, and create a situation a bit akin to the bomb tanks on MvM in TF2 (though hopefully less all-or-nothing). [B]Tasers[/B] take significantly less time to down a player, so getting tased actually is tense, rather than getting downed just being an issue of whether or not you're being hit through a wall. The tasing animation will skew the screen and generally be harder to shoot through, as in payday 1. [B]Cloakers[/B] no longer make the feedback sound when not charging. This should be less of an issue because by the time you're playing BO you'd usually know where they come from, anyways. Cloaker spawns will be normalized, and there will be fewer maps with inexplicable inundations of cloakers (this appears to be caused by a slapdash spawn allocation design choice when the new enemy was added). However, the game will be able to spawn a four-member cloaker team. [B]SWAT Turrets[/B]may spawn in different positions, and reload in about 75% of their normal time. They’re also heavily resistant to explosives and immune to fire. [B]Captain Winters[/B] will often spawn at a scripted point in a heist to maximize the annoyance/difficulty of getting to him. His defense position may be changed or even randomly selected between locations to increase exposure. He and his unit will be majorly resistant to fire and explosive damage. His booster effect and health will be unchanged. I'll post an example of heist changes a bit later on-this post is already quite long. A general goal with the design was to minimize the need for new assets, so maps rarely have new objects or heavily changed layouts.

To the post above, I'd add that damage delay should be removed as well. Tired of that shit not working and double hits occurring way too often.

Anytime I see a server that says "Host is Running...." I almost always instinctively leave because 99% they're caustic people "Silent Assassin" is straight up cheating, guys

[QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652469]Anytime I see a server that says "Host is Running...." I almost always instinctively leave because 99% they're caustic people "Silent Assassin" is straight up cheating, guys[/QUOTE] What's that?

[QUOTE=brenz;50650978]What would you guys hope from difficulty rebalance?[/QUOTE] Overkill should try taking some pointers from certain people on the outside, maybe some folks in the modding community. [sp]But what do I know?[/sp]

[sp]there's no winkyface rating so have a "funny" instead[/sp] Also [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/445110986866920153/C8A7A9ED9FC7E9850611CD6D1CB09BD666F9B741/[/t] Yep it's wood

[QUOTE=DeadMansChest;50652635][sp]there's no winkyface rating so have a "funny" instead[/sp] Also [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/445110986866920153/C8A7A9ED9FC7E9850611CD6D1CB09BD666F9B741/[/t] Yep it's wood[/QUOTE] Wood you believe it!?

[QUOTE=Super Muffin;50652328]I'm finding the people with NGBTO tend to be =[T$C]= or =TM$=, and generally terrible players all around. I'll sit in the lobby watching people get kicked endlessly. [t]http://i.cubeupload.com/AMfE0R.png[/t] [/QUOTE] The worst thing about this is that people don't even know why they're being kicked, they won't know or get the chance to explain why their perk deck isn't complete, they can't justify the perk deck choice to the host (nearly all of them are alright after the balance anyway). They'll just see "you have been kicked from the game" and move on to the next lobby.

[QUOTE=brenz;50652497]What's that?[/QUOTE] A mod that makes it so killing a non alert guard doesn't trigger his pager. There's no way to pretend that's not cheating.

[QUOTE=A Glitch;50652697]The worst thing about this is that people don't even know why they're being kicked, they won't know or get the chance to explain why their perk deck isn't complete, they can't justify the perk deck choice to the host (nearly all of them are alright after the balance anyway). They'll just see "you have been kicked from the game" and move on to the next lobby.[/QUOTE] Overkill should've had kick reasons like tf2 [editline]5th July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652714]A mod that makes it so killing a non alert guard doesn't trigger his pager. There's no way to pretend that's not cheating.[/QUOTE] I wanted this to be a mutator, might check it out [editline]5th July 2016[/editline] What's host is running though

[QUOTE=brenz;50652434]To the post above, I'd add that damage delay should be removed as well. Tired of that shit not working and double hits occurring way too often.[/QUOTE] Are you referring to temporary invincibility to lower amounts of damage when hit? Because removing that would make the game virtually unplayable.

[QUOTE=Finale;50652765]Are you referring to temporary invincibility to lower amounts of damage when hit? Because removing that would make the game virtually unplayable.[/QUOTE] Just gotta tweak damage values a bit. I'm sure it has been tried before. Just gotta avoid getting hit too often.

To respond to what finale posted, I 100% agree with everything minus the bomb squad, drills are Already enough of a pain

[QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652714]A mod that makes it so killing a non alert guard doesn't trigger his pager. There's no way to pretend that's not cheating.[/QUOTE] To be honest that doesn't sound so bad. I've always hated the 4 pagers restriction. This mod could certainly make stealth a bit more enjoyable. To make it more balanced I'd only make it so that surrendered guards don't trigger their pagers. Plus that makes a lot of sense.

[QUOTE=Loadingue;50652802]To be honest that doesn't sound so bad. I've always hated the 4 pagers restriction. This mod could certainly make stealth a bit more enjoyable. To make it more balanced I'd only make it so that surrendered guards don't trigger their pagers. Plus that makes a lot of sense.[/QUOTE] Hate it or not, it is part of the mechanics of the game, and as difficult as stslath is I want to earn the achievements for it I've yet to find a stealth Golden Grin lobby where the host doesn't cheat by using infinite favors

[QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652469]caustic people[/QUOTE] What does this even mean Cowstick soda?

[QUOTE=Loadingue;50652802]To be honest that doesn't sound so bad. I've always hated the 4 pagers restriction. This mod could certainly make stealth a bit more enjoyable. To make it more balanced I'd only make it so that surrendered guards don't trigger their pagers. Plus that makes a lot of sense.[/QUOTE] Stealth system has so many problems that this mod seems viable, the idea of a unique person able to use 4 pagers without anyone noticing anything is very dumb. And this is one of the major issues in Payday 2 Stealth

Me and my teammates used to think it was 1 pager per person, while it was difficult, it made stealthing a hell of a lot more cooperative

[QUOTE=Dick Slamfist;50652469]"Silent Assassin" is straight up cheating, guys[/QUOTE] It even appears to have been removed, as trying to go to the submission says it's hidden So it seems even LBG would have to agree

A difficulty tweak that just alters some damage and health values here and there is stupid, and not worth it to me. That's partly why I never enjoyed 145+, nor Death Wish. But it's very likely that's all Overkill is liable to do it once again to the minority that brag about how easy the game is. I don't personally understand the appeal of having something insta-gib you within moments of targeting you, I always figured the prospect of smarter enemies to be a much better alternative to making everything a cannon-sponge, but some people evidently just like having their balls put into a vice.