Fallout V23: "I got another thread that needs your help." - Games

Brand recognition. Bethesda took as much as they could from Fallout 1 and 2 and put it into Fallout 3. There's honestly to point removing it now.

Bethesda probably put Jet in since Fallout 3 because they probably wanted to attract the old players by "hey guys remember Jet? We have no idea how it works but we've put it in to show that we know the lore!" Damn someone already stated it.

[QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;49248744] But I believe the original writers of FO are ok with this, as they headed NV's writing and game and they didn't change jet back to what it was- a shitty addictive chem. They sorta just kept it the same. So I guess they weren't as anal about it. v:v:v[/QUOTE] They used F3 assets, that's why they haven't changed it Avellone was bothered about how Jet was portraited and that's why we had the inclusion of Dixon's Jet to show "real jet" And honestly this is why it bothers so much. No one is complaining about the new drugs Bethesda introduced in the Fallout lore. But what is the goddamn point of picking something from the old days and completely twisting it? It makes no goddamn sense because if it is intended to be a reference to old fans, the way they did pretty much piss all the old fans anyway

[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49248759]They used F3 assets, that's why they haven't changed it Avellone was bothered about how Jet was portraited and that's why we had the inclusion of Dixon's Jet to show "real jet"[/QUOTE] But that's sort of weird. They could've changed the jet back to what it was, seeings how they were really trying to appeal to older fallout fans. They weren't limited to fallout 3's chem design either, in NV Mentats was super debuffed from providing +5 int and per from 3 to 2 int and 2 per + 1 chr in NV. then again from what I've read from the wikia, Jet is basically a methamphetamine(meth) derivative.

What exactly does Bethesda do to make it look like they want to appeal to people? They do nothing but make the weirdest, illogical decisions. Most of what they get right seems to me like they weren't aware they were doing something right.

[QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;49248744]it's because you both are arguing two different arguments. Ganerumo is right. It's good to have a slo mo chem but Ruhroh is also right, that slomo chem canonically shouldn't be jet. But I believe the original writers of FO are ok with this, as they headed NV's writing and game and they didn't change jet back to what it was- a shitty addictive chem. They sorta just kept it the same. So I guess they weren't as anal about it. v:v:v[/QUOTE] Jet in FO3 and NV, while not exactly the same, was pretty close to the original effects. With the exception that curing the addiction, along with any other chem addiction, becoming hilariously easy.

[QUOTE=Hogie bear;49247875]Christ, what is your sensitivity?[/QUOTE] Low

Also, ruhroh, where'd you get the info that avellone included dixon jet for that reason?

[QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;49248770]But that's sort of weird. They could've changed the jet back to what it was[/QUOTE] They couldn't because FNV was pretty much advertised (and taken as) an expansion from F3. They couldn't interfere with anything added by it without backslashes, they prefered to add their own interpretations. Bethesda made Nuka Cola iconic for them, but they added Sunset Sarsparilla as the drink of choice for the west coast (something the previous games didnt had) without removing Bethesda's Nuka Cola. they had the references to F3 products and referenced Autumn and the east coast enclave operations but still followed their own interpretations and made the enclave just remnant old guys instead of a plot point. I don't think i need to remind you that Bethesda was initially against another west coast game so they had some initial ideas that they adapted for new vegas when they got the aproval. [QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;49248804]Also, ruhroh, where'd you get the info that avellone included dixon jet for that reason?[/QUOTE] from the only semi-reliable source i can have for scrapped NV decisions, Jsawyer's he commented about it in one of his blog posts, but i can't be bothered to search it now because between his blog and his ask.fm search engines can be a bitch. feel free to do it and point it out to me if my memory is playing tricks though and i'll glady admit i was wrong

Given how prevalent raider dens are looting & selling chems is a great source of income.

[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49248807] I don't think i need to remind you that Bethesda was initially against another west coast game so they had some initial ideas that they adapted for new vegas when they got the aproval.[/QUOTE] again, where'd you get this from? [editline]4th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Flapjacks;49248813]Given how prevalent raider dens are looting & selling chems is a great source of income.[/QUOTE] hell making chems and selling them can be a great source of income too.

[B]Breakdown[/B] Highly addictive chemical administered as eyedrops. Enhances the user's perception of their surroundings significantly (+5 PER, high-contrast night vision), at the cost of lightheadedness and weakness (-2 STR during, -2 PER and slower movement speed after). Initially created by the US military as a sniper's aide, abandoned due to subjects developing paranoia, and now used recreationally by those wanting to see visions or feel as if they are psychic. [B]Echo[/B] Highly addictive injected chemical. Drastically enhances the user's senses and reaction time (+2 PER, +3 AGI, time slowed). Initially created as a chemical to be added to Nuka Cola, which would allow the consumer to savor the taste for longer, but it proved too addictive and was ultimately scrapped. Eventually the blueprints for the drug went underground, and it became a popular way to cheat in organized fighting and other sports. Making new chems isn't all that hard. The name is the hardest part.

[QUOTE=ClarkWasHere;49248819]again, where'd you get this from?[/QUOTE] already answered. jsawyer game design posts and answering questions is honestly the only reliable source around seeing as everyone else never comments about it but he's more than happy to talk about the inners and out of his time during NV. you can take it with a grain of salt but i don't have many reasons to doubt him specially when he's as eager to point Obsidian's own faults during the development of NV and PoE himself

[QUOTE=Atlascore;49248852]They had full access to F3's assets and the ability to make any changes they wanted to them, if they were actually [I]that[/I] bothered by Bethesda's portrayal of Jet, why not change it?[/QUOTE] Obsidian isn't one person and they can't change everything at their whims, they were still commited to do a spinoff to Bethesda's game. And they changed it - see, Dixon's Jet. They didn't changed Jet itself but they changed who had access to it - mad raiders and people who fallen to bad times like Pacer, the junkies in freeside, Monte Carlo motel, desperate hookers in Gomorrah, etcetera. It's not that hard to realize honestly.

Since it's so easy to roleplay as him now with the names, what would Max Rockatansky's SPECIAL be? I'm thinking super high STR and END, zero luck, low low CHR, and medium PER / INT

Jet just makes me want to play that Dredd inspired police game [editline]4th December 2015[/editline] hell it looks pretty much exactly the same [t]http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/judgedredd/images/5/52/Slo-mo_2.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20130902122531[/t]

[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49248732]But Jet is not supposed to be enjoyable. That was the whole point of Jet. They could have created a new drug (like they made many others) for the same effect. They had no obligation of picking Jet, a bad drug, and turn it into a good drug. Why this is so hard for you to understand i don't know.[/QUOTE] I'm kinda failing to see one important point from your argument, perhaps this is explained by the lore in FO2 but you haven't brought it up. If jet is a shitty drug that barely has a high, why would anyone take it? Even in real life, the drugs that fuck you up still have huge highs, even ones like krokodil or heroin, which is why people take them. Having a drug that is incredibly addictive with bad withdrawal symptoms but doesn't make you feel good isn't good business sense.

I really want Irma's outfit for my character. If she wasn't glued to the Silver Shroud one, that is.

Their aim is to get you hooked. There's the promise of an amazing high, but it never comes, so you keep taking more and more and slowly digging your own grave. That's what Jet's supposed to be. It's a drug created by drug pushers to sell more of itself.

[QUOTE=Samiam22;49248895]I'm kinda failing to see one important point from your argument, perhaps this is explained by the lore in FO2 but you haven't brought it up. If jet is a shitty drug that barely has a high, why would anyone take it? Even in real life, the drugs that fuck you up still have huge highs, even ones like krokodil or heroin, which is why people take them. Having a drug that is incredibly addictive with bad withdrawal symptoms but doesn't make you feel good isn't good business sense.[/QUOTE] Jet still makes you high as balls. And it's so addictive that you can't stand not being as high as you were when you used Jet because life around you is so shit. I think it's Jules (not sure about his name now) that explain you about the wonders of jet but when you pressure him about why he's not an user himself he spills the beans about how Jet is an instant satisfaction that fucks you over for the rest of your life Point is: making you high = making you great at combat. Specially because most jet addicts are pushovers

[QUOTE=Kommodore;49248537] concord, lexington, diamond city (couldn't just say i'm here for a haircut? isn't that the whole point of having a dialogue wheel??), and on and fucking on. i hate the prelude so much, it totally soured me on the main quest. i dont want to play your shitty quest for SHAUN, i would never even give a kid that name, i have no fondness whatsoever for the 5 minutes of hugely loaded backstory you gave me. it would take me literal hours to be convinced to care about this white bread family in their cul de sac, now shut the fuck up about it and let me play the real game.[/QUOTE] There's a thing people used to complain about in New Vegas, and that is that pretty much every dialogue has an option of "What is X" even if there's no reasonable way of not knowing what X is by that point. It always bothered me because apparently people have never heard the idea of playing the fool, pretending you don't know something to gather information or make yourself seem stupid and harmless to someone. There's a reason the Courier's card in the deck that came with the Collector's Edition was the Joker. Anyway, my point is I feel Fallout 4 is the opposite side of the same coin. It's impossible to not acknowledge certain things. In many conversations you'll have 3 options which all say the same thing in a different tone (which would be fine if there were 10 options) and 1 that doesn't mention the thing but still alludes to it, or in your case still mentions it. I'm not against the voiced protagonist. I'm not against the limit to 4 choices. But when Alpha Protocol exists, a game that has basically the same dialogue system but better, and it was made by the other developers of Fallout it makes Bethesda's fuck ups look even worse. I hope for the DLC they take a look at how Alpha Protocol and Mass Effect handled dialogue and let you choose different personalities, instead of 3-4 ways of saying the same thing.

[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49248807] from the only semi-reliable source i can have for scrapped NV decisions, Jsawyer's he commented about it in one of his blog posts, but i can't be bothered to search it now because between his blog and his ask.fm search engines can be a bitch. feel free to do it and point it out to me if my memory is playing tricks though and i'll glady admit i was wrong[/QUOTE] I decided to take a look on Josh Sawyer's blog, out of curiosity. Here's an interesting fact why Honest Hearts was bland compared to the rest of the DLCs. [URL="http://jesawyer.tumblr.com/post/134405650091/im-not-sure-what-your-involvement-in-honest"]Read here[/URL] [QUOTE=Josh Sawyer] Honest Hearts had the most compressed development schedule of the four main DLCs. At a high level, I designed it to be pretty simple because I was very concerned that we would not get it done on time. Other designers on the project wanted to do more complex things with it, but I had them reduce the complexity of the quests to limit potential risk. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=E3245;49248929]I decided to take a look on Josh Sawyer's blog, out of curiosity. Here's an interesting fact why Honest Hearts was bland compared to the rest of the DLCs. [URL="http://jesawyer.tumblr.com/post/134405650091/im-not-sure-what-your-involvement-in-honest"]Read here[/URL][/QUOTE] His blog is very interesting and i recommend anyone who enjoyed the game to read it. He also has a very good explanation about why the legion is so "evil" and not as much as a grey faction opposed to the others

[QUOTE=Samiam22;49248895]I'm kinda failing to see one important point from your argument, perhaps this is explained by the lore in FO2 but you haven't brought it up. If jet is a shitty drug that barely has a high, why would anyone take it? Even in real life, the drugs that fuck you up still have huge highs, even ones like krokodil or heroin, which is why people take them. Having a drug that is incredibly addictive with bad withdrawal symptoms but doesn't make you feel good isn't good business sense.[/QUOTE] In lore the average time of high when taking jet is 15 minutes. It's also dirt cheap both from a lore and gameplay standpoint in fallout 2, you can find it nearly anywhere.

[QUOTE=optimussentinel;49248909]I really want Irma's outfit for my character. If she wasn't glued to the Silver Shroud one, that is.[/QUOTE] If you max out your pickpocket skill, you can steal it from her. You can also upgrade it with ballistic weave, so that's pretty cool. My only gripe with it is that your hair clips through the back part.

[QUOTE=Everything;49248913]Their aim is to get you hooked. There's the promise of an amazing high, but it never comes, so you keep taking more and more and slowly digging your own grave. That's what Jet's supposed to be. [B]It's a drug created by drug pushers to sell more of itself.[/B][/QUOTE] every commercialized drug ever

[QUOTE=Ruh-roh;49248932]His blog is very interesting and i recommend anyone who enjoyed the game to read it. He also has a very good explanation about why the legion is so "evil" and not as much as a grey faction opposed to the others[/QUOTE] I just found it and read it. I'm pretty sure someone posted it before, so I'll just [URL="http://jesawyer.tumblr.com/post/133867000061/3-disclaimers-i-love-new-vegas-love-the-legion"]link[/URL] it instead.

[QUOTE=skylortrexle;49238348]I had this happen. Verified files and it fixed it. Wiped all my inis, but it fixed it. [/QUOTE] Verifying didn't seem to do anything, neither did a clean install. Anyone have any other ideas why my game just suddenly stopped loading beyond the launcher?

[t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/400055647317745043/07B6C7A663FF2301C3AF17D13AB88F9DE7DD35FF/[/t] thats how u roll with style jack

Y'know, I'm kinda disappointed at how few drastic conversions of weapons there are. Imagine a 12 gauge minigun. Smaller drum size, lower range and poor performance against armor, but fires shotgun shells at an extremely high rate, ripping through crowds of light or unarmored targets like rice paper. How about slugs for the shotguns? Or a taser conversion for the 10mm?