Killing Floor v8 - Come Out, Come Out Little Pigs! - Games

[QUOTE=Keychain;49175710]what[/QUOTE] what what?

better that it's just cosmetic shit than op weaponry.

[QUOTE=usaokay;49176199]I already treat this game as a finished product due to how long the updates are taking and how there aren't a lot of bugs. Early Access to me usually means something not fully set into stone (see: Rust) and will be gradually realized overtime. Killing Floor 2 isn't like that, but a ton of you guys seem to have the preconception that this is still Early Access. Nope. It's a finished product. The only huge issue that people have with Early Access is that some devs treat it like a finished product or the community thinking that it is still in beta. I don't care if they added in microtransactions; especially during Early Access. It was eventually coming, what with the Polycount contest and them saying that they will add in microtransactions during Early Access. Maybe this is their way of testing how people will like the business model, so if the people don't like it, they can tweak it somehow. You guys just seem still upset at the whole Payday 2-debacle.[/QUOTE] This would be a finished product if it only costed $15. There's hardly any content in KF2 to warrant a $30 purchase.

[QUOTE=Pops;49176217]better that it's just cosmetic shit than op weaponry.[/QUOTE] [quote]In the future we may be adding weapons with new gameplay for sale, but this will appear in the “Shared Content” area on the server.[/quote]

[QUOTE=Naught;49176173]what what?[/QUOTE] In the butt.

[QUOTE=PotatoArmada;49176287]This would be a finished product if it only costed $15. There's hardly any content in KF2 to warrant a $30 purchase.[/QUOTE] damn, that sounds super entitled. the quality of things in this game is top notch, even if there 'isn't that much' it's enough for players to easily get 100 hours or more. 15$ is indie games level.

[QUOTE=Naught;49176334]damn, that sounds super entitled. the quality of things in this game is top notch, even if there 'isn't that much' it's enough for players to easily get 100 hours or more. 15$ is indie games level.[/QUOTE] In it's current state you can compare it to similar games for the same price, like Vermintide, and see that KF2 is seriously lacking. And I might be confused, but are you implying they should just release the game as is?

[QUOTE=Naught;49176334]damn, that sounds super entitled. the quality of things in this game is top notch, even if there 'isn't that much' it's enough for players to easily get 100 hours or more. 15$ is indie games level.[/QUOTE] The problem is that at the current rate, Indie developers are more reliable and productive, with fewer people and less money, than Tripwire is.

The whole entitled argument is stupid anyway. A products worth shouldn't be judged by the publisher of the product, it should be judged by the consumers. [QUOTE=usaokay;49176397]You put 186 hours into the game. If people like you who actually spent at least 20+ hours into a continually-updating game with great gunplay and graphics, then the devs did something to fully justify that $30 pricetag.[/QUOTE] Because it will be a finished product someday. My point earlier was that it isn't in any way finished now.

[QUOTE=PotatoArmada;49176404]The whole entitled argument is stupid anyway. A products worth shouldn't be judged by the publisher of the product, it should be judged by the consumers. Because it will be a finished product someday. My point earlier was that it isn't in any way finished now.[/QUOTE] You pumped more than 180 hours into an EA game that is still missing a bit of it's final content; I'd say that you got more than your money's worth, regardless of how much bitching you make about how the game is incomplete and update speed and blah blah blah.

I never complained that I never got my money's worth. Just that saying it's a finished game is silly.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49176483]? It is or isn't early access? Store page says early access, Devs say early access, it's gotta be early access. The "major" updates were not that major honestly. Adding in a new perk without even thinking about balancing isn't worth a 4 month wait. Now the maps are nice quality, but fuck me if that took 4 months to make on a team like Tripwire. It anything, it feels like a game demo. And now, a game demo that you pay money for and then get treated like a f2p Korean mmo player. I mean damn, I pay money so I don't get treated like a F2Per.[/QUOTE] To be fair, Ubisoft thought Unity was finished, so that logic doesn't always apply.

The only reason why this is getting so much traction is because of the rage directed towards PD2's botched transactions system making some people utterly lose it at the sight of any sort of in-game purchasable content, regardless of the actual content itself. If the PD2 incident didn't happen, then you'd see a more subdued, but still angry, reaction. Also, people would've raged no matter when Tripwire chose to announce this. If they did this after EA, people would go apeshit over TWI "pulling the rug from under them" and suddenly introducing transactions because they assumed that TWI would never do transactions, as the game was officially "done". Doing it now means people will get used to it early instead of having it suddenly appear after the game was declared done.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49176497]I don't think that logic applies in both directions. And Unity was finished wasn't it? Just a buggy POS? Like old bethesda games? [editline]24th November 2015[/editline] I'm glad honestly. I hope more and more people find this practice unacceptable, because it is killing games.[/QUOTE] There's a pretty big difference between unlocking the mint xxxDeaTHAnGelxxx skin for your SCAR-H in a virtual crate and buying actual advantages, such as XP boosts and unlocking weapons early. One is just for fun that some people take way too seriously, while the other can and will give you an advantage over others. If a company feels its in their best interest to add transactions, I'd much rather take cosmetics only over actual advantages.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;49176497]I don't think that logic applies in both directions. And Unity was finished wasn't it? Just a buggy POS? Like old bethesda games? [editline]24th November 2015[/editline] I'm glad honestly. I hope more and more people find this practice unacceptable, because it is killing games.[/QUOTE] Any game released in that condition could hardly be considered finished by anyone sane. But more on topic, i definitely agree, myself and many other people i know have straight up lost all hope and stopped playing a game when stuff like this has happened. I was excited for Evolve but the moment i found out there was, what, $200 pf DLC already in the game on launch, i immediately dropped it.

The system they're implementing could be done in a much better way. But as a business, they're more focused on total cost and benefit than considering more ethical options.

I don't get how purely optional cosmetic transactions can completely ruin your opinion of a game. I could understand if you're some sort of OCD freak that needs to have every skin just because you can, but that's it. Even accessories that give Ana different hair or some shit like that are something I don't care about, much less use it as the deciding factor if I still like KF2 or not.

[QUOTE=Ziron;49176564]I don't get how purely optional cosmetic transactions can completely ruin your opinion of a game. I could understand if you're some sort of OCD freak that needs to have every skin just because you can, but that's it. Even accessories that give Ana different hair or some shit like that are something I don't care about, much less use it as the deciding factor if I still like KF2 or not.[/QUOTE] The people that say cosmetic microtransactions make the game itself suck are just being silly. It'll still play the same regardless. But it certainly does say something about TWI. [editline]24th November 2015[/editline] It has hurt their public image quite a bit.

[QUOTE=PotatoArmada;49176587]The people that say cosmetic microtransactions make the game itself suck are just being silly. It'll still play the same regardless. But it certainly does say something about TWI. [editline]24th November 2015[/editline] It has hurt their public image quite a bit.[/QUOTE] In the short-term, yes. Long term? I think it'll only harm them a little.

I gotta give TWI credit for one thing. They gave me an idea for my channel. :v:

[QUOTE=Ziron;49176606]In the short-term, yes. Long term? I don't think it'll only harm them a little.[/QUOTE] Most likely. Depends how they continue to develop the system.

Waiting for Vermintide to add treasure chests and lockpicks for 2,49€.

[QUOTE=Goblin_5;49176647]Waiting for Vermintide to add treasure chests and lockpicks for 2,49€.[/QUOTE] "You have to pay $0.99 to eliminate that loot skaven, Dwarf!" - Saltzpyre

Does anybody else have a problem with the flood of awful looking weapon skins and stupid hats that we are going to have to see now? It genuinely bothers me.

I really don't have a problem with this whole cosmetic thing, my only issue is I wish they'd save this for later when there's more gameplay-affecting content, I think releasing it now after months of not having content update just hit a nerve on some people and now it's being overblown, as is often the case with people who are into something.

My take on this situations is that they're lazy as fuck and they see nothing but a money printer out of a half finished game. I'm tolerant of the cosmetics, although I'd prefer for it to have never gone this direction, but they need to get their priorities in order. After the first major update, we didn't see shit for a MONTH. Nothing beyond a bugfix patch, no balancing or anything for a month. Then after that month, we get an announcement that they're starting work on the next update. What the hell did they do for that whole month? I understand there's planning involved with adding content to the game but that shit can be done and out of the way in a week-two weeks tops. Which afterwards, they can start work on making the assets. I feel that they did basically nothing for over a month, then announced that they were going to have something for us within a month, and that was almost 2 months ago. Now they announce that they're devoting manpower to establish this item store thing when they could've, you know, been working on FINISHING THE FUCKING GAME. They already promised that it would be out of early access in 6 months from pre-launch. The way it looks, either they're going to have to break that promise, or take it out of EA early and say it's finished with 7 out of 10 perks and 6-7 maps. Keep in mind, before this was announced, it had been in development for 2-3 years. The core engine is good and stable, but the content isn't entirely here yet, and the way their priorities are set shows that they give no fucks about the end user and care more about stuffing their wallet. The first major update had a huge red flag that this was going to happen when it read out "Free Content Pack" when it's supposed to be a part of the core game. That sounds like they're trying to attract as many buyers as possible despite that it was said on the EA store page that it was intended for people to give feedback on what to do and was not a final, finished product intended for everyone to play. They mainly wanted the hardcore fans to play and improve upon what they had in KF1, not have every little CoD kiddie with their parent's money get in on a game before it's truly finished. I see this as part of why we've had some weird as hell balance choices happen in the last update. They just need to get their priorities straight and finish this before focusing on something that exists solely to make more money.

I don't care about the dumb micro-transaction stuff because it's only cosmetics (for now) but I do care that the game isn't even finished yet and they're already trying to get more mone.

did they not see the backlash after overkill did this? and putting it out during EA for gods sake, really

I just wrote a small essay about this situation on the subreddit that explains my feelings on the situation. [URL="https://np.reddit.com/r/killingfloor/comments/3u2ej4/why_this_could_be_bad_but_its_not_yet_or_why_you/"]Which you can find here.[/URL] Or if preferred I can quote it here.

You guys miss the point of this conversation. MICROTRANSACTIONS can be okay If they are not in Crates form. Crates are a bad gamble. They could just make a store with normal priced items a nd highly priced exclusive items (Gold skin). EXAMPLE PORTAL 2 [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/559780497146668408/20357AAE252DE439AE8D6620635E0C4F157CF057/[/t] 4,99$ for a SKIN. Look at Icarus. Prices are reasonable and cheap. [t]http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/560988302849301014/9D9560AE4EC7630B9330A5876566580CDE1B4546/[/t] Paying something upfront for a thing you want is more customer-friendly than a Fucking crates!