[QUOTE=69105;39233631]if you guys are looking for a good cyberpunk game, i'd reccomend omikron: nomad soul
it's not necessarily in the cyberpunk category, but it's horribly forgotten and should really be remembered. especially for being a 1999 game: it might have 1999 visuals and wonky controls but its gameplay is still top knotch and the story is pretty engaging
[img]http://www.atomicgamer.com/screenshots/game-1456/10586-800.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.mobygames.com/images/shots/l/253587-omikron-the-nomad-soul-windows-screenshot-shooting-sequence.jpg[/img][/QUOTE]
Yeah, and the game was pretty ambitious for its time too. It's like a big mix of adventure, fighting, FPS, and RPG. It was also really meta and had a good soundtrack with David Bowie.
System Shock is pretty awesome, if you can get past the fact that the controls were designed with MS-DOS in mind :v:
[QUOTE=Janus Vesta;39233700]Suggestions for cyberpunk games? No one has mentioned Oni yet? For shame Facepunch, for shame.[/QUOTE]
E.Y.E is fun but the learning curve is very steep
Dystopia is very good, probably my favorite cyberpunk themed multiplayer shooter (Shame it's dead now)
Neotokyo is pretty good
Seeing as we're talkin' about great RPGs where choices matter, I'd just like to use this occasion to plug Alpha Protocol. AP's all about choice, there's shittons upon shittons of these, and it's perfectly possible (or in fact even inavoidable) to miss out on some content.
Also you can run around with a lumberjack beard, aviator glasses and a baseball cap.
Basically what I'm tryin' to say is that if reading all that stuff makes you want to play a good RPG and you've already played The Witcher, go play Alpha Protocol. (it's really, really cheap because of the criminally low scores the game got; worth noting is the fact that some of the unfavourable reviews had stuff that was painfully, obviously, flat-out wrong - showing that the reviewers didn't even bother to play the game because "lol Obsidian made it it must be buggy 3/10").
It also has a pretty nice high-tech, spy atmosphere at times, which is probably a part of why I decided to post about it here.
tl;dr go buy Alpha Protocol unless you hate Obsidian (in which case there's something wrong with you on a fundamental level)
[QUOTE=Rents;39235306]System Shock is pretty awesome, if you can get past the fact that the controls were designed with MS-DOS in mind :v:[/QUOTE]
I remember playing system shock a while back on Dosbox and being pretty impressed. The control scheme is archaic, but it's pretty cool. Mechanically, I was surprised at how many option there were. I picked up a laser gun and saw that I could change its power output with a sliding scale and that there was a button to overload it as well and risk overheating.
There was also that time that I activated the mining laser before I had brought up the shields and destroyed earth but I don't want to talk about that.
[QUOTE=69105;39233899]oni is cool and all but i hated it. HATED IT
I bet if I played it now though I'd love it to death. the anime-VG style was pretty cool but that was really the only thing going for it[/QUOTE]
Oni was a complete nightmare to play, until you actually got used to the bizarre controls. After that, it became one of my all time favorites. I still have it around the house somewhere, but sadly my sister took her PS2 with her when she moved out.
Wasn't Omikron the one where you could repossess someone after you died to come back to life?
[editline]16th January 2013[/editline]
Also, I really don't see the problem with having a customizable character. The whole point of TRPG and the crux of the fun is that you are able to weave your own story. Being able to make your own adventure with basic guidelines has worked timelessly with table tops and really it's about time someone actually converted those ideas into a game.
How will the camera be in this? Will it be third person like the Witcher? I hope so, I'd love to see what they can do with the animations of cool ass bionic parts.
[QUOTE=Skwee;39239281]How will the camera be in this? Will it be third person like the Witcher? I hope so, I'd love to see what they can do with the animations of cool ass bionic parts.[/QUOTE]
No word on that but it's safe to assume third person. Wouldn't really make all that much sense for it to be in first anyways given it's based off a TRPG and it's CD Projekt.
[QUOTE=postmanX3;39234554]As for a predetermined/player-determined protagonist... I think I'd generally lean towards a predetermined protagonist simply because it ALWAYS allows for a more engaging and focused story. I don't give half a shit about the story in, say, Elder Scrolls because it's stupidly impersonal. Considering CD Projekt's skill with story telling, I think it'd be unfortunate for them to shoot themselves in the foot with a faceless protagonist.[/QUOTE]
It's very much possible to have a very personal story with a completely customizeable character, it's much, much more difficult, but it's possible.
An example of this would be NWN2's expansion Mask of The Betrayer.
Still not as good as with a predifined character, but yeah, it's possible.
i hope this has a strong feel of Ridley Scott-esque artistic detail
Alien had a timeless interpretation of the early 22nd century, feeling completely believable, thanks to its depth
everything felt in place: clutter everywhere, low-fidelity, but rugged cathode ray monitors, you know the drill: a dirty and used future
Blade Runner is pretty much a go-to source for inspiration of well, and I would call it Alien's more younger and fervent brother
[QUOTE=M.Ciaster;39235351]Seeing as we're talkin' about great RPGs where choices matter, I'd just like to use this occasion to plug Alpha Protocol. AP's all about choice, there's shittons upon shittons of these, and it's perfectly possible (or in fact even inavoidable) to miss out on some content.
Also you can run around with a lumberjack beard, aviator glasses and a baseball cap.
Basically what I'm tryin' to say is that if reading all that stuff makes you want to play a good RPG and you've already played The Witcher, go play Alpha Protocol. (it's really, really cheap because of the criminally low scores the game got; worth noting is the fact that some of the unfavourable reviews had stuff that was painfully, obviously, flat-out wrong - showing that the reviewers didn't even bother to play the game because "lol Obsidian made it it must be buggy 3/10").
It also has a pretty nice high-tech, spy atmosphere at times, which is probably a part of why I decided to post about it here.
tl;dr go buy Alpha Protocol unless you hate Obsidian (in which case there's something wrong with you on a fundamental level)[/QUOTE]
Damn that game had a lot of content. There were like three characters I never even met, didn't know they existed until I saw someone else talking about them.
[QUOTE=M.Ciaster;39235351]Seeing as we're talkin' about great RPGs where choices matter, I'd just like to use this occasion to plug Alpha Protocol. AP's all about choice, there's shittons upon shittons of these, and it's perfectly possible (or in fact even inavoidable) to miss out on some content.
Also you can run around with a lumberjack beard, aviator glasses and a baseball cap.
Basically what I'm tryin' to say is that if reading all that stuff makes you want to play a good RPG and you've already played The Witcher, go play Alpha Protocol. (it's really, really cheap because of the criminally low scores the game got; worth noting is the fact that some of the unfavourable reviews had stuff that was painfully, obviously, flat-out wrong - showing that the reviewers didn't even bother to play the game because "lol Obsidian made it it must be buggy 3/10").
It also has a pretty nice high-tech, spy atmosphere at times, which is probably a part of why I decided to post about it here.
tl;dr go buy Alpha Protocol unless you hate Obsidian (in which case there's something wrong with you on a fundamental level)[/QUOTE]
From what I gather nobody denies the fact that AP has an amazing dialogue system and the fact that there are consequences and stuff like that.
People are mad about the fact that the gameplay itself (the shooty/sneaky part) is bad. And the bugs and glitches really dont help one bit there.
[QUOTE=spekter;39237439]Also, I really don't see the problem with having a customizable character. The whole point of TRPG and the crux of the fun is that you are able to weave your own story. Being able to make your own adventure with basic guidelines has worked timelessly with table tops and really it's about time someone actually converted those ideas into a game.[/QUOTE]
It works with tabletops because those games are limited, quite literally, only by the imagination of the DM and players. That's just not true of video games. No developer will ever be able to provide every possible option in every possible situation for obvious reasons.
As such, developers have two choices: player-defined protagonist with incredibly general character arc and simplified "save the orphans or burn the orphanage" moral decisions, or a predefined protagonist with a narrow character arc and focused choices that match the character's personality.
[QUOTE=postmanX3;39240787]It works with tabletops because those games are limited, quite literally, only by the imagination of the DM and players. That's just not true of video games. No developer will ever be able to provide every possible option in every possible situation for obvious reasons.
As such, developers have two choices: player-defined protagonist with incredibly general character arc and simplified "save the orphans or burn the orphanage" moral decisions, or a predefined protagonist with a narrow character arc and focused choices that match the character's personality.[/QUOTE]
You can't expect all developers to follow that same method towards player-defined chars and moral choices forever. Games are going to get more complex and for all we know Cyberpunk could be taking it in a new direction. The far off release date kinda supports this.
They've mentioned every step of the way that table top elements are making their way into the game and they could very well mean things to make it more than just the usual formula.
Games that give you control over your character and story have proven highly successful in the past more than purposely written characters. Especially nowadays where we're able to create bigger and more in-depth worlds that help support freedom of choice. There's never been anything wrong with giving power to the player.
It's not about following a method or formula of player-defined characters, it's about the impossibility of adapting the game narrative to cope with player freedom without making sacrifices somewhere. Unlike tabletop roleplaying games all videogame stories are a pre-designed series of events, that isn't possible to get away from. I don't really understand how you could expect game developers to work around this issue. It isn't feasible to write a story or dialogue so complex that it branches at every player choice in their character definition, new technology isn't magically making it possible to create immersive and rich writing that manages to adapt to player-designed characters on the same level as pre-defined characters.
[QUOTE]Games that give you control over your character and story have proven highly successful in the past more than purposely written characters. Especially nowadays where we're able to create bigger and more in-depth worlds that help support freedom of choice.[/QUOTE]
Not really. Both Oblivion and Skyrim had an unimmersive story with generic dialogue, thanks to their player-defined characters forcing the writing to suit any type of hero the player may have designed. The redeeming qualities of those games were their sandbox-like gameplay, not their narrative.
[QUOTE=postmanX3;39240787]As such, developers have two choices: player-defined protagonist with incredibly general character arc and simplified "save the orphans or burn the orphanage" moral decisions, or a predefined protagonist with a narrow character arc and focused choices that match the character's personality.[/QUOTE]
They can also go completely linear like most JRPGs, and there is also a middle path between the two ways you described, giving the character a background but otherwise leaving just about everything up to the player, like in Baldur's Gate and the like.
I'd rather have a good story with well written characters and dialogue with little or no customisation than the ability to dick around in character creation and clothes shops and ending up with no player character voice acting and everyone addressing me as agent/soldier/chosen one.
[h2]YES YES YES[/h2]
[url]http://www.thewitcher.com/community/entry/327[/url]
[img]http://wpc.4d7d.edgecastcdn.net/004D7D/www/thewitcher/files/news/big/en_9ff204f2.jpg[/img]
they better not be trolling or else i'm going to slay some poles
[QUOTE=Rents;39241817]I'd rather have a good story with well written characters and dialogue with little or no customisation than the ability to dick around in character creation and clothes shops and ending up with no player character voice acting and everyone addressing me as agent/soldier/chosen one.[/QUOTE]
Better yet, have the good story with well written characters and then add all the completely visual customization on top of that Saints Row style.
[QUOTE=69105;39243016][h2]YES YES YES[/h2]
[url]http://www.thewitcher.com/community/entry/327[/url]
[img]http://wpc.4d7d.edgecastcdn.net/004D7D/www/thewitcher/files/news/big/en_9ff204f2.jpg[/img]
they better not be trolling or else i'm going to slay some poles[/QUOTE]
I think it's time to post Witcher related stuff in it's thread.
[url]http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1060097&p=39241460&viewfull=1#post39241460[/url]
[QUOTE=Rents;39241817]I'd rather have a good story with well written characters and dialogue with little or no customisation than the ability to dick around in character creation and clothes shops and ending up with no player character voice acting and everyone addressing me as agent/soldier/chosen one.[/QUOTE]
Choosing what your character wears is hardly related to how well written they are.
[QUOTE=Antary;39240694]From what I gather nobody denies the fact that AP has an amazing dialogue system and the fact that there are consequences and stuff like that.
People are mad about the fact that the gameplay itself (the shooty/sneaky part) is bad. And the bugs and glitches really dont help one bit there.[/QUOTE]
it really is a shame though, because if the combat and glitches weren't so godawful I think it would have been a real classic game, and Obsidian would have got the kind of money they deserved
[QUOTE=DiscoInferno;39234614]I didn't know The Witcher was based on a series of books.[/QUOTE]
I highly recommend you to read them, I do read them in Polish as it's my native language, they are very addictive to read and always keep your interest levels high up.
[QUOTE=Appolox;39253595]I highly recommend you to read them, I do read them in Polish as it's my native language, they are very addictive to read and always keep your interest levels high up.[/QUOTE]
Do they go beyond the story that's been told in the games so far?
I've always been interested in Witcher but the first game has very rickety gameplay for me and I can't run the second game.
First Witcher game is based more around the first book, which is basically a mix of different stories from Geralt's adventures, there is about 7 tomes, well at least I have that many.
The plot itself is lightly based on the first tome, there are certain dialogues or reminders in the game about the first book, so if you read it you will go like "hey I know this, it was in the book!"
The Plot in The Witcher is totally new, apart from little bits and pieces from the book otherwise it's all different, most of the characters remain the same.
I don't know much about The Witcher 2, I haven't play it because I can't run it and it's a shame.
[QUOTE=BlackRainbow;39252647]Choosing what your character wears is hardly related to how well written they are.[/QUOTE]
What I was getting at is I'd rather have an Adam Jensen over a Dragonborn.
[QUOTE=Rents;39254205]What I was getting at is I'd rather have an Adam Jensen over a Dragonborn.[/QUOTE]
Adam Jensen wasn't that good of a character in my opinion.
[QUOTE=elowin;39265757]Adam Jensen wasn't that good of a character in my opinion.[/QUOTE]
It was an example of an established character over a hundred permutation-recognised only by pre-conceived title character, not specifically those two.
[QUOTE=Rents;39254205]What I was getting at is I'd rather have an Adam Jensen over a Dragonborn.[/QUOTE]
in all fairness Bethesda haven't been able to write a good protagonist since Morrowind, so the DB isn't really a very good example of an open-ended player character
seriously, dude had no personality even if you tried to inject one yourself
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