Fallout Thread V30: The universe where everyone is left handed - Games

[QUOTE=venom;52000313]I wonder if/when we'll get a GameJam for Fallout 4? :([/QUOTE] I mean we kinda did when they showed off ethesda.net as a modding platform what with that giant mecha thing that we never saw again

[QUOTE=Whit3;52000472]They had an internal GameJam during the development, since Todd thought that it would be a good idea. The power armor jet pack is one of the implemented creations. They probably won't have another public one after the Skyrim GameJam backslash.[/QUOTE] What backlash?

[QUOTE=venom;52000539]What backlash?[/QUOTE] People got mad because they showed progress on a lot of very interesting concepts and only ended up implementing some of the less exciting ones.

I guess people think it sucks that A-all those things aren't in the game B-All those things are really interesting, and skyrim is full of blandness. C-Even when stuff got implemented, it wasn't the best of the gamejam, and it was often poorly done (No playable werebears, and they're a solthsteim feature) D-The most interesting stuff,like seasons, has been left out. That's my theories anyway. I didn't know there was so much backlash

Would have been nice if they just dumped whatever they had from the game jam into the devkit, leave it for enterprising modders to finish

[QUOTE=The Jack;52000307]There's something off about new vegas. They improved on everything in fallout 3. Especially writing, which I care a lot for. It feels worse somehow. Level design?[/QUOTE] Definitely the level design, or more so the cut content. There was suppose to be a lot more settlements and areas for the the Legion. Regardless I consider it the true Fallout 3 in spirit.

[QUOTE=The Jack;52000307]There's something off about new vegas. They improved on everything in fallout 3. Especially writing, which I care a lot for. It feels worse somehow. Level design?[/QUOTE] I've always compared Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas thusly. "Fallout 3's map puts you at a crossroads, Fallout New Vegas's puts you at the start of a road. Fallout 3's story is one path, Fallout New Vegas's is a crossroad." In terms of combat zones outside of quests, Fallout 3 has a few memorable ones out of many. Fallout New Vegas has very few in hard to locate nooks in the mountains or right on the edges of the map and none of them are all that memorable as "dungeons".

Has anyone had issues running the game in borderless window? I found my FPS drops from 70+ on ultra to maxxing at 30fps after about a half hour of gameplay in borderless, and straight up CTDing randomly every half hour to an hour. On a whim I verified integrity (repaired one file, which seems to have been my config files because my HUD colors reset and my graphics went back to default) and changed it back to regular fullscreen and I seemingly don't have either issue anymore.

Relating to that gamejam: I think bethesda GS is just a poorly directed group. When they're left to their own devices they make great stuff that they want to make, and help the game a lot better. When they're making the base game, They make content because they have to make content to satisfy some lizard overlord with a quota. Said lizard lord doesn't have any idea how harmful his inane decisions are, and nobody will discuss them with him. Like, I get it. Fallout 4 and skyrim have mass market appeal. There's a big focus on getting upgraded items and new perks because they're addictive and market research has shown that people lap that shit up. There's always something new to do. The focus is on progression. But -That's not fun to develop, so it's often of low quality/quantity. -It stifles creativity. -It's bad for the world, because it creates inconsistencies. A glass mace exists and is really heavy in oblivion, despite the fictional material being A-Very light and B-very shock absorbent and thus probably really terrible for mace construction. And it exists because the developers want a juicy tiered system of unlocks, even if it doesn't make sense to do such a thing. The other focus is on shit that just looks great in marketing Dragons, vehicle power armour, craftable settlements. Voiced protagonists. Infinite quests. Radiant AI. Famous voice actors that'll do one throwaway character To be fair to this. A lot of this stuff is a good idea, or very close to a good idea. I just don't feel like it's well intentioned, especially since they half ass it or change it for appeal. For instance; dragons. Common Dragons don't really use the voice as you'd expect, they just breath fire/ice as you'd expect from a dragon. (I think someone pointed out the lines for the voice are there, and it's a glitch that they don't use them. Bullshit. They took it out because a market research team thought it was weird) Craftable settlements felt like they were just capitalizing on the success of building games. Otherwise, we'd have an in-depth wasteland settlement builder, rather than something resembling Gmod. infinite quests and radiant AI could've been a godsend if they focused on them and put considerable effort in procedural generation, rather than a half assed thing they gave up on and still used as a marketing gimmick. It's been... three/four games now since the concept? [I] I'm guessing they don't have good writers because no good writer would be happy with this shit. [/I] I could rant for a significant period of time. I just think it's clear that the heads at betheda don't have a good plan for where to take fallout/tes, and have a very shareholder friendly, anti consumer, anti worker way of doing things.

I'm surprised there hasn't been a review on AmmoTweaks, it adds in a ton of stuff and features that are review worthy, yet its never been covered.

Managed to get paints working (cept for jetpacks, dunno if those even have any in the mod), seems Legendary Modifications (and LM Continued) was conflicting. Can live without that stuff tbh. Also disabled FO4 War Tags since I figured i'l prolly not going to use those. Still not seeing any additional choices for shocks, actuators, hydraulics and some plating for bits other than the torso, but i'm wondering if there was anything there to begin with; might just be added categories for future expansion. I suppose I could make it easier on myself and use another mod, but from what i've seen all the others do are stats rebalances (no module additions), and Worsin's last version is even older.

Is there an alternative to that Conquest mod? It seems to be severely outdated.

[QUOTE=The Jack;52001032]Relating to that gamejam: I think bethesda GS is just a poorly directed group. When they're left to their own devices they make great stuff that they want to make, and help the game a lot better. When they're making the base game, They make content because they have to make content to satisfy some lizard overlord with a quota. Said lizard lord doesn't have any idea how harmful his inane decisions are, and nobody will discuss them with him. Like, I get it. Fallout 4 and skyrim have mass market appeal. There's a big focus on getting upgraded items and new perks because they're addictive and market research has shown that people lap that shit up. There's always something new to do. The focus is on progression. But -That's not fun to develop, so it's often of low quality/quantity. -It stifles creativity. -It's bad for the world, because it creates inconsistencies. A glass mace exists and is really heavy in oblivion, despite the fictional material being A-Very light and B-very shock absorbent and thus probably really terrible for mace construction. And it exists because the developers want a juicy tiered system of unlocks, even if it doesn't make sense to do such a thing. The other focus is on shit that just looks great in marketing Dragons, vehicle power armour, craftable settlements. Voiced protagonists. Infinite quests. Radiant AI. Famous voice actors that'll do one throwaway character To be fair to this. A lot of this stuff is a good idea, or very close to a good idea. I just don't feel like it's well intentioned, especially since they half ass it or change it for appeal. For instance; dragons. Common Dragons don't really use the voice as you'd expect, they just breath fire/ice as you'd expect from a dragon. (I think someone pointed out the lines for the voice are there, and it's a glitch that they don't use them. Bullshit. They took it out because a market research team thought it was weird) Craftable settlements felt like they were just capitalizing on the success of building games. Otherwise, we'd have an in-depth wasteland settlement builder, rather than something resembling Gmod. infinite quests and radiant AI could've been a godsend if they focused on them and put considerable effort in procedural generation, rather than a half assed thing they gave up on and still used as a marketing gimmick. It's been... three/four games now since the concept? [I] I'm guessing they don't have good writers because no good writer would be happy with this shit. [/I] I could rant for a significant period of time. I just think it's clear that the heads at betheda don't have a good plan for where to take fallout/tes, and have a very shareholder friendly, anti consumer, anti worker way of doing things.[/QUOTE] Sounds like someone at Bethseda should stand up to the lizard lord and tell them if they want sales to go through the roof they should let the developers decide the deadline and add what they feel is fun. I'd rather fight a giant mudcrab boss than have "infinite quests".

I don't think Bethesda intentionally "hold back" their games.

If anything I think Beth somewhat suffers from too much dev freedom based on what Todd has said, many development choices seem to be decided primarily on 'hey wouldn't it be cool if...' and then it never turns out as good as it sounds

I think that's Todd going 'Wouldn't it be cool if..." and the majority of developers have absolutely no say in what they're doing.

[QUOTE=The Jack;52002013]I think that's Todd going 'Wouldn't it be cool if..." and the majority of developers have absolutely no say in what they're doing.[/QUOTE] Does your dad work at Bethesda or something? How do you know what's going on in Todd Howard's Chocolate Factory?

200 hours and I've still never gone to the Combat Zone.

[QUOTE=DiscoInferno;52002051]Does your dad work at Bethesda or something? How do you know what's going on in Todd Howard's Chocolate Factory?[/QUOTE] I don't know if it's specifically Todd, but there's a lot of stuff in Skyrim/fallout 4 that just... I don't think a democratic, or anarchic studio, with real love for their own series, would be happy with the decisions made for TES and Fallout. It's gotta be an autocracy. You never see the nuances of love, beyond a level designer sneaking in a teddy on the toilet, that you would in two series' with a lot of lore and history. It's factory made-mass market stuff.

[QUOTE=The Jack;52002133]I don't know if it's specifically Todd, but there's a lot of stuff in Skyrim/fallout 4 that just... I don't think a democratic, or anarchic studio, with real love for their own series, would be happy with the decisions made for TES and Fallout. It's gotta be an autocracy. You never see the nuances of love, beyond a level designer sneaking in a teddy on the toilet, that you would in two series' with a lot of lore and history. It's factory made-mass market stuff.[/QUOTE] So essentially you're talking out of your arse.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;52002118]The Combat Zone. Never forget.[/QUOTE] What about it? I haven't played FO4 for awhile and I vaguely remember it, but what's the big deal?

Pretty much all of the stuff from the skyrim game jam got added, and the stuff that didn't was probably too buggy or resource intensive, but ended up getting added through mods anyway. Like HDT physics are buggy as shit a lot of the time for me.

[QUOTE=Wulfram;52002246]Pretty much all of the stuff from the skyrim game jam got added[/QUOTE] What? No, most stuff didn't

[QUOTE=Katatonic717;52002256]What? No, most stuff didn't[/QUOTE] The remaster introduced the water flow, I think that is one of the only things, but not in the base game.

[url]http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Game_Jam[/url] A list of stuff from gamejam, showing what was added, how it was added, or what wasnt.

Spell combinations, e.g. Flames + Raise Zombie = Conjure Flame Atronach, Fear + Healing = Drain Health . It would be nice if that was added. Stealth enhancements such as water arrows and Assassin's Vision (detect life). Water arrows can be used to extinguish torches; guards will relight darkened areas. That was actually added in a mod iirc. Moving on as this is FO and not ES.. The gamma repeater is cool

[QUOTE=The Jack;52001032]When they're left to their own devices they make great stuff that they want to make, and help the game a lot better. When they're making the base game, They make content because they have to make content to satisfy some lizard overlord with a quota. Said lizard lord doesn't have any idea how harmful his inane decisions are, and nobody will discuss them with him. [/QUOTE] Sorry but statements like this show a lot of ignorance of the process of actually making a game. Beth's game jams are essentially modding for developers. Modding, contrary to popular belief, is absolutely nothing like making a game, and I think anyone who's ever done both on a professional level will agree. It's easy to look at the gamejam video and think "Wow just look at how much stuff they made in a week by their own initiative!" with no concept of the amount of coordination, resource and time management it takes to actually finish a game with a clear vision and design rather than building something on top of it without much care for quality, stability, time constraints or even design ramifications. To call Beth badly managed on this point alone is basically making the case for every single company ever for having design leads rather than letting developers waste their time do whatever to see if it sticks. You could make the case that other developers have no say in the creative process.. but you can't, unless you work there.

[QUOTE=DiscoInferno;52002182]So essentially you're talking out of your arse.[/QUOTE] Skyrim comes out after years of development -bad storytelling for every questline (DB isn't so bad) -infinite quests is tedius fetchquests -lackluster combat -lackluster magic. It has a few new features, but it's weak and there's far less spells than any other TES before it -stupid npcs that say a few lines of dialogue -The 'glass mace' issue. -the perk trees are a mess that was put in with obviously no thought beyond "it'll look good in marketing" Developers get a week to do whatever they like. there's weather There's spears There's werebears and goblin/reiklings, things missing from the base game. There's a giant enemy. There's enchanted arrows There's inventive spells Clearly, there's a disparity in what bethesda can do, and what bethesda does. There's obviously some very passionate developers, who care a lot for the world and the lore (Hence the werebears) and yet, things are as they are. Maybe if team X wasn't shitting out a faction written by a five year old, they could've done something worthwhile. Edit; I do know how to make a game. The issue is... they don't achieve big goals (like radiant quests) but they achieve a lot of inane goals (look at all the different dragon types there are, here's a questline for the theives guild you can't possibly think good, here's a glass mace, this guy is voiced by Max Von Sydow and you'll see him twice) Why not achieve the basics, and give the developers more freedom? Or hire a writer at least.

[QUOTE=The Jack;52002471]*Chatting bollocks*[/QUOTE] That's a whole lot of bullshite right there mate I'm going to have to slow you down. [QUOTE]-bad storytelling for every questline (DB isn't so bad) [/QUOTE] And you think Todd handwrote each and every guild quest? While they're certainly not the best written stories ever, there is a large ammount of eeffort put into each one. The College has puzzle bosses, unique assets, lots of side content, and lectures given by each tutor. The Companions have lycanthropy and all its assorted gameplay changes. The Thieve's Guild attempts to avert the expectation that every quest it gives you will be uninspired "go here and steal a thing" by introducing racketeering, industrial espionage, and a glimpse into the less-explored Nocturnal Cult aspect of the organisation. The Bard's College, I believe, is lucky to have made it into the final game but it leads into a festival, something no other TES game has truly had. Morrowind NPCs would sometimes say "it's so-and-so day" but it would mean nothing since they were all rooted to the spot. [QUOTE]-infinite quests is tedius fetchquests[/QUOTE] The same system was used for almost all quests in Daggerfall. Skyrim's only downfall is its smaller worldspace. [QUOTE]-lackluster combat -lackluster magic. It has a few new features, but it's weak and there's far less spells than any other TES before it[/QUOTE] TES has never been a series known for deep or complex combat, being derivative from the old days of CRPGs, compared to them Skyrim is a blistering paced, reactive action game. There are fewer spells, yes, but each spell is in a clear tier within its school, removing redundant or plain useless spells. The spell visuals are also the best in any TES, better than the tiny glimmery balls of twinkles in Morrowind and Oblivion. [QUOTE]-stupid npcs that say a few lines of dialogue[/QUOTE] Voice acting is expensive and time-consuming. With gamers spending so much time in the game world repetition is bound to occur. And hey, at least the NPCs actually look like they're doing things rather than sitting in the exact same spot all day everyday. [QUOTE]-The 'glass mace' issue.[/QUOTE] I don't even know what that is. You're just making up "well known issues" as if this was something scholars have written about. [QUOTE]-the perk trees are a mess that was put in with obviously no thought beyond "it'll look good in marketing"[/QUOTE] What even is this? When were the perk trees pushed as a marketing bulletpoint? What do you mean "put in with obviously no thought"? It's not obvious to me. Nothing you say seems to be obvious to anyone but you. [QUOTE]*Gamejam Stuff*[/QUOTE] I'll refer you to what Ryo Ohki said about what it takes to [I]really[/I] make a game rather than you talking out of your arse and coming out with as much shit as the phrase implies.

I actually thought Skyrim's new perk system was pretty good not the perks themselves, but the template was better than oblivion's imo