D&D V6 - Edition jokes don't really make sense anymore - Games

[QUOTE=Crimor;51095038]So I'm finally making a spirit based character in shadowrun, how the hell do you use bound spirits well/what kind of spirits should you bother binding.[/QUOTE] Channeling or whatever it's called is the way to go.

So I've been sitting on this idea for a while for my only war campaign while the two squads fuck around on Novishdracovish and it's Orks and Traitours. The idea is that they go on a hive world suspected for heretical and traitorous means and essentially cleaning up after failed Inquisition attempts. Information thus far only goes on knowledge when the planet was reputably faithful, even then that knowledge is very much outdated and the current knowledge is full of meaningless information, courtesy of insurgency and traitorous efforts. When they do attack or infiltrate, their enemy will be fueled by music on reinforced PA systems orchestrated by some crazy heretek priests in the upper hives. They'll give some hefty bonuses for damning penalties, such as +20 weapon skill and ballistics in return for -20 toughness -20 agility, that sort of thing along with a frenzy status for the enemy. When they do reach the priests and disable them, they'll have to make a decision on whether or not to A. use these music systems against the heretics, therefore making a turning point whilst possibly risking their necks by purist forces and having to die or go into darker paths, or B. leaving it be / destroying it and in doing so possibly allowing the battle for the world to become a stalemate or even its destruction. Possible economical losses for the Imperium on B. Due to the way that one of them min/maxed the fuck out of CQC without my supervision I'll have to introduce a way to circumvent this. Maybe swarms of Chaos Militia or a straight up psyker nullifying their ability. What do you guys think?

[QUOTE=Crimor;51095038]So I'm finally making a spirit based character in shadowrun, how the hell do you use bound spirits well/what kind of spirits should you bother binding.[/QUOTE] Knowing what tradition you're going to be would help, since that determines what types of spirits you can use, whether you use possession spirits or not, and if charisma is your drain stat.

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51094974]So my DMing went pretty good. They are new players and I'm a very new DM and having only had one night to make a campaign i think i did really good. Party: Wood elf fighter CN Human fighter LG Dwarf cleric LG (ai controlled by me) The whole premise of this campaign is that the archlich has already won. Demons and undead have driven mortal kind (even the drow and the orcs) into a corner in the far west. And only through the most powerful magics has everyone secured themselves a area of peace. Like "attack on titan" if there where no walls just magic. Started as they had been hired to find this women's son who was part of a mercenary guild and was sent from the capital to kill a bunch of evil blah blah blah. He's dead. Mercenary guild sent him and countless more to their deaths via demons They met a cleric and killed ONE of the two imps that where killing the mercenaries. The other escaped and started a plague to stop the travellers. It worked. Heros stopped it but the town was destroyed. They get to the next town over. They plague was starting, the mayor was consorting with demons. And there was an assassin who killed one of the only guards who knew what was going on. They stop the plague, they learnt why the mayor was involved with demons (it promised it could bring his family back if it let the demon take three souls. So it took the town monks souls leaving them in a coma and hasn't been heard of since.) and the assassin is still on the loose. We stopped there as the party was heading towards the capital a massive human port town that is very religious. Any ideas at what i could throw at them? Any thoughts?[/QUOTE] Maybe have them converse with a church in the port town that is confident they have a plan to seal/kill the Archlich, but said plan involves a mass murder of the townsfolk so they have to stop it. Or you could take the plot of the first episode of Fullmetal Alchemist with Father Cornello, a priest who is essentially conning people into believing what he creates are "miracles" when they are really just elaborate uses of alchemy. Although that one is sorta similar to your previous adventures.

[QUOTE=elowin;51096623]Knowing what tradition you're going to be would help, since that determines what types of spirits you can use, whether you use possession spirits or not, and if charisma is your drain stat.[/QUOTE] Aztec

[QUOTE=Crimor;51097749]Aztec[/QUOTE] Shoot yourself now to save the more paranoid people on your team's time

[QUOTE=Crimor;51097749]Aztec[/QUOTE] Alright, so first of all, you should always make sure you've gotten a lot of tasks at the summoning phase before you bind a spirit. If you got very few, just scrap it and try again another day unless you're on a tight schedule. Since binding spirits costs a good chunk of money it's a waste if they don't owe you a decent amount of tasks. Good news is charisma traditions are pretty much objectively the best for summoning, because how many bound spirits you can have at a time is dependent on charisma so you need it even if it's not your drain stat. Also puts you in a good position to be a face as well as a mage, if you want. The bad news is you only have one out of the three most widely useful spirit types (Man, Task, Guardian) so that'll limit your options a bit. One last thing before I get into specific spirits, you should be very careful about binding high force spirits. Spirit summoning is dangerous because the drain is very random, and when you're binding a spirit it effectively throws three times as much drain at you, while you only get two drain rolls. You might be able to sleep it off, but if the spirit gets some lucky rolls it just might kill you outright. Use with caution. Alright so onto your spirit types. Unlike every other type of spirit, Guardian spirits can use weapons. All guardian spirits can use common melee weapons, and with optional powers they can learn to use any type of ranged weapon and exotic weapons. If your party is lacking a sniper or doesn't have anyone with heavy weapons skill, you might want to bind a guardian spirit with longarms and/or heavy weapons (or two with one skill each) At lower force ratings, a guardian spirit with a strong melee weapon is your best close combat option. At high force ratings (about 7-9, depending on what weapon you use) force-scaling spirit powers like elemental attack, fear (the only ones guardians can get), elemental aura and others start to outperform it. Since high force spirits should generally be left for serious emergencies due to the physical drain involved, if you want to have some basic spirits for brute force combat situations, force 6 guardian spirits with good weapons at hand are your strongest option Another useful type of spirit to keep bound to you at all times is... any spirit with the Guard power. Doesn't really matter what type it is. If you got a guardian spirit for sniping or heavy weapons and don't use it very often, you can put it on Guard duty as well. No matter what spirit you pick, just have it sustain the Guard power on the party at all times, and you can choose at any time to avert a glitch or other accident at will, at the cost of one task. Beast spirits are primarily meant for combat, like guardian spirits. Unfortunately, they're simply worse at fighting than guardians are. They have few unique abilities that are useful out of combat, you have other spirits with search and concealment (water spirits get both as regular powers instead of optional powers, for one), enhanced senses are rarely useful, animal control is very niche and guardian spirits can pick it as an optional power. So that just leaves movement, whose usefulness is entirely dependent on how your gamemaster interprets it's nonsensical power description. If he lets you use it on others, beast spirits at least might be useful for getaways in very specific situations. Don't bother. Fire spirits are very useful at higher force ratings, since they have a lot of those force-scaling combat powers and like guardian spirits have very high initiative (they both have their physical initiative ratings printed wrong though, they should be +3 and +4 for guardians and fire spirits respectively.) Elemental attack, engulf, energy aura, fear, noxious breath and even to a degree accident and confusion are all extremely useful at higher force ratings. If you're ever in an emergency situation and need a high force spirit to just absolutely devastate your opposition, it's the way to go. Water spirits have many of the same combat powers as fire spirits, except most of them are optional powers, they're lacking noxious breath and fear so ironically their non-lethal options are worse than fire's, they're slower both in movement speed and initiative and their agility is lower. Unless you're going on an underwater adventure or you're out in the rain, stick to fire spirits for combat. Outside of combat, the search and concealment powers can be pretty useful, weather control is neat but as far as actual usefulness goes it's extremely niche, and movement depends on interpretation. Don't bother with plant spirits. They're your worst combat option and their only unique power, silence, is almost entirely useless unless you're fighting one of the very rare creatures with sonic attacks. As for metamagics, like Tatsu said up above, Channeling is absolutely broken assuming your GM isn't banning or nerfing it. Your physical attributes will get a huge boost and you can borrow their magic and mental attributes, neither of which are subject to your augmented maximum. Imagine if you could temporarily have 12 in all your mental attributes and magic, and +6 to all your physical attributes. That's what channeling a force 12 spirit is like. That's powerful in and of itself. If you then turn those stats towards summoning powerful spirits with your huge magic rating and massive drain pool, it's completely broken. Your GM will probably either nerf or ban it, though. Great Form spirits are also likely to be banned, they're not very practical anyway. And obviously there's centering. Not much else in the way of metamagics useful for summoning. Ally spirit is an option, but it's a huge long-term investment.

[QUOTE=Rudevinny;51099554]I had my first D&D session as a true neutral human bard. Being quite silver-tongued, I tried to find myself a squire. I spotted a gullible kid whom I convinced I was a knight in the need of a squire and suggested he join me. I got a natural 20 when I made a persuasion check, but everything went to shit when the kid rushed to tell his mom that he's going to be an adventurer. I failed one check and the lady told me to get the fuck out. Drat. Then I went to the inn, reunited with rest of my party and the innkeeper gave us a quest... to solve the case of missing children. Oh fuck. I think I just made myself the prime suspect for the case.[/QUOTE] That's why you spot orphaned urchins, and play on their unknown past to convince them they're preordained for greatness and legend under your wing. No parents to slap some sense into them and no way for them to rurn back. You're a fooooooooool!

The more I look at it, the more I'm convinced Wizards are better thieves than Rogues. Talking about 5e.

[QUOTE=munky91;51099745]The more I look at it, the more I'm convinced Wizards are better thieves than Rogues. Talking about 5e.[/QUOTE] Not even a little bit. No expertise, no fast hands, no bonus action hide/dash/disengage. They can do it sorta, but not as well as a rogue (or bard)

Got my copy of the DM guide 5e today. Played all day long with my group. They where telling my that they where hooked on the story and can't wait to see where it goes. I know I'm doing it wrong though, for instance I'm sure there is no way a level 2 fighter should be able to use the duel wield fighting style and have her second attack do +8 dam. (Even with her magical weapons) But it's silly and awesome and we are having fun. I just hope she doesn't find another dm one day who points out everything i did wrong. I suppose i should be more worried that they successful joined the inquisition (which is literally warhammer 40k inquisition in fantasy setting.) And been directly involved in destroying 4 towns. If they keep up I'm not going to have any towns left. I cant wait to see how they react to the next major city. Its a huge desert slave city.

Hold on--a level 2 fighter has magical weapons? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't magical gear something that happens further into the game than 2nd level? Of course, if they're being challenged by the combat encounters and enjoying themselves, it doesn't really matter.

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51099913]Got my copy of the DM guide 5e today. Played all day long with my group. They where telling my that they where hooked on the story and can't wait to see where it goes. I know I'm doing it wrong though, for instance I'm sure there is no way a level 2 fighter should be able to use the duel wield fighting style and have her second attack do +8 dam. (Even with her magical weapons) But it's silly and awesome and we are having fun. I just hope she doesn't find another dm one day who points out everything i did wrong. I suppose i should be more worried that they successful joined the inquisition (which is literally warhammer 40k inquisition in fantasy setting.) And been directly involved in destroying 4 towns. If they keep up I'm not going to have any towns left. I cant wait to see how they react to the next major city. Its a huge desert slave city.[/QUOTE] they shouldn't be doing +8 on their main hand attack never mind their off hand and they probably shouldn't have magical weapons at level 2 either :v:

[QUOTE=Alsojames;51099960]Hold on--a level 2 fighter has magical weapons? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't magical gear something that happens further into the game than 2nd level? Of course, if they're being challenged by the combat encounters and enjoying themselves, it doesn't really matter.[/QUOTE] Oh I'm sure it is, but the church offered them a reward for going above and beyond the call of duty and saving over 700 people (out of 10,000) from a cultists hellfire which destroyed the city. Seriously that was an awesome part of this campaign. Evil cult dude has magical orb that will unleash hellfire on a city wiping it out, cultists locked the gates from inside ready to sacrifice themselves, the plan was they would escape via an underground network of tunnels into the sewers where they would meet a Drow. INSTEAD they kicked down the door to the cult hq, tried to stop the "bomb" but couldn't. I gave them an out but the choose to stick with the people inside, quickly mounted a party of guards took back the gatehouse and opened the north gate just as the helfire plunged from the sky. They could have left even with the gates open but still went around helping people escape and ended up saving those 700, leading them to a nearby town and setting up a refugee camp for them. I think they earned themselves a couple of magic swords.

I'm pretty much stuck between Shinto and Aztec right now, manspirits are nice but I would like to try that mystical guardian spirit at some point :v:

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51100021]Oh I'm sure it is, but the church offered them a reward for going above and beyond the call of duty and saving over 700 people (out of 10,000) from a cultists hellfire which destroyed the city. Seriously that was an awesome part of this campaign. Evil cult dude has magical orb that will unleash hellfire on a city wiping it out, cultists locked the gates from inside ready to sacrifice themselves, the plan was they would escape via an underground network of tunnels into the sewers where they would meet a Drow. INSTEAD they kicked down the door to the cult hq, tried to stop the "bomb" but couldn't. I gave them an out but the choose to stick with the people inside, quickly mounted a party of guards took back the gatehouse and opened the north gate just as the helfire plunged from the sky. They could have left even with the gates open but still went around helping people escape and ended up saving those 700, leading them to a nearby town and setting up a refugee camp for them. I think they earned themselves a couple of magic swords.[/QUOTE] the thing is that even a +1 sword is a pretty big dealio in fifth with [URL="https://olddungeonmaster.wordpress.com/2014/08/30/bounded-accuracy/"]bounded accuracy[/URL] in stuff like pathfinder etc players are expected to have certain bonuses from items as part of their progression, but that's not the case in fifth - flat magical bonuses aren't really needed for characters to perform as their innate progression deals with that if you want to give your players magical stuff at low levels, that's ok - but it's much cooler to give them situational things and utility items than flat bonuses anyway! a sword that can, once a day add an extra d6 to your attack and damage roll is probably not quite as strong as a straight +1, but it's far more engaging and interesting without interfering too much with class progression

[QUOTE=Mellowbloom;51100123]the thing is that even a +1 sword is a pretty big dealio in fifth with [URL="https://olddungeonmaster.wordpress.com/2014/08/30/bounded-accuracy/"]bounded accuracy[/URL] in stuff like pathfinder etc players are expected to have certain bonuses from items as part of their progression, but that's not the case in fifth - flat magical bonuses aren't really needed for characters to perform as their innate progression deals with that if you want to give your players magical stuff at low levels, that's ok - but it's much cooler to give them situational things and utility items than flat bonuses anyway! a sword that can, once a day add an extra d6 to your attack and damage roll is probably not quite as strong as a straight +1, but it's far more engaging and interesting without interfering too much with class progression[/QUOTE] Thanks for the info, I'll keep that in mind next time. I always figured a +1 was a fairly uninteresting object.

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51100158]Thanks for the info, I'll keep that in mind next time. I always figured a +1 was a fairly uninteresting object.[/QUOTE] happy to help! I was actually working on a book of magical items for fifth, I need to get back to that as a side note, 1-use magical items like potions and scrolls are super cool things to give to your party. Purely by being a one shot they feel super important and they make for great spotlight moments as players pull out stuff they've held onto for multiple sessions

[QUOTE=Crimor;51100110]I'm pretty much stuck between Shinto and Aztec right now, manspirits are nice but I would like to try that mystical guardian spirit at some point :v:[/QUOTE] From a mechanical standpoint, basically what the choice between man or guardian boils down to is whether you want a type of spirit that can emulate a combat character or you want a type of spirit that can emulate your own spellcasting ability. If you're planning on learning a lot of spells, having the option to summon one or more spirits of man to effectively allow yourself to cast more spells every turn is useful, with the added utility of being able to cast those spells remotely by sending your spirit where it needs to be. Suddenly you can cast touch range spells on people far away, or even with no line of sight. On the other hand, guardian spirits can do almost anything your street sam or rigger drone can do if you get them the right equipment. If your team doesn't have enough combat focused characters (if you can ever have enough), or they're lacking skill with a weapon that might be useful, having guardian spirits to round out the group is very useful. From a thematic standpoint, do you want to be a weaboo or the guy who everyone connects with aztechnology.

Yeah, everyone will assume shinto mages are weebs, and that aztec mages are bloodmages or have links to Aztechnology.

I always wanted to play a witty Jewish mage who was trying to figure out how to summon golems. I statted out the character and everything; I would have just appeared to the other characters as a slightly off-kilter rabbi before busting out the manabolts.

[QUOTE=AtomicWaffle;51100786]I always wanted to play a witty Jewish mage who was trying to figure out how to summon golems. I statted out the character and everything; I would have just appeared to the other characters as a slightly off-kilter rabbi before busting out the manabolts.[/QUOTE] Is there even a jewish trad? otherwise I feel like a refluffed vodou would work nicely, gotta get dem possession spirits in clay.

[QUOTE=Crimor;51100793]Is there even a jewish trad? otherwise I feel like a refluffed vodou would work nicely, gotta get dem possession spirits in clay.[/QUOTE] Yeah, Qabbalism, and it is a possession tradition. Even if it didn't though, new traditions are like the easiest and safest thing to homebrew new ones of. The framework is all there, not really anything you can break or fuck up.

Does anyone own any personal dice trays? I kind of want to make my own but I don't know how I want to personalize it.

[QUOTE=elowin;51100855]Yeah, Qabbalism, and it is a possession tradition. Even if it didn't though, new traditions are like the easiest and safest thing to homebrew new ones of. The framework is all there, not really anything you can break or fuck up.[/QUOTE] You say that, but I've seen a lot of people complain about how many people they see homebrewing new traditions that arbitrarily have guardian, man, AND task spirits.

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51099913]Got my copy of the DM guide 5e today. Played all day long with my group. They where telling my that they where hooked on the story and can't wait to see where it goes. I know I'm doing it wrong though, for instance I'm sure there is no way a level 2 fighter should be able to use the duel wield fighting style and have her second attack do +8 dam. (Even with her magical weapons) But it's silly and awesome and we are having fun. I just hope she doesn't find another dm one day who points out everything i did wrong. I suppose i should be more worried that they successful joined the inquisition (which is literally warhammer 40k inquisition in fantasy setting.) And been directly involved in destroying 4 towns. If they keep up I'm not going to have any towns left. I cant wait to see how they react to the next major city. Its a huge desert slave city.[/QUOTE] Bear in mind that off-hand attacks do NOT get stat bonus to damage. So a +1 offhand weapon would do the weapon damage.. +1. You still get full bonus to hit, just not all that sweet damage. Instead of a ton of magic items you could have rewarded them with levels (and should if you didn't), as well as consumable magic items and favors from the church. That, and Inspiration all around. Permanent magic items are not just candy to be handed out en masse, even for something like this.

[QUOTE=Rats808;51101361]You say that, but I've seen a lot of people complain about how many people they see homebrewing new traditions that arbitrarily have guardian, man, AND task spirits.[/QUOTE] One of the core traditions already has all three, so it's that's not even really a valid complaint. The real problem is that spirit summoning is broken at every step. Like most other parts of Shadowrun's magic system, the mechanics really need to get a big revamp like deckers got in 5e.

Question: My party will now have control of a small group of low level soldiers, they are just their bodyguards, and footmen they dont need character sheets or anything but I'm unsure how i can control them. My plan was that I'd tell my party they have 3 or so people under their control and any orders you issue will be followed? I don't know if there is any offical way to do it.. Also, they are soon to enter a castle under siege, how do i control large numbers of creatures and humans? Say there are 9 people, maybe i do something like group them into threes and add all their health together so 9 now becomes 3?

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;51103030]Question: My party will now have control of a small group of low level soldiers, they are just their bodyguards, and footmen they dont need character sheets or anything but I'm unsure how i can control them. My plan was that I'd tell my party they have 3 or so people under their control and any orders you issue will be followed? I don't know if there is any offical way to do it.. Also, they are soon to enter a castle under siege, how do i control large numbers of creatures and humans? Say there are 9 people, maybe i do something like group them into threes and add all their health together so 9 now becomes 3?[/QUOTE] Are you playing PF/D&D? If so when it came to NPC followers there were two kinds that I've noticed - Cohorts and Hirelings. Cohorts are like PCs only weaker (I think they're typically 2 levels below their employer in PF), share their employer's alignment and typically are completely loyal to the PC that hired them. Hirelings tend to be weaker than PCs as well and are usually just in it for the pay. Rather than control them directly I would probably say that PCs should be able to give them orders but have very little direct control over them and instead the GM controls them. They're definitely less loyal than Cohorts and probably expect payment. Both also need feeding, shelter and equipment (although I'd expect hirelings to bring their own). As for Mass Combat, if you're playing PF then it has [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/other-rules/mass-combat]a mass combat system[/url] and if not then you could take some ideas and edit them for your own system? Another thing you could try is converting groups of enemies into "one" unit/token and controlling the battle that way, although I'd also ensure that PCs also have their own troops with them unless they're particularly high level. Alternatively what I did in a past game was I mostly made the battle fairly abstract - as it was quite large and my PCs were quite low level I had them make checks to influence the battle and avoid injury rather than fighting and winning it single handedly.

[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;51103105] Alternatively what I did in a past game was I mostly made the battle fairly abstract - as it was quite large and my PCs were quite low level I had them make checks to influence the battle and avoid injury rather than fighting and winning it single handedly.[/QUOTE] Ahh, i like that!