I'm gonna take what Warborg said and expand on the weapons but by comparing to C:DDA again.
I know cdda has a big advantage here because graphics are ASCII but in that game you can wield anything, even if it does no damage.
This is cool because sometimes your best improvised weapon ends up being something pathetic like a copper pipe, but then when you find a baseball bat or anything capable of doing actual damage, the sense of reward and investment is amplified
[editline]29th July 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Morbo!!!;52519452]This is a double-edged sword. Guns exist, and especially in a US setting it makes sense for you to come across them. Most games get it wrong by those guns being unchallenging to use, especially against slow-moving targets. When in reality, with shitting yourself cause zombies and all that, you probably wouldn't be double-tapping motherfuckers like a navy seal. This is what I was getting at with my earlier post, guns just plain aren't fun to use in the vast majority of zombie games because they negate the challenge. Equally, you don't want to make them so difficult to use or have such drawbacks that using them is practically suicidal to the point you'd never put it to use. If I, the player, had to compensate for my [I]character[/I] shitting themself and/or being inept with firearms, it'd be a lot more compelling because there's more risk vs the same potential reward. Like I said, I wouldn't care exactly what form that'd take mechanically (eg cone-of-fire [pls no] or weapon sway) so long as guns =! not having to worry (ammo notwithstanding), so long as they don't necessarily mean winning every fight you use one in.[/QUOTE]
Again - like in CDDA, guns are pretty easy to find, but ammo is scarce. Most people choose not to use firearms, though, because they're LOUD. Using a 9mm to kill one straggler should alert hordes from all directions, let alone a shotgun or fully automatic weapon. It should be a (powerful) emergency tool that will end up making your overall situation worse
[editline]29th July 2017[/editline]
By the way, the game title art is fucking awesome, with the tree and all
I have a few questions for the devs if possible
- Do you have any kind of intention for ingame radio system?
- How big do you want the map to be? And how big is it right now? (I was thinking about the stretch goals for vehicles and if we were to get planes then I just thought about map size)
- What are you going to do for the future of the game. When you guys hit 1.0 - Is there any future plans for expansions or do you guys hope the modding community will be able to guide that?
I hope you guys will achieve what you want from a Zombie survival game - And even better that people agree with your idea of it.
Best of luck with the kickstarter :smile:
[QUOTE=Kylel999;52519588]
Again - like in CDDA, guns are pretty easy to find, but ammo is scarce. Most people choose not to use firearms, though, because they're LOUD. Using a 9mm to kill one straggler should alert hordes from all directions, let alone a shotgun or fully automatic weapon. It should be a (powerful) emergency tool that will end up making your overall situation worse
[/QUOTE]
I disagree, to each his own and all that, but that's too far on the other end of the spectrum. They should be powerful, easier to use than melee for sure, but not point-and-click as they are in many games. I like the way they function in No More Room in Hell, ie they're very effective at giving you some breathing room, but there's never enough ammo to clear a street and make it safe. I think there's a balance to be found there - no, they shouldn't be practically silent, but equally I don't think they should draw the whole city towards you, this depending on their ease-of-use though. If it's as easy as NMRiH to actually hit your targets, sure, bury the player in zombies, but if there's a lot more challenge involved, you shouldn't be punished so severely. They'd still be the most efficient means of killing zombies, their use should still carry benefits and drawbacks, but you don't want it to be extreme or only idiots will fire them.
[QUOTE=Morbo!!!;52520897]I disagree, to each his own and all that, but that's too far on the other end of the spectrum. They should be powerful, easier to use than melee for sure, but not point-and-click as they are in many games. I like the way they function in No More Room in Hell, ie they're very effective at giving you some breathing room, but there's never enough ammo to clear a street and make it safe. I think there's a balance to be found there - no, they shouldn't be practically silent, but equally I don't think they should draw the whole city towards you, this depending on their ease-of-use though. If it's as easy as NMRiH to actually hit your targets, sure, bury the player in zombies, but if there's a lot more challenge involved, you shouldn't be punished so severely. They'd still be the most efficient means of killing zombies, their use should still carry benefits and drawbacks, but you don't want it to be extreme or only idiots will fire them.[/QUOTE]
Hey, not only idiots will fire them :v: Those mechanics can be taken to the players advantage too, if he/she's smart enough - many times I've intentionally went into an abandoned house in an area densely populated by zombies, dumped explosives or gasoline on the floor, made a ton of sound from inside, ran out the back door and set fire/blow the house up. The noise will distract them from you (if it's night and they can't see you running out into the darkness) and they'll all gather round the fire inside the house until the entire home is engulfed and it kills all of the zeds.
But yes, there should be a balance of these things as you've said
[QUOTE=Morbo!!!;52520897]I disagree, to each his own and all that, but that's too far on the other end of the spectrum. They should be powerful, easier to use than melee for sure, but not point-and-click as they are in many games. I like the way they function in No More Room in Hell, ie they're very effective at giving you some breathing room, but there's never enough ammo to clear a street and make it safe. I think there's a balance to be found there - no, they shouldn't be practically silent, but equally I don't think they should draw the whole city towards you, this depending on their ease-of-use though. If it's as easy as NMRiH to actually hit your targets, sure, bury the player in zombies, but if there's a lot more challenge involved, you shouldn't be punished so severely. They'd still be the most efficient means of killing zombies, their use should still carry benefits and drawbacks, but you don't want it to be extreme or only idiots will fire them.[/QUOTE]
I don't think there should be artificial difficulty based on the character's emotions and panic. I don't like separation of character and player emotion. If I'm in a corner with a gun and there's 5 zombies approaching, I, as a player, am not freaking out about it, I'm concentrating so I don't die and lose my stuff. If you wanna make it physical issues, like having weapon sway if you've been sprinting, I'm all for it, but making guns artificially worse because of factors that affect my player that [I]I can't control[/I] are a terrible idea. I don't want to sit there and be going "you fucking dipshit stop freaking out so I can shoot" because that's just not enjoyable. Hell, if anything, I'd say just do it The Last of Us style mixed with RPG-lite elements where over time as you shoot you get better at it, so when you start out you're terrible and have some awful weapon sway, but as you play it reduces and gets better.
Besides, after a while of dealing with zombies I'm sure they'd be less shitting-your-pants scary because the survivors wouldn't be scared average population anymore.
[QUOTE=gk99;52526886]I don't think there should be artificial difficulty based on the character's emotions and panic. I don't like separation of character and player emotion. If I'm in a corner with a gun and there's 5 zombies approaching, I, as a player, am not freaking out about it, I'm concentrating so I don't die and lose my stuff. If you wanna make it physical issues, like having weapon sway if you've been sprinting, I'm all for it, but making guns artificially worse because of factors that affect my player that [I]I can't control[/I] are a terrible idea. I don't want to sit there and be going "you fucking dipshit stop freaking out so I can shoot" because that's just not enjoyable. Hell, if anything, I'd say just do it The Last of Us style mixed with RPG-lite elements where over time as you shoot you get better at it, so when you start out you're terrible and have some awful weapon sway, but as you play it reduces and gets better.
Besides, after a while of dealing with zombies I'm sure they'd be less shitting-your-pants scary because the survivors wouldn't be scared average population anymore.[/QUOTE]
You just described my ideal FPS/RPG progression mechanic for guns and weapons in general - rather than arbitrarily increasing "accuracy" and "damage" stats, it's the character's ability to operate and aim it - the type of bullet, its velocity etc don't change because its firer is more or less experienced, only the likelihood of it hitting its target. So in other words, Skyrim with guns, where your ability with a weapon (class) passively increases as you use it. The difference between melee weapons and firearms being that the user's skill actually impacts the former's damage potential.
The long and short of it is, in most zombie games, especially those with generic shamblers and runners and little more to spice it up, the potential of guns far exceeds the challenge posed by the types of enemies you fight, and most players are skilled enough to fully leverage that potential. The way most go about addressing that is by making ammo extremely rare, which does the job, but I think adding challenge to the shooting mechanics themselves is the more fun way to go - you get to shoot more, there's greater risk/reward, and a sense of personal progression, if not mechanical if RPG style stats are involved.
I get what you mean about taking control away from the player, in this case based on fear. I think that element would be abstracted by such a mechanic, and play in to how it affects the player.
[QUOTE=gk99;52526886]I don't think there should be artificial difficulty based on the character's emotions and panic. I don't like separation of character and player emotion. If I'm in a corner with a gun and there's 5 zombies approaching, I, as a player, am not freaking out about it, I'm concentrating so I don't die and lose my stuff. If you wanna make it physical issues, like having weapon sway if you've been sprinting, I'm all for it, but making guns artificially worse because of factors that affect my player that [I]I can't control[/I] are a terrible idea. I don't want to sit there and be going "you fucking dipshit stop freaking out so I can shoot" because that's just not enjoyable. Hell, if anything, I'd say just do it The Last of Us style mixed with RPG-lite elements where over time as you shoot you get better at it, so when you start out you're terrible and have some awful weapon sway, but as you play it reduces and gets better.
Besides, after a while of dealing with zombies I'm sure they'd be less shitting-your-pants scary because the survivors wouldn't be scared average population anymore.[/QUOTE]
I think when you're in direct control of your character ie a third or first person shooter, stuff such as panic and more emotional stuff should be cut out completely. If the zombies are a genuine threat you should just be left to panic on your own accord.
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;52529104]I think when you're in direct control of your character ie a third or first person shooter, stuff such as panic and more emotional stuff should be cut out completely. If the zombies are a genuine threat you should just be left to panic on your own accord.[/QUOTE]
I agree - but if shooting/combat mechanics are simplified to the point of making killing your target trivial, there'll be a lot less room for actual panic
The Dead Linger 2.0
[QUOTE=sam6420;52530177]Unlike a lot of people in this thread, I missed the zombie hype train, so I can definitely see myself playing this. I'll need some sort of exlusive facepunch swag, of course.[/QUOTE]
shhh it's getting tempting.
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;52530702]shhh it's getting tempting.[/QUOTE]
are you seriously suggesting that there weren't any facepunch swag to begin with.
what the hell man
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;52530702]shhh it's getting tempting.[/QUOTE]
As both a backer and member of FP I would like to respectfully request assless chaps with a modelled postal's ass for FP members.
Gas Mask with FP icon on it or bust
[QUOTE=Daemon White;52531032]Gas Mask with FP icon on it or bust[/QUOTE]
You'll be the first loser I kill then. Insta-KOS.
EDIT: Also enjoy my hard earned $30, I'm poor but I want to help. I wish you the best of luck.
Oh and now you have to make me an exception to the rule and make me an NPC, actually just make me all the NPCs.
There should be a laptop hidden in a kid's bedroom with the original monkey_123 ordeal on the screen :v:
im crying. oh fuck oh fuck were gonna be poor. i have to email garry and demand a refund
I got a question about the world creation tools, can they import real life height data for creating the world spaces, or is it all created from scratch?
[QUOTE=Kylel999;52532521]There should be a laptop hidden in a kid's bedroom with the original monkey_123 ordeal on the screen :v:
im crying. oh fuck oh fuck were gonna be poor. i have to email garry and demand a refund[/QUOTE]
What is this ordeal you speak of?
[QUOTE=Abaddabadon;52533086]What is this ordeal you speak of?[/QUOTE]
[url]http://wikipunch.com/Monkey_123[/url]
Part of Facepunch history
We're getting ready to release a gameplay video sometime soon. There'll be a post here with it as soon as it's ready.
Jezus, I still remember talking to you when you were still working on that crysis mod I believe. How things have come!
This is looking seriously good. And someone made an excellent post last page about personal stuff and trophies.
[QUOTE=Ray551;52533285][url]http://wikipunch.com/Monkey_123[/url]
Part of Facepunch history[/QUOTE]
Holy shit that's 11 years old now
I've been a member of this forum longer than half of my life
I'm psyched for a gameplay video
Always nice to see Facepunchers putting out cool shit like this.
I'm currently really sick and trying to push through into getting the new gameplay video out.
Wish me luck!
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;52558934]I'm currently really sick and trying to push through into getting the new gameplay video out.
Wish me luck![/QUOTE]
I wish you luck!
Dude oh my god this is the mod that got me to buy Crysis 2 :D Got a bit disappointed back then but that was mostly because I thought development stopped. Happy to see you're all still working on it. I'll be backing this and keeping my eyes on it ;D Looking great so far, cant wait for gameplay video!
[QUOTE=Hyzo;52559856]Dude oh my god this is the mod that got me to buy Crysis 2 :D Got a bit disappointed back then but that was mostly because I thought development stopped. Happy to see you're all still working on it. I'll be backing this and keeping my eyes on it ;D Looking great so far, cant wait for gameplay video![/QUOTE]
I wish I could've done more with the Crysis 2 Mod SDK. It's the biggest reason we're working with Epuc to get SOLID tools in the hands of modders. Thank you for the support :)
[QUOTE=Johnny Guitar;52560665]I wish I could've done more with the Crysis 2 Mod SDK. It's the biggest reason we're working with Epuc to get SOLID tools in the hands of modders. Thank you for the support :)[/QUOTE]
Yeah don't get me wrong, I'm actually glad to see you guys working on ue4 instead of the Crysis SDK and taking your time with it to get it good. UE4 is more versatile at this point and open source too so it's the best choice kinda wish it was an option back in 2012 so this would be even closer to release because I can't wait to play this :D Also I told myself I wouldn't say anything about how you guys should make this game but having seen other crowdfunding projects in the past just keep in mind that while I love the idea of developers getting feedback from the gamers that will play their game just don't let them get too much control of how they want your game to be. Just make the game you want to make and turn to the public for inspiration and feedback, because you can't please everyone :D Good luck!
[media]https://youtu.be/6BKbYvm7Q2A[/media]
what's the source of your zombies here? what type are they? we talking romero zombies or some of the more recent rage zombies or something else
[QUOTE=Steven :D;52573793][media]https://youtu.be/6BKbYvm7Q2A[/media][/QUOTE]
Killer looking fog right there. I'm anxious to see the zombie types and how well the AI will be.
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