The Elder Scrolls Megathread XX: Might as well be XXX - Games - Facepunch Forum

The Elder Scrolls Megathread XX: Might as well be XXX

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Tannin is the guy designing the gun, Dark0ne is the one running interference/marketing, as has openly just stated he doesn't even play or mod Skyrim, other than when he faffed around with NMM whenever that was, and he's perfectly certain Tannin is incapable of making mistakes Tannin has made at least three hyper arbitrary decisions: 1 No ordering 2 Must install on C Drive into x86 3 Must 100% comply with Microsoft Win10 ->USER<- (not admin) policies that pretty much kill advanced interconnected or interdependent modding for Firaxis, Bethesda, and CDPR games, at least the current and past titles, period. His exegesis is the RULE system will have enough power and flexibility that at [I]runtime[/I] Vortex can sort and process things correctly every time without fail, even with external tools that [B]must[/B] inject and stay resident and more importantly, ->persistent<- into existing code. Maybe he's right, but given his track record that doesn't appear to be an absolute, especially the issues he had with MO2. Maybe someone working with him is some kind of virtualization wunderkind and he's absolutely right, but there's no evidence of that in this version, in fact quite the opposite seems to be the case, and ironically enough people are already reporting vortex is erasing their entire mod setup when attempting to uninstall it or just uninstall a single mod, just like NMM still does to this day. Perhaps they need to take some more time before declaring how awesome and clean it is. If I just wanted to install a bunch of textures, why the hell would I need Vortex anyway, which is pretty much all you can do with it right now. :|

[QUOTE=27X;53101288] Tannin has made at least three hyper arbitrary decisions: 1 No ordering 2 Must install on C Drive into x86 3 Must 100% comply with Microsoft Win10 ->USER<- (not admin) policies [/QUOTE] These three things, with my current computer setup, has, to put it simply, made Vortex is shite in my eyes. Mainly numero dos on that list. Like come the fuck on Tannin, I got my C drive full atm and I [I]know[/I] that there are modders who have 128 GB SSDs specifically reserved for their OS. They can't store mods for 2+ games on their drives. Does Tannin even play games?

[QUOTE=Benzine;53101235]Guards OHK after getting enough hits on you so tanks don't afk in the city with like 3 on them. The best way to escape em is to not sprint and save your stam for rolling out of the roots. But otherwise yeah they're annoying as hell, I don't even bother trying to pickpocket anymore.[/QUOTE] The money that you get out of pickpocketing still so worth it though I've been going to areas with a lot of merchants and very few guards that I can loot the safe boxes and basically just get an easy way out

I would've always have liked guards to be like, dudes in the 30-60 range for weapon skill, with most being pretty mundane (but still strong) in attributes, with the exception of some individuals like veterans or captains or men at arms and stuff. A fair few would have cheap enchantements on their gear or a bit of silver, with many of the weapons having enchantments that help with the arrest rate rather than the kill rate, but also to help with monsters that have -resist normal weapons- on them. and of course, most of them would be far weaker than the crazy heights the player gets to, but they'd make up for it with numbers and teamwork. I mean guards would frequently have to fight monsters if we go by lore (and I guess even the games have a fair amount of this). I just think it'd be cooler to fight many weaker enemies with some semblance of tactics than some level scalling dudes, because it's [I]always[/I] level scaling dudes. I think it'd be great if the player could feel like doomguy gone medieval as a high level warrior, rather than the same dude fighting battles with higher health and damage against enemies with higher health and damage. Variety. Also If I could see town's regularly seiged by monsters I would be so happy.

I'm okay with how guards are built. They're designed that way so that a player cannot go full chaotic evil and absolutely wipe out a town and while you may argue that's a bit of a loss for the player, it also makes it feel like there's more weight to crime in the city seeing as if you're caught and you decide to run, there's no beating them in the long run. It's a mild immersion breaker when you consider how many guards a single city is able to shit out but it's a very minor one for a very minor concept that doesn't really need a lot of thought or time put into it. Guards are essentially just fluff. If Dawnguard is any indication, towns besieged by monsters is fucking terrible and only fun on paper. It's all fun and games until all of your favorite vendors are killed offscreen or die in a corner and that city you like is now a ghost town because everyone was slaughtered by raids. Like, it's entertaining if you actively [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/51695]mod your game[/url] to [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/1041]work around[/url] that [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/63478/]concept[/url] with a character built for the purpose of enduring something as cataclysmic, but in day-to-day interactions in average runs that shit sucks and there's no real way around it.

Gan we're talking about eso

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;53102580] Like, it's entertaining if you actively [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/51695]mod your game[/url] to [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/1041]work around[/url] that [url=https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/63478/]concept[/url] with a character built for the purpose of enduring something as cataclysmic, but in day-to-day interactions in average runs that shit sucks and there's no real way around it.[/QUOTE] I think the idea'd be that cities take advantage of defensive walls and gates whilst towns would have castles/forts to retreat too. The former isn't really doable when they're seperate world spaces (or at least, you'd have to do things in two worldspaces) and I'd think a few nameless npc's would be good when they [I]do[/I] get in. It helps that there'd be some predictability to it, like moon phases, scouting, watch towers and signals or bells would be helpful.

[QUOTE=The Jack;53102456]I would've always have liked guards to be like, dudes in the 30-60 range for weapon skill, with most being pretty mundane (but still strong) in attributes, with the exception of some individuals like veterans or captains or men at arms and stuff. A fair few would have cheap enchantements on their gear or a bit of silver, with many of the weapons having enchantments that help with the arrest rate rather than the kill rate, but also to help with monsters that have -resist normal weapons- on them. and of course, most of them would be far weaker than the crazy heights the player gets to, but they'd make up for it with numbers and teamwork. I mean guards would frequently have to fight monsters if we go by lore (and I guess even the games have a fair amount of this). I just think it'd be cooler to fight many weaker enemies with some semblance of tactics than some [B]level scalling dudes[/B], because it's [I]always[/I] level scaling dudes. I think it'd be great if the player could feel like doomguy gone medieval as a high level warrior, rather than the same dude fighting battles with higher health and damage against enemies with higher health and damage. Variety. Also If I could see town's regularly seiged by monsters I would be so happy.[/QUOTE] well see tactics don't really matter if you can just level up a few times and one shot guards because their health doesn't scale to your damage.

Yeah but if three of them are going to stab you at once you're going to have to chose who to one-shot and the rest'll shank you. Would also kill to see some spears that can keep you out of arms length. You know when you see movies and they're using spears to control a monster's movements? A group of spears aught to be pretty good at gang banging the player. If you focus on getting past one the rest'll move in and give you a good poking. Spears.... TES... *sigh*

The player will always be way to smart, well equipped, and agile and guards will always be too dumb and slow to best them in a game of tactics in the context of the vanilla mechanics. Bethesda tries to design their enemies pretty uniquely, with different resistances, abilities, stat blocks, and combat AI but these subtleties are more there for appearances than game design because every encounter can be solved by wacking it over the head a few times. Elder Scrolls isn't known for hard counters and probably won't be ever, if you want guards to fight they way you want them to fight then I suggest picking up the creation kit. Video games just don't have the flexibility of tabletops, level scaling is pretty damn necessary even if Beth does a piss job of it.

[QUOTE=VenomousBeetle;53102633]Gan we're talking about eso[/QUOTE] Sorry I'm used to The Jack ranting about Skyrim at this point Most of my points still apply to ESO anyhow. City sieges would just be tedious trash with high level players clamping on one place waiting for respawns. Guards being actually beatable easily at higher levels would mean cities would just be flooded with the same shitlords killing off everyone because they can get away with it.

[QUOTE=cdr248;53102953] Bethesda tries to design their enemies pretty uniquely, with different resistances, abilities, stat blocks, and combat AI but these subtleties are more there for appearances than game design because every encounter can be solved by wacking it over the head a few times. Elder Scrolls isn't known for hard counters and probably won't be ever, if you want guards to fight they way you want them to fight then I suggest picking up the creation kit. [/QUOTE] The only things that stood out in the last game were dragons, dragon priests and the rare wisp mother. Arguably hag ravens and centurions. Spheres are bullshit, Falmer are bullshit, Draugr let you kill them when they sleep, bandits are as expected. Morrowind had some really hard encounters and I refuse to enter a dungeon that has vampires in, dragon priests are a fun sort of hard. They were probably the best things of skyrim. Spider daedra stick out to me. I think it's the summons. Bethesda are obviously capable of interesting things. It's just a shame they make them rare.

I miss goblins

[QUOTE=_Maverick_;53103122]I miss goblins[/QUOTE] i miss when goblins looked cool eso's monster design is usually pretty good, but uh [t]https://s.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/942ae8d55db2bba788816af7db55c756/200344120/eso_goblin.jpg[/t] you fucking what [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] remember morrowind, when goblins rode intelligent lizard-wolves and grew into bigger horned goblins eventually and looked interesting and unique while still clearly being goblins [t]http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120923083721/elderscrolls/ru/images/b/ba/Morrowind_goblin.png[/t] i miss that [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] don't even get me started on ESO's rieklings [t]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/elderscrolls/images/d/d9/Riekling_%28Dragonborn%29.png/revision/latest?cb=20131221094916[/t][t]http://images.uesp.net//4/42/ON-creature-Ice-Biter_Savage.jpg[/t] :thinking:

That just looks like a Orc Nothing about that image says goblin [t]https://www.imperial-library.info/sites/default/files/beast_oblivion_goblin.png[/t] Come on Bethesda, even these Oblivion era ones would look better

it's especially annoying that rieklings are just blue goblins in ESO since [t]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/elderscrolls/images/7/71/Goblin_Grunt_Tribunal.png/revision/latest?cb=20150510120638[/t][t]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/elderscrolls/images/b/b3/Riekling.png/revision/latest?cb=20121110004322[/t] yeah clearly intended to be the same thing come on the whole "rieklings are just ice goblins" is supposed to be an in-universe misconception by people who dont know better, not actually what they are [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] ESO also has the only appearance of the [URL="http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Ice_Tribes"]Ice Tribes[/URL] outside of the super old and obscure Dawnstar and Shadowkey games (probably, it's not outright stated but they're visually similar and the location fits), but they look like this [t]http://images.uesp.net//d/d6/ON-prerelease-Riekr_Wrothgar.png[/t] [URL="http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Riekr"]at least it's not yet another goblin reskin but its kinda lame[/URL] [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] also I hope one of these days Bethesda remembers that thing about Altmer using goblin slaves as ground troops [I]where are my Thalmor goblin marauders[/I]

[QUOTE=_charon;53103144][I]where are my Thalmor goblin marauders[/I][/QUOTE] they were on the wrong side of 11/11/11

[QUOTE=_charon;53103144] ESO also has the only appearance of the [URL="http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Ice_Tribes"]Ice Tribes[/URL] outside of the super old and obscure Dawnstar and Shadowkey games (probably, it's not outright stated but they're visually similar and the location fits), but they look like this [t]http://images.uesp.net//d/d6/ON-prerelease-Riekr_Wrothgar.png[/t] [URL="http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Riekr"]at least it's not yet another goblin reskin but its kinda lame[/URL] [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] also I hope one of these days Bethesda remembers that thing about Altmer using goblin slaves as ground troops [I]where are my Thalmor goblin marauders[/I][/QUOTE] That's not the worst. It's better than skyrim's falmer.

[QUOTE=The Jack;53103193]That's not the worst. It's better than skyrim's falmer.[/QUOTE] what is wrong with you falmer are one of my favourite designs in TES as whole, they're so creepy looking and really distinctive they really embody that spirit of taking common fantasy tropes and creating a unique spin on them that makes TES what it is [editline]2nd February 2018[/editline] they're like the "fallen elf" kind of thing you see a lot, except taken to this disturbing extreme where they've become vicious little cave monsters clad in insect shells but are still noticeably people; just really fucked up people who have been through a physical and mental hell for generations edit: falmer are basically [t]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/5/5d/Monster_Manual_5e_-_Drider_-_p120.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20141112143053[/t] plus [t]http://zam.zamimg.com/images/e/c/ec6f2b7275d940a12bef3ae796783f11.jpg[/t] with a little bit of body horror and societal collapse mixed in and i dig that

[QUOTE=The Jack;53103193]That's not the worst. It's better than skyrim's falmer.[/QUOTE] Yeah unless you mean the Snow Elves from Dawnguard, I agree with Charon, the Falmer were a nice breath of fresh air as far as the unique enemy department goes.

[QUOTE=J!NX;53099414][t]https://i.imgur.com/4XZ7xSC.png[/t][/QUOTE] Is this ESO? Why does he look like a talking head from Fallout 1?

[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;53103344]Is this ESO? Why does he look like a talking head from Fallout 1?[/QUOTE] Or the Mystery of the Druids finally got solved and he's happy again. the answer was he just needed a friend

looks like oblvion with photoscanned skin

[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;53103344]Is this ESO? Why does he look like a talking head from Fallout 1?[/QUOTE] Its on max settings (INI edit to go above max for textures) + 2160p let that sink in

[QUOTE=J!NX;53103359]Its on max settings (INI edit to go above max for textures) + 2160p let that sink in[/QUOTE] It's an MMO with instancing. I can run WF at 8K and hit 60fps, because it's made for sticking lots of stuff on screen, not gouging out your gpu's heart out with real time foliage tessellation. TES VI will probably accomplish that, all while looking like a game from 2012.

[QUOTE=27X;53103858] TES VI will probably accomplish that, all while looking like a game from 2012.[/QUOTE] implying it actually ever comes out

I'm a bit iffy about VI ever coming out after seeing the direction Fallout 4 went, unless they say they're going back a bit on what made the previous games good I might just wait for the inevitable remake of Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim on the modern engine before getting it.

[QUOTE=ChicagoMobster;53104617]I'm a bit iffy about VI ever coming out after seeing the direction Fallout 4 went, unless they say they're going back a bit on what made the previous games good I might just wait for the inevitable remake of Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim on the modern engine before getting it.[/QUOTE] Frankly it would be egregious not to continue the ES series. The fanbase of the MMO alone should justify making it.

[QUOTE=Zenreon117;53104652]Frankly it would be egregious not to continue the ES series. The fanbase of the MMO alone should justify making it.[/QUOTE] Honestly after the previously mentioned FO4 and, well, Skyrim, I don't know if i really want another one. I don't trust Bethesda to not fuck it up even further.

[QUOTE=DeVotchKa;53104758]Honestly after the previously mentioned FO4 and, well, Skyrim, I don't know if i really want another one. I don't trust Bethesda to not fuck it up even further.[/QUOTE] Honestly it won't matter if it sucks as long as the game is still very moddable. My fear is they'll fuck up the modding so we can't fix their dumb mistakes like usual.

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