• Physical punishment as a way of disciplining your children
    170 replies, posted
My father rarely hit me,but once he does,he always use thick broom stick or heavy belt buckle. My mom often hit me and my brother with rattan stick and sometimes,belt (not the buckle) It was effective at first,but as time pass,we eventually have enough anger to break that stick to pieces,although not the broomstick or belt. Im not an expert on this but,i think minor punishment like pinch,or spank is alright. But,the one that involves thing like belt is bad idea,because that will either make them really fear you (instead respecting you) or that will make them go rebellious when they grow old enough.
[QUOTE=ejonkou;52122430]I think a belt or any tool to beat a child is stepping over the line. Though a light spanking and a stern talk to can do wonders.[/QUOTE] Guess it really depends on how you grew up. I got belted for extremely bad behavior. Never made me violent or some crazy person. If anything it made me respect the situation more and what i did, thus making me not do it again. Even then I can only recall maybe 3-5 times i actually got spanked or belted. Every situation justified.
A light slap on the wrists or in the worst case a slap on the bottom, but an issue is how the parent goes about even mild punishment. If you're screaming and cussing then the kid doesn't learn jack. If you calmly say why they're being given a slap and that this is the result of a very bad action, then it's coming from a place of consequence and not anger, be sure to talk with them after to explain why you did the thing you did. Hitting kids, beating them is wrong. Spanking your kids lightly, calmly, and rarely seems to be how I think about it. [sp]Now spanking your wife over your knee, well that should be done frequently[/sp]
I was beaten by my asshole dad several times during my younger years. It didn't teach me shit about discipline, but rather to fear dissappointing my dad. He would call me an idiot, worthless, etc. When I was twelve I told someone (my mom) for the first time. Because my parents don't live together staying with my mom every second week was basically safe haven while going back to dad's isolated house out in the countryside was hell. When he found out that I had spoken with the school therapist about it (who contacted social services) he became furious and kicked me out while putting the blame for everything on me. If it hadn't been for my mother and brother the sheer emotional shock of that event would've probably made me go insane. The discipline I have today comes from own free will, mental resolve and the fact that my other parent raised me properly and taught me good moral values. You should never lay a finger on a child. Never. It only harms them.
spank me daddy
[QUOTE=xZippy;52122525]I can't exaggerate enough how wrong this is. At least for some people. Though I might be saying this because I have a father with a pretty bad anger problem, as well as needing the last word in any argument, and I did everything in my power to not get on that side of him. Even when I was a little kid, he'd still smack the shit out of me if I went too far. And I also had a best friend who had his parents hit him on a constant basis. His mother even had a specially made stick just for hitting her kids. However, the woman had a bit of bitchy satan blood, where she would remove all good vibes with just her presence. Regardless, that "little bit of abuse" worked on us, but isn't completely necessary, as these are things that can stick with a person for a very long time.[/QUOTE] It depends on the person. They're some who say getting beat didn't teach them anything about discipline. In the cases you mentioned, that also sounds like being straight up scared of your parents. I don't think that's the right way to go about it, others have covered it already in this thread, but I don't think it teaches kids proper respect. Its just fear at that point, and could cause the kid to become violent themselves (either in current time or in the future).
[QUOTE=Vodkavia;52123957]My mother beat me horribly. Brooms, sticks, wooden spoods; she used anything she had on hand. She lashed my back and rear end until I was red and bruised. [/QUOTE] I feel sorry for you having to deal with that but that isn't the same as getting a single spank on the ass for being a little shit. I'd assume most people agreeing with physical punishment agree with a single spank with an open hand for being a particularly nasty shit, and explaining what they did wrong and what they should do instead. rather than repeatedly beating the child
[QUOTE=Vodkavia;52123957]It's strange how this is still controversial. You ask people about the subject of spanking or otherwise attacking a child in order to correct a behavior and you get a lot of people who say "it works," it's "nessecary sometimes" and "I turned out alright." [I] Never once do you find people actually citing studies to back up these ideas. [/I] [url]https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/moral-landscapes/201309/research-spanking-it-s-bad-all-kids[/url] [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/18/adrian-peterson-corporal-punishment-science_n_5831962.html[/url] [url]http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/09/opinion/sendek-corporal-punishment/[/url] It's almost as if studies on the subject are overwhelmingly negative My mother beat me horribly. Brooms, sticks, wooden spoods; she used anything she had on hand. She lashed my back and rear end until I was red and bruised. The only thing I "gained" from it was knowing from an earlier age that my mother was physically and emotionally abusive. Years later when I visited family I relived the same experiences through my nephews and nieces. We stayed for a month or so, so I get to see how that style of "parenting" was passed on. These kids, some of them still toddlers and others as old as twelve endured everything I dealt with except worse. They were pummeled, slapped and knocked around to the point that it drew blood. Please don't fucking normalize child abuse.[/QUOTE] There's a very big difference between constantly beating someone up, and giving someone the odd spanking for actually doing something wrong, don't label everyone who does physical punishment as child abusers. The same can be said for telling kids off verbally, that too can be done in an abuseful manner, to the point of traumatization.
IMO if you need to spank your child to tell them they've done something wrong you have failed a bit as a parent. It is up to the parents teach the kids what's right and wrong.
I got the belt a couple times as a kid, and i tell you what, it worked. whatever i did to deserve it, i sure as hell never did it again.
[QUOTE=Ziirxia;52122042]Did your parents ever lay a hand on you? Being from Denmark too, no one in my group of friends have been spanked etc and neither did my parents.[/QUOTE] Never. [editline]19th April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Alice3173;52121980]You'd find a much greater correlation between kids growing up to become assholes and parents not punishing their kids at all compared to physical punishments and nonphysical ones. And as for the bit on physical abuse: Those people tend to be grouped into two main groups. Ones who, having been physically abused, will refrain from using any sort of physical force on their kids ever (even being too soft on them too) because they don't want to have their children fear them like they did their abusive parent(s) and those who were physically abused but are lacking in the awareness to realize they're no different than their abusive parent. In my experience you'll find very few people who suffered abuse and don't fall into one of those two groups.[/QUOTE] Not using physical punishments does not mean you shouldn't punish your child when they do something bad, obviously.
Funny, the one thing I [I]ever[/I] got spanked for as a standard punishment was lying, and nowadays lying is something I do a hell of a lot, even more than back then. It's basically become a habit for me. The spanking didn't make me think "Hey, lying's a bad thing," it just made me more desperate to get away with doing it. I think it's more important to teach a kid [I]why[/I] something is wrong rather than just simply keeping them from doing it out of fear or whatever.
The whole thing about punishing children is that it's all relative to how you treat them in any other situation. Kids don't have a good perception of fairness, let alone a perception of the outside world. Whatever happens in their close family will be their only point of reference for a fairly long time, until they grow old enough to have the mental faculty to draw comparisons. This means that talking an extra bit louder or giving your child a single spank on the ass is really all you'll need, so long as you're normally treating them with love and care. [editline]19th April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Dr. Ocsid;52125085]Funny, the one thing I [I]ever[/I] got spanked for as a standard punishment was lying, and nowadays lying is something I do a hell of a lot, even more than back then. It's basically become a habit for me. The spanking didn't make me think "Hey, lying's a bad thing," it just made me more desperate to get away with doing it. I think it's more important to teach a kid [I]why[/I] something is wrong rather than just simply keeping them from doing it out of fear or whatever.[/QUOTE] From experience both as I grew up and seeing my cousins and uncles raising children who were much younger than me, fair punishment is often less about doing something moronic or bad and more about challenging authority in an often reckless, self-endangering way. Kids don't necessarily understand the risks of some of their actions and won't necessarily listen to you telling them how and why it's dangerous so sometimes it's necessary to give them a reminder of who's in charge until they're actually old enough to start making their own decisions intelligently.
It's highly situational and should only be used as a last resort, but speaking from personal experience, it can be an effective way to instill order in a person and respect of authority when they're young. For me at least, it taught me that there's consequences to my actions and I should consider what could happen before I do something. Though I will say, if you resort to using force as a means of discipline, [b]you must explain[/b] to your kids why you did what you did and what you were trying to teach via your actions. Otherwise you're kids will probably just assume you're being an asshole for no reason.
Being raised on a strict family, mischief usually ended me with the belt on the ass or spanking. They never did this out of hatred. In a way I believe this taught me the meaning of consequence and to think before acting and discipline. Other sorts of punishments that didn't include it was being locked in the bathroom for several hours and getting my bedroom without my computer or eletricity. My cousin said she'd never lay a hand on her son, so he can do pretty much whatever and never get any real consequence out of it, only sort of getting his videogame/phone taken away for a few hours/days and then he was back to doing wrong shit again. He grew to be a massive asshole, often retorting his parents because he probably knew they wouldn't do much.
Yeah there's kind of a fucking universe between an acceptable spank (read: a push on your child's bum that kind of nudges his ass forward while leaving barely more than a stinging feeling for half a minute) and [I]hitting[/I] your child. It would be nice for once to have one of those discussions without the same kind of idiotic hyperboles backed by the same appeal to emotion nonsense that we get every time.
Those sources mostly talk about the escalation/repetition of punishment as a constant means of keeping children in line, wherein most people here discussed spanking as a method of exceptional, last resort punishment that won't be used in any regular light. All they do is prove that constantly spanking your children isn't a good way to mold them into obedience, and will in fact do the opposite. Something which not many people have claimed in this thread. The studies even mention how they have to be taken with a grain of salt because they are both very reliant on correlations in nature and only address the repeated use of spanking, ie [I]abuse of the method[/I], and some of them even push forth "conditional spanking", which is the thing I said was good to use, as an acceptable last resort method to get a kid in line when they openly defied other disciplinary methods that aren't violent.
[QUOTE=GoDong-DK;52125008]Not using physical punishments does not mean you shouldn't punish your child when they do something bad, obviously.[/QUOTE] You kinda missed my point. I wasn't saying whether or not you should. I was saying that that's what happens in effect. Because of their own personal experiences, those people tend to go too far in the opposite direction trying to avoid being the same as their abusive parent(s).
I don't think that physical violence from a parent is ever okay for the average kid. Now that said I do know a guy who was a pretty big bully in elementary school, and it was kinda a problem, he was getting in trouble and shit, the school was always on the parent's ass, so the dad paid some of the 6th graders to beat the shit out of his son and bully him for a week. Kid never bullied anyone ever again, though I'm not sure I think that's a good solution either, even if it did work. I think the approach of discipline for a child requires the understanding that kids don't always comprehend stuff the same as adults. The guy I just talked about had been given the world of chances and explainings about how he was wrong, he didn't get it until our peers beat the shit out of him and he felt the same as the people he bullied. But for most people I don't think they need that, I think most people and kids are capable of empathy and understanding the consequences of their actions without fear of violence to make them conform, but there is a certain subset of people that do require that level of consequence I think, otherwise we wouldn't have prisons and such no?
Whole point is that regular punishment will sometimes not work. Kids can be defiant sometimes to a self-endangering extreme and spanking is something you use when other punishment that are more gentle cannot work. Children aren't dumb and will learn how to avoid or deal with punishment. There are always going to be cases where nothing else works and giving your child a light spank is the only thing that will get their attention long enough to tell them to cut the shit and calm the fuck down. No fucking shit repeatedly, unconditionally smacking your child's rear whenever they act defiant isn't going to be healthy. Same for sending them up to their room for doing the smallest things or talking loud at them or any other action that could be considered punishment. Everything you can do to a child can lead to negative repercussions down the line if you do it too much and too often.
Purely as an opinion here with no backing and as a kid who only got spanked so few times I'm not even sure if it ever happened - There might be a point at which it's acceptable, but it has to be an extreme. I feel like implying to a child that they are ultimately untouchable and no physical contact will ever come to them no matter what they do may be more dangerous than a wrist or butt slap. Because most of these studies are locked behind a paywall, I can't really delve into how they conduct and differentiate the punishment. I see "the belt" as way out of line.
Spanking your kids gives them a spanking fetish later on in life
Hm... physical punishment is actually the norm for Asia culture (rarer nowadays, but extremely common 15 or so years back), canes being sold on the street for disciplining children, almost all schools permit and supply teachers with a cane. You did something the authority don't permit, you get x amount of stroke. Same goes for families but harsher (if you FUCKED UP good you can bet anything can become your parent's weapon, depends on your parent, of course), my family, all my friends', and those who don't get caned are dubbed spoiled. Everybody's sort of "okay" with it. Honestly? They are kinda effective? Things are orderly, and everybody kinda know their place, you know you do things to displease the adults you just gon' feel pain. The lessons just kinda always end up "yeah don't do that again unless you wanna get hurt", so I would say it wasn't very educational so obviously it isn't perfect, but ey, as I said, it was effective. Some really successful individuals grew up with this lifestyle and most of them appreciate the parenting style, keeps them in check during youth. I dunno bout nowadays, I assume it is lessened and more incentive-based.
I don't know shite about parenting, and I can totally envision situations in which harsher-than-normal punishment could be considered necessary, and in such a case I am not sure what I think of the difference between different kinds of punishments. In any case, I find it telling that everyone countering back at Vodkavia are perfectly following exactly what he said: [I]Never once do you find people actually citing studies to back up these ideas.[/I] I'm inclined to believe the guy posting studies, rather than the people just going [I]"Yeah but I'm talking about light and rare spanking though it's different"[/I]. You're still just saying [I]"it works"[/I], [I]"it's necessary sometimes"[/I] and not backing it up with anything.
I'm not backing it up with studies because I'm not pretentious enough to claim I've read several studies on a subject so disconnected from my daily life and my interests, let alone pretentious enough to claim others should agree with me simply because I linked them, knowing full well no one will actually sit down and read them if only for the fact they're behind a paywall. Every time someone just dumps like five or six links to various articles I always have the steaming suspicion that they just googled it and threw it in there as an easy "look I'm right the science men back me up" point. It's basic appeal to authority shenanigans that people utilize because they know no one actually takes the time to read through what can be up to a hundred pages of numbers, conclusions and results, let alone pay to access them.
Well, I feel like when the argument is [I]"sometimes inflicting pain on children is ok"[/I], it really needs strong evidence.
My dad used to spank my brothers and I. I still love and respect my parents. I have no interest in using violence on others. I can't say if what he did shaped me into a better person. But either way, I'll still love and respect my dad for everything he's done for me, the good and the bad. Because now I know what I shouldn't do if I ever become a father. It was a learning experience from both sides, as a child and as an adult.
[QUOTE=Viper123_SWE;52124948]IMO if you need to spank your child to tell them they've done something wrong you have failed a bit as a parent. It is up to the parents teach the kids what's right and wrong.[/QUOTE] Do you really think that's the only reason kids act out? Because they don't know it's wrong? Ridiculous [editline]19th April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=The golden;52125255]Quoting this to bring it to the 2nd page so people can read this. If you hit any person out in public you would be arrested and charged with assault. Why is it suddenly OK to hit your kids? If anything it should be LESS ok to hit your kids as they're your own fucking children. If you can't handle raising a child without resorting to losing your temper and striking them then please don't have fucking children. I repeat what Vodkavia said - don't fucking normalize child abuse.[/QUOTE] And I'd like to repeat another user Sorry you got beat but there is a huge difference between being spanked on your ass once for fucking up and having an adult beat the fuck out of you, no one is advocating to beat children here. [editline]19th April 2017[/editline] I think the most annoying thing about your argument is you're basically implying my parents hated me/were horrible to me/raised me wrong/are monsters because they slapped me on the ass for beating the shit out of kids at school because I wanted to be a bully. And I [I]knew[/I] it was wrong to be a bully, I just didn't care. I never had these feelings towards them. I never feared my parents, I never resented them. They raised me into the man I am today and I have no issues with who I am.
It's just as stupid and outdated as things like racism, sexism and it shouldn't be a thing just like the other two. The only reason it's still even used is because of schools that used rulers to beat children and parents that think because their parents did it it's okay for them to do it, not to mention it can lead to emotional trauma and for that child to then do it to their kids later on in life.
I grew up getting caned a fuckton and I didn't suffer any emotional trauma. Neither did any of my childhood friends. Did I get mixed up with corporal punishment vs. abuse?
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