• Are current cartoons on television REALLY all that bad?
    245 replies, posted
[img]http://www.totalmediabridge.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/MLP-show-title-card_1.jpg[/img] More than enough proof the answer is yes.
[QUOTE=jimhowl33t;33583002]There are a few pearls (Adventure time, Regular show...) in a sea of mediocrity.[/QUOTE] Both of those shows seem to realize that they have adult audiences, so they slip in slight undertones. Adventure Time, for example, references that the land of Ooo is actually a post-apocalyptic version of the United States, and the reason magic exists is because of the high-radiation levels. If you have a sharp eye, you'll often notice small things such as skeletons in business suits, undetonated warheads stuck in the ground, remnants of old buildings, ect..
Adventure Time and Regular Show are great.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;33592662][img]http://www.totalmediabridge.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/MLP-show-title-card_1.jpg[/img] More than enough proof the answer is yes.[/QUOTE]I'd rather watch that than new Spongebob episodes. [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] To be honest...
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;33592662]-snip- More than enough proof the answer is yes.[/QUOTE] Such a nice post. I like the part where you wrote a well reasoned and thought out argument, backing it up with other shows to compare them to the ones of today. Bravo to you good sir.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;33592662]*pony shit* More than enough proof the answer is yes.[/QUOTE] [img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/emot-golfclap.gif[/img] This is by far the most insightful post in the entire thread, excellent job deconstructing the series and explaining your reasoning in a clear and concise manner. It sure is annoying when bronies post pony shit everywhere with no context or explanation, don't you think? Not that you'd ever do that or anything, you sure showed them with that quality post of yours. I'm sure you know exactly what I'm talking about, some of them even say that people who go out of their way to bullshit the show are more annoying than those that like it. Can you believe that? [editline]December 6th, 2011[/editline] Let's just end this conversation here so asteroid doesn't get to enjoy the shitstorm he clearly intended to create
[QUOTE=camaroni;33592885]Such a nice post. I like the part where you wrote a well reasoned and thought out argument, backing it up with other shows to compare them to the ones of today. Bravo to you good sir.[/QUOTE] If you're looking for an older show to give comparison, why not Dexter's Lab? [img]http://radbot.net/pix/1395.gif[/img] To give a serious opinion, Didn't the same chick make Powerpuff Girls and Foster's Home? Personally, I'll admit I liked her oldest work, PPG, when I was a kid, but I never found Foster's Home all that appealing, and despise MLP and find it difficult to comprehend how it's hit such a disturbingly large audience so far from its target. Granted, while PPG was somewhat more directed towards girls, whereas Foster's Home was somewhat more gender-neutral, but I think a bit of that had to do with my youth, I'm not so sure I'd watch, or enjoy, PPG now as I did then. Mostly I only watch Spongebob, King of the Hill, and anything that pops up on Teletoon at Night if I happen to be watching, and I'd be inclined to agree the new episodes aren't quite as good. Hell, the movie wasn't all that great either. Not to really say I find any of these good, just amusing, because I have a very broad sense of humour, ranging from extremely immature (As in everything Seth McFarlane touches) to sophisticated. I find more I like to watch Cash Cab, Sons of Guns, Big Bang Theory, NCIS, or even the news over most cartoons. Hell, there've been nights where I've stayed up until 3 watching Storage Wars or Billy the Exterminator for hours, not really sure why either. I'm sure I could have been watching Futuama, some shit by Seth, or The Dating Guy, but listening to some middle-aged guy annoyingly yelling "YEEEEEEEP!" over and over appeals to me more than most late-night cartoons nowadays.
From what I've seen cartoons that are aimed specifically at children tend to just be ignored by older people. They don't watch it, but then they weren't intended to. On the other hand, cartoons that don't really advertise themselves as being solely for kids but are by no means aimed specifically at adults tend to either get praised or reviled by the same people who ignore "kiddy shows", of course I'm not taking the creepy fanbase that may result into consideration here but that's something that isn't intended to happen.
No. Have you ever gone back and watched shows from your childhood? I did and they weren't nearly as great as I remembered. [editline]5th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=DaCommie1;33593294]If you're looking for an older show to give comparison, why not Dexter's Lab? [img]http://radbot.net/pix/1395.gif[/img] To give a serious opinion, Didn't the same chick make Powerpuff Girls and Foster's Home? Personally, I'll admit I liked her oldest work, PPG, when I was a kid, but I never found Foster's Home all that appealing, and despise MLP and find it difficult to comprehend how it's hit such a disturbingly large audience so far from its target. Granted, while PPG was somewhat more directed towards girls, whereas Foster's Home was somewhat more gender-neutral, but I think a bit of that had to do with my youth, I'm not so sure I'd watch, or enjoy, PPG now as I did then. Mostly I only watch Spongebob, King of the Hill, and anything that pops up on Teletoon at Night if I happen to be watching, and I'd be inclined to agree the new episodes aren't quite as good. Hell, the movie wasn't all that great either. Not to really say I find any of these good, just amusing, because I have a very broad sense of humour, ranging from extremely immature (As in everything Seth McFarlane touches) to sophisticated. I find more I like to watch Cash Cab, Sons of Guns, Big Bang Theory, NCIS, or even the news over most cartoons. Hell, there've been nights where I've stayed up until 3 watching Storage Wars or Billy the Exterminator for hours, not really sure why either. I'm sure I could have been watching Futuama, some shit by Seth, or The Dating Guy, but listening to some middle-aged guy annoyingly yelling "YEEEEEEEP!" over and over appeals to me more than most late-night cartoons nowadays.[/QUOTE] Craig McCracken did PPG and Foster's. His wife, Lauren Faust, did MLP.
I think that there were not more good cartoons in the 90's , but just more cartoons(especially appealing to the male kid), increasing funding for cartoons, and allowing great ideas to become reality . Cartoons almost seem to be dying breed today, or at least shifting towards a younger audience, with live-action soaps taking over the older age groups, lowering the funding for older-age cartoons, making companies stick to tried-and-trusted techniques. Even in the 90's, there were plenty of terrible cartoons, but we don't remember them, due to the fact of their lack of lasting effect. Who remembers Hammerman? [quote][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gcbbd42lHnE[/media][/quote] Very few people, right? Why, because it wasn't very good. But if we look a good cartoons from back then, such a Batman TAS, tons of people remember it nowadys. Why? Because it was bloody good, every delicious detail burning into our brains. [quote][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-u07UEDT5I[/media][/quote] So, even if there were tons of terrible cartoons-and there were quite a few- we only really remember the good ones because we watched the good ones. And even cartoons as lowly considered as MLP are still fairly good, but of course the creators have had to reduce the story a bit for the younger audience it pertains to. But even then it has quite a few mature jokes and references plugged into it, such as an episode spoofing The Big Lebowski. Also the few episodes I've watched are actually pretty intense for a little-girl's show featuring prancing pink ponies, even some life or death ones.
[QUOTE=C0linSSX;33593228][img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/emot-golfclap.gif[/img] This is by far the most insightful post in the entire thread, excellent job deconstructing the series and explaining your reasoning in a clear and concise manner. It sure is annoying when bronies post pony shit everywhere with no context or explanation, don't you think? Not that you'd ever do that or anything, you sure showed them with that quality post of yours. I'm sure you know exactly what I'm talking about, some of them even say that people who go out of their way to bullshit the show are more annoying than those that like it. Can you believe that? [editline]December 6th, 2011[/editline] Let's just end this conversation here so asteroid doesn't get to enjoy the shitstorm he clearly intended to create[/QUOTE] Alright you want reasons then phine here: SFX: almost entirely stock sounds, just plain annoying Voices: they grate on your ears, and I wouldn't be surprised if there's only three different voice actresses and that each voice is just a different amount of helium in their lungs animation: sub-par even by flash standards faces: rubberfruit, nuff said character design: theres only about 2 characters and the rest are just recolors (and the occasional hat) and that's aside from the terrible personalities music: if you can even call it that, it just plain hurts, I listened to one of the "songs" and my ears literally not exaggerating in the least started bleeding. Your move freak Also a decent cartoon (I can't believe I'm gonna say this): Phineas and Ferb. [editline]pootis[/editline] [QUOTE=DaCommie1;33593294]To give a serious opinion, Didn't the same chick make Powerpuff Girls and Foster's Home? Personally, I'll admit I liked her oldest work, PPG, when I was a kid, but I never found Foster's Home all that appealing, and despise MLP and find it difficult to comprehend how it's hit such a disturbingly large audience so far from its target. Granted, while PPG was somewhat more directed towards girls, whereas Foster's Home was somewhat more gender-neutral, but I think a bit of that had to do with my youth, I'm not so sure I'd watch, or enjoy, PPG now as I did then.[/QUOTE] 100% agreed.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;33594162]Alright you want reasons then phine here: SFX: almost entirely stock sounds, just plain annoying[/quote]Most shows use mostly stock sounds, i never found them annoying in the episodes I watched (first 3 I think), can't see how the could really be.[quote] Voices: they grate on your ears, and I wouldn't be surprised if there's only three different voice actresses and that each voice is just a different amount of helium in their lungs[/quote] Agree with you that most of the voices sound like a squeak-toy mixed with helium, but it's meant to sound all cute and whatnot . [quote]animation: sub-par even by flash standards[/quote] seems more avarage, might look less fancy because of the art style or time constraints.[quote] faces: rubberfruit, nuff said[/quote] Cartoon animation humour and emotion has always relied on exaggeration of emotions and body parts, especially in kid's cartoons. I think Rubberfruit takes it a notch more, making silly faces the base of most of his humour.[quote] character design: theres only about 2 characters and the rest are just recolors (and the occasional hat) and that's aside from the terrible personalities[/quote] Agree with you there's little variation between characters, but they're ponies, it's somewhat hard to make much variation between them without overdoing it. [quote] music: if you can even call it that, it just plain hurts, I listened to one of the "songs" and my ears literally not exaggerating in the least started bleeding.[/quote] The guy who produced the music, Daniel Ingram, has won 2 music awards, 2010 Leo Awards for Best Music in an Animated Series for Martha Speaks, and the 2008 Leo Award for Best Music in a Variety Television Show for About a Girl. But it comes down to personal taste really. My ears weren't bleeding by the end of the show, i think. Let's not derail much more though, O.k?
[QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]Most shows use mostly stock sounds, i never found them annoying in the episodes I watched (first 3 I think), can't see how the could really be. Agree with you that most of the voices sound like a squeak-toy mixed with helium, but it's meant to sound all cute and whatnot . More seems more avarage, might look less fancy because of the art style or time constraints. Cartoon animation humour and emotion has always relied on exaggeration of emotions and body parts, especially in kid's cartoons. I think Rubberfruit takes it a notch more, making silly faces the base of most of his humour. Agree with you there's little variation between characters, but they're ponies, it's somewhat hard to make much variation between them without overdoing it. The guy who produced it Daniel Ingram, has won 2 music awards, 2010 Leo Awards for Best Music in an Animated Series for Martha Speaks, and the 2008 Leo Award for Best Music in a Variety Television Show for About a Girl. But it comes down to personal taste really. My ears weren't bleeding by the end of the show, i think. Let's not derail much more though, O.k?[/QUOTE] I'm only going to respond to two of your points as it's 4 am and I don't have time to rebut the rest: Music: oh how the mighty have fallen derailing: well the topic is are modern cartoons all that bad, mlp is a modern cartoon.
Some of the cartoons that are currently on air in Netherland make no sense at all. They don't teach kids anything, they sometimes can be offensive aswell.
Cartoons these days are shit. The drawn ones are unfunny and contentless just like the animated ones, now reduced to talking-animals and their routines. Do you remember the funny, colourful, full of cliché, accompanied by an orchestra enternainment brought by [img]https://www.thecommerce.es/WebRoot/StoreES/Shops/ea3073/MediaGallery/logo_0020_tom_0026_jerry.jpg[/img] Well these days are over. Now year after year TV shows get worst, and the 3D animation movies are getting boring and all alike. The only one that stands out the crowd is UP by Disney Pixar
Just gonna say: Adventure Time and Regular Show are pretty rad. Flapjack had a pretty good run too. Everything else is a fucking joke. I mean, the Garfield Show is probably the only animated show I've ever had the pleasure of viewing to fuck up lip-syncing. But oh well, this is what happens when you slip out of the audience. I distinctly remember loving the Cartoon Cartoon lineups, and my parents just [i]hated[/i] them. Only show they were ever willing to watch was Courage the Cowardly Dog. They loved the good old stuff from Hannah-Barbera instead, stuff like Top Cat and Scooby Doo. Now I'm out of the new loop, and now I can't stand most of the shit on TV nowadays.
Look below for show currently running on cartoon network that are actually pretty fun and/or original: Adventure time Regular Show The Amazing World of Gumball MAD (many people will disagree with me on this)
[QUOTE=McNab;33599832]Look below for show currently running on cartoon network that are actually pretty fun and/or original: Adventure time Regular Show The Amazing World of Gumball MAD (many people will disagree with me on this)[/QUOTE] gumball is a little forced at times, but i do have to agree with this and mad is absolutely magnificent at times
[QUOTE=wlzshroom;33600224]gumball is a little forced at times, but i do have to agree with this and mad is absolutely magnificent at times[/QUOTE] yes yes this
[QUOTE=McNab;33599832] MAD (many people will disagree with me on this)[/QUOTE] I cannot help but to be among those people. To me, MAD seems to try too hard to be like a kid-friendly Robot Chicken and ends up feeling forced and convoluted with random pop culture references; acting like it is pushing the envelope with its celebrity teasing. Some of the jokes are good ideas, but are executed poorly. Then, of course, there are the skits that are based entirely on internet memes and gags. The worst one in that category would have to be ThunderLOLcats. It was... painful. And the fact that they got Will Friedle (who voices Lion-O in the current Thundercats series) made it all worse.
Alright it's been 12 hours and now I can think straight-er. SO: [QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]Most shows use mostly stock sounds, i never found them annoying in the episodes I watched (first 3 I think), can't see how the could really be.[/quote] True everyone has used stock sounds, that's why they're stock sounds, but I've never seen anything so relentlessly spam them at you like that. It's gotten to the point where some people think fim is where those sounds originated. [QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]Agree with you that most of the voices sound like a squeak-toy mixed with helium, but it's meant to sound all cute and whatnot .[/quote] I concede on that one, it's supposed to be cute but it comes out of a more "that's so cute it's stupid" to me at least. [QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]seems more avarage, might look less fancy because of the art style or time constraints. Cartoon animation humour and emotion has always relied on exaggeration of emotions and body parts, especially in kid's cartoons. I think Rubberfruit takes it a notch more, making silly faces the base of most of his humour.[/quote] You could be right about the "art" style. Seemed the same with the faces though, really none of it would've been funny to me were it not for the rape faces and the knowledge of who it is that watches it (a sort of so bad it's funny type thing). But at the same time I'll admit plenty of people have done that as well. [QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]Agree with you there's little variation between characters, but they're ponies, it's somewhat hard to make much variation between them without overdoing it.[/quote] Alright yeah, they're working within pretty limited constraints but are there even any male characters? Seems a touch sexist. [QUOTE=Sumap;33594306]The guy who produced the music, Daniel Ingram, has won 2 music awards, 2010 Leo Awards for Best Music in an Animated Series for Martha Speaks, and the 2008 Leo Award for Best Music in a Variety Television Show for About a Girl. But it comes down to personal taste really. My ears weren't bleeding by the end of the show, i think. [/QUOTE] This I brought up again for two reasons. 1 You're probably right, the music just grates on my ears because it's not the type of music I like. 2 Didn't Martha Speaks parody mlp once? Also now I admit I may be derailing this thread a bit. So how does anime factor into all of this?
[QUOTE=-Ben_Wolfe-;33602643]I cannot help but to be among those people. To me, MAD seems to try too hard to be like a kid-friendly Robot Chicken and ends up feeling forced and convoluted with random pop culture references; acting like it is pushing the envelope with its celebrity teasing. Some of the jokes are good ideas, but are executed poorly. Then, of course, there are the skits that are based entirely on internet memes and gags. The worst one in that category would have to be ThunderLOLcats. It was... painful. And the fact that they got Will Friedle (who voices Lion-O in the current Thundercats series) made it all worse.[/QUOTE] Yeah you either like it or hate it. A certain skit that was a crossover of toy story 3 and the bourne ultimatum had me gasping for air it was so funny, thats what made me like it.
I don't really even know what any modern cartoons are besides adventures time and regular show, and I don't really watch those either. But I have to ask: Am I the only one who absolutely hated the fuck out of Johnny Bravo? Just about everything else was good though.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;33602952]Alright it's been 12 hours and now I can think straight-er. SO: True everyone has used stock sounds, that's why they're stock sounds, but I've never seen anything so relentlessly spam them at you like that. It's gotten to the point where some people think fim is where those sounds originated.[/quote] Honestly I haven't noticed any overuse of stock sounds, just what you'd hear on any other Flash animated kid's cartoon. The most distinct one I can think of is that *squee* sound. [quote]I concede on that one, it's supposed to be cute but it comes out of a more "that's so cute it's stupid" to me at least.[/quote] The overly cute nature of the show and the voice acting is one of the hardest things to get over, I'll agree. Compare the voice acting in this to other children's cartoons, though (especially other shows on the Hub). In many cases the voices are equally or even more grating than the ones in MLP, and on top of that the quality of the acting itself is lower due to cheesy dialogue and/or shitty acting. This could just be the fandom reality distortion field talking, but I really don't see how the voices are any worse than those in other similar shows. [quote]You could be right about the "art" style. Seemed the same with the faces though, really none of it would've been funny to me were it not for the rape faces and the knowledge of who it is that watches it (a sort of so bad it's funny type thing). But at the same time I'll admit plenty of people have done that as well.[/quote] I honestly can't tell what you're trying to say here, but it seems like you're remaining neutral so nothing needs to be said. [quote]Alright yeah, they're working within pretty limited constraints but are there even any male characters? Seems a touch sexist.[/quote] That would be Hasbro's interference, the show may be produced by a good team but the final say on every decision always goes to the large corporation on top. [quote]This I brought up again for two reasons. 1 You're probably right, the music just grates on my ears because it's not the type of music I like. 2 Didn't Martha Speaks parody mlp once?[/quote] By music I assume you mean the musical numbers and not the BGM. I feel that the songs are good in the context of the episodes despite their undeniable cheesiness, but given that you don't watch the show your feelings are understandable. Out of curiosity, how much of the show have you actually seen?
Of of all the points asteroidrules gave, I think kids couldn't give a damn about music, voice acting, animation.
[QUOTE=GameAdict;33581920]Oh jeez. I remember some programmes I used to like. Then they decided to replace some of the best with...baby programmes *choke*. If you'll excuse me...I'm just gonna...throw the TV out the window now.[/QUOTE] They did that to me it went from CN to crappy KidsCo (lol sonic underground so old)
[QUOTE=C0linSSX;33603720]reponses[/QUOTE] Gentlemen, [i]this[/i] is how you discuss MLP on facepunch.
[quote]Honestly I haven't noticed any overuse of stock sounds, just what you'd hear on any other Flash animated kid's cartoon. The most distinct one I can think of is that *squee* sound.[/quote] Cat noise effects, noise effects for when rainbow dash crashes, and yes that rubber duck squeak noise(by the way, I want that sound clip if anyone has it, it's pretty funny actually). That's three things I can name right off the top of my head [quote]The overly cute nature of the show and the voice acting is one of the hardest things to get over, I'll agree. Compare the voice acting in this to other children's cartoons, though (especially other shows on the Hub). In many cases the voices are equally or even more grating than the ones in MLP, and on top of that the quality of the acting itself is lower due to cheesy dialogue and/or shitty acting. [b]This could just be the fandom reality distortion field talking[/b], but I really don't see how the voices are any worse than those in other similar shows.[/quote] Indeed it is the distortion field talking. It is blatantly obvious that Luna and Rarity are voiced by the same person, because she's very bad at masking her voice. Applejack and Rainbow Dash are also noticably the same person, but it's only at some select moments and it's not bad, but it's not Jim Cummings quality voice masking. [quote]That would be Hasbro's interference, the show may be produced by a good team but the final say on every decision always goes to the large corporation on top. [/quote] I can't tell if you're admitting it or not but yes the show is controlled by Hasbro and is in fact a 22 minute glorified toy commercial. So the main point is to maximize profits. This was achieved by having as few voice actors and actresses as possible, and using Flash based animation with an 8 bit color scheme(3 red, 3 green, 2 blue) which is poor to say the least. You also get the standard low quality flash animation detail and although it might be argued that can be attributed to flash itself, nobody forced Hasbro to use flash. [quote]By music I assume you mean the musical numbers and not the BGM. I feel that the songs are good in the context of the episodes despite their undeniable cheesiness, but given that you don't watch the show your feelings are understandable.[/quote] No not really. They're sort of just thrown in, and in the latest episode I just gave up and fucking skipped it, they're just sort of tacked on. It's reminiscent of Quest for Camelot where the songs were added in AFTER the main part was produced, and I wouldn't be shocked if it was the same situation here. Also they serve as a great way to extend the show by 5 minutes so the writers can condense it. Wouldn't want those dumb children to have to absorb anything, lets just make it generic stories with stereotypical characters for 22 minutes and we can sell our toys. [quote]Out of curiosity, how much of the show have you actually seen?[/quote] Every one including the one from Saturday. Emily Westmaas, a friend of mine, is a fan of the show. Always asks me to watch it over skype.
Well we may have derailed the thread but at least we increased the quality of the debate! [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=froztshock;33603437]But I have to ask: Am I the only one who absolutely hated the fuck out of Johnny Bravo? Just about everything else was good though.[/QUOTE] I don't remember much but I didn't like it either. [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=sa2fan;33603789]Of of all the points asteroidrules gave, I think kids couldn't give a damn about music, voice acting, animation.[/QUOTE] I'll accept the last two but I've got to disagree on music, I very much cared about the music I heard in the background of stuff when I was a kid. [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=C0linSSX;33603720]I honestly can't tell what you're trying to say here, but it seems like you're remaining neutral so nothing needs to be said. [/QUOTE] I'm saying that he may have a point on the overall quality of the non facial animation but I do think they were going for exactly what rubberfruit does with his faceposing: the dialogue doesn't matter as much as the random expressions they can put on while they say it. However I do admit that's funny in its own way. [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=garrynohome;33604732]I can't tell if you're admitting it or not but yes the show is controlled by Hasbro and is in fact a 22 minute glorified toy commercial. So the main point is to maximize profits. This was achieved by having as few voice actors and actresses as possible, and using Flash based animation with an 8 bit color scheme(3 red, 3 green, 2 blue) which is poor to say the least. You also get the standard low quality flash animation detail and although it might be argued that can be attributed to flash itself, nobody forced Hasbro to use flash.[/QUOTE] Exactly. If the "show" is going to actually going to be more than a 30 second commercial then the quality should be better than that of a cheap toy commercial, not just the length. [editline]6th December 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=garrynohome;33604732]Cat noise effects, noise effects for when rainbow dash crashes, and yes that rubber duck squeak noise(by the way, I want that sound clip if anyone has it, it's pretty funny actually).[/QUOTE] Yeah I like that rubber duck effect to, although it got me raging when it was used in the gmod idiot box (every brony who watched it thought mlp invented that sound and accused dasbo of going brony).
I think a lot of it owes to how unmemorable the new cartoons are. Nothing you see in today's shows really affects you to the point where you can't help but remember or change your view on something. Pretty much anyone who grew up watching cartoons in the 90's would be familiar with the phrase "omelette du fromage" as more than just a French phrase. Cartoons don't do stuff like this anymore (It won awards if I remember correctly; and I can only find the Italian version on youtube): [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFHRFTy7pgI[/media]
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