• Age of consent should be lowered.
    608 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Lamar;28531606]The age of consent should be lowered in America. It is abnormally high and there are too many people wasting away in prison for having consensual sex acts with 14 year olds. In nations that are much more physically and mentally healthy than the USA (such as Spain, where the age of consent is thirteen) it is not uncommon to see middle aged men dating thirteen year olds. There is no rational basis for these ridiculous modern laws. We have made many of our Founding Fathers "child molesters" with their passage. Thankfully the laws are going to be smashed in the coming economic collapse. What is your take? Lowered age of consent for better or for worse? I should remind you that our abnormally high age of consent ages are modern and uncommon phenomena. [b]read this to be more informed[/b] [url]http://mirror.wikileaks.info/wiki/An...to_child_porn/[/url][/QUOTE] bad idea
[QUOTE=Detective P;28533517]:words:[/QUOTE] The problem with your argument is that we're not discussing 14-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds (well, not all of us are). OP is obviously trying to make it so that 30-year-olds (or whatever age he is) can fuck 14-year-olds. In most states 14-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds holds no legal punishments, though it is frowned upon. The problem is that 30-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds holds all sorts of problems, both practical and moral. Read through the thread and then come back here.
[QUOTE=Sanius;28533938]No, let's not. You're putting words into his mouth in the dumbest way possible.[/QUOTE] I wouldn't necessarily call it putting words in his mouth, more like applying his logic in a different way. Still, just because a large group of people want something doesn't mean it should be legalized.
[QUOTE=Xenomoose;28533958]The problem with your argument is that we're not discussing 14-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds (well, not all of us are). OP is obviously trying to make it so that 30-year-olds (or whatever age he is) can fuck 14-year-olds. In most states 14-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds holds no legal punishments, though it is frowned upon. The problem is that 30-year-olds fucking 14-year-olds holds all sorts of problems, both practical and moral. Read through the thread and then come back here.[/QUOTE] Well, firstly, we are, simply by bringing into account age of consent. Age of consent in America doesn't even relate to sexual intercourse of minors and adults- it's still illegal if the adult and the minor are the age gap above the age of victim. Age of consent is specifically for consenting minors. But even putting that aside, again, it comes down to the fact that many 14 year olds are indeed mature enough to make decisions like this, but many are not- this still is an issue of limiting the rights of all based on actions of some. [QUOTE=Feuvert;28533782]It's more of a preventive law than an active one. It's also one big debate as to know if a 14 years old can actually give consent or not, because the AoC is exactly about this. You bring fair points, but I still think any 14 years old can't take their own decisions for themselves. They're not considered adults either. I also know 14 years old that are very childish and makes stupid decisions that endangers their lives. Every person can make a decision for themselves. The only difference is that someone older with more experience can probably make better ones than teenagers with sexual urges. Please note that I am an atheist, and that religion has nothing to do with my points.[/QUOTE] There's not much difference between 16 and 14 as far as maturity goes. I understand that the line must be drawn somewhere, but this happens anyhow, and in all honesty the only harm done is due to ignorance that can easily be eliminated with proper education, which is easily done at the parental level if not even the school level. Also, taking into the fact that sex with 14 year olds happens consensually already, regardless of the laws, quite frequently. The law hardly prevents as much as it harms individuals who have consensual relations. [QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28533817]I'm sorry, I fail to see how vacuuming your house is comparable to under-age sex. Also, juding by that last sentence, stoning should be legalized too. Fine. Just because a majority does it doesn't mean it's right.[/QUOTE] The point was to counter your statement about how I was stating that this is a limitation of a natural liberty on the basis that most people consider it inherently wrong simply because of cultural stigma. But since you simply didn't understand the original statement or the explanation, I'm not going to explain it again.
I'm just going to leave this here, [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Protection_Clause[/url] [url]http://www.religioustolerance.org/chil_int.htm[/url] Arguing with the lot of you at this moment is futile, do your own research, only you can enlighten yourself. Also I had to take a break, I nearly burst a kidney while laughing at the vacuum analogy.
[QUOTE=Lamar;28532930]Tired of the prudish and puritanical nature of the US. I'm not even a pedo like everyone is suggesting, I'm just tired of this old-fashioned thinking in every facet of American life. I started with this.[/QUOTE] hey look i'm totally with you i hate old-fashioned thinking as well but removing laws that ultimately protect childeren from abuse is not the right way
[QUOTE=Lamar;28534172]I'm just going to leave this here, [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Protection_Clause[/url] [url]http://www.religioustolerance.org/chil_int.htm[/url] Arguing with the lot of you at this moment is futile, do your own research, only you can enlighten yourself. Also I had to take a break, I nearly burst a kidney while laughing at the vacuum analogy.[/QUOTE] Arguing with US is futile? You're the one dodging questions and confrontations like a motherfucker, not us! And what the fuck does the first link have to do with this discussion? Oh right, it gives you an incredibly vague excuse to fuck children.
[QUOTE=thisispain;28534189]hey look i'm totally with you i hate old-fashioned thinking as well but removing laws that ultimately protect childeren from abuse is not the right way[/QUOTE] I'm for protecting children from abuse, but removing their freedoms at the same time is unacceptable. It just stinks of the patriot act.
A few days ago two people from my class (sophmores/15-16) decided to have sex in the library Guy was expelled, no one knows about the girl. Oh and our library is puny, almost nowhere to hide, really. Do we know what sex is? Yes. Do we know how to have sex? Yes. Are all of us smart enough to actually handle it? Fuck. No. Detective P, you asked "why not?" Its because even though there are some teenagers who can handle sex at 14, there are a lot who can't. Too many who can't to repeal the law. I once dated a girl who's parents conceived her when they were 18 and 19, and I doubt they planned for it because they don't even have custody anymore. She has problems. I don't see why anyone would advocate allowing even younger people to risk having a child and either screwing up their own life and/or the child's.
[QUOTE=BigOwl;28531770]No. :v: People are doing more and more drugs, shouldn't heroine be legalized to accommodate this?[/QUOTE] you're comparing sex to heroine?
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[QUOTE=Lamar;28534172] Arguing with the lot of you at this moment is futile, do your own research, only you can enlighten yourself. Also I had to take a break, I nearly burst a kidney while laughing at the vacuum analogy.[/QUOTE] Don't take offense, I'm not calling you a pedophile or some demon spawn... But you really have been avoiding counter arguments, dude.
[QUOTE=Azaer;28534217]Are all of us smart enough to actually handle it? Fuck. No. [/QUOTE] What the fuck is up with this thinking? Sex is sex. If feels good and is healthy and natural. All of this bullshit about it being emotionally scarring unless you're 16, 18, or some arbitrary age is complete bullshit and a relic of Christian thinking.
[QUOTE=Azaer;28534256]Don't take offense, I'm not calling you a pedophile or some demon spawn... But you really have been avoiding counter arguments, dude.[/QUOTE] Why should I address them when they're unsubstantiated or ad homs? [QUOTE=Sanius;28534282]What the fuck is up with this thinking? Sex is sex. If feels good and is healthy and natural. All of this bullshit about it being emotionally scarring unless you're 16, 18, or some arbitrary age is complete bullshit and a relic of Christian thinking.[/QUOTE] sex is the most simple activity in the whole world, I don't see how some people here are even trying to bring in the responsibility aspect into it. Fuck, it's human nature.
[QUOTE=Lamar;28534210]I'm for protecting children from abuse, but removing their freedoms at the same time is unacceptable. It just stinks of the patriot act.[/QUOTE] the issue is that childeren are easily fooled and coerced most child abuse actually comes from family members and the victim never ever consents because the victim doesn't even really know what is going on i understand where you are coming from, and i dare say your heart is in the right place but ultimately the facts simply disagree with you
[QUOTE=Da Jester;28531913]You see, we as [I]the tyrannical majority[/I] see pedophilia as, immoral. Even if it's consensual it's still wrong, it could be traumatic for a thirteen year old to have sex with a thirty year old man, that's like one of your teachers coming onto you.[/QUOTE] :eng101:
[QUOTE=Lamar;28534292]Why should I address them when they're unsubstantiated or ad homs?[/QUOTE] Why are you not addressing valid questions that aren't unsubstantial and ad hom?
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28534322]Why are you not addressing valid questions that aren't unsubstantial and ad hom?[/QUOTE] Japan, Spain, South Korea, etc
Well a 17 year old should not go to jail for being with a 17 year old.
[QUOTE=Sanius;28534282]What the fuck is up with this thinking? Sex is sex. If feels good and is healthy and natural. All of this bullshit about it being emotionally scarring unless you're 16, 18, or some arbitrary age is complete bullshit and a relic of Christian thinking.[/QUOTE] Well, I wouldn't look at it only emotionally, but also on the physical side and the cons of it. We all know the pros of fucking hoes, but a lot of people forget the super armor called condom. [editline]10th March 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Lamar;28534352]Japan, Spain, South Korea, etc[/QUOTE] Quote my arguments on page 4, and reply to all of them with a valid answer, and I will join your side.
Hey guys, lets legalize murder! What's that? There are problems with that? But I want to kill somebody! OP, you're avoiding the point of your own thread. You ignore every argument about it. I know a 14 year old, he is in a few honors classes, and is one of the biggest idiots that I know. He is very strict about 'abstinence', yet has received three blowjobs from some freshman sluts. Point is, he doesn't even understand the point of sex, or the risks involved. I would not want that to be legal in any part of the world. You can't trust kids with this stuff.
[QUOTE=Lamar;28534352]Japan, Spain, South Korea, etc[/QUOTE] Actually, scratch that one. You haven't answered a question I think you should: [QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28532939]I'm okay with you avoiding other questions like a champ, but at least answer me this, straight up: What age do you think the AoC SHOULD be lowered to?[/QUOTE]
Ya no. Not going to happen. If what you are saying is true, Spain is fucked up beyond belief.
'round here, age of consent is 16, with there being a tolerance of 3 years (IE, 18 year old cannot go below a 15)
[QUOTE=ManningQB18;28534409]Hey guys, lets legal murder! What's that? There are problems with that? But I want to kill somebody! [/QUOTE] How do you idiots who compare sex with murder sleep at night? Do you live in a bubble?
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28534411]Actually, scratch that one. You haven't answered a question I think you should:[/QUOTE] Lower than it is at the moment. For a specific age an unbiased NGO should conduct studies as to what an appropriate age should be. Age shouldn't be based off puritanical values, but science, and we all know children are hitting puberty at an ever increasing rate.
This analogy is less silly than the vacuum, and alot more drastic, but I'm trying to explain my point. You have the ability of free thought at the age of 13. Everyone does. You can think for yourself, and speak for yourself. You have opinions, and you know how to say them. At some point in your life, you have likely slandered, libeled, or verbally assaulted someone. The majority has. Infact, some people's speech has made some people go crazy, caused emotional distress, and has caused people to contemplate and carry out suicide. It's obvious that many people can not handle free speech, because of this. So let's ban free speech for everyone because the majority can't use it right, up until a certain age, of course, which has no direct correlation to maturity and ability to use free speech rationally, and then it's ok, as long as you only speak freely with people of that age or older. Disregard the fact that many people use free speech for good, and that people use it irresponsibly for bad even past the age of free speech, and that everyone speaks freely anyhow, and that the majority of those charged with the free speech protection laws have been speaking freely and responsibly with others of their own age group. Because some can not use it safely and maturely, and we refuse to educate on how to use it so, we decide that speech should be outright illegal for those under the age of 16, and illegal to speak freely between adults and minors.
[QUOTE=Sanius;28534282]What the fuck is up with this thinking? Sex is sex. If feels good and is healthy and natural. All of this bullshit about it being emotionally scarring unless you're 16, 18, or some arbitrary age is complete [B]bullshit and a relic of Christian thinking.[/B][/QUOTE] Ok, this is a shot at everyone who bangs on Christians like this (I'm not one, but my best friends are and holy shit do you people piss me off) Whoever is the majority persecutes. The pagans did it to Christians, but the moment the Christians came to power suddenly pagans were being chased through the streets. This is what you guys do on FP, if it is in any way from religion its complete bullshit. Guess what: many things Christians teach are right on the money. Modern virtues exist because they were first taught in mosques, churches and other such places of worship. OKay, *end rant* And to you actual argument: I already laid out two examples of people doing because its natural and good, but being stupid about it. If you just have sex because it brings euphoria and is natural, there is the problem. You aren't taking the actual risks first. Do I support abstinence? Hell no. I'm just saying that having sex when you aren't even an independent individual is not the best idea. If you have a child, great job you may have just fucked his/her life and possibly your own, and if you don't have the patience to wait a few years then you aren't mature enough for it, anyways. Tl:dr-- Risk>Reward IMO.
[QUOTE=Lamar;28534292]Why should I address them when they're unsubstantiated or ad homs? sex is the most simple activity in the whole world, I don't see how some people here are even trying to bring in the responsibility aspect into it. Fuck, it's human nature.[/QUOTE] No, I think eating is the most simple activity. It's also a human nature that's killing a lot of people due to abuse of it, or the lack of it. Some people doesn't know where to draw the line in food eating. We could compare it to sex. Some people can't draw the safe line in it, and I'm pretty sure a 14 years old cannot. And also, to answer to your bullshit 'Other countries has lower Age of consent'. If a country legalize slavery, should all the other countries follow? This is a world with different ethical values. America and Canada knows that having sex with kids isn't something right. Other countries can set the line wherever they want, that doesn't mean they're [b]EXEMPLES.[/b]
[QUOTE=Sanius;28534429]How do you idiots who compare sex with murder sleep at night? Do you live in a bubble?[/QUOTE] I actually wasn't comparing it like that. I was using murder as an example of something that is very wrong, and how OP is avoiding all reasons against his cause. It was an analogy to explain the futility of the argument.
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