How do you get someone to stop trying to convince you to get a Mac?
88 replies, posted
[QUOTE=.Lain;43997158]any argument someone often tries to give me for not buying a mac is often horse shit[/QUOTE]
stupid price
everything is soldered together
lack of driver support, at least until recently
[B]explorer is miles better than finder[/B]
DirectX isn't dead yet, although still dying.
سمَـَّوُوُحخ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ امارتيخ ̷̴̐خ
There's more, but can't recall atm.
Tell him he should buy it if he wants you to get one so bad, that should shut him up. Worst thing that happens is you get a free Mac.
[QUOTE=willtheoct;44008712]stupid price
everything is soldered together
lack of driver support, at least until recently
[B]explorer is miles better than finder[/B]
DirectX isn't dead yet, although still dying.
سمَـَّوُوُحخ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ ̷̴̐خ امارتيخ ̷̴̐خ
There's more, but can't recall atm.[/QUOTE]
The price is down to compact size and quality of the display and chassis. My Y500 cost $1100 or so, a bit more than half as much as the MacBook Pro I wanted. It's also twice as heavy, twice as thick, and twice as flimsy. Try finding a metal-chassis laptop that's the same size and as powerful as a MacBook Air or Pro and is also significantly cheaper. There are a handfull of ultrabooks that can match or slightly exceed the Air or 13" Pro, but almost nothing that can even come close to the power and size of a MacBook Pro 15".
A lot of windows laptops now have soldered-on parts. Very few in the same weight and size class as MacBooks aren't. All the Mac desktop systems can have their RAM and storage upgraded. The Mac Pros can have their GPUs upgraded, and all Macs now can have external GPU's through thunderbolt if you really need more power.
What lack of driver support? All the hardware that comes with Macs has always worked with Macs. Unless you mean in boot camp, in which case you're absolutely right and Apple have been less than stellar with supporting Mac hardware in Windows.
I'd argue against the explorer being better thing. I find Finder to run smoother and I've only ever had it freeze once, where Explorer has crashed on me multiple times on multiple computers for very little apparent reason.
DirectX is a development level problem. If game companies had developed for OpenGL in the first place, then it wouldn't even be relevant. As it is, many games now have an OpenGL rendering mode. Once game companies cease developing for DirectX, it will cease to be relevant.
Sorry, Google Translate is giving me nothing on the Arabic, so I can't really comment on it. Unless you're trying to say that OS X can't display it, which is incorrect. If you have the font packs installed (Comes with all new Macs and is optional when upgrading OS X), it displays it fine.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]The price is down to compact size and quality of the display and chassis. My Y500 cost $1100 or so, a bit more than half as much as the MacBook Pro I wanted. It's also twice as heavy, twice as thick, and twice as flimsy. Try finding a metal-chassis laptop that's the same size and as powerful as a MacBook Air or Pro and is also significantly cheaper. There are a handfull of ultrabooks that can match or slightly exceed the Air or 13" Pro, but almost nothing that can even come close to the power and size of a MacBook Pro 15".
A lot of windows laptops now have soldered-on parts. Very few in the same weight and size class as MacBooks aren't. All the Mac desktop systems can have their RAM and storage upgraded. The Mac Pros can have their GPUs upgraded, and all Macs now can have external GPU's through thunderbolt if you really need more power.
What lack of driver support? All the hardware that comes with Macs has always worked with Macs. Unless you mean in boot camp, in which case you're absolutely right and Apple have been less than stellar with supporting Mac hardware in Windows.
I'd argue against the explorer being better thing. I find Finder to run smoother and I've only ever had it freeze once, where Explorer has crashed on me multiple times on multiple computers for very little apparent reason.
DirectX is a development level problem. If game companies had developed for OpenGL in the first place, then it wouldn't even be relevant. As it is, many games now have an OpenGL rendering mode. Once game companies cease developing for DirectX, it will cease to be relevant.
Sorry, Google Translate is giving me nothing on the Arabic, so I can't really comment on it. Unless you're trying to say that OS X can't display it, which is incorrect. If you have the font packs installed (Comes with all new Macs and is optional when upgrading OS X), it displays it fine.[/QUOTE]
that's the arabic that crashed osx
lel
[QUOTE=Mysterious Mr.E;43999235]We use imacs in my graphic com class. Worst shit ever. Takes forever to get things to work. Applications crash constantly. And it should not take 5 mins to save a fucking word or photoshop document for a $2000 computer.[/QUOTE]
they probably aren't recent/clogged up with shit from multiple users
[editline]23rd February 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=willtheoct;44008712]
[B]explorer is miles better than finder[/B]
[/QUOTE]
tabs lol
[editline]23rd February 2014[/editline]
literally a feature most linux file managers even have
[editline]23rd February 2014[/editline]
also trek you make a good point, almost all ultrabooks/netbooks as thin as a macbook pro or air are unserviceable to the same degree. apple still sells the macbook pro classic, if you want upgradability
not as if mass consumers give the next shit about upgradability, because they don't
Just get a mac.
And then install gentoo on it.
Whenever he brings up MAC, just convince him to install GENTOO.
Take a large portion of his/her budget.
Macs are aight.
I enjoy mine, but it's not worth the money at all. Definitely wish I had a PC at certain times, but whatever.
Just keep telling him to fuck off and he'll get the point eventually.
Build a Hackintosh and show them this PC feature called right click.
[QUOTE=willtheoct;44008712]
[B]explorer is miles better than finder[/B]
[/QUOTE]
Now we know you're not being serious.
I'm reminded of [URL="http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=macs_cant"]this.[/URL]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2dBfIwt__w[/media]
No but seriously, Macs aren't very good for some games. It just doesn't work.
Play games he can never play while whistling the Windows start-up sounds.
Piss in his drinks
[QUOTE=Stonecycle;44018320]Now we know you're not being serious.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=.Lain;44012519]
tabs lol
[/QUOTE]
Explorer != Internet explorer
And to be quite honest, if I didn't have access to windows 7 and linux distros, I would probably switch to a mac. win8 is far worse than any OS I've ever used.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]The price is down to compact size and quality of the display and chassis. My Y500 cost $1100 or so, a bit more than half as much as the MacBook Pro I wanted. It's also twice as heavy, twice as thick, and twice as flimsy. Try finding a metal-chassis laptop that's the same size and as powerful as a MacBook Air or Pro and is also significantly cheaper. There are a handfull of ultrabooks that can match or slightly exceed the Air or 13" Pro, but almost nothing that can even come close to the power and size of a MacBook Pro 15".
[/QUOTE]
I can't imagine why someone would care how heavy their laptop is.
But your Y500 is not only half as expensive, it is also more powerful than the <$2200 laptop you were looking at. For comparison, lets use the $2050 [URL="http://store.apple.com/ca/buy-mac/macbook-pro?product=ME293LL/A&step=config"]Macbook Pro.[/URL]
CPU: yours has dynamic clocking up to 3.4GHz, theirs goes up to 3.2. Apple does not mention the model of CPU, merely two of three important specs, but we can assume the same cache.
RAM: identical
GPU: I have no idea what GPU is included in the mac, either it uses an integrated GPU, or apple's website is useless. Wait no, after clicking "add to cart" I found it has an integrated GPU. you have the GT 750m. Clear winner.
HDD/SSD: yours comes with a 1TB HDD with a 16GB SSD. Theirs has a 256GB SSD. Not a numerical comparison, but in general the Y500 has a better setup.
DVD reader: yours is internal, theirs comes with an external one to make the laptop thinner.
Display: Yours is 1920x1080. Theirs is "Retina", a largely used and well known empirical standard of measurement. both screens are 15'', and I think the apple display is also 1080p.
Keyboard: Both are backlit, and keyboards.
Battery: Yours has an OK battery. Theirs is not advertised to have a battery.
wow, yours also costs $950 less, cool huh?
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]A lot of windows laptops now have soldered-on parts.[/QUOTE]
I would really like a citation, link, or source, or something on this.
And a reminder: soldered-on devices do NOT have better durability, soldering is NOT cheaper than not soldering, and there is NO good reason to solder a device other than make it un-upgradable, un-repairable, and environmentally unfriendly.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392] Very few in the same weight and size class as MacBooks aren't. All the Mac desktop systems can have their RAM and storage upgraded. The Mac Pros can have their GPUs upgraded, and all Macs now can have external GPU's through thunderbolt if you really need more power.
[/QUOTE]
Not only do you need to pay more for the base model, but you need to get an external GPU too? cool. Well, at least my laptop can play games without needing to be plugged into an external device. Not that that's ever useful, it only comes in handy on the bus or when you have time to play but need to pack up in a hurry.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]
What lack of driver support? All the hardware that comes with Macs has always worked with Macs. Unless you mean in boot camp, in which case you're absolutely right and Apple have been less than stellar with supporting Mac hardware in Windows.
[/QUOTE]
You answered your own question, but I can extend that further: Hackintosh. If someone doesn't want to pay $1000 more than they have to for inferior hardware, but wants access to OS X, they will build a hackintosh. When they do, they need to make sure OS X is compatible with their hardware, a task that is incredibly rare on EVERY other operating system.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]
I'd argue against the explorer being better thing. I find Finder to run smoother and I've only ever had it freeze once, where Explorer has crashed on me multiple times on multiple computers for very little apparent reason.
[/QUOTE]
Everything from right click>rename to not using pictographs for buttons to displaying folders in their correct order makes explorer better. Finder does a couple of things right though, so I'll leave that one to opinion.
I'd also like to take the opportunity and point out that by default, OS X scrolls backwards.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]
DirectX is a development level problem. If game companies had developed for OpenGL in the first place, then it wouldn't even be relevant. As it is, many games now have an OpenGL rendering mode. Once game companies cease developing for DirectX, it will cease to be relevant.
[/QUOTE]
Yes.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44012392]
Sorry, Google Translate is giving me nothing on the Arabic, so I can't really comment on it. Unless you're trying to say that OS X can't display it, which is incorrect. If you have the font packs installed (Comes with all new Macs and is optional when upgrading OS X), it displays it fine.[/QUOTE]
[URL="https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1302653"]It isn't relevant anymore, but I had loads of fun when this was discovered.[/URL]
[QUOTE=willtheoct;44025409]Explorer != Internet explorer
...
Everything from right click>rename to not using pictographs for buttons to displaying folders in their correct order makes explorer better. Finder does a couple of things right though, so I'll leave that one to opinion.
I'd also like to take the opportunity and point out that by default, OS X scrolls backwards.[/QUOTE]
But Explorer (which I meant the file browser to begin with) doesn't have tabs, you can't hold Alt and drag to move it, Alt and right-click-drag to resize it, and the filesystem uses some hillbilly-level backwards things, like backslash (easier to accidentally press enter or backspace) and [i]requires defragmenting[/i]. Can't even browse accurately, where as in Nautilus (common file browser on Linux), there's a slight gear button (or hamburger depending on your icon theme) to take care of more advanced things like bookmarking. Others will also point and laugh at me for not using Nemo, another file browser.
The other day I had to use Explorer on Win7 and holy crap why was it so impossible to actually get places? Had to open two windows to move files across vast directories. The context (right-click) menu also doesn't place new document/folder items in an obscure place. Explorer loses in a double checkmate. But I haven't used Finder, so don't ask me anything about it.
If you want to hate against Macintosh the operating system and not the laptop, just know it's really a fancy pansy [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_%28kernel%29]BSD[/url].
[QUOTE=Stonecycle;44025528] it's really an [B]overpriced, locked down[/B] [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_%28kernel%29]BSD[/url].[/QUOTE]
ftfy
The comparisons going on are OS X vs windows, and by extension, apple hardware vs other vendors' hardware. I haven't had enough experience with linux to compare, mostly because I have no idea how to get drivers for the gt630m, but if I was able to install them, I probably wouldn't be using windows.
Allow me to correct your head to head comparison here with some facts from the rather easy to find [url]http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs-retina/[/url]
[QUOTE=willtheoct;44025409]I can't imagine why someone would care how heavy their laptop is.
But your Y500 is not only half as expensive, it is also more powerful than the <$2200 laptop you were looking at. For comparison, lets use the $2050 [URL="http://store.apple.com/ca/buy-mac/macbook-pro?product=ME293LL/A&step=config"]Macbook Pro.[/URL]
CPU: yours has dynamic clocking up to 3.4GHz, theirs goes up to 3.2. Apple does not mention the model of CPU, merely two of three important specs, but we can assume the same cache.
RAM: identical
GPU: I have no idea what GPU is included in the mac, either it uses an integrated GPU, or apple's website is useless. Wait no, after clicking "add to cart" I found it has an integrated GPU. you have the GT 750m. Clear winner.
HDD/SSD: yours comes with a 1TB HDD with a 16GB SSD. Theirs has a 256GB SSD. Not a numerical comparison, but in general the Y500 has a better setup.
DVD reader: yours is internal, theirs comes with an external one to make the laptop thinner.
Display: Yours is 1920x1080. Theirs is "Retina", a largely used and well known empirical standard of measurement. both screens are 15'', and I think the apple display is also 1080p.
Keyboard: Both are backlit, and keyboards.
Battery: Yours has an OK battery. Theirs is not advertised to have a battery.
wow, yours also costs $950 less, cool huh?[/quote]
Why would someone care how heavy their laptop is? Because if you ever want to carry it anywhere, with a 7 pound carry weight(more with the upgraded power brick), it's a huge fucking pain to carry this thing around.
GPU: The Y500 has a GT 750m. The MacBook Pro has a GT 750m. However, the MBP also has Iris Pro graphics as well. Iris Pro graphics are a hair under a GT 750m, IIRC. The MacBook Pro scores a big victory here because its dedicated graphics card is exactly the same as the Y500's, however it also has integrated graphics, which the Y500 lacks. Not only that, but the integrated graphics are actually very good, letting it game while unplugged and saving large amounts of battery versus the Y500.
CPU: The Y500 has an Ivy Bridge processor, the MBP has a Haswell processor. The Y500 can clock slightly higher, but the MBP has vastly better power management. Since this is a laptop which should be able to be used away from power, the MBP scores another victory here.
Storage: The Y500 has its 1tb spinning drive with a 16GB cache SSD. The cache just plain isn't big enough to be properly useful. It can't cache the whole OS as well as commonly used programs. It's got a mechanical hard drive, a 5400 rpm one at that, and it feels like one. The MacBook Pro has an SSD, which lets it feel far faster. However, 256gb just isn't enough for a primary computer. To get a reasonable amount of storage, 512gb, you need to upgrade it for $300, which is an absurd price. In this case, I'd honestly declare it a tie. You're stuck between not enough storage, or storage that's so slow it hurts.
Optical drive: You've actually given Apple more credit than it deserves, here. The MBP doesn't come with an external drive, that's a separate purchase, an expensive one at that if you go for an Apple one. Fortunately you don't have to, but it's still $30 or so for an aftermarket one. Optical drives are one of those things whose usefulness varies from person to person. I would have been perfectly happy if I didn't have one, but I do. The Y500 comes with one, so it gets the win.
Display: The Y500 has a 1080p display with average color and brightness, and slightly below average viewing angles. The Retina MacBook Pro has a 2880x1800 display with excellent color, contrast, and a viewing angles. The MacBook Pro is the clear winner and by a massive margin, too. Minor note: The MBP has a 16:10 display, versus 16:9 for the Y500. I prefer 16:10, but it's almost impossible to get that aspect ratio on a non-business Windows laptop.
Keyboard: The Y500 has a dedicated number pad. The MacBook Pro does not. Typing feel is a personal preference. I prefer the MBP's, some people could prefer the Y500. The backlighting on the MBP is white, the Y500's is red. Also personal preference. Y500 wins because of its number pad.
Battery: This is a fucking joke. The Y500 has at most 3 hours of extremely careful usage. I'm talking display brightness at minimum, all possible tasks closed, everything but wifi turned off. The MacBook Pro can chug along for 8 hours of web browsing with display at half brightness. Crushing winner: MBP.
One thing you forgot to mention is physical dimensions. The MacBook Pro is leaps and bounds ahead. It's stronger, yet smaller in every dimension and weighs about 2.5 pounds less. That makes a huge difference when you have to haul your computer around every day. Obvious winner: MBP.
The MBP has some smaller features that it beats out the Lenovo on, like a much better webcam and an ambient light sensor for the keyboard/screen. The Y500 has significantly better speakers, however. Personally I'd prefer the speakers over the ambient light sensor and webcam.
The Y500 might have cost much less (closer to $800 less at MSRP), but it's also much less of a computer. It comes down to if you're willing to spend the price difference for the increase in quality and features. Many people are, many people aren't.
[quote]I would really like a citation, link, or source, or something on this.
And a reminder: soldered-on devices do NOT have better durability, soldering is NOT cheaper than not soldering, and there is NO good reason to solder a device other than make it un-upgradable, un-repairable, and un-recyclable.[/quote]
I can't give you an exact global link that says "Many windows laptops have soldered parts," However I have found about 5 Ultrabooks, which are the laptop class the MacBook Pro is competing in, that have non-soldered RAM. Generally, these fall into two groups: Ultra-high end ones that are in the price range of an MBP, or bottom-end ones that barely match the Ultrabook category.
[quote]Not only do you need to pay more for the base model, but you need to get an external GPU too? cool. Well, at least my laptop can play games without needing to be plugged into an external device. Not that that's ever useful, it only comes in handy on the bus or when you have time to play but need to pack up in a hurry.[/quote]
This was written under the impression that the MacBook Pro doesn't have a dedicated GPU, but the point I was making was that any Mac can accept an eGPU to give it more life in the future. The MacBook Pro is a capable gaming machine without one, with its GT 750m and Iris Pro iGPU, and even the 13" one with its non-pro Iris integrated graphics can compete.
[quote]You answered your own question, but I can extend that further: Hackintosh. If someone doesn't want to pay $1000 more than they have to for inferior hardware, but wants access to OS X, they will build a hackintosh. When they do, they need to make sure OS X is compatible with their hardware, a task that is incredibly rare on EVERY other operating system.[/quote]
How is this Apple's problem? Saying that Hackintosh specific problems are something wrong with the OS is like saying that a car is poorly designed because it can't be easily forced to accept an engine swap from a different manufacturer. They explicitly forbid making a Hackintosh, so I don't see why they should be forced to consider the people who are doing it.
[quote]Everything from right click>rename to not using pictographs for buttons to displaying folders in their correct order makes explorer better. Finder does a couple of things right though, so I'll leave that one to opinion.
I'd also like to take the opportunity and point out that by default, OS X scrolls backwards.[/quote]
Right Click > Rename is replaced by pressing Enter, while opening the highlighted item is done with command+O. It's just a different set of shortcuts. If you'd started out using a Mac, like I did, you'd have found having to right click to rename to be bothersome. That's all just personal preference stuff, not anything inherently wrong with the file browser. Same thing for pictographs. They've got tooltips on them, so it's not exactly difficult to figure out which means what, and once you do it's easy as pie and they look nicer. What do you mean displaying folders in their correct order? You mean alphabetically? That's done in almost exactly the same way as Windows. Just sorting by name. I'm not sure what else you could mean by this.
The scrolling was introduced in Lion(I believe), and is there to be more familiar to people who are used to iDevices. This one I actually think is extremely annoying and I wish it had been an option to invert it, rather than being the default. In fact, I think pretty much every UI change in Lion would be better off as an option or not there at all, especially getting rid of scroll bars.
[quote][URL="https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1302653"]It isn't relevant anymore, but I had loads of fun when this was discovered.[/URL][/QUOTE]
Ah, I was unaware of this exploit. Still, system-crashing exploits aren't unique to Apple. For example a while ago, EVE Online's installer was accidentally overwriting a file called Boot.ini. Unfortunately, it would be overwriting the Windows one that was absolutely critical to being able to boot Windows, rather than the EVE Online one that was just a minor part of the update. This caused peoples' computers to become unbootable requiring an entire reinstallation of the operating system on affected machines if no backups were available. I'd argue that this is actually more serious than crashing a web browser.
I'm not trying to argue that one operating system or manufacturer is better. Lenovo makes some pretty nice high-end systems, and Windows 8.1 is an excellent operating system once you overcome its usage quirks. What I am arguing, is that it's almost impossible to get a laptop that's as good as a MBP in every way without spending as much or nearly as much as one. It's easy to get a laptop that's as powerful or more powerful, sure. But it's difficult to get one that's as good or better in all the other aspects besides raw performance.
If he keeps pissing you off, tell him to fuck off.
I like how he says "fine, got something up your ass, jeez..."
Wow what a fine example of a hypocrite.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44025884]Allow me to correct your head to head comparison here with some facts from the rather easy to find [url]http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/specs-retina/[/url]
[/QUOTE]
That link was NOT easy to find. But thanks for the link, this makes the comparison less crazily one-sided.
[QUOTE]
Why would someone care how heavy their laptop is? Because if you ever want to carry it anywhere, with a 7 pound carry weight(more with the upgraded power brick), it's a huge fucking pain to carry this thing around.
[/QUOTE]
seven pounds. 3 Kg.
really?
To be fair, my laptop is 6 pounds+toshiba power cord & bar, but I have no problem with it.
[QUOTE]
Keyboard: The Y500 has a dedicated number pad. The MacBook Pro does not.
[/QUOTE]
this, I was not aware of. I know few people use the numpad, but I would be annoyed without it.
[QUOTE]
The Y500 might have cost much less (closer to $800 less at MSRP), but it's also much less of a computer. It comes down to if you're willing to spend the price difference for the increase in quality and features. Many people are, many people aren't.
[/QUOTE]
Slow down there, we just compared a $2050 apple laptop to a $1150 lenovo. A laptop, or even "ultrabook" for $2000 could definitely blow the MBP out of the park, even with this new page of information.
[QUOTE]
I can't give you an exact global link that says "Many windows laptops have soldered parts," However I have found about 5 Ultrabooks, which are the laptop class the MacBook Pro is competing in, that have non-soldered RAM. Generally, these fall into two groups: Ultra-high end ones that are in the price range of an MBP, or bottom-end ones that barely match the Ultrabook category.
[/QUOTE]
My bad, I have no idea what makes an ultrabook vs laptop. I wasn't looking at "ultrabooks", just gaming laptops.
[QUOTE]
How is this Apple's problem? Saying that Hackintosh specific problems are something wrong with the OS is like saying that a car is poorly designed because it can't be easily forced to accept an engine swap from a different manufacturer. They explicitly forbid making a Hackintosh, so I don't see why they should be forced to consider the people who are doing it.
[/QUOTE]
Well, it isn't apple's problem. The problem is, [U]as a functional OS, it is limited to one set of hardware[/U]. The counter-argument to that seems to be "build a hackintosh to run OS X" which isn't such an easy solution.
[QUOTE]
Right Click > Rename is replaced by pressing Enter, while opening the highlighted item is done with command+O. It's just a different set of shortcuts. If you'd started out using a Mac, like I did, you'd have found having to right click to rename to be bothersome. That's all just personal preference stuff, not anything inherently wrong with the file browser. Same thing for pictographs. They've got tooltips on them, so it's not exactly difficult to figure out which means what, and once you do it's easy as pie and they look nicer. What do you mean displaying folders in their correct order? You mean alphabetically? That's done in almost exactly the same way as Windows. Just sorting by name. I'm not sure what else you could mean by this.
[/QUOTE]
the keyboard shortcut here is vastly better than the explorer shortcut(either right click>rename or alt>f>m), but at certain times I don't like using the keyboard. Not a big deal though.
But dragging and dropping into a folder in finder drags it to the folder that the whole window is looking at, and not the folder you dragged it onto. THAT is a problem.
I'm also the kind of person to "never combine" taskbar icons. If the text wasn't there, I would never remember what it does. Not many people share that opinion.
[QUOTE]
Ah, I was unaware of this exploit. Still, system-crashing exploits aren't unique to Apple. For example a while ago, EVE Online's installer was accidentally overwriting a file called Boot.ini. Unfortunately, it would be overwriting the Windows one that was absolutely critical to being able to boot Windows, rather than the EVE Online one that was just a minor part of the update. This caused peoples' computers to become unbootable requiring an entire reinstallation of the operating system on affected machines if no backups were available. I'd argue that this is actually more serious than crashing a web browser.
[/QUOTE]
I would argue that as an EVE-Online problem, and not a windows problem. But, maybe UAC would be more useful if it required more than one level of permission to access things like boot.ini.
As for the exploit: it was made known on russian apple forums in February last year. Apple did nothing about it, until August when people fed up with apple not fixing it decided to publicize it widely.
On the other hand, Microsoft fixes exploits within a week, unless the NSA tells them not to.
[QUOTE]
I'm not trying to argue that one operating system or manufacturer is better.
[/QUOTE]
That's not how I do things.[QUOTE]
Windows 8.1 is an excellent operating system once you overcome its usage quirks.
[/QUOTE]
A car without an engine is an excellent car once you can overcome the fact that it can't drive
[QUOTE]What I am arguing, is that it's almost impossible to get a laptop that's as good as a MBP in every way without spending as much or nearly as much as one. It's easy to get a laptop that's as powerful or more powerful, sure. But it's difficult to get one that's as good or better in all the other aspects besides raw performance.[/QUOTE]
Personally, raw performance is most of what matters to me, and I'm sure I'm not alone on that. But in aspects that aren't raw performance, I must say macs are far superior, with the exception of the soldering thing.
Macs are:
-Shiny
-Generally higher quality metal
-Sturdy
-Better for picking up girls
-Not "for nerds" <-- this is actually what I hear most commonly from mac users
-Sold in apple stores
-Compatible with all apple products
And once again, none of those things matter to me in a laptop.
[QUOTE=Riller;43994365]This is honestly the thing I hate the most about Mac users. Everything is an application, not a program. :v:[/QUOTE]
This is something I've always wondered about.. I've seen them called applications and programs even on very old non-mac computers. Which one is right damn-it.
Tell him to shut up, and if he keeps telling you buy one, tell him that you won't. And if he still continues tell him he should buy a Windows computer and use the exact same arguments as he does and then annoy the shit until he won't talk to you.
[editline]24th February 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;44026484]This is something I've always wondered about.. I've seen them called applications and programs even on very old non-mac computers. Which one is right damn-it.[/QUOTE]
Apps are from appstore, programs are from the web. (That's how I go when I call shit apps or programs. Usually my iPhone is apps, and my Mac is programs. Is there really a difference?)
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;44026484]This is something I've always wondered about.. I've seen them called applications and programs even on very old non-mac computers. Which one is right damn-it.[/QUOTE]
Applications is normal on all OS's. However, "App" and "Apps" can go skip into a well and drown.
[QUOTE=Aathma;44032519]Applications is normal on all OS's. However, "App" and "Apps" can go skip into a well and drown.[/QUOTE]
The only time it is acceptable to use app in relation to a computer is in regards to metro apps on Windows 8.
My sister has an '11 MBP, and over the course of those 3 years, it has slowed down to an almost HALT.
Shes decent with computers, not installing stupid, system clogging software, and just over the period she's had the computer, its gotten extremely, extremely slow. It freezes constantly and is always giving you the rainbow pinwheel. On the other hand, my dad(who is about the same computer literate as my sister) has a 4-5 year old ASUS that runs nearly as good as new, even chock full of programs.
For me, I hate using macs, they just feel awkward as hell, and seeing how my sister's comp aged, I'll never buy one. Plus I like to game, so meh :v:
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;44033335]The only time it is acceptable to use app in relation to a computer is in regards to metro apps on Windows 8.[/QUOTE]
Metro apps need to die in a hole as well.
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