• With eBooks, why is there not an "indie writer" renaissance going on?
    46 replies, posted
Background: So now is the time for college, and as such I've been looking into Textbook options, which are always lavishly expensive if you get a recent edition. Because I have recently purchased an ASUS Transformer tablet+keyboard, this thing has great ebook and emagazine support. Upon looking up etextbook versions of my books I need, I was suprised to find that the e-versions, which use no paper, have no logistics required to get them, don't require any money to pay for employees... cost just as much as the normal textbooks, or only about $10-$20 cheaper. The Point: So I breifly google-researched into the matter, which got me to this article: [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-a-stackpole/who-benefits-from-high-eb_b_522137.html[/url] Here's a writer outlining exactly what the cost breakdown for ebooks are. Pretty much, 75% or so is pure profit for the publisher, while about 10%-25% goes to the author, and said money tends to take 8 months to get to the pocket of the author. It's been commmon knowledge for a while now that Authors have always needed publishers in order to get their books out and into the world. But then the author talks about something I never even thought of... he publishes his own "ebooks", gets 75% of the cut, and sees that money at the end of the month. Whats his cost to do this? Well... its virtual, so there is none. I'm sure all of you know about the recent rise in power Indie games have had, thanks to the digital distribution age we are currently in. Indie games were always hard to get exposure back in the day because the only good way to get said exposure was to give floppy's and CD's to your friends and hope they spread the word. With the rise of XBLA and Steam, and indie-friendly services such as Humble Bundle and IndieFund, we've literally seen an explosion in great indie games, where the indie can actually make a solid living off his work, because they don't need to deal with publishers to get exposure. But why is the same not happening for ebooks? I've yet to hear of a single author self-publishing an ebook for himself, even really obscure indie channels tend to still go through a publisher somewhat. eBooks are really a popular growing medium, and more and more people are wanting content for their Kindles and their eReaders and their Tablets to read. But the only things I see going on these days are still the same old story of authors screwing themselves over by siding with publishers, who then screw over the consumer with monopoly pricing on a digital good. I'd love to read magazines and books on my TF, its very fun an enjoyable to use for this purpose. And also very helpful being how lightweight it is. The readers are feature rich, and have plenty of neat-factor to them. But.... I don't have a single purchased book or magazine on here. Because currently its a publisher controlled market, and it would be absolutely retarded for me to spend $12.99 to buy an ebook when I could have a physical copy that I could sell later or have on my bookshelf for $14.99 Where is the indie-revolution for ebooks? The market is here, the means are here, and indie developers for games have proven you can make money by self-publishing. Imagine how popular and exposed your book would be as an indie author, publishing a book in e-book only with a pay-what-you-want model. That is unprecidented, and its that kind of progressive thinking thats been really great for indie game developers, which caused that market to flourish. They say books are a dieing art, and it saddens me to see that they could easily become a popular medium to entertain again if authors were not so conservative with their publishing options. We need to see the same progressive thinking happen among authors in order to keep the book alive again (or ebook, in this case)
I keep thinking about writing a book of some sorts, but I'm not very good at writing and I'd only end up copying other stories too much. I have to agree though, in this age it's possible to buy books from an 'app store' only for books, so there should be an influx of really good, reasonably priced indie books!
I dunno about you, but I hate reading ebooks. Maybe others feel the same way :v:
In part it's due to the risks involved. Currently a publisher usually is successful in 1 out of 10 books or so they publish. From this one book they tend to pay all their authors to a certain extent. Likewise another factor to consider is marketing and the amount of producers. The indie game market is relatively small. The amount of writers and potential indie writers is absolutely giant. Much bigger competition. And publishers are very unwilling to hurt their traditional markets and retailers tend to push at them to keep certain prices. YOu see the same thing in DD of games.
Maybe one day I will be able to buy my Pokemon fanfics straight off the eBook store.
There is a lot more to the picture. A good publisher has connections to various media outlets and will be able to get a book exposure that an independent author will not get. If we consider a situation where someone wrote an excellent book, but this the author is rather unknown and inexperienced in advertisement, that book is likely going to go nowhere. In the case that the author hooks up with a publisher that recognizes the potential of the book, the publisher will do the advertisement which will in return give the author recognition. Although the author may be taking more of a cut in per book sale, they will be making more since the book will sell more. It's good to note that the author might be selling at a loss, they might have actually made more without a publisher, but that's a risk they are aware of. The publisher is also taking a risk in accepting an author that is rather unknown because they are not sure if their investment will pay off. A well respected author certainly will have leverage in their contracts because they are far less risky, but the more risky the author, the more likely you're in for a bad contract.
But you could say the same exact things about indie games too, and all you really need is some smart personal marketing a real web presense. Hell, to paraphrase what one indie game developer said at one point (forget who): "We don't need retailers" In reference to the fact that their retail sales were so abysmal compaired to their digital sales. The fact is, Publishers are a channel you go through if you need exposure on a retail front. Traditionally, this was the only way you could get a book realized. But in the digital medium, you don't need a publisher. Sure it helps to have marketing and exposure, but the thing is that marketing and exposure only works and is appealing to a very specific, but very old audience. In this day and age, you can market your product to an audence without having to have a publisher back you up. Companies like Wolfire have no publishers, and have zero exposure other than their website, blog, videos, etc all going through the proper channels to get to people who are internet savvy enough to appreciate their games. And they are some of the most progressivly sucessful indie developers on the market. Why can't it be the same way for a book? A good analgy would be Doctor Horrible's Sing Along Blog. Only ran on the internet for a week, was online only, etc. Except the small musical some actors decided to do during a slow work period exploded into internet fame to the point where you can now view it on digital-friendly channels like Netflix.
cuz video games are better
You are really misrepresenting today's audience because if this was true, the majority of books and games would be done in such a manner. Really, the whole basis of your question is "why isn't the market how I see it?". Certainly there are plenty of examples of success in which there was no publisher, but what you don't see is many of the same production of similar quality that aren't popular. This concept of what you don't see is also important in book sales as well, because although a publisher may make a huge profit on 1 out of every 10 books, they may break even on 3/10, and they may lose a bit of money on out of 6/10. These numbers are hypothetical, but it's important to realize that any business like this uses the profit of the successful to counteract the failure of the unsuccessful. It's similar in a lot of engineering and drug fields, they'll invest a lot of money into projects that are risky and are prone to fail, but they were willing to take the risk because if the investment pays off, it pays off big. It's also critical to understand that not a lot of people have the ability to market themselves. Certainly some people do, but so many people don't.
[QUOTE=KorJax;32154195]But you could say the same exact things about indie games too, and all you really need is some smart personal marketing a real web presense. Hell, to paraphrase what one indie game developer said at one point (forget who): "We don't need retailers" In reference to the fact that their retail sales were so abysmal compaired to their digital sales. The fact is, Publishers are a channel you go through if you need exposure on a retail front. Traditionally, this was the only way you could get a book realized. But in the digital medium, you don't need a publisher. Sure it helps to have marketing and exposure, but the thing is that marketing and exposure only works and is appealing to a very specific, but very old audience. In this day and age, you can market your product to an audence without having to have a publisher back you up. Companies like Wolfire have no publishers, and have zero exposure other than their website, blog, videos, etc all going through the proper channels to get to people who are internet savvy enough to appreciate their games. And they are some of the most progressivly sucessful indie developers on the market. Why can't it be the same way for a book? A good analgy would be Doctor Horrible's Sing Along Blog. Only ran on the internet for a week, was online only, etc. Except the small musical some actors decided to do during a slow work period exploded into internet fame to the point where you can now view it on digital-friendly channels like Netflix.[/QUOTE] thing is, videogames usually have teams and there's less competitions than in books. The closest to what propose has been the webcomic market as far as I know, which often profit from the fact that they are able to grab people by large amounts of free content.
probably because most independent writers don't really know how to self-publish ebooks. [editline]6th September 2011[/editline] and ebooks are still relatively new to most people so a physical presence is still desirable
Because you take a huge risk by self-publishing.
I think its because writing good content that people really want to read takes tons of effort, and that is why people don't really pick it up.
Because I have yet to launch the renaissance by uploading my epic Steam-Punk Haruhi Crossover.
my steampunk version of the bible is underway guys!!!
[QUOTE=Lazor;32155889]my steampunk version of the bible is underway guys!!![/QUOTE] That would actually be really awesome.
that's actually my friend's project but don't expect it for like 10 years because he knows he's not ready for something that ambitious yet he's a good writer tho
There is, it's just mostly confined to the tabletop roleplaying realm.
You think it'd be easier to get published if authors like Kyell Gold and Stephanie Meyer can get their crap out there.
[QUOTE=Cuon Alpinus;32157167]You think it'd be easier to get published if authors like Kyell Gold and Stephanie Meyer can get their crap out there.[/QUOTE] They write shit that appeals to their target group, and do it well. Quite few people can write 300 pages of shit and still get somebody to read it.
Why should eBooks make a huge difference? People have been writing fiction and putting it on the Internet (for free) for more than a decade. Having it in a more portable medium is nice, but the fact of the matter is that when a full-length novel by a known author is only a couple of bucks, people just aren't interested in material of lesser quality. Indie games exist because they give you less, and in turn have a lower price. Books are not priced such that a cheaper-but-inferior model can work.
Indie music and gaming have flourished because of the internet, I think it's time for lierature to have its moment of glory.
[QUOTE=dvondrake;32150396]Because nobody has an ebook, that's why.[/QUOTE] My family has 3.
This is a very good point.
There [I]is[/I] an indie write renaissance going on right now, in fact. It's called [B]tons of fucking terrible fanfiction[/B]
[QUOTE=catbarf;32163472] Indie games exist because they give you less, and in turn have a lower price.[/QUOTE] Hohoho, :deluded:
[QUOTE=Géza!;32164652]Indie games exist because they give you less, and in turn have a lower price[/QUOTE] haha sorry what I couldn't hear you over AI War and how wrong you are [editline]7th September 2011[/editline] [quote]Why should eBooks make a huge difference? People have been writing fiction and putting it on the Internet (for free) for more than a decade. Having it in a more portable medium is nice, but the fact of the matter is that when a full-length novel by a known author is only a couple of bucks, people just aren't interested in material of lesser quality.[/quote] because thanks to e-ink reading ebooks isn't an eye strain requiring you to sit at a computer
[QUOTE=Géza!;32164652]There [I]is[/I] an indie write renaissance going on right now, in fact. It's called [B]tons of fucking terrible fanfiction[/B][/QUOTE] This is what's keeping the renaissance from happening, all the would-be authors are stuck in their fantasy realms and write this shit
[QUOTE=WastedJamacan;32167536]This is what's keeping the renaissance from happening, all the would-be authors are stuck in their fantasy realms and write this shit[/QUOTE] um no those aren't the would-be authors they are just awful writers it doesn't matter what they are writing
[QUOTE=Lazor;32167582]um no those aren't the would-be authors they are just awful writers it doesn't matter what they are writing[/QUOTE] It was a joke.
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