Holy shit, scrolling this thread's filled my head with fuck from the lack of knowledge and 12 year-olds going "No chicks with dicks ty" which is completely irellevant to the topic.
We're all in a boat together, and we should all accept eachothers for what we may feel or think. Our opinions are what makes us mentally unique, however numerous times in your lifespand you'll run into a choice where it's not your opinion that should speak, it's your heart. Let people live their lives aswell as they live yours. Set no bounderies for others.
Transgender rights? What bullshit. They're human, they deserve rights like anyone.
Backtracking to Sobotnik's strange feelings on the matter, these operations do benefit society.
People who pay for these operations then make more money for cosmetic surgery firms. These firms then pay their employees who buy products. The money spent on these products then, in some way, goes to the workers, who then pay for products themselves. This leads to a small boost in a nation's economic well-being, therefore benefiting those who live in the nation as well as the countries which said nation trades with.
Given that the US economy isn't built off sex changes, but still.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;32964429]I have no issue with them, but to have operations to change genders or the such seems a waste of labour.
There may also be an issue with regards to relationships they get into, and if they keep their identity a secret from the other the couple will have massive problems down the line.[/QUOTE]
In the same context I could say "Why live? It's a waste of labor." Are you a nihilist?
[QUOTE=joes33431;33206116]Backtracking to Sobotnik's strange feelings on the matter, these operations do benefit society.
People who pay for these operations then make more money for cosmetic surgery firms. These firms then pay their employees who buy products. The money spent on these products then, in some way, goes to the workers, who then pay for products themselves. This leads to a small boost in a nation's economic well-being, therefore benefiting those who live in the nation as well as the countries which said nation trades with.
Given that the US economy isn't built off sex changes, but still.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention the fact that the person can be who they want which will undoubtedly increase their productivity but that's a ridiculous way to look at it.
The way I view things like this are simple:
It's not causing harm to anyone in any way shape or form, then it's okay.
Sobotnik has a point, would you rather a doctor be performing surgeries to save lives or reassign genders? Where would you rather a governments money go?
Just because what he says is bleak doesn't change the reality of the situation to the people who have to make these decisions.
[editline]13th November 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=joes33431;33206116]Backtracking to Sobotnik's strange feelings on the matter, these operations do benefit society.
People who pay for these operations then make more money for cosmetic surgery firms. These firms then pay their employees who buy products. The money spent on these products then, in some way, goes to the workers, who then pay for products themselves. This leads to a small boost in a nation's economic well-being, therefore benefiting those who live in the nation as well as the countries which said nation trades with.
Given that the US economy isn't built off sex changes, but still.[/QUOTE]
Same argument can be made for a drug dealer.
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33253669]Sobotnik has a point, would you rather a doctor be performing surgeries to save lives or reassign genders? Where would you rather a governments money go?
Just because what he says is bleak doesn't change the reality of the situation to the people who have to make these decisions.[/QUOTE]
Just because they're reassigning someone's gender instantly means they're not saving lives? What if they only specialize in that sort of surgery? Then by not performing them they're not even doing their job.
I've got a lot of gender issues or whatever the hell you want to call them, but the way I see it gender assignment surgery, is to me, just... worthless. Having my genitals essentially mutilated wont make me the person I would rather be. Getting fake tits wont make me feel like the person I would rather be. If anything it just shows how far I'm willing to go to kid myself I can be that person. And the simple truth is I can't.I would rather deal with that than do any surgery, and frankly I will never be able to understand why anyone would do it.
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33253893]and frankly I will never be able to understand why anyone would do it.[/QUOTE]
sure ya can. just try harder
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33253893]I've got a lot of gender issues or whatever the hell you want to call them, but the way I see it gender assignment surgery, is to me, just... worthless. Having my genitals essentially mutilated wont make me the person I would rather be. Getting fake tits wont make me feel like the person I would rather be. If anything it just shows how far I'm willing to go to kid myself I can be that person. And the simple truth is I can't.I would rather deal with that than do any surgery, and frankly I will never be able to understand why anyone would do it.[/QUOTE]
Trans in denial
Worst kind of person for these kind of arguments.
I hope you can get someone to get to you before you live a life of depression because of it.
[QUOTE=Onyx3173;33253877]Just because they're reassigning someone's gender instantly means they're not saving lives? What if they only specialize in that sort of surgery? Then by not performing them they're not even doing their job.[/QUOTE]
Would you rather a government/business fund the training of heart surgeons or whatever, or cosmetic surgeons?
I consider Transgenders "it's"
But It still has rights.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;33253922]Trans in denial
Worst kind of person for these kind of arguments.
I hope you can get someone to get to you before you live a life of depression because of it.[/QUOTE]
I would rather be the way I was born than an impression of what I would like to be. I don't see how it would change the way I see myself at all. The way I see it's just one thing on a long list of how I would like my life to be. I can't change them all, accepting that is part of maturity in my view. If surgery is what makes some people happy they can go for it, but I just don't see it the way they do.
I think transgenders should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community.
[QUOTE=drfeelgood223;33254193]I think transgenders should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community.[/QUOTE]
Than Tran Girls will Reproduce with Tran Guys
Then Boom, Trannys fucking flinging knives and chainsaws at everyone and invading europe. Killing Floor all over again.
[QUOTE=drfeelgood223;33254193]I think transgenders should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community.[/QUOTE]
"I think shitposters should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community."
Hey I can be a fucked up human too!
[QUOTE=Michael haxz;33253990]I consider Transgenders "it's"
But It still has rights.[/QUOTE]
So you're perfectly fine with dehumanizing a group of people with a legitimate medical diagnosis?
I bet you love Autistic people.
[QUOTE=Michael haxz;33254302]Than Tran Girls will Reproduce with Tran Guys
Then Boom, Trannys fucking flinging knives and chainsaws at everyone and invading europe. Killing Floor all over again.[/QUOTE]
Using Tranny in an debate on Transpeople.
Yep, no need to pay attention to you anymore.
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33254029]I would rather be the way I was born than an impression of what I would like to be. I don't see how it would change the way I see myself at all. The way I see it's just one thing on a long list of how I would like my life to be. I can't change them all, accepting that is part of maturity in my view. If surgery is what makes some people happy they can go for it, but I just don't see it the way they do.[/QUOTE]
Its fine that you don't see a reason but you REALLY sound like a Transperson in denial. But it's your ultimate life decision and you can do whatever you choose.
[QUOTE=drfeelgood223;33254193]I think transgenders should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community.[/QUOTE]
That's terrible.
-snip, fucking automerge-
[QUOTE=Michael haxz;33253990]I consider Transgenders "it's"
But It still has rights.[/QUOTE]
Also terrible.
[editline]12th November 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33253935]Would you rather a government/business fund the training of heart surgeons or whatever, or cosmetic surgeons?[/QUOTE]
Why would it be a choice? In what world could we not do both?
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33253935]Would you rather a government/business fund the training of heart surgeons or whatever, or cosmetic surgeons?[/QUOTE]
When was that the subject of what I was saying? I was purely saying that just because a doctor isn't doing some life saving surgery doesn't mean it's useless or a waste. Why should someone not live how they want to live just because someone else thinks that it's pointless? I think 90% of the shit that people go out and buy is pointless, you don't see me going around saying that they shouldn't have those things.
[editline]12th November 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Michael haxz;33253990]I consider Transgenders "it's"
But It still has rights.[/QUOTE]
Way to go. I consider people who do stupid things like that "morons".
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;33254369]Also terrible.
[editline]12th November 2011[/editline]
Why would it be a choice? In what world could we not do both?[/QUOTE]
Not ours. There are never enough doctors to treat everyone, and the idea that someone with the skills to help the dying would put them to use on cosmetics is just depressing. This doesn't go for trans specifically either.
Honestly, it seems to me we're all just people. Why should anyone be treated differently because of how they feel about themselves?
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33254453]Not ours. There are never enough doctors to treat everyone, and the idea that someone with the skills to help the dying would put them to use on cosmetics is just depressing. This doesn't go for trans specifically either.[/QUOTE]
By doing the surgery(which not every trans person even wants by the way) they are virtually removing the suicide risk of that person! They ARE saving someone! Its much more thsn just simple cosmetic surgery for fucks sake! Why has no one pointed this out?
[QUOTE=Skelmech;33254525]virtually removing the suicide risk of that person![/QUOTE]
You had best be trolling...
[QUOTE=drfeelgood223;33254193]I think transgenders should all muster inside of a large cave somewhere and live there for the rest of their lives like some sort of fucked up mole people community.[/QUOTE]
[URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/839/unledsjc.jpg/][IMG]http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/7215/unledsjc.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
So do you get mad when you see your own posts then?
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33256073]You had best be trolling...[/QUOTE]
You're a little slow as well, you should read up on how the human mind can work in people besides yourself.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;32964986]We should work on finding out the number of transexxuals that are created every year, followed by finding out how much better they work after surgery and if the advantages are good in the long run.
Next we find out how it is without the surgery, and depending upon how much their labour produces compared to those with surgery and determine the costs saved by not having a surgery and see the long term advantages.
If it is found that the latter or former is more efficient, go with the one that is. There are also many ways to increase happiness of labourers. For example with rewards for reaching targets, entertainment, consumer goods, food/drink, etc.
If the surgery group is found to be more efficient, then work towards slowly reducing the number so as to cure and prevent the condition of gender dysphoria over time so as to reduce the cost of surgeries.
You also must consider that whilst it benefits the individual, we must take into account if it benefits everyone.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://s3.amazonaws.com/kym-assets/entries/icons/original/000/005/111/images.jpg?1297895914[/img]
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[QUOTE=Squeaken;33256073]You had best be trolling...[/QUOTE]
[url=http://nnlm.gov/bhic/2011/02/08/transgender-suicide-rates/]There actually is a very large attempted suicide rate.[/url]
[QUOTE=Squeaken;33256073]You had best be trolling...[/QUOTE]
-__- really? It's been said ATLEAST 4 times in this thread that transgender people have one of the highest rates of suicide.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;33254362]
So you're perfectly fine with dehumanizing a group of people with a legitimate medical diagnosis?
I bet you love Autistic people.
Using Tranny in an debate on Transpeople.
Yep, no need to pay attention to you anymore.
[/QUOTE]
Now that I think about it that way, I do apologize. Transpeople are people like you and me, and they have rights.
But I'm standing by the tranny thing so fuck off
[IMG]http://flipthatbird.com/wp-content/themes/StudioPress/images/middle-finger-retro.jpg[/IMG]
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