I'd like to compose my own "orchestral scores" for my own films?
46 replies, posted
Nothing is necessary in music, but music theory will certainly help out. It does do harm to people who feel like they have to stick to the rules. There are no rules in music.
If you can do good music without music theory great, I just don't know anyone who does.
Unfortunately producing a good track without live instruments is virtually impossible because for each instrument they just have a formula for the tone, and this doesn't account for how timbre changes in different ranges.
[QUOTE=ThunderGod;31791206]Unfortunately producing a good track without live instruments is virtually impossible because for each instrument they just have a formula for the tone, and this doesn't account for how timbre changes in different ranges.[/QUOTE]
Hahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
[editline]18th August 2011[/editline]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sy1dYFGkPUE&ob=av2e[/media]
Electronic music>>
[QUOTE=ThunderGod;31791206]Unfortunately producing a good track without live instruments is virtually impossible because for each instrument they just have a formula for the tone, and this doesn't account for how timbre changes in different ranges.[/QUOTE]
Not so correct. There are a lot of pretty realistic instruments that are sample based and take a lot of factors into consideration. Some are better than others, but it wouldn't be a stretch to say that the grand piano has been done quite well. There are some instruments that are harder to model, the main one being the guitar. But they are getting closer with that, check out the video below.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS5MDHMOWtE[/media]
[QUOTE=Croix;31797543]Hahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
[editline]18th August 2011[/editline]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sy1dYFGkPUE&ob=av2e[/media]
Electronic music>>[/QUOTE]
I was talking about orchestral film scores, which is what this thread is about. Dickweed. Instruments like the clarinet for example have four distinct ranges and I've never come across software that accounts for this.
If you are willing to spend big on software, there are some amazing VST's by Spectrasonics such as Omnisphere and Trillian which you might want to check out. They focus more on synth stuff but it's incredible stuff either way
[QUOTE=ThunderGod;31802589][...]Instruments like the clarinet for example have four distinct ranges and I've never come across software that accounts for this.[/QUOTE]
Well then you haven't really looked into it at all.
[QUOTE=Yur|ko;31802975]Well then you haven't really looked into it at all.[/QUOTE]
I agree, I recently found a really good orchestral soundfont .
[url]http://sso.mattiaswestlund.net/[/url]
You certainly are limited, but you should be able to attain the good results. Listen to the demo.
[QUOTE=ThunderGod;31802589]I was talking about orchestral film scores, which is what this thread is about. Dickweed. Instruments like the clarinet for example have four distinct ranges and I've never come across software that accounts for this.[/QUOTE]
My point still stands.
For people saying that FL Studio is bad to use maybe you should check this
[video=youtube;jDzmFCjaCMA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDzmFCjaCMA[/video]
I believe he uses the libarys from [URL="http://cinesamples.com/"]http://cinesamples.com/[/URL] to do his stuff. cinesamples stuff is pricey but if you want to be seriouse about it you should check that out for something that is cheap I don't know of anything apart from imageline having a Orchestral Sample CD which you could check out [URL="http://www.image-line.com/documents/orchestral.html"]http://www.image-line.com/documents/orchestral.html[/URL]
When people who know what they are talking about critique DAWs, they are usually criquing the workflow. Nobody really says you can't achieve similar results with the same plugins in different DAWs. People are saying that it it easier to achieve a result in one DAW as opposed to another.
How do I use samples? I know how where to put them and all and how to get them to appear in the program, but atm they're just separate soundfiles, how do I work with them? I don't feel like making a new channel for each note.
-snip nevermind-
Classical music degree student here. I've had my music performed by an actual symphony orchestra, and I get regular one-to-one tuition in classical composition, as well as playing violin in several orchestras, so I feel I have something to add to the discussion. (Not that I'm claiming to be an "expert" or anything, just sharing my personal experiences)
I always write my orchestral scores at the piano, by hand, on manuscript paper in short score. (ie, like piano music) It's the only way you can see exactly the layout of the textures you're using. That's one thing that's vital when it comes to orchestral writing - the voicing of chords, and the textures. The spacing of notes in chords, and the spacial relationships between melodies, counter-melodies, and harmonies, can only really be worked out fully at the piano.
(When it comes to writing orchestral music, you don't want to end up with "sections" of music that don't really have anything to do with each other, one after the other. When you've written a section, instead of coming up with new material, try re-developing old material instead, ie, what you've already got for the first section. This helps to give pieces a feeling of unity)
Once I've written a piece in short-score, I take it to the computer and sample and sequence etc. I use Reaper, with the Kontakt4 sampler (VST plugin) and EastWest Symphonic Orchestra (it was mentioned on the last page) but also ProjectSAM Symphobia is good for its muted brass and orchestral effects. But you can just use something like Sibelius and use the Symphony Orchestra or Film Orchestra preset, but it won't sound as good.
If you want to really get into it, get a book on orchestration. I have a couple, the one I use the most is "The Study of Orchestration" by Samuel Adler. I think it exists as an e-book too. It talks all about the pairings of orchestral sections, and the spacing of chords and voicing to get the best effects, including loads of excerpts from scores. It also goes through every orchestral instrument, tells you its ranges and limitations, and what it sounds like. An incredibly useful book, and I recommend it fully.
You want to try to stay away from just effectively writing electronic music with samples of orchestral instruments. While it might sound good/ok, it won't sound truly 'orchestral', your instruments might be playing things that are unplayable, and your orchestral textures might be totally unnatural, so you'll never be able to achieve the truly "real" orchestral sound. Even though you're not using a real orchestra, you want to make sure you're writing as though you are.
Also I disagree with the earlier statement that writing music for films is more simple than for 'classical' music. It's not true. You might think so from what you remember - and what you remember is usually the end-credits and the main theme tune. Yes, these parts are often rather simple, but that's only because they need to be catchy and memorable - the incidental music that goes underneath dialogue and action is easily as complicated as standard 'classical' repertoire.
@MrJazzy to use samples, you need a plugin called a sampler. That plugin takes your MIDI data and applies the correct sound to that note from the sample library you've selected. I use Kontakt4 (you can get a free version from the Kontakt site) but it depends on the format of your samples which sampler you need. If it's .nki then it's Kontakt you need. (I reccomend using Kontakt, most of the best sample packs are Kontakt-compatible). But I'm not really an expert on any of this techy-stuff, I just figure it out as I go along.
If you can already imagine the music, you need to find the program that will get your ideas down the quickest and easiest way. The best way i can think of would be to use the piano. Placing notes manually can get troublesome as you concentrate more on clicking and dragging boxes across the screen and less on music, which in most cases ends up with you forgetting or altering your score in a bad way without realizing.
The more keen you are at getting it to sound realistic the more problematic it can get. Is this very important? Personally, as long as it sounds good I'm cool.
[editline]22nd August 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=MrJazzy;31862025]How do I use samples? I know how where to put them and all and how to get them to appear in the program, but atm they're just separate soundfiles, how do I work with them? I don't feel like making a new channel for each note.[/QUOTE]
use a sampler vst plugin
it's made for this exact problem you have
[QUOTE=Neon-Knight;31879614]Classical music degree student here. I've had my music performed by an actual symphony orchestra, and I get regular one-to-one tuition in classical composition, as well as playing violin in several orchestras, so I feel I have something to add to the discussion. (Not that I'm claiming to be an "expert" or anything, just sharing my personal experiences)[/QUOTE]
Could you please post some of your own compositions and post in the pre 1910 classical music thread? Rated useful.
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