The perfect way to end poverty (atleast, in Vancouver)
103 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;28730471]It ends your definition of poverty and then creates a million other problems[/QUOTE]
Like what?
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[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;28730471]It ends your definition of poverty and then creates a million other problems[/QUOTE]
Poverty being the state of having little or no money and few or no material possessions in pure definition.
Get rid of currency, no rich or poor - if you classify how rich you are but how much crap you own then you can simply go get more crap, its free.
But I'm not being serious here, I just giving you a chaotic example that's not to be taken seriously.
thought it was the idea that every dude that isn't living in poverty should grab a shotgun and shoot one poor person.
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730528]Like what?[/QUOTE]
Oh wow where to start...
Well how are we going to keep producing well... anything? Factories arent going to keep producing and farmers arent going to keep growing crops in masses just for the good will of it. People aren't going to keep doing their jobs because there's just no incentive when you think about how many different kinds of jobs there are.
And that's just one example I can give right off the bat. Truth of the matter is that abolishing all currency is about as well thought out as OP's solution.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Vasili;28730552]Poverty being the state of having little or no money and few or no material possessions in pure definition.
Get rid of currency, no rich or poor - if you classify how rich you are but how much crap you own then you can simply go get more crap, its free.
But I'm not being serious here, I just giving you a chaotic example that's not to be taken seriously.[/QUOTE]
Well maybe it's because I've seen other people on here seriously suggest that.
Poverty is required for people to be rich.
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;28730655]Oh wow where to start...
Well how are we going to keep producing well... anything? Factories arent going to keep producing and farmers arent going to keep growing crops in masses just for the good will of it. People aren't going to keep doing their jobs because there's just no incentive when you think about how many different kinds of jobs there are.
And that's just one example I can give right off the bat. Truth of the matter is that abolishing all currency is about as well thought out as OP's solution.
-snip-[/quote]
How did native american tribes live then? How do the Amish live?
And yes, farmers ARE going to keep growing crops because that's how they eat.
Let's say you go to a farm and ask for some tomatoes. What do you have to trade for the tomatoes if money was abolished? Ultimately, it shows your worth.
Basically, How did societies exist without forms of currency? By trading goods and it's still very possible instead of all of us being useless cunts.
It bugs me how picky homeless people are. Our family friends always have to do those things to help them because of their church, and they are always saying things like, "Is there any meat in that soup? I'm a vegetarian..." How can they afford to be vegetarian? Well that's simple, they don't pay for it, everyone else does. They also always request for expensive types of coffee and want Starbucks, not just a gas station's coffee. They will refuse food/drinks just because it's not their usual meals/beverages. I don't know if it is just in my city, but most of them can fuck off. Especially the alcoholic ones.
The only reason you can't get rid of money is because humans are by influence of society greedy and selfish. They don't care about society as a whole, they only care when they benefit from caring. That doesn't just mean a paycheck, it can mean a reputation, recognition by another, feeling better about themselves, etc. Humans refuse to understand the concept of working to better society as a whole with no incentive or reward.
That does not work here. It also makes a mess.
There's also not enough cans here for everyone to make a living so they steal copper.
I can look down almost any alley and see a TV some fucking hobo has broken open and smashed to remove the copper components off of it. They leave toxic waste and broken glass everywhere.
If you were cynical, you would have to probably gas the downtown east side but that's against the Geneva convention, and it leaves room for people from Surrey to move in.
[QUOTE=Monomiro;28730799]The only reason you can't get rid of money is because humans are by nature greedy and selfish. They don't care about society as a whole, they only care when they benefit from caring. That doesn't just mean a paycheck, it can mean a reputation, recognition by another, feeling better about themselves, etc. Humans refuse to understand the concept of working to better society as a whole with no incentive.[/QUOTE]
Humans are not greedy by nature. We're the products of our environment.
For example, if ALL of us were greedy by nature, we wouldn't have people who didn't steal. I don't steal and i'm human. Humans are not naturally greedy.
Actually yes, you're right. I was wrong, society teaches us to be greedy.
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730840]Humans are not greedy by nature. We're the products of our environment.
For example, if ALL of us were greedy by nature, we wouldn't have people who didn't steal. I don't steal and i'm human. Humans are not naturally greedy.[/QUOTE]
If we aren't naturally greedy then why are some humans born greedy?
We ARE naturally greedy, some people to extents that surpass our own
[QUOTE=MIPS;28730810] and it leaves room for people from Surrey to move in.[/QUOTE]
:smith:
No one is going to solve poverty, because thats apart of civilization. You make them clean up the streets, the CoL will go up (More money around, inflates the price of goods). Impoverished people are always going to exist, like it or not.
They already do this. I don't think I've ever seen a loose can on east hastings.
[QUOTE=TAU!;28730426]I saw a sort of dispenser behind a supermarket I go to that allows you to deposit recyclable bottles in it and you receive the 5 cent deposit for it in return. If more of these are set up around cities then homeless people can at least be able to afford something to eat rather than sitting around and begging all day.[/QUOTE]
That's the flaw of these plans- assuming what all homeless want and need.
What if begging 'earns' more than collecting recyclables? Then the smart thing is to beg and not waste your energy collecting bottles and cans.
Even then, how do you know how much each homeless person needs? Some will eat more than others, some have more resources available(food kitchens/shelters/etc) than others.
That's not even getting into how much will be spent on drugs.
[QUOTE=chaz13;28733635]:smith:[/QUOTE]
You are wealthy enough to afford a way to connect to the internet so you are not in the same Surrey crowd concerned.
Communism is fine too
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730771]How did native american tribes live then? How do the Amish live?
And yes, farmers ARE going to keep growing crops because that's how they eat.
Let's say you go to a farm and ask for some tomatoes. What do you have to trade for the tomatoes if money was abolished? Ultimately, it shows your worth.
Basically, How did societies exist without forms of currency? By trading goods and it's still very possible instead of all of us being useless cunts.[/QUOTE]
The Native Americans lived in shit filled hovels and ate berries or they moved endlessly and lived hard lives while barely sustaining themselves on buffalo meat. Oh, and if they got sick well, good luck hopefully the medicine man can offer up some good herbs today because God's favor is your last hope. The Amish live lives almost as hard as that.
A farmer isn't going to give away his crops that he worked so hard for. Unless you have something of great value such as fuel for tractors or possibly need seeds or animal feed, which usually are held by other farmers, then he has no reason to give his crops to you. And, since he probably won't be able to sustain a large farm without his workers, who probably won't stick around when the farmer can't pay them anymore, he will have to downsize and keep a small family farm that is just enough to provide for himself so that he can survive until next harvest.
What exactly are you trying to prove? That people are just so generous and that they will give away their hard work so that they have a warm feeling in their hearts? The world is far darker place than you think if that is what you believe.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Jiyoon;28736535]Communism is fine too[/QUOTE]
Hahaha what a fucking joke.
We've seen communism in the past and we all know how well it works out.
[QUOTE=zydos;28733236]If we aren't naturally greedy then why are some humans born greedy?
We ARE naturally greedy, some people to extents that surpass our own[/QUOTE]
Born greedy? find me the greedy gene before you act like environment isn't the main factor.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Explosions;28736867]
We've seen communism in the past and we all know how well it works out.[/QUOTE]
Not going to say communism is the answer but those weren't real communism. You also cant say that somethign that didnt work before can never work.
[QUOTE=The Mighty Boatman;28730533][b]rules quote[/b][/QUOTE]
it isn't global, it's a Vancouver crisis
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730771]How did native american tribes live then? How do the Amish live?
And yes, farmers ARE going to keep growing crops because that's how they eat.
Let's say you go to a farm and ask for some tomatoes. What do you have to trade for the tomatoes if money was abolished? Ultimately, it shows your worth.
Basically, How did societies exist without forms of currency? By trading goods and it's still very possible instead of all of us being useless cunts.[/QUOTE]
Ok there's no poverty, but you just wiped out all our technology and medical advances and that isn't worth it IMO
[QUOTE=MIPS;28730810]That does not work here. It also makes a mess.
There's also not enough cans here for everyone to make a living so they steal copper.
I can look down almost any alley and see a TV some fucking hobo has broken open and smashed to remove the copper components off of it. They leave toxic waste and broken glass everywhere.
If you were cynical, you would have to probably gas the downtown east side but that's against the Geneva convention, and it leaves room for people from Surrey to move in.[/QUOTE]
Hey :ohdear: I grew up in surrey it ain't that bad.
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730771]How did native american tribes live then? How do the Amish live?
And yes, farmers ARE going to keep growing crops because that's how they eat.
Let's say you go to a farm and ask for some tomatoes. What do you have to trade for the tomatoes if money was abolished? Ultimately, it shows your worth.
Basically, How did societies exist without forms of currency? By trading goods and it's still very possible instead of all of us being useless cunts.[/QUOTE]
Not to many people are going to want to do a boring job for no reason. Unless you can replace boring jobs with robots no ones going to be a farm worker or something boring like that.
[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;28738705]Not to many people are going to want to do a boring job for no reason. Unless you can replace boring jobs with robots no ones going to be a farm worker or something boring like that.[/QUOTE]
Yeah that's the real issue that arises and I mean who would design and build the robots? (I know you were being sarcastic about that though)
[editline]22nd March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=ChrisDom;28730840]Humans are not greedy by nature. We're the products of our environment.
For example, if ALL of us were greedy by nature, we wouldn't have people who didn't steal. I don't steal and i'm human. Humans are not naturally greedy.[/QUOTE]
Read back to the Bible days man, there has never been a time in history when people weren't [b]killing[/b] each other over greed
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;28738741]Yeah that's the real issue that arises and I mean who would design and build the robots? (I know you were being sarcastic about that though)
[/QUOTE]
Either give them a massive orgy for building those robots or find some people who really like making robots I guess. But whatever motivates.
Food>Nutrition/power (why bite the hand that feeds you)
Money>[u]Drugs[/u]
[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;28738152]Not going to say communism is the answer [b]but those weren't real communism[/b]. You also cant say that somethign that didnt work before can never work.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman[/url]
[QUOTE=Explosions;28739101][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman[/url][/QUOTE]
You cant say communism failed if it was never really tried. Im not making an argument for communism Im saying your making a bad one against it.
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