News flash!
Being agnostic doesn't get you into heaven. Either you're in or you're out, not in between.
[QUOTE=Rowsdower;19047315]TONS of science is based on assumptions. Ever seen a quark or an electron? No? Well our entire scientific world is centered on how we believe they work.[/QUOTE]
quarks and electrons can be detected with equipment such as ATLAS
[url]http://www.atlas.ch/[/url]
Did sanding your face give you the inability of using paragraphs?
[QUOTE=Wadsworth;19047365]Because I would like to think that even if god was proven to exist I still would not worship him. Look around at all of the evil in the world, if god is omnipotent and he allows this shit to exist, why the hell would I bow down to him?[/QUOTE]
He does that to strengthen you as a person.
[QUOTE=KigJow;19047382]He does that to strengthen you as a person.[/QUOTE]
What proof do you have for the existence of your God? It's a simple enough question.
[QUOTE=Gorgonoth;19047359]After reading "A Brief History of Time" it removed my doubts about the all powerful and very much abstract "God" of most faiths. I believe that if there is an entity that created the Universe, it isn't a benevolent creature that crafted us in his image. More likely than not it's just a higher dimensional being that has the technology to manipulate the lower dimensions to its will. I'm not going to delve into the no boundary theory here, but here's the quote from Stephen Hawking:
"The idea that space and time may form a closed surface without boundary also has profound implications for the role
of God in the affairs of the universe. With the success of scientific theories in describing events, most people have
come to believe that God allows the universe to evolve according to a set of laws and does not intervene in the
universe to break these laws. However, the laws do not tell us what the universe should have looked like when it
started – it would still be up to God to wind up the clockwork and choose how to start it off. So long as the universe
had a beginning, we could suppose it had a creator. But if the universe is really completely self-contained, having no
boundary or edge, it would have neither beginning nor end: it would simply be. What place, then, for a creator?"[/QUOTE]
Yes this may be true, but pay careful attention to the "may". Would you really want to set your mindset to that of which may be, instead of that which has to be. Yes we would all like to know the secrets of the universe, and yes science seems like a solid backbone for that of which we solely seek, but be warned for the temptations of knowledge will one day be our downfall, and then you will wish to be a man of sight and sound, instead of a man of science and belief.
Lewis Black is a fucking genius. Listen to him. It's a comedy act, but he also makes a very valid point.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWqtpqQjNug[/media]
[QUOTE=gufu;19047201]Because you can't say that one religion is right over others. Pascals deal doesn't work. Stop trying to use it. Beside, being an infidel usually fucks you up more than being neutral.[/QUOTE]
How does Pascal's Wager not work? That's quite a statement.
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047414]Yes this may be true, but pay careful attention to the "may". Would you really want to set your mindset to that of which may be, instead of that which has to be. Yes we would all like to know the secrets of the universe, and yes science seems like a solid backbone for that of which we solely seek, but be warned for the temptations of knowledge will one day be our downfall, and then you will wish to be a man of sight and sound, instead of a man of science and belief.[/QUOTE]
No actually, even if our knowledge destroys our own race, I would never have wished it to be any other way. I would rather be destroyed through scientific pursuit than through religious war.
I'm going to state a few simple facts.
Ignorance is bad.
Faith is belief without evidence.
To believe in a god you need faith.
Belief without evidence is ignorant. (It's ignorant of the consequences of believing things without evidence, jump off cliff and you can fly)
Therefore, Faith is bad.
Therefore, believing in a god means you are ignorant.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;19047456]I'm going to state a few simple facts.
Ignorance is bad.
Faith is belief without evidence.
To believe in a god you need faith.
Belief without evidence is ignorant. (It's ignorant of the consequences of believing things without evidence, jump off cliff and you can fly)
Therefore, Faith is bad.
Therefore, believing in a god means you are ignorant.[/QUOTE]
This same logic means that assuming the lack of a higher power is also ignorant, for there is no evidence that there isn't a higher power!
/agree X100000 with OP.
[QUOTE=wuzzimu;19047284]The way I think of it, atheism is organized agnosticism. Where an atheist would actively deny religion, an agnostic would simply not care.[/QUOTE]
I agree. Atheists are such self-labelers. I live with two atheists and any time there is some sort of un-religious reference on TV (a mention to the crusades or the greedy church, priests molesting boys, an overly religious soldier getting killed in a movie, ANYTHING) i can be sure that one of them makes a comment about how they are "so glad" that they are atheists. EVERY freaking time...
One time i had just met someone at science convention and he was presenting his thesis soon. I told him good luck, and he said, "Thanks. I'd pray to God for guidance, but then again I'm an atheist so I don't believe he exists". I mean come on...
This raped my eyes trying to read it. You need to hit Enter/return more.
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047482]This same logic means that assuming the lack of a god is also ignorant, for there is no evidence that there's a lack of a god.[/QUOTE]
That which can be brought up without evidence can also be disproven without evidence. See, the tooth fairy, god, santa, and unicorns.
[QUOTE=GhetoGeek;19047499]This raped my eyes trying to read it. You need to hit Enter/return more.[/QUOTE]
It's all one paragraph.
[quote]That which can be brought up without evidence can also be disproven without evidence. See, the tooth fairy, god, santa, and unicorns.[/quote]
This truly is the definition of ignorance being bliss, you cannot simply disprove a belief with another belief.
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047299]Young sir, I am in no way trying to impose my own believes on you, for that is the work of the Atheist mindset; a mindset which is based upon a limited understanding of the world. For how can thee who does not understand the world even begin to comprehend the vast world of the afterlife, but be warned; the Atheist will attempt to twist and contort your mind, just as the Christians did to them. For they were able to break away from that, but never quite completely left. So they go on living live trying to impose the same beliefs of Christianity, but through a different message. More pity to the weak I say, it's never too late to learn.[/QUOTE]
I am no atheist.
The default logical stance on something is that it does not exist until there is evidence to the contrary. There is no evidence for anything supernatural existing. I agree that we do not KNOW, but, the issue with that, is that it's impossible to disprove a negative, think Salem Witch Trials. Can you prove you're not a witch? (Assuming that witches don't exist.)
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047482]This same logic means that assuming the lack of a higher power is also ignorant, for there is no evidence that there isn't a higher power![/QUOTE]
You can prove something doesn't exist through lack of evidence; there is no lamborghini in my garage because I looked. But you can't prove something DOES exist through lack of evidence.
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047482]This same logic means that assuming the lack of a higher power is also ignorant, for there is no evidence that there isn't a higher power![/QUOTE]
You don't need to know that something that isn't true, isn't true. Why can't you comprehend this? Do you need to prove that there isn't a bullet about to punch through your skull? Do you need to prove that your house isn't going to collapse right now (Given that you have no evidence pointing to something that may lead to structural failure, like an earth quake or whatever)? Do you need to prove that a god that has no evidence for his existence, doesn't exist?
While I understand that your reasoning for being on the fence is completely illogical, if I apply your logic to what I said before. I should be wearing a bullet proof helmet and I should leave my house immediately, "better safe then sorry".
you're all dumbfucks
Also: Welcome to puberty, yes we all know how right you are, how everyone else is wrong, and how nobody understands you. Take a number and get in line.
[QUOTE=flyguy88;19047523]you're all dumbfucks[/QUOTE]
your
[quote]Also: Welcome to puberty, yes we all know how right you are, how everyone else is wrong, and how nobody understands you. Take a number and get in line.[/quote]
I'm just tired of agnosticism being cast off to the side, like it is nothing; mere trash in the treasure of belief.
I like how OP is saying that assumptions are bad even though his afterlife and stuff still kind of is an assumption.
And I don't secretly yearn to be "a man of sight and sound", I secretly yearn to be like Alex Mercer
[QUOTE=Gorgonoth;19047545]Also: Welcome to puberty, yes we all know how right you are, how everyone else is wrong, and how nobody understands you. Take a number and get in line.[/QUOTE]
yeah youre right lets ignore how peoples faith kills people daily and how people are blowing themseleves up over a diety that may or may not be real. its totally a teenage thing, and not a problem at all.
you are
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047548]your[/QUOTE]
No he was correct with "you're"
Did that sander reach your brain or something?
[QUOTE=FLoggin Moffins;19047503]
This truly is the definition of ignorance being bliss, you cannot simply disprove a belief with another belief.[/QUOTE]
He's not, he's using it as an example.
So it's safe to assume that you are on the fence about unicorns, Santa, fairies and the aforementioned?
[QUOTE=Kybalt;19047559]yeah youre right lets ignore how peoples faith kills people daily and how people are blowing themseleves up over a diety that may or may not be real. its totally a teenage thing, and not a problem at all.[/QUOTE]
I was talking to Moffins, he acts just like an angsty teen that thinks he's right and everyone is wrong. I wasn't saying anything about religion, how about we read through the thread before posting eh?
stop wasting time on things we can never know
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