[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569087]But seriously, my point exactly. It just irks me that people of your belief have to say stuff like this, it's extremely insulting, but also the reason none of us can have a fucking serious conversation.
[editline]4th December 2011[/editline]
And every other religion hasn't? Before you throw that out there I can give you many many examples about how EVERYBODY has been tortured over the past EXISTENCE OF HUMANITY. Racism, Sexism, etc etc.
Now the question is, are we still speaking up today?
Did you experience that pain yourself?
And with the amount of swearing you have in your post I find it hard to take your point seriously.[/QUOTE]
I dunno, but as far as I know, Homosexuels are still severly discriminated in the USA, MAINLY because of religion
[QUOTE=Scar;33569176]Awww. Did I hurt your feelings? I'm [i]so[/i] sorry[/QUOTE]
Nah, you didn't, I understand that you're just compensating for your [i]tiny penis[/i]. :downs:
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3X5f3gY4iw&list=FLfI7BltkJ_R8yWLCj7wVcMw&index=14&feature=plpp_video[/media]
[editline]4th December 2011[/editline]
M0ds m0ve this to m@ss d3bate pl0x
[QUOTE=Noble;33568946]Were you there to see whether or not the holocaust occurred or do you just go by the evidence?[/QUOTE]
Hard, irrefutable proof =/= theories and soft evidence
[QUOTE=BigOwl;33569236]Hard, irrefutable proof =/= theories and soft evidence[/QUOTE]
You seem to have no idea what a scientific theory is, do you?
[QUOTE=Scoot12;33567515]Honeslty, 40% of the threads posted hear are about religion in which Atheists circlejerk to how "terrible" Theists are. Honestly this is coming from a non Religous person, you're all delusional and bigoted pricks who think that science is the only thing that matters and that every Religous person is a mentally disabled batshit crazy sub-human who should be burned on a cross. Fucking quit it and try to be more open minded. Also I might be banned but I don't care since I'm growing tired of reading all these lets hate Theists threads (Not to mention the mods ban if you have a conflicting opinion)[/QUOTE]
[url]http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1145159[/url]
[url]http://news.yahoo.com/believers-view-atheists-untrustworthy-study-185449324.html[/url]
Because fucktards like you consider us as trustworthy as rapists. The ignorance of the religious masses blows my mind on a daily basis, and I think in the year 2011 it's time for humanity to grow the fuck up and stop believing in dumb shit. Your retarded beliefs affect us, who want NOTHING to do with them, on a daily basis, despite how many different ways you can prove the whole damn tower of bigotry and superstition wrong. Science doesn't have all the answers yet, only an idiot would think so... but through science we know enough to know you're wrong.
[QUOTE=Chrille;33569190]Atheism isn't about hating religion, it's simply lack of belief. When little shitheads go out of their way to insult you because of your religion it's just primitive group behavior: "Attack the other group". And that "fact" about the majority of atheists being extremists is bullshit. I'm fairly certain your main experience with atheists comes from internet fora, which usually bring out the worst sides of everybody. You could visit any Scandinavian country, openly declare your religion and nobody would give a shit.[/QUOTE]
Thank you, and if you choose not to believe in God, just know that all of the religious people I know wouldn't care, it's just the crazy ones (in the midwest) that deface what I believe in.
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569268]Thank you, and if you choose not to believe in God, just know that all of the religious people I know wouldn't care, it's just the crazy ones that deface what I believe in.[/QUOTE]
Deface? They are more true to their belive than you, hombre. Christianity is a bigoted piece of racistic and sexistic shit, it only can't live up to that anymore and became what it is today
[QUOTE=BigOwl;33569236]Hard, irrefutable proof =/= theories and soft evidence[/QUOTE]
You don't even know what a theory is.
[QUOTE=Scar;33569201]I dunno, but as far as I know, Homosexuels are still severly discriminated in the USA, MAINLY because of religion[/QUOTE]
Religion and homophobia are two entirely separate things. There are hundreds of thousands of gay friendly churches.
[editline]4th December 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Scar;33569290]Deface? They are more true to their belive than you, hombre. Christianity is a bigoted piece of racistic and sexistic shit, it only can't live up to that anymore and became what it is today[/QUOTE]
Have you read the bible?
[QUOTE=Scar;33569290]Deface? They are more true to their belive than you, hombre. Christianity is a bigoted piece of racistic and sexistic shit, it only can't live up to that anymore and became what it is today[/QUOTE]
You talking about Old or New Testament? Because there's a huge change of pretty much anything in those two. Especially god went from a strict but guiding father figure to an all-loving and -forgiving family man.
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569307]Religion and homophobia are two entirely separate things. There are hundreds of thousands of gay friendly churches.[/QUOTE]
Read the bible, and tell me that again. Really, do it. The church doesn't have power anymore, so it can't pull shit like witch burnings or stonings anymore, so instead it presents itself as kind and accepting, which it really isn't. Again, read [url=http://www.evilbible.com/]this[/url] please
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569268]Thank you, and if you choose not to believe in God, just know that all of the religious people I know wouldn't care, it's just the crazy ones (in the midwest) that deface what I believe in.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Scar;33569290]Deface? They are more true to their belive than you, hombre. Christianity is a bigoted piece of racistic and sexistic shit, it only can't live up to that anymore and became what it is today[/QUOTE] Sadly, Scar is right: the "crazy" ones are actually "better" Christians than you. You [i]have[/i] read the bible, right? A lot of that shit is in there. What a lot of Christians follow now is a watered down version of religion that caters to the whims of science and society. It is a mere shadow of what it once was... not that I mind.
There are plenty of people who self-identify as Christian or some other religion that are kind, sensible people. And then there are other people who are complete bigots, things aren't black & white in this world. Do I dislike religion in general? Yes.
Besides of all the negative effects it has brought upon the world, I also disagree with the belief that people need religion to guide them towards being a good person.
I think that idea also brings many people to conclude that Atheists are amoral and generally untrustworthy, but again things aren't black & white with people. So that's my two-cents.
[QUOTE=Marik Bentusi;33569329]You talking about Old or New Testament? Because there's a huge change of pretty much anything in those two. Especially god went from a strict but guiding father figure to an all-loving and -forgiving family man.[/QUOTE]
But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Matthew 24:37, Luke 17:27
But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. ... Remember Lot's wife. Luke 17:29-32
For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Matthew 12:40
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. Matthew 5:17
I don't hate religion. I don't mind it at all.
[QUOTE=Scar;33569330]Read the bible, and tell me that again. Really, do it. The church doesn't have power anymore, so it can't pull shit like witch burnings or stonings anymore, so instead it presents itself as kind and accepting, which it really isn't. Again, read [url=http://www.evilbible.com/]this[/url] please[/QUOTE]
So painfully out of context, you can literally warp anything in the bible or any book for that matter to sound bad.
[QUOTE=Man Without Hat;33567556]95% of religious people are huge bigots.[/QUOTE]
I'd agree a majority of people, religious or not, are bigots.
Hence OP.
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569373]So painfully out of context, you can literally warp anything in the bible or any book for that matter to sound bad.[/QUOTE]
"Out of context" is a stock response.
[url]http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/13/half-of-new-testament-forged-bible-scholar-says/[/url]
[quote=BBC]By John Blake, CNN
(CNN) - A frail man sits in chains inside a dank, cold prison cell. He has escaped death before but now realizes that his execution is drawing near.
“I am already being poured out like a drink offering, and the time of my departure has come,” the man –the Apostle Paul - says in the Bible's 2 Timothy. “I have fought the good fight. I have finished the race. I have kept the faith.”
The passage is one of the most dramatic scenes in the New Testament. Paul, the most prolific New Testament author, is saying goodbye from a Roman prison cell before being beheaded. His goodbye veers from loneliness to defiance and, finally, to joy.
There’s one just one problem - Paul didn’t write those words. In fact, virtually half the New Testament was written by impostors taking on the names of apostles like Paul. At least according to Bart D. Ehrman, a renowned biblical scholar, who makes the charges in his new book “Forged.”
“There were a lot of people in the ancient world who thought that lying could serve a greater good,” says Ehrman, an expert on ancient biblical manuscripts.In “Forged,” Ehrman claims that:
* At least 11 of the 27 New Testament books are forgeries.
* The New Testament books attributed to Jesus’ disciples could not have been written by them because they were illiterate.
* Many of the New Testament’s forgeries were manufactured by early Christian leaders trying to settle theological feuds.
Were Jesus’ disciples ‘illiterate peasants?'
Ehrman’s book, like many of his previous ones, is already generating backlash. Ben Witherington, a New Testament scholar, has written a lengthy online critique of “Forged.”
Witherington calls Ehrman’s book “Gullible Travels, for it reveals over and over again the willingness of people to believe even outrageous things.”
All of the New Testament books, with the exception of 2 Peter, can be traced back to a very small group of literate Christians, some of whom were eyewitnesses to the lives of Jesus and Paul, Witherington says.
“Forged” also underestimates the considerable role scribes played in transcribing documents during the earliest days of Christianity, Witherington says.
Even if Paul didn’t write the second book of Timothy, he would have dictated it to a scribe for posterity, he says.
“When you have a trusted colleague or co-worker who knows the mind of Paul, there was no problem in antiquity with that trusted co-worker hearing Paul’s last testimony in prison,” he says. “This is not forgery. This is the last will and testament of someone who is dying.”
Ehrman doesn’t confine his critique to Paul’s letters. He challenges the authenticity of the Gospels of Matthew, Mark and John. He says that none were written by Jesus' disciplies, citing two reasons.
He says none of the earliest gospels revealed the names of its authors, and that their current names were later added by scribes.
Ehrman also says that two of Jesus’ original disciples, John and Peter, could not have written the books attributed to them in the New Testament because they were illiterate.
“According to Acts 4:13, both Peter and his companion John, also a fisherman, were agrammatoi, a Greek word that literally means ‘unlettered,’ that is, ‘illiterate,’ ’’ he writes.
Will the real Paul stand up?
Ehrman reserves most of his scrutiny for the writings of Paul, which make up the bulk of the New Testament. He says that only about half of the New Testament letters attributed to Paul – 7 of 13 - were actually written by him.
Paul's remaining books are forgeries, Ehrman says. His proof: inconsistencies in the language, choice of words and blatant contradiction in doctrine.
For example, Ehrman says the book of Ephesians doesn’t conform to Paul’s distinctive Greek writing style. He says Paul wrote in short, pointed sentences while Ephesians is full of long Greek sentences (the opening sentence of thanksgiving in Ephesians unfurls a sentence that winds through 12 verses, he says).
“There’s nothing wrong with extremely long sentences in Greek; it just isn’t the way Paul wrote. It’s like Mark Twain and William Faulkner; they both wrote correctly, but you would never mistake the one for the other,” Ehrman writes.
The scholar also points to a famous passage in 1 Corinthians in which Paul is recorded as saying that women should be “silent” in churches and that “if they wish to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home.”
Only three chapters earlier, in the same book, Paul is urging women who pray and prophesy in church to cover their heads with veils, Ehrman says: “If they were allowed to speak in chapter 11, how could they be told not to speak in chapter 14?”
Why people forged
Forgers often did their work because they were trying to settle early church disputes, Ehrman says. The early church was embroiled in conflict - people argued over the treatment of women, leadership and relations between masters and slaves, he says.
“There was competition among different groups of Christians about what to believe and each of these groups wanted to have authority to back up their views,” he says. “If you were a nobody, you wouldn’t sign your own name to your treatise. You would sign Peter or John.”
So people claiming to be Peter and John - and all sorts of people who claimed to know Jesus - went into publishing overdrive. Ehrman estimates that there were about 100 forgeries created in the name of Jesus’ inner-circle during the first four centuries of the church.
Witherington concedes that fabrications and forgeries floated around the earliest Christian communities.
But he doesn’t accept the notion that Peter, for example, could not have been literate because he was a fisherman.
“Fisherman had to do business. Guess what? That involves writing, contracts and signed documents,” he said in an interview.
Witherington says people will gravitate toward Ehrman’s work because the media loves sensationalism.
“We live in a Jesus-haunted culture that’s biblically illiterate,” he says. “Almost anything can pass for historical information… A book liked ‘Forged’ can unsettle people who have no third or fourth opinions to draw upon.”
Ehrman, of course, has another point of view.
“Forged” will help people accept something that it took him a long time to accept, says the author, a former fundamentalist who is now an agnostic.
The New Testament wasn’t written by the finger of God, he says – it has human fingerprints all over its pages.
“I’m not saying people should throw it out or it’s not theologically fruitful,” Ehrman says. “I’m saying that by realizing it contains so many forgeries, it shows that it’s a very human book, down to the fact that some authors lied about who they were.”
John Blake - CNN Writer[/quote]
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569373]So painfully out of context, you can literally warp anything in the bible or any book for that matter to sound bad.[/QUOTE]
Also, in what context is "God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. Matthew 15:4" suppoused to be ok?
Because it is the worst thing that has ever happened to humanity.
We mostly do not judge individuals,but religion as a whole.
Organized religion should be banned since it brings nothing but bigotry and death.
There is actually one religion accepted on Facepunch; it's Durgs Discussions and I approve it.
i really dont care about other religions as long as they arent being publicly extremist about it or trying to shove it down my throat.
converting me to a christian is not saving me. if a crazy dude with a gun starts opening fire and you shove me out of the way of bullets, that is saving me.
[QUOTE=FlakAttack;33569344]Sadly, Scar is right: the "crazy" ones are actually "better" Christians than you. You [i]have[/i] read the bible, right? A lot of that shit is in there. What a lot of Christians follow now is a watered down version of religion that caters to the whims of science and society. It is a mere shadow of what it once was... not that I mind.[/QUOTE]
Well hold on, have YOU read the bible? or just [url]www.evilbible.com[/url]?
Put everything that is said in context, take the fact that a lot of things in the bible are teaching metaphors and laws for AGES ago. Cultures were different and therefor had different laws, society wasn't nearly as politically correct, and you tell me that getting stoned to death was bad?
PEOPLE THAT WEREN'T CHRISTIAN IN THOSE DAYS WERE SACRIFICING FUCKING BABIES AND THE ROMANS CRUCIFIED PEOPLE.
Seriously though, death was not a big issue, people didn't have rights. So if there was gonna be death God was like "Hey, I gotta control this."
Then you move to new testament where he's like "wow, I gotta turn this stuff around, people are fat assholes".
ALL of the stuff in evilbible.com are old testament, and they are laws that applied to the culture because it needed it.
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569459]Well hold on, have YOU read the bible? or just [url]www.evilbible.com[/url]?
Put everything that is said in context, take the fact that a lot of things in the bible are teaching metaphors and laws for AGES ago. Cultures were different and therefor had different laws, society wasn't nearly as politically correct, and you tell me that getting stoned to death was bad?
PEOPLE THAT WEREN'T CHRISTIAN IN THOSE DAYS WERE SACRIFICING FUCKING BABIES AND THE ROMANS CRUCIFIED PEOPLE.
Seriously though, death was not a big issue, people didn't have rights. So if there was gonna be death God was like "Hey, I gotta control this."
Then you move to new testament where he's like "wow, I gotta turn this stuff around, people are fat assholes".
ALL of the stuff in evilbible.com are old testament, and they are laws that applied to the culture because it needed it.[/QUOTE]
I read it, cover to back; had to, went to a catholic school for 5 years
[QUOTE=BigOwl;33569236]Hard, irrefutable proof =/= theories and soft evidence[/QUOTE]
The crazy idea that the earth orbits the sun is "just a theory". Do you not accept this theory as proven fact?
[QUOTE=TJCTakSUn;33569459]Well hold on, have YOU read the bible? or just [url]www.evilbible.com[/url]?
Put everything that is said in context, take the fact that a lot of things in the bible are teaching metaphors and laws for AGES ago. Cultures were different and therefor had different laws, society wasn't nearly as politically correct, and you tell me that getting stoned to death was bad?
PEOPLE THAT WEREN'T CHRISTIAN IN THOSE DAYS WERE SACRIFICING FUCKING BABIES AND THE ROMANS CRUCIFIED PEOPLE.
Seriously though, death was not a big issue, people didn't have rights. So if there was gonna be death God was like "Hey, I gotta control this."
Then you move to new testament where he's like "wow, I gotta turn this stuff around, people are fat assholes".
ALL of the stuff in evilbible.com are old testament, and they are laws that applied to the culture because it needed it.[/QUOTE]
Since when is Matthew old testament?
"There are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it. Matthew 19:12"
"But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 8:1"
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. Matthew 10:34, Luke 12:51-53"
[QUOTE=FlakAttack;33569254][url]http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1145159[/url]
[url]http://news.yahoo.com/believers-view-atheists-untrustworthy-study-185449324.html[/url]
Because fucktards like you consider us as trustworthy as rapists. The ignorance of the religious masses blows my mind on a daily basis, and I think in the year 2011 it's time for humanity to grow the fuck up and stop believing in dumb shit. Your retarded beliefs affect us, who want NOTHING to do with them, on a daily basis, despite how many different ways you can prove the whole damn tower of bigotry and superstition wrong. Science doesn't have all the answers yet, only an idiot would think so... but through science we know enough to know you're wrong.[/QUOTE]
[quote]Honestly this is coming from a non Religous person[/quote]
kind of missed that line
Go to CHURCH
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