• The Global Warming Hoax (True or False)
    314 replies, posted
[QUOTE=iPope;32376861]Global warming doesn't necessarily mean that everything gets hotter. The global temperature will rise but this will cause changes to our weather systems. Changes in air temperature and in ocean currents will all affect the weather; both of which are affected by global warming. For example here in the UK it snowed deep for the first time in years. They said it wouldn't happen for another 80, yet it is now happening every year. I don't know if there is ever been a reason stated for this, but it is an example of something global warming can cause - more extremes.[/QUOTE] I know i just used it as a bad example
I personally believe global warming isn't really true (Maybe it's because i don't have enough evidence or something, but i honestly don't see it being true). I believe we should get more green alternatives though so living conditions don't get terrible in the future (i don't want pollution central.)
I think the title isn't really fitting for a discussion, since you pretty much said there that it is a hoax. I think it should be something more neutral, like "Global Warming - A problem or a myth?" That said, I don't think it's a hoax or myth at all. I live in the mountains, with big ski resorts. After talking with some engineers, they told me how they have to build deeper and broader fundaments for the ski lifts nearly every year. We can also see how our glaciers shrink from year to year. So I can see the problems it's causing in real life.
Gee, what an unbiased thread title.
[QUOTE=Wii60;32377512]I personally believe global warming isn't really true (Maybe it's because i don't have enough evidence or something, but i honestly don't see it being true)[/QUOTE] Based on what exactly?
It's real, it's just a natural cycle. Humanity is nowhere near capable of causing something that massive.
[QUOTE=Timebomb575;32377836]Based on what exactly?[/QUOTE] Well people claiming the World gets hotter faster every year due to it, that shits been happening for hundreds of years now (the World constantly gets hotter then colder then hotter every few years or so.) just one example. as i said, i probably don't have enough evidence.
I always had a tinfoil hat close me when it comes to global warming, there is simply more to it then we probably know.
[QUOTE=Confuzzed Otto;32376109]I feel it's true, but the proportions might be abit exaggerated. The sea levels rise 7 meters.. Isn't that really much considering ice is like 90% air?[/QUOTE] The fuck? Where the fuck did you get that 90% air from, holy shit.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;32377963]It's real, it's just a natural cycle. Humanity is nowhere near capable of causing something that massive.[/QUOTE] I usually hate to hear / say "carbon emissions" because I hear it more in bullshit than science ("buy eletric cars save the planet" sort of shit, even ignoring that the elecricity they run on is made from mostly carbon based fuels) But seriously, we have been dumping, a lot of fucking shit, into our atmosphere Plus, using oil untill it runs out, probably limiting our options even more, arent even remotely a good idea
[QUOTE=gamerman345;32377326]Global warming is not a threat to Humanity in my opinion. During the Medieval period Europe had a mini Ice age and we out lasted that, even with the Plague, the low life expectancy, and all the wars. By the time it becomes too big a problem to handle we will have Starships in space, and/or dozens of years of scientific advances.[/QUOTE] First of all, you can't compare a plague and wars which affect large parts, but not all of civilization to the effects of global warming, which will be constant and take place over the entire planet for a long, long time. Second, [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c1/2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png[/img]
[QUOTE=catbarf;32376297]People who say global warming is real: -Analysts -Al Gore [b]-The entire scientific community[/b] People who say global warming is fake: -Oil tycoons -Their wholly-owned media subsidiaries Hmm, I wonder which is more trustworthy.[/QUOTE] No, there are actually a lot of scientists publishing papers that point out flaws in the evidence for our influence in global warming. Values are left out, people are not sure how to interpret data and there is evidence that a similar increase in temperature occurred in the Middle Ages. I believes global warming is happening, but it isn't something we should be worried about.
I believe in Climate Change whole-heartedly, but not that humans are the problem. I would explain, but I'm sure someone has already explained earlier in the thread
[QUOTE=DrBreen;32376421]Global warming is a natural process, we can probably speed it up but not by much Actually, it's summer here and temperatures are between 15 to 25ºC max, last year it was like +35ºC every summer day[/QUOTE] I somewhat agree,we only accelerated the process and can only slightly slow it down...
[QUOTE=Overv;32378312]No, there are actually a lot of scientists publishing papers that point out flaws in the evidence for our influence in global warming. Values are left out, people are not sure how to interpret data and there is evidence that a similar increase in temperature occurred in the Middle Ages. I believes global warming is happening, but it isn't something we should be worried about.[/QUOTE] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c1/2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png[/img] If you Believe in Global Warming and think it's not something we should worry about, then I suggest you go read about the consequences of Global Warming.
The weather on earth have always been changing, and it still is. Humans can't do shit about it. It's nature. End of story, end of debate. Polar bears: [IMG]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-XppkSerKDtI/TfZ2VEUzYrI/AAAAAAAAKU0/SHabUe-BGXE/s1600/Polar_Bear_ANWR_1.jpg[/IMG] [editline]19th September 2011[/editline] [IMG]http://www.glogster.com/media/5/20/8/30/20083032.jpg[/IMG] [editline]19th September 2011[/editline] [IMG]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2349/2222146906_a7d04c8279.jpg[/IMG] [editline]19th September 2011[/editline] [IMG]http://www.wallpapers-free.org/wallpapers/15/Polar_Bear_Snow.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=CHRHN;32378610]The weather on earth have always been changing, and it still is. Humans can't do shit about it. It's nature. End of story, end of debate. Polar bears: [/QUOTE] Sorry, it's not the end of the discussion because you are demonstrably wrong. Climate change is a fact that has been increasing gradually since the industrial revolution.
Global warming isn't really "global warming" The media dubbed it "Global Warming" when in reality its the preceding events of the next ice age.(Climate change.)
It's not a hoax, the temperature is getting unnaturally high, and natural disasters are more likely to happen. Plus taking oil out of the ground creates gaps which the plates have to move to compensate for the empty space, which causes more earthquakes, and they trigger volcanic eruptions. This volcano may erupt soon and will be 10 times as powerful as krakatoa, or around 800 megatons of energy released. The global temperature will be porbably drop 1.7 degrees. While this will reduce the temperature, a shit ton of people will starve because lots of crops will fail.
Although there are disadvantages to the earth warming there are a number of advantages. * As temperatures rise various lands will experience favourable conditions for growing crops, whilst some land will be lost towards the equator the amount gained (Since a massive amount of land exists in the northern hemisphere) will most likely offset the agricultural land lost. *Various artic passages, such as the northwest passage will open up and allow shipping through. This can allow for increased movement and expands the options for various nations as new ports, towns and the such can sprout up. *Changing seasons will allow for more favourable growing seasons in some areas. *There will be less energy expended on keeping warm in colder climates. (Warm areas only really require good shade and loose clothes to keep cool.) This also means less people die due to cold related problems. *Various border disputes will cease to exist. For example there used to be an island that Bangladesh and India competed over. Due to a rise in sea levels the island no longer exists and thus the potential casus belli (Just war) no longer exists. *Various mountains will increase in height as the ice melts, which can provide an advantage in some respects. *Greenland, Antartica, etc will be finally able to more easily exploit the mineral resources that exist in their lands, and allow for human settlement as more tolerable climates arise.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]Although there are disadvantages to the earth warming there are a number of advantages. * As temperatures rise various lands will experience favourable conditions for growing crops, whilst some land will be lost towards the equator the amount gained (Since a massive amount of land exists in the northern hemisphere) will most likely offset the agricultural land lost. *Various artic passages, such as the northwest passage will open up and allow shipping through. This can allow for increased movement and expands the options for various nations as new ports, towns and the such can sprout up. *Changing seasons will allow for more favourable growing seasons in some areas. *There will be less energy expended on keeping warm in colder climates. (Warm areas only really require good shade and loose clothes to keep cool.) This also means less people die due to cold related problems. *Various border disputes will cease to exist. For example there used to be an island that Bangladesh and India competed over. Due to a rise in sea levels the island no longer exists and thus the potential casus belli (Just war) no longer exists. *Various mountains will increase in height as the ice melts, which can provide an advantage in some respects. *Greenland, Antartica, etc will be finally able to more easily exploit the mineral resources that exist in their lands, and allow for human settlement as more tolerable climates arise.[/QUOTE] Wow it's like you didn't pay any attention to what we talked about in that other thread some days ago at all. I'd say the loss of OUR BIOSPHERE'S STABILITY outweighs any combination of pluses you may have. But if you want *s, fine *Vast areas of land, populated land will gradually turn into deserts. *Elevated sea levels will kill huge amounts of people *While you may get better growing in some areas, the areas currently used will be fucked in the ass, and using this 'newly free agricultural land' won't cover the deficit. *Massive and constant tropical storms, hurricanes etc are going to cause incredible economic damage. *Increased acidic content in the oceans will kill the corals and send out entire fucking hydrosphere into a spiral of doom. I'll say it again, we are not technologically advanced enough to terraform the planet, nor to support our civilizations from the newly strengthened elements in a meaningful fashion
There are "stages" the planet goes through that dramatically changes the temperature to sorts, but GW is a dramatic changes to the dramatic temperature changes. Yes, it is real, and yes, we had a large effect in it. GO TREES!
[QUOTE=EcksDee;32380082]Wow it's like you didn't pay any attention to what we talked about in that other thread some days ago at all. [/QUOTE] Although I am aware of the numerous disadvantages there is, there are a number of advantages which must be brought up, otherwise this would be a very one-sided thread.
[QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]Although there are disadvantages to the earth warming there are a number of advantages.[/QUOTE] That's one of the crazier opinions on this subject I've heard. [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]* As temperatures rise various lands will experience favourable conditions for growing crops, whilst some land will be lost towards the equator the amount gained (Since a massive amount of land exists in the northern hemisphere) will most likely offset the agricultural land lost.[/QUOTE] Do you have any evidence to back this up or is this just speculative? [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*Various artic passages, such as the northwest passage will open up and allow shipping through. This can allow for increased movement and expands the options for various nations as new ports, towns and the such can sprout up.[/QUOTE] Essentially we're exchanging our already established, expensive, and bustling economic centers for punier ones. [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*Changing seasons will allow for more favourable growing seasons in some areas.[/QUOTE] And deserts for others? [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*There will be less energy expended on keeping warm in colder climates. (Warm areas only really require good shade and loose clothes to keep cool.) This also means less people die due to cold related problems.[/QUOTE] What about tropical disease? [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*Various border disputes will cease to exist. For example there used to be an island that Bangladesh and India competed over. Due to a rise in sea levels the island no longer exists and thus the potential casus belli (Just war) no longer exists.[/QUOTE] Pushing billions of people inward won't cause border disputes? [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*Various mountains will increase in height as the ice melts, which can provide an advantage in some respects.[/QUOTE] Like what? [QUOTE=Sobotnik;32379890]*Greenland, Antartica, etc will be finally able to more easily exploit the mineral resources that exist in their lands, and allow for human settlement as more tolerable climates arise.[/QUOTE] To my knowledge, we intentionally leave Antarctica unclaimed to avoid a resource grab. Even then, Antarctica won't exactly be favorable land.
In regard to a scientific consensus. [IMG]http://i52.tinypic.com/2dryivc.png[/IMG] [quote=The Scientific Consensus of Climate Change Revisited (Grey, D. (2010))]Concerning the second measure of attribution, approximately 9% of the IPCC participants are less than convinced that most recent and near future climate change is, or will be, a result of anthropogenic causes and approximately 10% of the non-IPCC participants share the same opinion. 86% of IPCC participants are convinced that most recent and near future climate change is, or will be, a result of anthropogenic causes and approximately 85% of non-IPCC participants make the same claim. However, if these measures are assessed in terms of absolute certainty considering only the values of 1 and 7, the data indicates that none among the IPCC participants is 100% convinced that anthropogenic sources are not to blame but only 39% are fully convinced that they are to blame. Among the non-IPCC participants only approximately 0.5% expressed a level of certainty that anthropogenic cause are not to blame but only 33% expressed absolute certainty that they are to blame.[/quote] My idea of an a strong scientific consensus is one in which you would find almost 100% in the highest category. This shows quite a strong level of agreement but certainly not that.
[QUOTE=Overv;32378312]No, there are actually a lot of scientists publishing papers that point out flaws in the evidence for our influence in global warming. Values are left out, people are not sure how to interpret data and there is evidence that a similar increase in temperature occurred in the Middle Ages. I believes global warming is happening, but it isn't something we should be worried about.[/QUOTE] Actually the amount of climate scientists that think that global warming isn't an issue is definately a part of the minority seeing as 97% of all climate scientists believe that human activity is affecting global tempatures. There have been 2 seperate independant studies that have proven that the majority of climate scientists agree that this is pretty serious. First one being the [url=http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/06/04/1003187107.abstract]Anderegg[/url] study from 2010 that asked climate scientists if they thought humans are contributing to global tempatures and then the [url=http://tigger.uic.edu/~pdoran/012009_Doran_final.pdf]Doran[/url] study from 2009, both of which had identical results. [QUOTE=catbarf;32376297]People who say global warming is real: -Analysts -Al Gore -The entire scientific community People who say global warming is fake: -Oil tycoons -Their wholly-owned media subsidiaries Hmm, I wonder which is more trustworthy.[/QUOTE] You would find this interesting I think [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbW-aHvjOgM[/media] Debunking the debunkers.
[QUOTE=Tobba;32378197]I usually hate to hear / say "carbon emissions" because I hear it more in bullshit than science ("buy eletric cars save the planet" sort of shit, even ignoring that the elecricity they run on is made from mostly carbon based fuels) But seriously, we have been dumping, a lot of fucking shit, into our atmosphere Plus, using oil untill it runs out, probably limiting our options even more, arent even remotely a good idea[/QUOTE] Don't get me wrong, we're causing some serious harm around here and are definitely going to cause major irrevocable damage but I think global warming is beyond our capabilities. [editline]19th September 2011[/editline] I think we need to be environmentally conscious and work to protect our environment, but not for the reasons Al Gora says we should.
[QUOTE=wingless;32375507]Well, I personally believe that global warming is not a hoax. I mean, what if it isn't? Then we'd kinda be fucked. We'd lose a whole lot of land mass. Gonna pull a classic here: Better safe than sorry. Of course, I always try to be rational and generate my views based on the evidence presented and I haven't seen any decent evidence to convince me that it is a hoax.[/QUOTE] This. Better be prepared and take precaution than let it happen.
[B]New [highlight]NASA[/highlight] Data [highlight]Blow Gaping Hole[/highlight] In Global Warming Alarmism[/b] Read this: [url]http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2011/07/27/new-nasa-data-blow-gaping-hold-in-global-warming-alarmism/?partner=yahoofeed[/url] [url]http://pielkeclimatesci.wordpress.com/2011/07/26/new-paper-on-the-misdiagnosis-of-surface-temperature-feedbacks-from-variations-in-earth%E2%80%99s-radiant-energy-balance-by-spencer-and-braswell-2011/[/url] Fake, and Gore and his affiliates should be in jail. Also: [url]http://www.mdpi.com/2072-4292/3/8/1603/pdf[/url]
[QUOTE=EcksDee;32378231] [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c1/2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png[/img][/QUOTE] Need a real source on this other then Wikipedia since the History Channel (which I find to be VERY informitive, expect with the aliens) and my History teacher both say that even though we think the temps are high, we are still in a 'cool' stage of the earth. (technically, still in the ice age)
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