Anarchy: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need - General

Anarchy, and most other social theories actually, doesn't seem to acknowledge one major flaw- People Are Dicks. Eventually, someone will get into a group with some other people, they will bring their people, get a shitload of weapons, threaten everybody to bring them their possessions and basically start a medivel society all over again. It's inevitable; It's a part of the human nature, to get together in a group. The only way to stop it is to have an authority in charge of preventing it, but guess what dipshits? You basically created a government. It's a classic catch 22, you need to govern it in order for it to be anarchy, but when you govern it, it's no longer anarchy.

Anarchy wouldn't work because of people like me. I would gather everyone into a single state. :v:

[QUOTE=Billiam;24549129]Anarchy wouldn't work because of people like me. I would gather everyone into a single state. :v:[/QUOTE] View above post^^

[QUOTE=kayOkay;24548276]Read more. Also, is that Sarkozy in your avatar? looks prety close but hard to tell. Would be pretty funny if it was him. :v: [/QUOTE] search archy in google images also i find anarchy very offensive anarchy is a compound word made up of "an" and "archy". an means no, therefore anarchy means no archy

yeah anarchy is great just look at africa

[QUOTE]Hello, FP. See where the confusion already lies? The definition of the word itself brings up two totally opposed meanings."Confusion; chaos; disorder" and "that proposes the cooperative and voluntary association of individuals and groups as the principal mode of organized society." [*][B]SO YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THE ORGANIZED SOCIETY THINGIE?[/B] Yes. Anarchy as a political theory is the rejection of any form of government and monopolized power. Instead, the power goes to people who decide together instead of relying on a shitty governement. Under Anarchy everyone is equal, and no one will give you orders. Decisions are made by people together, instead of being made by a fat-ass in a fucking suit behind a desk hiding a secretary giving him a blow job. [/QUOTE] Way to go, overthrow the governament only to be replaced by some warmongering leader. Even the smallest group of people can't exist without a leader. Thats why under democracy we have a leader whose powers are limited and his decisions subject to approval by the majority. [QUOTE] [*][B]HURRR BUT WE ALReADY HAv DEMOCRACY!!!!111!1!![/B] Fuck you. Democracy is like the cake, it's a lie. And unlike the cake, democracy is bitter. Under democracy, you have the "power" of choosing who will rule you. Problem is, democracy gives you the choice between a set of parties and leaders, even though you do not recognize any of them as reliable. It is like monarchy, except that instead of recurring to violence to have a new leader, you just need to band together and choose the other cunt. Another thing about democracy, is that you can have your own party, and thus become the "leader" you dream of. problem is, in order to be anything other than that-guy-who-licks-boots-for-a-recommendation, you will need to get connections, powerful people behind you, a huge number of supporters,... in other words, you need to have a mass behind you, and you will become just one of the two parties half the country doesnt believe in. Another misconception people are bred with about Anarchy is that its the same as democracy when it comes to decision making. The main difference is that decisions are made by the people, instead of their "leaders". For example, lets say that FP is a bunch of workers in a factory, there is no CEO, and we are thinking of getting new machines. Those who are directly concerned with those machines first decide wether theyr are needed or no. Then, they talk about it with the rest of the workers, and if the budget of the factory allows it, they acquire them. Under democracy, the CEO would do everything, and the workrs will simply: *Deal With It*. [/QUOTE] Yes instead of a leader voted by the majority we should have a guy that manipulates the others using force. If some workers of the factory want to get a machine, and other don't, what do you do? You do whatever most people agree with. Democracy 101. You know, we don't have a hivemind. [QUOTE] [*][B]SO LET'S SAY THAT WE LIVE IN ANARCHY... I CAN RAPE THat HOT CHICK NEXT DOOR WITH MY FRIENDS??? CAN I BE BOOBIES??[/B] You can, but you will have to assume the consequences. Sorry for breaking your hot wet dream. The fact that Anarchy doesnt recognize a higher authority doesnt mean that you can do whatever you want. It is an old myth and a lie made up by politicians. There are different anarchist currents, some do set laws (but these are decided between people instead of parliaments), and others do not enjoy the thought of laws, but clearly state that you will be punished by the community for unethical and dumb comportement. I will give examples further down. Remember tha most laws are either limits set by governments to tie a little corporates, or limits set by corporates to limit other corporates.(uhum patents?) [/QUOTE] Ah, so under anarchy there are consequences to some actions! You what the fuck that is called? A LAW SYSTEM YOU DUMB FUCK. [QUOTE] [*][B]OK. SO, THIS SOUNDS PRETTY GOOD. BUT HERE IS THE PROBLEM...... IT WILL NEVER FUCKING WORK! AS SOON AS THE GOVT IS DOWN THERE WILL BE RIOTS AND RAPE AND CEST AND FURRIES!!! OMG FURRIEEEEEESSSSS!!!!![/B] It is true, that, due to the majority of people getting used to being lead (not getting laid), a fall of the state can for sure bring upon us riots and rape and furries. But remember that this is only because people got used to being lead (not getting laid). If people learned how to assume their responsabilities, learned to respect each other, and learned not to listen to Justin Bieber, you might be surprised, and you will be soon enough. [/QUOTE] Yes thankfully everyone is respectful and wont do anything like murder or rape because of the absence of law. [QUOTE] [*][B]AWWWWWWRIGHT!! I CAN GIVE YOU A BILLION EXAMPLES OF ANARCHY GOING WRONG!11 STARTING WITH /B/!!1 huRrrr[/B] And I can give more examples of capitalism, democracy, monarchy and religion going wrong. so STFU. D:< [/QUOTE] The diffrence is, anarchy fails in every single fucking aspect, unlike democracy, monarchy, capitalism or communism. [QUOTE] [B]THE GREATEST FLAW OF ANARCHISTS IS THAT THEY CONCIDER MANKIND NATURALLY GOOD, WHILE THEY ARE EVIL.[/B] There have been countless debates about this subject and I will put my personal view on this, concider it my own and dont bash on anarchy because of it, but bash on me. I do believe that there are people born good, and people born bad. But I ultimatly believe that a person who was tought since childhood that he should not steal, but instead work, will not steal but work when he grows older. I do believe that what affects the way people think and behave most is the environement, and, right now, 99% are born in an average or poor family, thinking of how to get the food for tomorrow and the rent for this month. Under such conditions its natural for people to give more priority to things such as money and personal wellfare instead of thinking of the rest. The greatest example of this are Buddhist monks, they rarely steal or rape, and that's because they were tought about karma, good, evil and the balance of things, acions, reactions and consequences. And thus, such persons do not behave badely since they know the consequences of their actions. This is a luxury not everyone has, and most are born in modest environments surrounded with ganstas and da police. I do not expect those persons to understand the idea behind Anarchy, and, indeed, it might not work for them, which is where the next question is important. [/QUOTE] People are naturally egotistical, theres no goddamn way around it. If a political system doesn't consider this from the start, it fails from the start. [QUOTE] [B]MY DAUGHTER WILL GET RAPED BY A PSYCHO :([/B] She wont. First off, for people with psychological disorders and all, they kill as many people with governments as without, so why do you worry? And, as I said earlier, common sense and a good behavior are needed in communities. Their might not be a police station nearby, but the commnity is called community for a reason. And, just fyi, those who break a community's rules generally face a "court" and are judged by the said community. [/QUOTE] Yes we should politely ask murderers not to kill and rapists not to rape that will totaly work, you are fucking genius, theres no need to enforce law [QUOTE] [B]HERP IMMA TAKE MAH GUN AND MAH BUDDIES, AND SHOOT DA BITCHES AND BE TEH LORD.[/B] Why would you do that? If you are an anarchist, who joined a community to live without the dumb authority behind you, you probably wont be dumb enough to rally people and declare yourself warlord, or to find gullible people willing to be your soldiers in the first place... [/QUOTE] YES APPEAL TO EVERYONES GOOD SENSE THAT ALWAYS WORKS [QUOTE] [B]ITS HUMAN NATURE TO APPOINT A LEADER!!!![/B] I spent the entire OP telling you that me and a couple of persons dont want a leader... [/QUOTE] What about the rest of the sane people with a fully developed frontal lobe that realized that society can't exist without a leader? [QUOTE] [B]WHAT FORM OF GOVERNMENT YOU HAVE?[/B] Anarchy. We decide together instead of waiting for a dumbster to make the wrong decisions and vote him off in favor of another dumbster. [/QUOTE] How exactly do you decide together? Hivemind? [B]IN THE END, YOU ARENT WITHOUT AUTHORITY, SINCE YOU SET RULES FOR OTHERS TO FOLLOW.[/B] There is a big difference between hierarchy and organization. We refuse hierarchy, but we do organize ourselves. This is what 99" of the people seem to forget. Organization without hierarchy is an oxymoron. [QUOTE] [B]ANARCHY IS GREAT IN THE SHORT TIME, I WANT TO SEE IT LONGLIVED.[/B] Thats what we all do, tell the government to give us the right to stay long enough, though... They dont enjoy it. [/QUOTE] So, how many people have to die so you dumbfucks realized that anarchy doesn't work? [QUOTE] [highlight]SO WHATS THE POINT OF THIS THREAD?[/highlight] Telling FP that there is a difference between chaos and anarchy, between hierarchy and organization. And that you should weep everytime the medias say 'anarchy' instead of 'chaos', because they are telling you lies.[/QUOTE] Anarchysts are mainly dumb fucks in their 20's who need a fucking reason to rebel against everyone and fuck shit up. If that isn't true, please give me an example of someone who is mentally sane and has a fully developed frontal lobe, and believes the bunch of crap you just wrote.

Anarchy could work in small communities, but with more than 200 poeple or so, there will be a group that fucks up.

only Anarcho-communism would work because the system we are in now is already ruled by the rich and taking away laws would just make everything alot easier for them and if we used technology right Anarcho-communism could work

[QUOTE=kayOkay;24539641]Christiania existed for nearly 40 years, and is still alive. :smug:[/QUOTE] stop posting

Anarchy will never work in modern day society. Now a days people require a delicate balance of freedom and societal order. Give the people too much freedom, you have no society AKA Anarchy (See Somalia). If you don't give people enough rights, you end up with society telling you what you can and cannot do. AKA Communism (See Red China and The Peoples Republic of Korea). If you give the people just enough freedom, and societal order, you have harmony, and this is what most of us strive for. However if you managed to get enough people who want absolute chaos, i suppose anarchy would work. Not many people I know would like to worry about dying everyday though.

I know everyone will rate you dumb for mentioning Communism but I rated you informative for using cute little bullet points.

Why do people still fail to understand that Anarchy != Chaos ? Anarchy is an organized community of people deciding what they do together instead of someone deciding for the others. It's an ugly summary but it's the big image. What happened in Somalia is Despotism, the strongest wins. Anarchy is democracy applied from the lower basis of the actual hierarchy, the people. You guys tend to think that as soon as the government is down, people will pull out their guns and go rogue... Some might do so, some might not. And if those who do not pull their guns want to live together, what makes them right or wrong? Ah yes, Somalians, because obviously since we don't have real examples of an anarchist society, the best thing we should do is concider it evil and wrong.

[QUOTE=EagleEye;24550162]Anarchy will never work in modern day society. Now a days people require a delicate balance of freedom and societal order. Give the people too much freedom, you have no society AKA Anarchy (See Somalia). If you don't give people enough rights, you end up with society telling you what you can and cannot do. AKA Communism (See Red China and The Peoples Republic of Korea). If you give the people just enough freedom, and societal order, you have harmony, and this is what most of us strive for. However if you managed to get enough people who want absolute chaos, i suppose anarchy would work. Not many people I know would like to worry about dying everyday though.[/QUOTE] not so they can be raised to not go crazy

[QUOTE=Eudoxia;24550236]I know everyone will rate you dumb for mentioning Communism but I rated you informative for using cute little bullet points.[/QUOTE] Much appreciated, Sagan. :buddy:

[QUOTE=kayOkay;24550357] You guys tend to think that as soon as the government is down, people will pull out their guns and go rogue... Some might do so, some might not.[/QUOTE] The some that do will end up organizing and terrorizing the ones that don't into giving them all of their stuff. This is what happens in every state that doesn't have a proper high authority. People either give a shit about their own life or about the group they are in. This is why "anarchy" is a concept that is always brought up by suburban, white, emo kids. They never saw the real douchbags and assholes that the world has to offer, so they instantly assume that there aren't any. [editline]12:10AM[/editline] [QUOTE=imasillypiggy;24550360]not so they can be raised to not go crazy[/QUOTE] There are currently 310,144,000 people in the united states. Do you really think you can educate every single one of them not to be an asshole? Of course not. In the end of the day, when the shit hits the fan, everybody is a dick.

technocracy could be said to be a form of anarchy but it isnt dumb and has a real plan

[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;24550782]technocracy could be said to be a form of anarchy but it isnt dumb and has a real plan[/QUOTE] Technocracy is basically fascism in a different dress, just because the people up top are educated does not mean that they aren't pricks. At any given moment they can turn rogue and do whatever the fuck they want. Again, assuming people aren't dicks is the worst thing you can do when making social structure. It has to be as jerk-proof as possible.

[QUOTE=A Dead Guy;24550729]The some that do will end up organizing and terrorizing the ones that don't into giving them all of their stuff. This is what happens in every state that doesn't have a proper high authority. People either give a shit about their own life or about the group they are in.[/QUOTE] And I never claimed that an anarchist society will have everyone in it, just those who won't go batshit insane without the police fondeling their pockets. [QUOTE=A Dead Guy;24550729]This is why "anarchy" is a concept that is always brought up by suburban, white, emo kids. They never saw the real douchbags and assholes that the world has to offer, so they instantly assume that there aren't any.[/QUOTE] Way to go, you don't even know a word about me, and you assume am a white emo kid? It's because I saw enough douchebags running away from the police on a daily basis that I thought of how much they needed the police, and how much I didnt. [editline]10:19PM[/editline] [QUOTE=A Dead Guy;24550895]Again, assuming people aren't dicks is the worst thing you can do when making social structure. It has to be [B]as jerk-proof as possible[/B].[/QUOTE] We also call that a police-state, more commonly known as the paranoia-state.

[QUOTE=A Dead Guy;24550895]Technocracy is basically fascism in a different dress, just because the people up top are educated does not mean that they aren't pricks. At any given moment they can turn rogue and do whatever the fuck they want. Again, assuming people aren't dicks is the worst thing you can do when making social structure. It has to be as jerk-proof as possible.[/QUOTE] oh thats not how it works i was talking about the kind that uses no people to rule anyone but use machines to make the decisions. let me guess you will now say but the machines will be are rulers! no thats also not how it works

[IMG]http://www.facepunch.com/fp/rating/tick.png[/IMG] Great thread OP.

Sadly, there is always someone who wants MORE POWER, and thats why he will try to fuck your shit up. Currently its the guys without heart, the guys wearing suits and calculating human lives like they are just numbers, if we had Anarchy it would either be the strongest guys or the ones with the best tech.

isn't that one of the first sentences in the Communist Manifesto? oh sorry it was [I]Criticism of the Gotha Program[/I] [quote][I]In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly—only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners:[/I] From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs![/quote]

[QUOTE=kayOkay;24539641]Christiania existed for nearly 40 years, and is still alive. :smug:[/QUOTE] Christiania is nowhere near an anarchy.

[QUOTE=Kybalt;24539638]hey guys i have a good idea. lets band together and take over some people, force them to do what we want. sound good? i agree. and bam no more anarchy.[/QUOTE] All political ideologies aside, this is a bullshit argument for one simple reason. Example: "hey guys i have a good idea. lets band together and take over some people, force them to do what we want. sound good? i agree. and bam no more democracy/communism/socialism/jews." It can be applied to anything, and doesn't really prove anything.

[QUOTE=BloodYScar;24551156]Sadly, there is always someone who wants MORE POWER, and thats why he will try to fuck your shit up. Currently its the guys without heart, the guys wearing suits and calculating human lives like they are just numbers, if we had Anarchy it would either be the strongest guys or the ones with the best tech.[/QUOTE] aka africa

[QUOTE=kayOkay;24539818]In order to be anarchist, you are already open minded enough to accept others. Have you ever heard of anarchists kicking jew butt or hindou ass? Because being anarchist implies that you accept others and concider yourself the equal of everyone else. Its under hierarchy that thoughts of superiority breed.[/QUOTE] Like any sizeable group of people is going to be fully open minded, accepting and consider themselves equal to everyone else.

Anarchy can work. Only the meek and the non-useful will be routed. If survival is the goal than its by no means impossible, Chances are though that it wont be the fucking Stepford Community with happiness and sunshine, but it worked once for a long time.

If everyone decides as a whole, you're still going to inevitably have a group of other people that take advantage of the rest.

look at gamestop,banks and wallmart then come back to me. it seems its not the government but money that is the problem

Anarchy is for twelve-year-olds. Once you get past the point where every command issued is a pain and a burden you realize that part of human nature is to do things for the betterment of someone else or at-least betterment of a group. Government is a natural adaptation of this. Law is just a group of accepted rules, so even in your definition of anarchy which mentioned people accepting certain rules, there would be Law. So even Anarchy is a form of Government. Live alone in the mountains and never talk to anyone again, that's the only way to truly be without law or hierarchy. Besides, states-of-head get to wear kick-ass hats, so I would be among the people to abuse the gang-assemblies of an Anarchist world.