[QUOTE=Hesychasmos;25887106]Extremism either way is a terrible thing:
Evangelistic Fundies - We all know how that ends up.
Strongly-opinionated Atheists - Whether you realize it or not, trying to "prove those disillusioned bible-thumpers wrong" is actually the same as forcing your own (non)beliefs on them. By trying to make them realize that "there is nothing to believe in," you're effectively attempting to convert them to your own ways.[/QUOTE]
Wow, that was almost entirely irrelevant.
[QUOTE=Jookia;25887153]Theism means you have faith in a supernatural being that you can't prove exists. This is irrational, flawed thinking and discards logic.
That's why I bash theism. Because it makes people stupid.[/QUOTE]
Stupid in what sense? Surely not intellectually stupid - many of the greatest minds have been religious.
Besides, proof is complex. To me, I have all the proof I need in the existence of God; I know Him, and feel Him. It's not proof I can use to prove to you, but it is stronger than any argument against the existence of God.
tl;dr - belief's personal.
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887127]I think I messed up my definition of secularity, give me one second.[/QUOTE]
In that case, fine. There's no issue. You're a rational person with faith in something that some of us consider irrational. It doesn't matter, we're not trying to stop you from believing in what you want to.
You need to understand that being an atheist is sort of like trying to take on an oncoming rhino with a shotgun to protect those around you. Yes, you're going to hurt some innocent people who are in your line of fire, but it needs to be done.
We're trying to argue against the idiots who want religion to control the government- or to have a place in science.
[QUOTE=Dr_Funk;25887132]Why bother arguing about religion on Facepunch? No-one's really going to change their mind.
E:
[b]Why does it matter how many atheists hold an office? You'd assume their views would be the same (by default) as any candidate who's views/policies /aren't/ influenced by religion.[/b][/QUOTE]
EXACTLY. but why dont they hold office? because the american public will not elect an atheist.
[QUOTE=Dr_Funk;25887132]
Why does it matter how many atheists hold an office? You'd assume their views would be the same (by default) as any candidate who's views/policies /aren't/ influenced by religion.[/QUOTE]
Because it shows religion's control over the states.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;25887131]they do when religious people vote for religious candidates into office that press on their religious agenda or make decisions that are affected by religion. [b]how many atheists hold a high public office in the USA? or anywhere really for that matter?[/b][/QUOTE]
As I said, these people aren't doing this as a result of religion telling them to, they are doing it because they are idiots. They assume atheists are evil, they are entirely incorrect.
[QUOTE=BBKF;25887135]Way to be an argumentative dick.
Don't come off all smug and smart after all I did was prove you wrong in how others religious beliefs actually affect my life. I gave a couple examples and all you did was try to make me out to be demonizing religion.
Stop arguing, you're bad at it.[/QUOTE]
I was simply pointing out how his generalisations of all religious people as voting only for religious candidates has its flaws.
That wasn't aimed at you, I edited and then talked abou your flaws. I seriously do not give a fuck if you bash religious people for trying to force their beliefs on you, go right ahead, actually I encourage it.
Stop arguing, you're bad at it.
[QUOTE=RayDark;25887155]Doug, you're as thick as an osmium planet, you believe that it's illogical, and due to it's illogicality, it is unfalsifiable, which is illogical in itself.
Your stupid and 'white knight' approach to the, 'U CAN PROVE IT RONG BUT I WILL ALWAYS BELIEVE ALLAH AKBAR' argument is utterly mentally deficient.
IF YOU KNOW ITS WRONG, AND ILLOGICAL, THEN IT IS IN FACT, WRONG AND ILLOGICAL, AND NO AMOUNT OF WHITE KNIGHTING WILL SAVE YOU FROM THAT FACT.
Got it?[/QUOTE]
Ok. I do not believe I am wrong. Illogical, perhaps. But [b]I[/b] don't think I'm wrong. I believe in God. That's it, plain and simple.
[QUOTE=Savaril;25887171]In that case, fine. There's no issue. You're a rational person with faith in something that some of us consider irrational. It doesn't matter, we're not trying to stop you from believing in what you want to.
You need to understand that being an atheist is sort of like trying to take on an oncoming rhino with a [b]shotgun[/b] to protect those around you. Yes, you're going to hurt some innocent people who are in your line of fire, but it needs to be done. We're trying to argue against the idiots who want religion to control the government.[/QUOTE]
shotguns are actually pretty fucking accurate.
[editline]6th November 2010[/editline]
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887182]Ok. I do not believe I am wrong. Illogical, perhaps. But [b]I[/b] don't think I'm wrong. I believe in God. That's it, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]
do you believe it to be logical to believe in a god?
[QUOTE=Dr_Funk;25887170]Stupid in what sense? Surely not intellectually stupid - many of the greatest minds have been religious.
Besides, proof is complex. To me, I have all the proof I need in the existence of God; I know Him, and feel Him. It's not proof I can use to prove to you, but it is stronger than any argument against the existence of God.
tl;dr - belief's personal.[/QUOTE]Stop molesting God.
[QUOTE=RayDark;25887155]Doug, you're as thick as an osmium planet, you believe that it's illogical, and due to it's illogicality, it is unfalsifiable, which is illogical in itself.
Your stupid and 'white knight' approach to the, 'U CAN PROVE IT RONG BUT I WILL ALWAYS BELIEVE ALLAH AKBAR' argument is utterly mentally deficient.
IF YOU KNOW ITS WRONG, AND ILLOGICAL, THEN IT IS IN FACT, WRONG AND ILLOGICAL, AND NO AMOUNT OF WHITE KNIGHTING WILL SAVE YOU FROM THAT FACT.
Got it?[/QUOTE]
but we're mean
so we're wrong
[QUOTE=Dr_Funk;25887170]Stupid in what sense? Surely not intellectually stupid - many of the greatest minds have been religious.
Besides, proof is complex. [B]To me, I have all the proof I need [/B]in the existence of God; I know Him, and feel Him. It's not proof I can use to prove to you,[B] but it is stronger than any argument against the existence of God.[/B]
tl;dr - belief's personal.[/QUOTE]
You're retarded, and don't capitalize 'Him', a stupid flying fairy doesn't deserve such recognition, and you have proved your entire argument flawed.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;25887173]EXACTLY. but why dont they hold office? because the american public will not elect an atheist.[/QUOTE]
Are Barrack Obama, US President's views influenced by his faith? Is this known to the American public? Is this why they voted for him?
I believe not. While yes, a small minority will elect someone /because/ of their faith, I think the majority will elect someone /regardless/ of their faith, and rather by their policies.
E: [QUOTE=RayDark;25887197]You're retarded, and don't capitalize 'Him', a stupid flying fairy doesn't deserve such recognition, and you have proved your entire argument flawed.[/QUOTE]
And you've just proved yourself not worth listening to.
[QUOTE=LCBADs;25887159]Wow, that was almost entirely irrelevant.[/QUOTE]
Atheism = no all-knowing being
Coercing those who believe in an all-knowing being into believing that there is no all-knowing being = forcing atheistic views on them
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887182]Ok. I do not believe I am wrong. Illogical, perhaps. But [b]I[/b] don't think I'm wrong. I believe in God. That's it, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]
Yes and that will be your downfall. Doug, if it is illogical, it is illogical, and it WILL be proven wrong. One way or another. If it takes another Reich to get people to believe that then so be it. If you voice your opinions, you deserve to have them crushed.
[QUOTE=Hesychasmos;25887215]Atheism = no all-knowing being
Coercing those who believe in an all-knowing being into believing that there is no all-knowing being = forcing atheistic views on them[/QUOTE]
is it forcing if someone changes their mind after hearing the facts of the situation?
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;25887102]
A few people who happen to be religious force their views on you so you assume that everyone who is religious does the same? Get your generalisations out of here.[/QUOTE]
HOW THE FUCK DID I EVEN IMPLY ALL RELIGIOUS PEOPLE ARE OUT TO GET ME.
You are so fucking stupid it's beyond being acceptable now, I said these are ways others beliefs can affect me. Not "all religious people are stupid loudmouth dicks." You seem to be the only one here with that problem.
You're not even arguing now, you're just making shit up and throwing baseless insults around.
[QUOTE=Dr_Funk;25887204]Are Barrack Obama, US President's views influenced by his faith? Is this known to the American public? Is this why they voted for him?
I believe not. While yes, a small minority will elect someone /because/ of their faith, [B]I think the majority will elect someone /regardless/ of their faith, and rather by their policies.[/B]
E:
And you've just proved yourself not worth listening to.[/QUOTE]
You're an idiot. The majority of America is catholic. This means, and has shown to be true, that they will vote for a catholic/christian person.
[QUOTE=RayDark;25887216]Yes and that will be your downfall. Doug, if it is illogical, it is illogical, and it WILL be proven wrong. One way or another. If it takes another Reich to get people to believe that then so be it. If you voice your opinions, you deserve to have them crushed.[/QUOTE]
who took a dump in your cherios.
[QUOTE=Hesychasmos;25887215]Atheism = no all-knowing being
Coercing those who believe in an all-knowing being into believing that there is no all-knowing being = forcing atheistic views on them[/QUOTE]
I know. What the hell does it have to do with his (and apparently yours, for that matter) definition of hypocrisy?
[quote]I think the majority will elect someone /regardless/ of their faith, and rather by their policies.[/quote]
okay you can think that but that certainly isnt what actually happens.
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887097]I'm sure he can. But that's not what I meant, it bugs me to see people interjecting and trying to manifest there beliefs into other peoples lives. And my stance on evolution, I believe in evolution more than Adam & Eve that's for damn sure. Homosexuality: Stay away from me and I'll let you do what you please. [B]Secularity has no place in government[/B].[/QUOTE]
You just fucked yourself.
Alright, I'm holding up my white flag here. I didn't mean to argue with anybody besides the people who came to shit up the thread. I respect your Kybalt and Raydark and many other people in here. But there are a select few that set me off. I apologize to any who I have offended or whatever.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;25887237]who took a dump in your cherios.[/QUOTE]
God.
[QUOTE=RayDark;25887234]You're an idiot. The majority of America is catholic. This means, and has shown to be true, that they will vote for a catholic/christian person.[/QUOTE]
Most are protestant, I'm pretty sure.
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887255]Alright, I'm holding up my white flag here. I didn't mean to argue with anybody besides the people who came to shit up the thread. I respect your Kybalt and Raydark and many other people in here. But there are a select few that set me off. I apologize to any who I have offended or whatever.[/QUOTE]
That's fine.
I'm atheist and I'm allowed to touch my dick.
And enter dark rooms without being scared of werewolves jumping on me.
[QUOTE=LCBADs;25887257]Most are protestant, I'm pretty sure.[/QUOTE]
I disagree.
[QUOTE=RayDark;25887249]You just fucked yourself.[/QUOTE]
Like I said, I had my definition of secularity mixed up. Again, I apologize for that. Church and state [b]do[/b] need separation. Religion has no room in politics.
[QUOTE=antair;25885990]I'm Christian as well, and would appreciate less hostility towards religion.[/QUOTE]
Funny, my next door neighbor has tried to convert me at least 3 times and invites me to religious events, each time I have shrugged it off politely and have not made a big deal out of it, omitting the fact that I don't even believe in a god each time.
I can generalize too, people bash religion on here because you people go out of your way to make yourselves known. You're like furries.
[QUOTE=Dougz;25887255]Alright, I'm holding up my white flag here. I didn't mean to argue with anybody besides the people who came to shit up the thread. I respect your Kybalt and Raydark and many other people in here. But there are a select few that set me off. I apologize to any who I have offended or whatever.[/QUOTE]
Your beliefs didn't set me off, the fact that you made this thread did. This thread is like that 'I have no faith in humanity' thread. It always has the same conclusion.
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