Making Facepunch better - Don't post about ratings
5,003 replies, posted
Now I'll actually need to read each thread thoroughly to figure out which posts are shitposts and which are funny.
Though I do understand the reasoning, ratings made it easier for me to enjoy SH.
It feels like sensationalist headlines is turning from a fun place to discuss the news with jokes, to a no fun allowed serious business forum.
Might as well just change the name to "news discussion" and strip all the fun out of it.
This is kind of a good change though.
Now you actually have to read the posts on the forum and not look at what icon it has at the bottom of the post, allowing you to form your own opinion and sharing it.
[QUOTE=gastyne;48152355]This is kind of a good change though.
Now you actually have to read the posts on the forum and not look at what icon it has at the bottom of the post, allowing you to form your own opinion and sharing it.[/QUOTE]
While that obviously does make sense, it retracts from the experience for people who skim through threads.
[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;48152235]Here is a brief insight into how we make decisions about the forum, since it was asked for:
The moderators informally discuss the intended goal, weighing in exactly how we could accomplish whatever we're aiming for. If changes to the layout or features are necessary for that, we talk about the pros and cons, etc, then do a rough vote. If Garry hasn't got anything to add, we order our Web Slave to make the changes. Then we just keep an eye on them for a bit to see if they're getting the desired effects, and tweak from there if necessary. It's a quick and informal process, but it gets the job done.
That ain't to say that you folks aren't included in the process, though. [I]This[/I] is part of that process. That's what this thread is for. You're giving feedback, dropping ideas, being all sassy and shit, and blah blah blah. It's all good, yo.
Rude!
No promises from me, though. I'm out of control! Nobody can stop me![/QUOTE]
It would be great if we could give feedback [I]before[/I] the changes are made instead of "It's changed now, deal with it."
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48152311]Also people with ratings really like being scape goat. Instead of debating on why they are against X argument they'd just rate you dumb rather then discussing about it.[/QUOTE]
Correct. In a discussion board, our primary focus is to foster discussion. Not discourage it.
Users seem to be getting the impression that the popularity contest that would manifest in Sensationalist Headlines served as a valid indicator of "true" posts — this couldn't be farther from the truth.
Further — we do not want emote opinion wars hampering a user's motivation to post. It takes 2 seconds to rate a user dumb, but it also takes 2 minutes to refute a user's post. A user who volunteered to participate in the discussion by posting an argument deserves more tangible and contentful respect in why he is incorrect — than silent misleading rating accumulations with no effort-based opinions.
[QUOTE=dai;48151173]and I feel the burn from lacking ratings in SH, I browse a lot myself, but I know the goal and we're watching to see how it works in practice. [B]If it sticks[/B], I WILL miss being utterly confused as to what I said the night before when I see shit like this on the ticker
[/QUOTE]
I somehow doubt there's a chance it'll ever come back, for better or worse.
As someone who frequents the SH a lot, I'm more or less indifferent to the loss of ratings. Most ratings in my threads there were for the articles themselves, not me. And I've never really cared whether someone thought my opinion was dumb or right, most who have really disagreed with me reply to me anyway.
Though I don't really think it'll have much of an impact on SH in the long run. It'll be interesting to see someone post an opinion where only those disagreeing can reply because those who would usually rate agree on it to show their support of said opinion would get banned for "why reply" if they posted their agreement.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;48152374]Correct. In a discussion board, our primary focus is to foster discussion. Not discourage it.[/QUOTE]
Then if ratings were such an issue in SH why have them anywhere? Seriously by that logic we just shouldn't have them on the site at all
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48152311]Another thing is with Ratings is that people have been banned for trolling with ratings in SH before. Can't remember the specific threads but that's been a case before.
Also people with ratings really like being scape goat. Instead of debating on why they are against X argument they'd just rate you dumb rather then discussing about it.
So removing ratings entirely in SH is good. SH should be a place of discussion not about who's got the biggest dumb box count or agree count.[/QUOTE]
Before we had ratings, people who disagreed simply did not reply with a post. Rating it dumb or not rating it is indifferent - the poster still isn't speaking.
i feel that ratings on op only in sh would be a good compromise if possible
[QUOTE=Leestons;48152373]It would be great if we could give feedback [I]before[/I] the changes are made instead of "It's changed now, deal with it."[/QUOTE]
That'd take out the fun.
[QUOTE=Sand Castle;48152278]
also how do you guys feel about adding more horizontal space for gold avatars[/QUOTE]
i'd actually love this. things feel too squishy atm
[QUOTE=Sand Castle;48152305]oh hahahaha
i just remember hearing at some point that steveuk had alleged access to a private fp web development subforum[/QUOTE]
FUNNY HUH?
[QUOTE=Robotboy655;48152438]FUNNY HUH?[/QUOTE]
y-yes, sir.... v-very funny
w-what are you doing with that knife?
[QUOTE=Starpluck;48152374]Correct. In a discussion board, our primary focus is to foster discussion. Not discourage it.
Users seem to be getting the impression that the popularity contest that would manifest in Sensationalist Headlines served as a valid indicator of "true" posts — this couldn't be farther from the truth.
Further — we do not want emote opinion wars hampering a user's motivation to post. It takes 2 seconds to rate a user dumb, but it also takes 2 minutes to refute a user's post. A user who volunteered to participate in the discussion by posting an argument deserves more tangible and contentful respect in why he is incorrect — than silent misleading rating accumulations with no effort-based opinions.[/QUOTE]
Agree and Disagree would still work in SH.
A post with 30 agrees is better than 31 posts all saying the same thing. They kept the threads readable for people who got there late.
So with lack of SH ratings, are posts similar to this going to be dealt with or something?
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/idwqJHp.png[/IMG]
I feel like this will occur more often now.
[QUOTE=Sand Castle;48152441]y-yes, sir.... v-very funny
w-what are you doing with that knife?[/QUOTE]
What knife? This thing?
[img]http://i.imgur.com/Rv4phZX.png[/img]
[QUOTE=Robotboy655;48152458]What knife? This thing?
[img]http://i.imgur.com/Rv4phZX.png[/img][/QUOTE]
is that a dildo
[editline]8th July 2015[/editline]
what are you doing with that dildo
[editline]8th July 2015[/editline]
please
no
[QUOTE=Starpluck;48152374]Correct. In a discussion board, our primary focus is to foster discussion. Not discourage it.
Users seem to be getting the impression that the popularity contest that would manifest in Sensationalist Headlines served as a valid indicator of "true" posts — this couldn't be farther from the truth.
Further — we do not want emote opinion wars hampering a user's motivation to post. It takes 2 seconds to rate a user dumb, but it also takes 2 minutes to refute a user's post. A user who volunteered to participate in the discussion by posting an argument deserves more tangible and contentful respect in why he is incorrect — than silent misleading rating accumulations with no effort-based opinions.[/QUOTE]
While that is true, I think it wouldn't hurt to keep a few ratings such as Agree, Disagree, Informative and Useful for quick opinions about posts from others. I found Informative and Useful especially handy if someone made a big post with information about the topic in it, as you could gauge from those ratings how relevant said information by that poster was. Late can stay for when someone is late at making a point (well, duh), and maybe bringing back Bad Reading just for SH if someone failed to read the article would have been okay too. I like refuting points from others too on certain topics, but I won't let a few boxes stand in my way when giving my opinion.
Just outright removing ratings for SH feels a bit weird to me considering that ratings are really part of Facepunch.
i broke my own merge
wow
Welcome to Making Facepunch Better™ [B]👌[/B]
Here at MFB, we specialize in glitter, rotation and opinion limitation devices.
How may we be of service?
[QUOTE=Sand Castle;48152470]is that a dildo
[editline]8th July 2015[/editline]
what are you doing with that dildo
[editline]8th July 2015[/editline]
please[/QUOTE]
It's a balloon sword you pervert.
[QUOTE=Jordax;48152478]While that is true, I think it wouldn't hurt to keep a few ratings such as Agree, Disagree, Informative and Useful for quick opinions about posts from others.[/QUOTE]
As reiterated prior — we do not believe the inclusion (or rather rating substitution) of an "Agree" or "Disagree" will change the Sensationalist Headline's rating-problematic behavior.
In response to my example of 'dumbing' a post, you held that having a "Disagree" would serve as a suitable replacement. My illustration of the example is not based on a rude or meaner rating such as 'dumb' which can be neutered down to disagree — but rather the impulsive tendency to disregard a post in a matter of seconds without debate — even as the poster deserved an elevated level of respect for taking several minutes to conjure his argument. This discourages the poster from continuing, and that act should only occur after a well-reasoned reciprocating response was directed at the original poster.
[QUOTE=~Kiwi~v2;48152442]
[editline]9th July 2015[/editline]
Sticking it where the sun don't shine.[/QUOTE]
Right in the Lappland.
At first I thought there was something wrong with my internet connection but I like the new SH, pls keep it this way.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;48152582]As reiterated prior — we do not believe the inclusion (or rather rating substitution) of an "Agree" or "Disagree" will change the Sensationalist Headline's rating-problematic behavior.
In response to my example of 'dumbing' a post, you held that having a "Disagree" would serve as a suitable replacement. My illustration of the example is not based on a rude or meaner rating such as 'dumb' which can be neutered down to disagree — but rather the impulsive tendency to disregard a post in a matter of seconds without debate — even as the poster deserved an elevated level of respect for taking several minutes to conjure his argument. This discourages the poster from continuing, and that act should only occur after a well-reasoned reciprocating response was directed at the original poster.[/QUOTE]
While I like making long, drawn-out counter-arguments, not everyone is obsessively contrarian as I am.
I also cannot see how this explicitly benefits this cause. Nobody is going to say "oh, I can't post a disagree rating, guess I'll actually write something instead". Those people are now essentially cut off from contributing anything.
Very, [i]very[/i] rarely have I seen any posts which are wrong, but are in good faith and deserve a rational response. Most of the time, it's legitimate shitposting that doesn't deserve any recognition beyond a box. Those are the kind of posts which [i]should[/i] be disregarded in a manner of seconds without debate. They deserve no such thing because they are either blatantly inflammatory or just irrationally stupid.
Might as well see how it works out before arguing for or against it.
will titles or username changes ever come back, please answer
[QUOTE=Sand Castle;48152649]will titles or username changes ever come back, please answer[/QUOTE]
Uh,probably not.
[QUOTE=Robotboy655;48152657]Uh,probably not.[/QUOTE]
I think one of the mods here has done a few under-the-table name changes for people!
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