Why hasn't "under god" been removed from the American pledge? - General

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18753955]Actually the number one religious affiliation within the U.S. is Christianity. 159,030,000 adult members Followed by non-religious/secular members: 27,539,000 The difference is staggering. source: [url]http://www.adherents.com/rel_USA.html#religions[/url] It doesn't change the fact however, that a majority should rule the whole mass. When it comes to other things that is. This one word thing is stupid.[/QUOTE] So? That doesn't make us a Christian nation. That makes us a nation with Christian's in it. What? No. That's fucking stupid. That ruins the whole point of a representational democracy. [editline]11:52PM[/editline] [QUOTE=zombiefreak;18754005]Most of our laws are based on the bible.[/QUOTE] Oh really. Name all of the ten commandments that are part of US law.

[QUOTE=zombiefreak;18754005]Most of our laws are based on the bible.[/QUOTE] This is definitely a case of trolling...

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18753897]No we're not ya dumbass. The whole point of this country was to escape from a "christian nation".[/QUOTE] And now you're far more Christian than us :smug:

[QUOTE=smurfy;18754048]And now you're far more Christian than us :smug:[/QUOTE] I call genetic drift.

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18754027]So? That doesn't make us a Christian nation. That makes us a nation with Christian's in it. What? No. That's fucking stupid. That ruins the whole point of a representational democracy. [/QUOTE] Hi. Welcome to the real world. Representational democracy doesn't work. The whole pourpuse of republicanism was to maintain disinterestedness. There are too many agendas working today to allow politicians to work while weighing both sides. This is the best government we could come up with to date. It's not perfect. But we got nothing better. Both communism and democracy are good theoretically. Communism fails to work well in practice. So does democracy, however it's slightly less of a fuck up.

[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;18742631]It's blatantly unconstitutional as it infringes on separation of church and state, and it was only added during the Cold War by some priest because back then if you were an atheist you were considered a Russian red commie who wanted to burn the capitalist pigs. Goddammit, america. Same goes for the motto "In God We Trust" now that I think about. Fff-[/QUOTE] First off, it's a phrase, you don't have to say it if you don't want to, but it's not unconstitutional. Now, if everyone was forced to celebrate Christmas, and only Christmas, then that would be unconstitutional, because the Church would be forced on the State, the state being the people. Secondly, there was no such thing as Communism back in the 1860's, save for "The Communist Manifesto" by Karl Marx, but other then that it wasn't even an established party in any country, so what you just said was retarded. Thirdly, why do you care so much about a phrase, leave it be, it's not hurting anyone except butthurt atheists who want EVERYONE to be atheist, quit forcing your views upon people.

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18754085]Hi. Welcome to the real world. Representational democracy doesn't work. The whole pourpuse of republicanism was to maintain disinterestedness. There are too many agendas working today to allow politicians to work while weighing both sides. This is the best government we could come up with to date. It's not perfect.[/QUOTE] Uh, hello non sequitor. So you admit that this is a representational democracy and therefor the majority doesn't directly rule the country? [editline]11:58PM[/editline] [QUOTE=purvisdavid1;18754114]First off, it's a phrase, you don't have to say it if you don't want to, but it's not unconstitutional. Now, if everyone was forced to celebrate Christmas, and only Christmas, then that would be unconstitutional, because the Church would be forced on the State, the state being the people. Secondly, there was no such thing as Communism back in the 1860's, save for "The Communist Manifesto" by Karl Marx, but other then that it wasn't even an established party in any country, so what you just said was retarded. Thirdly, why do you care so much about a phrase, leave it be, it's not hurting anyone except butthurt atheists who want EVERYONE to be atheist, quit forcing your views upon people.[/QUOTE] Er, the cold war was in the 1960s. And communism did in fact exist at that time.

[QUOTE=purvisdavid1;18754114]First off, it's a phrase, you don't have to say it if you don't want to, but it's not unconstitutional. Now, if everyone was forced to celebrate Christmas, and only Christmas, then that would be unconstitutional, because the Church would be forced on the State, the state being the people.[/QUOTE] Children are forced to say the phrase and therefore have to acknowledge there is a God and he has power over them. [QUOTE=purvisdavid1;18754114]Secondly, there was no such thing as Communism back in the 1860's, save for "The Communist Manifesto" by Karl Marx, but other then that it wasn't even an established party in any country, so what you just said was retarded.[/QUOTE] "under God" was added in the 1950's or 60's or something [QUOTE=purvisdavid1;18754114]Thirdly, why do you care so much about a phrase, leave it be, it's not hurting anyone except butthurt atheists who want EVERYONE to be atheist, quit forcing your views upon people.[/QUOTE] That's the point, the country's government is suppose to be secular.

lolatheists

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18754133]Uh, hello non sequitor. So you admit that this is a representational democracy and therefor the majority doesn't directly rule the country?[/QUOTE] I edited my post to help you understand it better. This country doesn't work on the idea set up by democracy, because no one person is unbiased, or without interests in either side of policy. Therefore, majority tends to rule. It's not right, but it's just the way it is. It's the best thing we could come up with.

[QUOTE=Maegord;18753384]God. And if they tried to remove "under god" from it. Can you imagine the protests and how pissed off people would be? Remember that still majority of the nation believes in god.[/QUOTE] About 95% of the population believes in god, to be exact. Negligible minority aren't they?

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18754180]I edited my post to help you understand it better. This country doesn't work on the idea set up by democracy, because no one person is unbiased, or without interests in either side of policy. Therefore, majority tends to rule. It's not right, but it's just the way it is. It's the best thing we could come up with.[/QUOTE] What? So? Even then the point is that the majority of the American people doesn't automatically rule the country. You could say that perhaps the publicly appointed representatives rule the country, but they have to abide by the separation of church and state and can't favor any religion. Meaning this can't be a "christian country". And more non sequitor cynical nonsense.

[QUOTE=Billiam;18754040]This is definitely a case of trolling...[/QUOTE] It was a troll to make a point. A point which no one got.

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18754133]Er, the cold war was in the 1960s. And communism did in fact exist at that time.[/QUOTE] Oh shit I completely misread that, I thought he said it was added during the civil war because a priest was fearful of communists. :facepalm:

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18754228]What? So? Even then the point is that the majority of the American people doesn't automatically rule the country. You could say that perhaps the publicly appointed representatives rule the country, but they have to abide by the separation of church and state and can't favor any religion. Meaning this can't be a "christian country". And more non sequitor cynical nonsense.[/QUOTE] But they do. The majority does rule this nation. This is why gay's can't marry for example. This is also why the word "under god" isn't going anywhere. You can cry about it all you want, but thats life, and you need to stop living in a bubble where you think the world is fair and just, and living up to the ideal upon which it was founded. Blacks couldn't vote or have basic civil liberates for hundreds of years, until the MAJORITY agreed to extend those rights to them. It took fighting, and not arguing little wording and phrasing of documents.

[QUOTE=Derubermensch;18754181]About 95% of the population believes in god, to be exact. Negligible minority aren't they?[/QUOTE] About as large as black people and gays, and they get plenty done. [editline]12:09AM[/editline] [QUOTE=purvisdavid1;18754276]Oh shit I completely misread that, I thought he said it was added during the civil war because a priest was fearful of communists. :facepalm:[/QUOTE] what how did you even get there that's like misreading "they'd proven vampires don't exist hundreds of years ago!" as "Richtor Belmont killed all the vampires hundreds of years ago!"

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18754300]But they do. The majority does rule this nation.[/QUOTE] No. That is the point of a Constitution, so that there are things about the nation that can't be changed just because a majority wants to change them. The fact that America is secular is one of these things.

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18754306]About as large as black people and gays, and they get plenty done.[/QUOTE] They aren't alone. During the civil rights movement, white protesters fighting for back rights outnumbered african-americans three to one.

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18754300]But they do. The majority does rule this nation. This is why gay's can't marry for example. This is also why the word "under god" isn't going anywhere. You can cry about it all you want, but thats life, and you need to stop living in a bubble where you think the world is fair and just, and living up to the ideal upon which it was founded. Blacks couldn't vote or have basic civil liberates for hundreds of years, until the MAJORITY agreed to extend those rights to them. It took fighting, and not arguing little wording and phrasing of documents.[/QUOTE] Un-American(Not non-applepie and football Un-American the real kind) post. Though I have to agree to an extent, but that doesn't change the fact that "under God" is stupid huh? And that the minority can change things for the better. Sometimes.

[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;18754341]No. That is the point of a Constitution, so that there are things about the nation that can't be changed just because a majority wants to change them. The fact that America is secular is one of these things.[/QUOTE] I understand that is what the constitution lays out as the law. It does not mean it is followed. It's a flawed system. [editline]12:11AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Billiam;18754363] Though I have to agree to an extent, but that doesn't change the fact that "under God" is stupid huh?[/QUOTE] it's just a word. I'm an atheist so the phrase is meaningless to me.

[QUOTE=BobbyDigital;18754368]I understand that is what the constitution lays out as the law. It does not mean it is followed. It's a flawed system.[/QUOTE] So you're saying we shouldn't complain when the government does something it clearly should not be doing?

[QUOTE=JohnnyMo1;18754400]So you're saying we shouldn't complain when the government does something it clearly should not be doing?[/QUOTE] Complain all you want. It just wont change a thing. The government stopped following the constitution strictly ever since Hamiltonian views became widespread. Roosevelt's New Deal was HORRIBLY unconstitutional, and people scolded him for it. It's a cyclic pattern, and this one phrase is just pointless to argue about. I much rather spend time protesting gay marriage bans, and anti-abortion laws. Those are what's killing the nation, not a few words in a little ceremonial phrase no one is forced to say.

Ha, have you seen current court cases, we dont follow the constitution, might as well give it to south Africa to use. More like guily until proven innocent. Just because you think it's "cool" to rebel against the U.S. by being unique. Just because you are unique doesnt make you useful. Move to Canada then you won't have to deal with saying that tiny little bit of the pledge that you whine about. Welcome to the real world, its not getting changed.

Did you know that the top of the Washington Memorial (The pencil thing, I don't remember the name) says "In God We Trust" on a plaque on top of it?

Its part of our heritage and history. No one can force you to take the pledge anyway. Its not a big deal We might as well remove the word "God" from all of out historical documents that founded the United States by your logic

Yeah shit, we better destroy that and the statue of liberty, and most landmarks, cant have a religous country because it goes against the constitution SHIT!

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;18753983]what seriously, that makes no sense what are you trying to say[/QUOTE] I'm trying to say that if the Pledge is about Americans' rights then removing God would be removing the right to God and America would be a Godless country and everyone would go to hell. Just because you don't want to say God. Wanker.

If you really care about the lyrics of the pledge, start a protest or civil movement. There's too many Christians in America for your opinion to matter, anyways.

I pledge allegiance to the united states of America and to the republic for which it stands a bunch of states under atheist rule, divisible, and jobs for all!

[QUOTE=Kymandu;18754757]I pledge allegiance to the united states of America and to the republic for which it stands a bunch of states under atheist rule, divisible, and jobs for all![/QUOTE] Oh fuck I read that wrong -snip-