Why hasn't "under god" been removed from the American pledge? - General

[QUOTE=Trotsky;18765993]Jefferson was a badass you fuck.[/QUOTE] Jefferson ain't nothin' but a lil' bitch.

[QUOTE=TheAnarchist;18765968]Who the fuck cares about Jefferson?[/QUOTE] Fuck you he was a boss

[QUOTE=Kukuzi;18766013]Fuck you he was a boss[/QUOTE] In any case he's definitely not anymore.

His contributions to the US will remain in memory longer than anything you will do :smug:

God is in the pledge because people back then were very religious and it has just stayed there since. But seriously, so what if it's in there? Just because you may not believe in God, doesn't mean it will kill you to say it. I stand up to the pledge because I live in this country and I give respect to those who died for it, not whining over it because "God" is in it. Grow up

It's not infringing on separation of church and state. The church isn't making or changing any laws here. Besides, it's not a big deal. So 'under God' is in the pledge, it's not really doing any harm. Deal with it, it's called being tolerant. Religious kids who go to public schools have to do it whenever they learn about evolution, which is taught because it is not a religious belief but a secular theory. Because church and state are separate, as they should be.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;18766093]It's not infringing on separation of church and state. The church isn't making or changing any laws here. Besides, it's not a big deal. So 'under God' is in the pledge, it's not really doing any harm. Deal with it, it's called being tolerant. Religious kids who go to public schools have to do it whenever they learn about evolution, which is taught because it is not a religious belief but a secular theory. Because church and state are separate, as they should be.[/QUOTE] I just wonder if the people who defend "Under God" being in the pledge would also be as passive if it read "Under Allah" I would love to see the uproar from an action like that. All the while the Muslims are loling repeating just what you said, "be tolerant".

[QUOTE=Kymandu;18754655]Ha, have you seen current court cases, we dont follow the constitution, might as well give it to south Africa to use. More like guily until proven innocent. Just because you think it's "cool" to rebel against the U.S. by being unique. Just because you are unique doesnt make you useful. Move to Canada then you won't have to deal with saying that tiny little bit of the pledge that you whine about. Welcome to the real world, its not getting changed.[/QUOTE] Yeah I'm just an egotistical teen who's cool who likes to rebel against the governments fuck government ANARCHY!!! Stop being dumb. [quote=Kymandu]Yeah shit, we better destroy that and the statue of liberty, and most landmarks, cant have a religous country because it goes against the constitution SHIT! [/quote] What does the statue of liberty have to do with religion. And having a religious country DOES go against the constitution, if it's government supported. [quote=lazyguy]I'm trying to say that if the Pledge is about Americans' rights then removing God would be removing the right to God and America would be a Godless country and everyone would go to hell. Just because you don't want to say God. Wanker. [/quote] Have you ever read the constitution and/or our rights or are you just a dumbass.

[QUOTE=Kukuzi;18766137]I just wonder if the people who defend "Under God" being in the pledge would also be as passive if it read "Under Allah" I would love to see the uproar from an action like that. All the while the Muslims are loling repeating just what you said, "be tolerant".[/QUOTE] Allah is a god. The word "god" does not mean Jesus or whoever. For all I know, it means the flying spaghetti monster god I believe in.

[QUOTE=TheAnarchist;18766000]Jefferson ain't nothin' but a lil' bitch.[/QUOTE] he had sex with his Slave and was an amateur scientist.

[QUOTE=Kukuzi;18766137]I just wonder if the people who defend "Under God" being in the pledge would also be as passive if it read "Under Allah" I would love to see the uproar from an action like that. All the while the Muslims are loling repeating just what you said, "be tolerant".[/QUOTE] Do you know about the religion of Islam? Allah is considered to be the same God as the God of the Isrealites (the Christian God). Saying 'under Allah' is a specific exclusion of the Christian religon, like saying Yahweh would exclude Muslims. And you bet there'd be an uproar if it was changed to 'under Allah'. We've got troops fighting radical terrorists in the middle east, and we still keep 9/11 in memory. There's a very negative stereotype of Muslims in the US, so a nation under Allah wouldn't go so well.

[QUOTE=Ragy;18766059]God is in the pledge because people back then were very religious and it has just stayed there since. But seriously, so what if it's in there? Just because you may not believe in God, doesn't mean it will kill you to say it. I stand up to the pledge because I live in this country and I give respect to those who died for it, not whining over it because "God" is in it. Grow up[/QUOTE] hey look, it's ragy not understanding church/state separation and thinking someone threatens his freedoms. [editline]05:54PM[/editline] [QUOTE=NoShogun;18766093]It's not infringing on separation of church and state. The church isn't making or changing any laws here. Besides, it's not a big deal. So 'under God' is in the pledge, it's not really doing any harm. Deal with it, it's called being tolerant. Religious kids who go to public schools have to do it whenever they learn about evolution, which is taught because it is not a religious belief but a secular theory. Because church and state are separate, as they should be.[/QUOTE] Schools are public institutions municipal buildings separation of church and state keeps religion out out of the state. schools = public public = state you see I dumbed this down because you haven't read the thread

[QUOTE=Ragy;18766253]Allah is a god. The word "god" does not mean Jesus or whoever. For all I know, it means the flying spaghetti monster god I believe in.[/QUOTE] I think most people know what God they are referring to. Yes, no shit it wouldn't go over well.

[QUOTE=TheAnarchist;18765968]Who the fuck cares about Jefferson?[/QUOTE] yeah man it's not like he wrote up one of the most important documents in the united states's formation yeah who cares. also see above he was quite awesome.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;18766259]Do you know about the religion of Islam? The Allah is considered to be the same God as the God of the Isrealites (the Christian God). Saying 'under Allah' is a specific exclusion of the Christian religon, like saying Yahweh would exclude Muslims. And you bet there'd be an uproar if it was changed to 'under Allah'. We've got troops fighting radical terrorists in the middle east, and we still keep 9/11 in memory. There's a very negative stereotype of Muslims in the US, so a nation under Allah wouldn't go so well.[/QUOTE] but people don't know that. That's the catch.

The two religions are so ridiculously close it is amazing. The two are practically cousins, I was using it as an example of "tolerance".

[QUOTE=Kukuzi;18766353]The two religions are so ridiculously close it is amazing. The two are practically cousins, I was using it as an example of "tolerance".[/QUOTE] Most religions developed and took ideas from others.

[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;18766309]yeah man it's not like he wrote up one of the most important documents in the united states's formation yeah who cares. also see above he was quite awesome.[/QUOTE] The U.S. has long ago dropped Jeffersonian ideals. Did you know he would have hated major cities and the majority of the population living in them? Jefferson believed that our country should be an agrergian republic, and that the only freedom is the freedom of owning land, and being able to grow your own crops to feed yourself and your family.

[QUOTE=Ragy;18766371]Most religions developed and took ideas from others.[/QUOTE] There is even some controversy over what religion was the first monotheists. Not to say that anyone should really care, but I am pretty sure self appointed Ancient Egyptian prophet claimed to worshiped only one God. Although he acknowledged the others, some would call this henotheism.

[QUOTE=Trotsky;18766278] Schools are public institutions municipal buildings separation of church and state keeps religion out out of the state. schools = public public = state you see I dumbed this down because you haven't read the thread[/QUOTE] I read the thread. So if schools equal state, how are we infringing on schools? Students shouldn't be forced to say the pledge, but removing the word 'God' would be a slap in the face to anyone who does believe in a God. The basis of monotheistic religion is faith in a God. Denying the existence of that God is considered, within the religion, wrong. However, it's no skin off an atheist or agnostic's bones to say 'under God'.

[QUOTE=Trotsky;18765993]Jefferson was a badass you fuck.[/QUOTE] Hey we can agree on stuff politically RESURRECT TJEFF

[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;18742649]It's the document that grants me my individual rights as an American citizen, I kind of care about it.[/QUOTE] A goddamn paper doesn't give you rights. You inherit human rights when you are born, shit like the constitution are there to remind governments not to step on them.

[QUOTE=demoguy08;18766702]A goddamn paper doesn't give you rights. You inherit human rights when you are born, shit like the constitution are there to remind governments not to step on them.[/QUOTE] I'm gonna have to go with Carlin on this one [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F1Lq1uFcAE[/media]

[QUOTE=demoguy08;18766702]A goddamn paper doesn't give you rights. You inherit human rights when you are born, shit like the constitution are there to remind governments not to step on them.[/QUOTE] Yeah, so without a constitution I might as well not have them because they can just step all over it. The constitutuion labels the rights people have when they are born. Not all countries have that, and their governments step on them aways, so yes, it technically does. [quote=BobbyDigital]The U.S. has long ago dropped Jeffersonian ideals. [/quote] Uhm, bro, I never said anything about his ideals. I was talking about his importance in writing the Declaration, we all know his political ideals were silly.

Why is the phrase "god save the queen" still used in the UK and why do they still sing an entire song about it? I'll tell you why, TRADITION! Deal with it.

[QUOTE=Kymandu;18754655]Ha, have you seen current court cases, we dont follow the constitution, might as well give it to south Africa to use. More like guily until proven innocent. Just because you think it's "cool" to rebel against the U.S. by being unique. Just because you are unique doesnt make you useful. Move to Canada then you won't have to deal with saying that tiny little bit of the pledge that you whine about. Welcome to the real world, its not getting changed.[/QUOTE] Dude I'm like 25 years old. Don't tell me to go to Canada. You go to Canada. Canadian. [editline]10:21AM[/editline] [QUOTE=SM0K3 B4N4N4;18767467]Why is the phrase "god save the queen" still used in the UK and why do they still sing an entire song about it? I'll tell you why, TRADITION! Deal with it.[/QUOTE] Because we're Queen fetishists.

I'm totally ignoring the past 10 pages of responses and answering the OP's question: "Under God" was added to the pledge in the 1940's because Jahova's Witnesses' belief system doesn't allow them to pledge themselves to anything other than God or God-affiliated things. The Government saw this as a potential problem, with a bunch of possible rebels running around in the states, so they added 2 words to the pledge in order to ensure their allegience to the States. That's the short answer, at least. [editline]12:26PM[/editline] [QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;18742979]The USA was not founded on Christianity.[/QUOTE] Yes, it was. The reason we, as a country, are so generally conservative as opposed to the liberal atmosphere of almost every other major western country is because our country is loosely founded upon the beliefs of the Puritans, an extremely conservative Christian sect. They were the first people to arrive and set up colonies, so obviously their beliefs are still at least a little bit present with us now.

[QUOTE=Reflectent;18742653]That's the pledge, not the Constitution.[/QUOTE] Look at the thread title.

[QUOTE=Kukuzi;18766137]I just wonder if the people who defend "Under God" being in the pledge would also be as passive if it read "Under Allah" I would love to see the uproar from an action like that. All the while the Muslims are loling repeating just what you said, "be tolerant".[/QUOTE] Allah is in a different language. It's just God in Arabic. Muslims believe in the same god as Christians and Jews.

As an Athiest, I can say. Why does anyone give a fuck?