[QUOTE=l l;37176179]was your choice of words intentional or just a coincidence? :v:[/QUOTE]
Huh?
If you can eat solid foods again, your shit WOULD be pretty much back to normal is what he's saying
[QUOTE=postmanX3;37176061]I linked [URL="http://www.destructoid.com/the-importance-of-a-gay-gamer-convention-232467.phtml"]this article[/URL] in that thread.
I guess basically the point is that the gaming industry is obviously catered towards the straight, white teenage-to-30-ish demographic, and it'd just be nice to have a convention targeted at a gay demographic. It's also not exclusive or anything; straight people would be quite welcome, it just wouldn't be targeted at them, the same way E3's booth babes probably aren't targeted at gay guys.
So we don't "need" our own convention any more than straight people need conventions obviously aimed at them. It's just a cool way for like-minded people to congregate.[/QUOTE]
What makes a game gay, and why do gays have to be a target audience? The only difference between gays and straights is the sexuality, so in order to make 'gays' or 'straights' an actual target in the first place, a relationship or sexual content has to be included. There's no need for that. I don't actually like romance in my games, straight or not. I think that most gamers feel the same way, since titles like CoD and Battlefield are dominating the market, titles with absolutely no love-interests and complete action.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
Now I can understand it from a story perspective, but you have to realize most games don't have any in-depth story. For all we know a lot of well known video game characters are in fact gay.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
I'd actually like it even better if they didn't name their sexuality, so it'd be more open for interpretation. That makes everyone happy, and doesn't alienate one audience from the other.
On an unrelated note
[img]http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/23270_101894033193580_8306_n.jpg[/img]
Good goin' z
wow i got a message on my okcupid account for the first time.
i abandoned that site months ago.
[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;37177582]Now I can understand it from a story perspective, but you have to realize most games don't have any in-depth story. For all we know a lot of well known video game characters are in fact gay.
I'd actually like it even better if they didn't name their sexuality, so it'd be more open for interpretation. That makes everyone happy, and doesn't alienate one audience from the other.[/QUOTE]
in my mind, gordon freeman is the biggest gaylord in city 17
[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;37177582]What makes a game gay, and why do gays have to be a target audience? The only difference between gays and straights is the sexuality, so in order to make 'gays' or 'straights' an actual target in the first place, a relationship or sexual content has to be included. There's no need for that. I don't actually like romance in my games, straight or not. I think that most gamers feel the same way, since titles like CoD and Battlefield are dominating the market, titles with absolutely no love-interests and complete action.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
Now I can understand it from a story perspective, but you have to realize most games don't have any in-depth story. For all we know a lot of well known video game characters are in fact gay.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
I'd actually like it even better if they didn't name their sexuality, so it'd be more open for interpretation. That makes everyone happy, and doesn't alienate one audience from the other.[/QUOTE]
Why are you pandering to straight people?
In the event there's a relationship in a game, such as Mass Effect, it's nice to have the option to have a gay relationship. In the event they're making realistic characters, it might be an idea to include the odd gay character to make the game more relateable to.
Also you're coming from one very specific perspective - you can't claim to speak for most gamers. Even if most gamers don't like romance in their games, there's clearly a large potential market share of people who don't play COD or Battlefield that gaming devs could monetise by making games that appeal to them. I'm not actually a massive fan of bland point-and-shoots; I much prefer games with some narrative depth. Ultimately there's clearly a large market available for people who aren't just in to action games and devs are looking to target that market. The point-and-shoot is pretty nailed down, so maybe the devs want to make some sort of RPG or even a shoot-em-up with a cohesive story line - because if all the gamers are flooded with games like COD, let's get some people who aren't gamers to start playing games by making new games that appeal to them.
Take for example Half Life 2. That's an FPS but we also, at one point as a character, start engaging with Alyx and she basically flirts with us in the lift up to the Citadel roof. That's an example of heterosexuality in games. If a Dev wanted to make a similar game and perhaps have a gay character, a gaymercon would be a great way to get feedback.
Also the way a lot of games are going, things like sexuality are being expanded on more in depth - so there's more of a need to explore this sort of thing. I don't see how openly naming a character as gay alienates anyone but homophobes - we can play games with heterosexual characters and likewise straight people can play a game with a gay protagonist. The more fleshed out game storylines become, the more egregious the absence of gay people. Not even to mention transgender people, who don't really get a look-in in any games (except maybe Bridget, but that was always confusing).
A gaymercon tackles the issue of homophobia in the gaming community. Now, we're all apparently quite thick skinned but for some people, hearing the word "fag" or "faggot" casually thrown around can be quite disheartening. Moreover, the gaming community is [b]incredibly[/b] childish when it comes to things like gay people. See the response to Mass Effect 3 having a gay option - a bunch of people ended up posting on the BioWare forums "Eeew I don't want Shepard to be a faggot!" (he wasn't, it's just an option) or upon the revelation that in Bully you can kiss boys [i]as well as[/i] girls.
At the end of the day, even if you think there's no real need for a gaymercon, what's the harm in a gaymercon? It's not alienating anyone, because anybody who goes "I was supportive of gay rights, but now they're doing a gaymercon I'm a homophobe! >:(" was never actually supportive of us in the first place. Clearly a lot of people want a gaymercon - because otherwise it would never have gotten off the ground - and even if it's something that doesn't appeal to the hArDcOrE gAmErZ, then maybe this is a *con for people who aren't into that sort of game? There's a niche in the market that is being filled by the con.
Frankly I'm a bit suspicious of all the people who are going "We don't NEED a gaymercon! I'm EXACTLY the same as STRAIGHT PEOPLE!" because it sounds like you're going "I'm not that different! I'm exactly the same as you guys! ACCEPT MEEEE!". The only difference between straight guys and gay guys is that we like dick and they don't, but that's not a difference that can be easily brushed aside when we're under represented in the gaming world. Not to mention lesbians, bisexual people and transgender people - when was the last time you saw a lesbian protagonist who wasn't created just to appeal to the male gaze? When was the last time you saw a sensitively handled transgender anything?
almost tl;dr'd, glad I read it. Good write up.
Also yeah, I'm not gay, but I'm all for more gay options in games and stuff. It annoyed me in Mass Effect 2 how you could straight / lesbian but not gay.. putting it in wouldn't have hurt anyone lol..
[QUOTE=Gar~;37176953]If you can eat solid foods again, your shit WOULD be pretty much back to normal is what he's saying[/QUOTE]
Oh. OH. Okay, I feel a tad stupid now.
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;37169323]gaymer is the stupidest word i've ever heard[/QUOTE]
It's just a pisstake, doesn't really bother me til this convention bullcrap
[QUOTE=Splurgy_A;37180473][b]Why are you pandering to straight people?[/b]
In the event there's a relationship in a game, such as Mass Effect, it's nice to have the option to have a gay relationship. In the event they're making realistic characters, it might be an idea to include the odd gay character to make the game more relateable to.
Also you're coming from one very specific perspective - you can't claim to speak for most gamers. Even if most gamers don't like romance in their games, there's clearly a large potential market share of people who don't play COD or Battlefield that gaming devs could monetise by making games that appeal to them. I'm not actually a massive fan of bland point-and-shoots; I much prefer games with some narrative depth. Ultimately there's clearly a large market available for people who aren't just in to action games and devs are looking to target that market. The point-and-shoot is pretty nailed down, so maybe the devs want to make some sort of RPG or even a shoot-em-up with a cohesive story line - because if all the gamers are flooded with games like COD, let's get some people who aren't gamers to start playing games by making new games that appeal to them.
Take for example Half Life 2. That's an FPS but we also, at one point as a character, start engaging with Alyx and she basically flirts with us in the lift up to the Citadel roof. That's an example of heterosexuality in games. If a Dev wanted to make a similar game and perhaps have a gay character, a gaymercon would be a great way to get feedback.
Also the way a lot of games are going, things like sexuality are being expanded on more in depth - so there's more of a need to explore this sort of thing. I don't see how openly naming a character as gay alienates anyone but homophobes - we can play games with heterosexual characters and likewise straight people can play a game with a gay protagonist. The more fleshed out game storylines become, the more egregious the absence of gay people. Not even to mention transgender people, who don't really get a look-in in any games (except maybe Bridget, but that was always confusing).
A gaymercon tackles the issue of homophobia in the gaming community. Now, we're all apparently quite thick skinned but for some people, hearing the word "fag" or "faggot" casually thrown around can be quite disheartening. Moreover, the gaming community is incredibly childish when it comes to things like gay people. See the response to Mass Effect 3 having a gay option - a bunch of people ended up posting on the BioWare forums "Eeew I don't want Shepard to be a faggot!" (he wasn't, it's just an option) or upon the revelation that in Bully you can kiss boys [i]as well as[/i] girls.
At the end of the day, even if you think there's no real need for a gaymercon, what's the harm in a gaymercon? It's not alienating anyone, because anybody who goes "I was supportive of gay rights, but now they're doing a gaymercon I'm a homophobe! >:(" was never actually supportive of us in the first place. Clearly a lot of people want a gaymercon - because otherwise it would never have gotten off the ground - and even if it's something that doesn't appeal to the hArDcOrE gAmErZ, then maybe this is a *con for people who aren't into that sort of game? There's a niche in the market that is being filled by the con.
Frankly I'm a bit suspicious of all the people who are going "We don't NEED a gaymercon! I'm EXACTLY the same as STRAIGHT PEOPLE!" because it sounds like you're going "I'm not that different! I'm exactly the same as you guys! ACCEPT MEEEE!". The only difference between straight guys and gay guys is that we like dick and they don't, but that's not a difference that can be easily brushed aside when we're under represented in the gaming world. Not to mention lesbians, bisexual people and transgender people - when was the last time you saw a lesbian protagonist who wasn't created just to appeal to the male gaze? When was the last time you saw a sensitively handled transgender anything?[/QUOTE]
When the fuck was I doing that? Just because I don't give a shit about romance doesn't mean I'm 'pandering to the straights'. What is this, Fox News?
I was just simply stating I don't give a shit about those things and from gaming sales, most gamers don't either.
I can completely understand for games like Mass Effect where it's about choice. But you're comparing the fucking Bioware forums to the rest of the gaming community, which is once again a HUGE fucking mistep. Not only that, there was a legitimate reason why lots of people disliked the gay option in ME3; not because of the fact that it's gay, but rather that it comes off as completely abrupt and there is no middle ground. '"Are you gay?" *YES/NO* YES: Go almost immediately into gay fucking, no relationship crap at all. NO: "Aww"' end of story. It was fucking terrible writing. That's why people disliked it. That fucking hamburger helper ruined that scene.
[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;37182378]When the fuck was I doing that? Just because I don't give a shit about romance doesn't mean I'm 'pandering to the straights'. What is this, Fox News?
I was just simply stating I don't give a shit about those things and from gaming sales, most gamers don't either.
[/quote]
If you didn't give a shit, then I wouldn't be saying this. It's because you're actively criticising it. You're specifically saying "We don't need this because it's divisive!". I've seen it time and again from gay guys, if it's not "We don't need pride parades! STRAIGHT PEOPLE DON'T HAVE PARADES" it's "I'm not like those OTHER gay guys who listen to Lady Gaga! Look how heteronormative I'm being!". More often than not, the sort of person who makes a show over this sort of thing is pandering to straight people.
Perhaps that's quite the leap in assumption, but it's certainly my experience.
[quote]I can completely understand for games like Mass Effect where it's about choice. But you're comparing the fucking Bioware forums to the rest of the gaming community, which is once again a HUGE fucking mistep.[/quote]
No True Scotsman. The Bioware forums are symptomatic of a far deeper problem - that is, if you're not a straight white male gamer, you're on the "outside" of the gaming community. The casual racism, the casual sexism (oh God, the sexism), the casual homophobia - you might be able to temper yourself to it, but there's a hell of a lot of people who can't. I don't especially care if a 12 year old rages at me and tells me that I'm an awping faggot who sucks my father's dick, but you can't possibly claim the gaming community is rife with homophobia (unless you have a very myopic definition of what "the gaming community" is). Not to mention transphobia - wasn't there some behind the scenes video from that guy walking around a gamercon dressed as a girl getting [i]continual[/i] shit heaped on him for it? He was just dressing up as a girl for a lark - can you imagine how a trans woman who didn't pass would have felt in that environment?
[quote]Not only that, there was a legitimate reason why lots of people disliked the gay option in ME3; not because of the fact that it's gay, but rather that it comes off as completely abrupt and there is no middle ground. '"Are you gay?" *YES/NO* YES: Go almost immediately into gay fucking, no relationship crap at all. NO: "Aww"' end of story. It was fucking terrible writing. That's why people disliked it. That fucking hamburger helper ruined that scene.[/QUOTE]
Well, you could argue that in the context of the scene there wasn't really much scope for courting, but first off you can't possibly claim the vast majority of complaints over that scene were because the gay romance wasn't fleshed out enough - the creator himself had to post on the forums defending the scene from all the homophobia. Secondly if the scene really was as shitty as you think it was, perhaps you should let BioWare know? Maybe through some sort of convention where they could discuss LGBT issues specifically? Like... a [i]gaymercon[/i]?
tl;dr If you just didn't care I wouldn't be doing one of my pompous posts, but it's because you actively undermined gaymercon as "unnecessary" that I turned the verbose ray on you
Just my two cents, I didn't like the gay option in ME because it felt more like pandering without any actual allegorical exploration of the issue, like they did for interacial marriage with specism.
Not saying ME is particularly deep, but I question if Bioware's heart is in the whole gay thing if they tackle minors ty issues and more or less marginalize gay issues.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=BagMinge104;37183820]Just my two cents, I didn't like the gay option in ME because it felt more like pandering without any actual allegorical exploration of the issue, like they did for interacial marriage with specism.
Not saying ME is particularly deep, but I question if Bioware's heart is in the whole gay thing if they tackle minors ty issues and more or less marginalize gay issues.[/QUOTE]
like everyone points to ME as this bastion of inclusiveness in the gaming world, but compare it to literally any other peice of media that tackles gay issues and you realize that it handles things pretty poorly. If ME is what qualifies as progressive, then that's exactly why we need gaymercon.
Evening gents, insert a certain Lonely Island song here.
Valkyria Chronicles is the #1 gay game. All the insignificant troop characters are individual, so there are gays. Jann Walker for example has the following potentials:
[B]Fancies Men[/B] - Having men nearby makes them happy, leading to enhanced accuracy when firing.
[B]Largo Lover[/B] - Just knowing that Largo is nearby gives confidence and boost in attack power.
Here are some quotes from Jann, our favourite JRPG gay:
[B]Selection[/B]
"You got it, hon!"
"For you? Suurre."
[B]Killing a Foe[/B]
"Sorry, honey."
[B]Enemy Sighted[/B]
"I see a bad guy!"
"Oooo! Here's one!"
[B]Personal Potentials[/B]
"Ahhchh...oh boo." (Pollen Allergy)
"I could get lost in those muscles {singing}!" (Fancies Men)
"Largo...you're the only man for me." (Largo Lover)
His Engish voice actor also plays Marcus Fenix in Gears of War. That guy's probably gay too.
[QUOTE=MasterFen007;37184164]Evening gents, insert a certain Lonely Island song here.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m3yhdagCJN1rpihr1o2_500.jpg[/img]
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Teto;37184580]Valkyria Chronicles is the #1 gay game. All the insignificant troop characters are individual, so there are gays. Jann Walker for example has the following potentials:
[B]Fancies Men[/B] - Having men nearby makes them happy, leading to enhanced accuracy when firing.
[/QUOTE]
And they said letting gays in the military would be a bad thing.
[QUOTE=Splurgy_A;37183565]Well, you could argue that in the context of the scene there wasn't really much scope for courting, but first off you can't possibly claim the vast majority of complaints over that scene were because the gay romance wasn't fleshed out enough - the creator himself had to post on the forums defending the scene from all the homophobia. Secondly if the scene really was as shitty as you think it was, perhaps you should let BioWare know? Maybe through some sort of convention where they could discuss LGBT issues specifically? Like... a [i]gaymercon[/i]?[/QUOTE]
in fairness, the sheer arrogance from bioware during the entire ME3 episode means that a lot of the vitriol was somewhat justified
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;37185832]in fairness, the sheer arrogance from bioware during the entire ME3 episode means that a lot of the vitriol was somewhat justified[/QUOTE]Agreed on that point, but on a slightly different yet related topic, (figured i'd crowbar this into the conversation at some point before I forget entirely) the abuse towards Hepler wasn't. She didn't even write half the shit people complain about, they just single her out because some neckbearded fucktard dredged up an old interview she did where she admitted to not liking to play games that much (shock and horror, who'd expect a writer to like writing?) and made a pic of it with all kinds of shit written all over it.
[QUOTE=MasterFen007;37184164]Evening gents, insert a certain Lonely Island song here.[/QUOTE]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4iiyRv_NrQ[/media]
[QUOTE=Teto;37184580]Valkyria Chronicles is the #1 gay game. All the insignificant troop characters are individual, so there are gays. Jann Walker for example has the following potentials:
[B]Fancies Men[/B] - Having men nearby makes them happy, leading to enhanced accuracy when firing.
[B]Largo Lover[/B] - Just knowing that Largo is nearby gives confidence and boost in attack power.
Here are some quotes from Jann, our favourite JRPG gay:
[B]Selection[/B]
"You got it, hon!"
"For you? Suurre."
[B]Killing a Foe[/B]
"Sorry, honey."
[B]Enemy Sighted[/B]
"I see a bad guy!"
"Oooo! Here's one!"
[B]Personal Potentials[/B]
"Ahhchh...oh boo." (Pollen Allergy)
"I could get lost in those muscles {singing}!" (Fancies Men)
"Largo...you're the only man for me." (Largo Lover)
His Engish voice actor also plays Marcus Fenix in Gears of War. That guy's probably gay too.[/QUOTE]
He's also Bender on futurama.
[QUOTE=Broguts;37187585]He's also Bender on futurama.[/QUOTE]
yeah he's in loads of shit
he played that dude in VTMB too
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;37187605]yeah he's in loads of shit
he played that dude in VTMB too[/QUOTE]
He plays random guards in Escape from butcher bay.
[editline]11th August 2012[/editline]
Oh... I just read the ingredients for this cereal bar I just ate. And it has peanuts, which I'm allergic to. Not lethally mind you, and nothing has happened yet. But I'm still concerned.
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;37187605]yeah he's in loads of shit
he played that dude in VTMB too[/QUOTE]
Also this:
[video=youtube;9qOdggdLPLM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qOdggdLPLM[/video]
He's no Mark Hamill, but still pretty good.
[QUOTE=Teto;37184580]His Engish voice actor also plays Marcus Fenix in Gears of War. That guy's probably gay too.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure John DiMaggio is married.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ipOg6jLQLg[/media]
Goddamn, 5:45-the end really stirs things up in me.
Hi guys! I'm back from a few days from moving my sister into college!
hi colin
I saw a giant statue of a penis. I am not joking.
Feeling lonely :(
[QUOTE=Higginz511;37189151]I'm pretty sure John DiMaggio is married.[/QUOTE]
to [I]YOU [/I]maybe
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