• The Zeitgeist movement is pointless
    136 replies, posted
I won't pass judgment on the entire group (besides an outstanding show of naivety which is shared by their fans), but I do find it funny how they went from already-fringe conspiracy theories to way-out-there fantasies about human beings (robots) whose only desires is sustainable environmental efficiency.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;28087937]I won't pass judgment on the entire group (besides an outstanding show of naivety which is shared by their fans), but I do find it funny how they went from already-fringe conspiracy theories to way-out-there fantasies about human beings (robots) whose only desires is sustainable environmental efficiency.[/QUOTE] I'll be honest and say that the fact-less derogatory statements that are heaped on to this, only add to its credibility. If people can't honestly criticize it, then it only says that there's not as much to criticize as they make out to be. [QUOTE=Croix;28087828]I just watched a bit of the Zeitgeist. Shit's stupid, it looks like goddamn propaganda with "symbolic" messages and shitty video effects and such. if they didnt try to make it look so big and scary I wouldnt mind, but comeon. Comeon.[/QUOTE] Which one did you watch? The Zeitgeist movement itself has more focus on the 3rd movie, with the Resource Based Economy proposition.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;28087937]I won't pass judgment on the entire group (besides an outstanding show of naivety which is shared by their fans), but I do find it funny how they went from already-fringe conspiracy theories to way-out-there fantasies about human beings (robots) whose only desires is sustainable environmental efficiency.[/QUOTE] Take from it what's logical and ignore the bullshit. That's pretty much how you approach anything in this genre.
[QUOTE=Rubs10;28088129]I'll be honest and say that the fact-less derogatory statements that are heaped on to this, only add to its credibility. If people can't honestly criticize it, then it only says that there's not as much to criticize as they make out to be. [/QUOTE] I wasn't criticizing it. I just feel like they missed a critical step between "Consumer drone society hellbent on destroying the very planet it requires to live on" and the Venus Project.
[QUOTE=Drax-Quin;28086213]Emm OP not at anytime do you ever consider the idea of sustainability, our economy demands infinite resources but resources are finite, this was very much observed by the Zeitgest movement. You seem to have some ignorant belief that everything is fine and dandy and that the current economic system will work forever. Seriously please think ahead and consider the implication society today may have on future generation and don't be so closed-minded.[/QUOTE] There is no Malthusian Dilemma.
[QUOTE=Croix;28087828]I just watched a bit of the Zeitgeist. Shit's stupid, it looks like goddamn propaganda with "symbolic" messages and shitty video effects and such. if they didnt try to make it look so big and scary I wouldnt mind, but comeon. Comeon.[/QUOTE] First it depends on which movie you watched and 2nd almost all trying to change your view documentaries are symbolic in many ways. In other words criticize what they say rather then how they say it.
OP completely missed the point the Zeitgeist movement is trying to make. Capitalism isn't a system that's fine. Capitalism wants the biggest profit possible thus making little space for sustainability, clean production and the quality of human life.
[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;28077693]I dont believe in conspiracy theories but I like the idea of a resource based economy. In fact the creator of the movement doesn't put focus on conspiracy theories anymore. Its now about the idea of a new system rather then saying the government is evil and junk like that. [editline]15th February 2011[/editline] Are you saying that the systems that don't work will die horribly or something? I mean you cant just say are current system will somehow magically solve environmental change and greed one day and no one is going to pollute for no reason or anything like that.[/QUOTE] You can't change human nature; ergo you can't change greed. Every single one of us is greedy to an extent and its much easier if we adapt to that rather than try and change it. Greed is present in all animals, its the very foundation of evolutionary theory. In other words, the competition for resources is what drives us to succeed and maintain our society and race. This is the reason why a resource-based economy just would not work. The majority of people need some incentive to help others or to even work to the best of our abilities.
What an idiot!
[QUOTE=Earthen;28104390]You can't change human nature; ergo you can't change greed. Every single one of us is greedy to an extent and its much easier if we adapt to that rather than try and change it. Greed is present in all animals, its the very foundation of evolutionary theory. In other words, the competition for resources is what drives us to succeed and maintain our society and race. This is the reason why a resource-based economy just would not work. The majority of people need some incentive to help others or to even work to the best of our abilities.[/QUOTE] Part of the Zeitgeist movement talks about how someone's childhood and genes influences how they are later on. It suggests that everyone can be better if you treat them correctly. Personally, I find that notion to be a bit too idealistic.
[QUOTE=Rubs10;28082288]It promotes the Venus Project which is all about reforming governments and the economy.[/QUOTE] It uses it as an example.
zeitgeist itself is pointless
[QUOTE=Earthen;28104390]The majority of people need some incentive to help others or to even work to the best of our abilities.[/QUOTE] I didn't know people get something out of feeding starving Africans. your really just inserting human nature with nothing to back it up.
[QUOTE=HybridTheroy;28112552]zeitgeist itself is pointless[/QUOTE] what the fuck are you DOING
responding to yourself? [quote=imasillypiggy]yes he is[/quote]
[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;28120367]responding to yourself?[/QUOTE] not technically myself
[QUOTE=imasillypiggy;28116940]I didn't know people get something out of feeding starving Africans. your really just inserting human nature with nothing to back it up.[/QUOTE] People act altruistically because it makes them feel good. If you give to charity you feel as if you've done something to feel good about yourself. Thus there was an incentive to do it.
[QUOTE=David29;28072406]While I agree that conspiracy theories are pretty much bullshit, as we have seen thanks to Wikileaks it is equally bullshit to say that the government doesn't lie to us at all.[/QUOTE] I would like to say to you that the dollar s only in the USA and the US President can Print money at will... that is truly risky for a country but since the dollar is only in the states it is really easy to recover from such an action... so the thing is that they have surely lied to you but the recovery from their mistakes is not that difficult.. At least, not as difficult as in other countries... P.S. I live in Greece and the politicians are useless here, our strategy sucks and we have loans quite often... Their mistakes are not that easy to cover them and correct them without the people notice
[QUOTE=nemmises5;28084876]-snip- my own stupidity. [editline]16th February 2011[/editline] heres a good mindset: question everything. trust nothing. thats how I am[/QUOTE] There is a fine line between cynicism and paranoia.
[QUOTE=Earthen;28125836]People act altruistically because it makes them feel good. If you give to charity you feel as if you've done something to feel good about yourself. Thus there was an incentive to do it.[/QUOTE] Not everyone feels good about giving away their stuff.
funfact: zeitgeist is a word that comes from the german words zeit which means time and geist which means spirit which brings along its meaning, the spirit of the time; the spirit characteristic of an age or generation
in around 50 years i will laugh at you, oh so silly facepuncher. we already had a zeitgeist thread with decent logical responses, this is just opinionated crap.
[QUOTE=livelonger12;28072284]Peter Joseph, Jacque Fresco and their followers will never overthrow the current socio-economic structure of humanity -- we don't need that. The current economic paradigm is fine; it's adjusted by nature itself via capitalism and its principle, natural selection; and it's sustained by a slight mix of socialism (e.g. via universal healthcare). The worst of this movement are the conspiracy films in which they attempt to "expose" the supposedly corrupt leaders behind the system -- a move that will never assist them. The governments are not there to betray the people, and do not lie to the people. The governments govern society to eliminate social and economic pathologies. That, and their anticipation of the monetary system for collapse -- this will not happen. Sure, it has its ups and downs, but the system is fine for our needs, and will eventually result in global sustainability (how about that? No poverty? Surely such a system must be removed!). In short, all these global and socio-economic conspiracy movements are dumb -- they're nothing more than paranoid agendas pushed by a small group or a single leader that is somewhat reflective of terrorism. I shall now proceed to my tinfoil house to eat my tinfoil pancakes![/QUOTE] I thank the lord I don't believe in that none of you are political leaders :)
[QUOTE=Rubs10;28135904]Not everyone feels good about giving away their stuff.[/QUOTE] Well no one has to give away "there stuff". you can keep your tv if you want to or you could put your art on the internet (like most people do) and let everyone see it or you dont.
Is this the illuminati?
[QUOTE=Mattk50;28137700]in around 50 years i will laugh at you, oh so silly facepuncher. [/QUOTE] You will remember this thread in 50 years and still have an account? [editline]18th February 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Earthen;28125836]People act altruistically because it makes them feel good. If you give to charity you feel as if you've done something to feel good about yourself. Thus there was an incentive to do it.[/QUOTE] Well then that will be there incentive. I mean the fact that people like feeding Africans shows something good about what motivates people.
I couldn't care less about the zeitgeist movement, All i want is a resource based economy, no matte what name it is... [editline]19th February 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Rubs10;28135904]Not everyone feels good about giving away their stuff.[/QUOTE] why would you need to OWN stuff if it is abundant? [editline]19th February 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Earthen;28104390]You can't change human nature; ergo you can't change greed. Every single one of us is greedy to an extent and its much easier if we adapt to that rather than try and change it. Greed is present in all animals, its the very foundation of evolutionary theory. In other words, the competition for resources is what drives us to succeed and maintain our society and race. This is the reason why a resource-based economy just would not work. The majority of people need some incentive to help others or to even work to the best of our abilities.[/QUOTE] Greed is not part of human nature, it's a side effect of lack.
[QUOTE=SIRIUS;28138232]I couldn't care less about the zeitgeist movement, All i want is a resource based economy, no matte what name it is... [editline]19th February 2011[/editline] why would you need to OWN stuff if it is abundant?[/QUOTE] You'd want to make sure you have some on hand. Why would someone else need your stuff if it is abundant? Cause they have no money of course.
This silly notion of "your" and "mine" is fictional, and unnecessary in a stable environment of abundance.
[QUOTE=Rubs10;28138300]You'd want to make sure you have some on hand. Why would someone else need your stuff if it is abundant? Cause they have no money of course.[/QUOTE] You know if he wanted your stuff he could just go get the same stuff you have. Its not like he would take yours or anything.
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