Piracy - General - Facepunch Forum

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159643]I don't have to get used to it. Because it's illegal and a felony. Just like I don't have to get used to my ex-girlfriend who watched me pee through a window. Fuck no, I got a restraining order is what I did.[/QUOTE] Well... You know, I really don't know how to respond to that, but I would expect you of all people to think at least a little outside the box. You're being more biased than the Catholic Church right now.

Piracy isn't a big problem, but it's still a problem in itself. Whether I pirate or not is out of the question, but I can understand why it's illegal.

Depends the situation. For CNC4: Ahoy mateys, Pirate away! Mass Effect 2: Die you pirating scum!

I love troll threads, they give me a good laugh.

[QUOTE=Linelor;21159671]Well... You know, I really don't know how to respond to that, but I would expect you of all people to think at least a little outside the box. You're being more biased than the Catholic Church right now.[/QUOTE] Yes because I think criminals who are committing federal felonies should probably not be doing that, I am like the catholic church. Because I think the creator of a consumer product should be compensated for their investments on behalf of the consumer, I am biased. Because I think the stupid fucking bass-ackwards rationalizations that pirates give like "I'm not hurting them, I'm just not paying them" and "I'll buy their next game!" and "I don't think they deserve the money" are fucking stupid, pathetic attempts at retroactively justifying selfishness, theft and general criminal activity. [editline]04:51AM[/editline] God forbid I think a legitimately damaging crime is bad! No, I'm just not seeing it straight because I'm biased. Because FP is clearly full of economists and I'm just way too obsessed with not being a selfish dickhead.

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159583]You are hindering their profits and invalidating their investments by using their products at their expense without their consent. That is a very valid form of theft. [/QUOTE] No. Ok say i am going to buy a game, i get to the shop, walk in and find out i don't have enough money, I go home, dissapointed and pirate the game, never actually buying the game. That is different to pirating a game that you are never going to buy. Think of it this way, you are getting something that you would otherwise never get, that is not stealing. That is simply [i]not giving them money[/i]. EDIT: A friend of mine said the only thing you're stealing is a potential sale on your part, you're not taking anything from them, they wouldn't lose anything they didn't already have. If you live on someone's boat or in their house you're using something of theirs, and yeah, probably causing damage. The similarities are pretty strong I admit, however, there are also many aspects of that analogy not covered there. Software piracy is like blocking a business opponent from making a sale or deal, except that it isn't even a solid deal, it's a potential deal. Here's a good example, company A has a physical product, they spend $50 making it and are going to sell it for $100. You break into their warehouse and steal it. Result? They have LOST a product worth $50 that they can no longer sell. If that is an electronic product like a game or movie, you pirate it and then they've lost the chance at making $50. They still have the product and can still sell it to other people. The only thing they've lost is [potentially] the ability to sell a copy of that product you. However it's still safe to be sold to other people just like nothing ever happened. Of course, if everybody were to pirate software the companies would be out of pocket (because people who had pirated the software would be less likely to buy it), and I'm not saying piracy isn't a bad thing, just that it's often blown right out of proportion. However, there's another aspect to factor in, a lot of the time the people who pirate wouldn't have paid for the game anyway, there is of course, those who would. At the end of the day however, the companies would be far better spending money on making a good game rather than stopping people from pirating it, look at spore for a classic example, extreme DRM to the point it was a hindrance and a pain for those who paid for it, yet it was the most pirated game of the year. In contrast, Galactic Civilisation shipped with absolutely no DRM or copy protection and sold far better than expected.

[QUOTE=Dylanhutch;21159719]Think of it this way, you are getting something that you would otherwise never get, that is not stealing[/QUOTE] I am never going to get a porche. Does that mean it's okay for me to just take a porche? [editline]04:56AM[/editline] If you can't buy it, you don't fucking get it! That is the dumbest fucking rationalization I have ever heard. [editline]04:57AM[/editline] And FYI that IS stealing by every single fucking legal definition of the goddamn word. [editline]04:58AM[/editline] Theft: The illegal taking of property without the proprietor's consent. The ONLY qualification for theft is that the owner did not consent to you having it. Developers have the RIGHT to tell you to go fuck yourself and that you can't play their games. Have you ever read an EULA? Because that's basically everything they say. They can, for any reason or no reason at all, withdraw consent for your use of their software, making any future use a criminal breach of your contract. They are legally binding contracts on an international level, FYI. And you agree to them simply by having the software, legitimately or not.

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159701]Yes because I think criminals who are committing federal felonies should probably not be doing that, I am like the catholic church. Because I think the creator of a consumer product should be compensated for their investments on behalf of the consumer, I am biased. Because I think the stupid fucking bass-ackwards rationalizations that pirates give like "I'm not hurting them, I'm just not paying them" and "I'll buy their next game!" and "I don't think they deserve the money" are fucking stupid, pathetic attempts at retroactively justifying selfishness, theft and general criminal activity.[/QUOTE] Well I don't encourage it, except in certain circumstances like things you can't even get ahold of save a 10 year old copy on e-bay for $150 that probably doesn't work or something. I realize in the short term, it does hurt a company, but if you loose a little of that bias or sober up or solve whatever is driving this blind rage, then you will see that you can find some light in the darkness. Piracy is here, and it's here to stay unless someone comes up with some way I can't even imagine to stop it. Pirates spend money too, piracy generally helps to assure that it goes to the good producers and the people who push generic shit out the door loose money. It's basic economics. Something new has come along, in this case the internet and the advent of Piracy; some have adapted (aka made games that aren't generic shit and are worth $50 someone worked hard for) or they will go out of business. This goes on in EVERY corner of business, just in different ways. It's called Economic Darwinism and it's a big part of capitalism. At least in this version, even the smallest of companies have the ability to rise to the top and contend with the big dogs. I'm a certified CPA and took many classes on Marketing and Economics btw, and have thought on this subject a lot. I'm not a law person so I don't look at it that way. I look at it from a economic standpoint.

[QUOTE=Linelor;21159772]...whatever is driving this blind rage...[/QUOTE] Stupid people using stupid logic.

TF2 cannot be pirated properly, and that's why it's hated in Poland.

[QUOTE=Linelor;21159772]but if you loose a little of that bias or sober up or solve whatever is driving this blind rage[/quote] Excellent argument. Rather than acknowledging what I said you simply shrug it off and call it "biased." Tell me, what the fuck IS my bias specifically. [quote]Piracy is here, and it's here to stay unless someone comes up with some way I can't even imagine to stop it. [/QUOTE] I can think of a few ways. Namely, if and when we stop the war on terror we can take a few billion of that multi-trillion and start seriously enforcing the DMCA. Targeting not only distributors but also single downloaders, and pushing for maximum punishments in every viable case. In addition, encouraging civil cases as well on behalf of the developers.

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159810]Excellent argument. Rather than acknowledging what I said you simply shrug it off and call it "biased." Tell me, what the fuck IS my bias specifically. I can think of a few ways. Namely, if and when we stop the war on terror we can take a few billion of that multi-trillion and start seriously enforcing the DMCA. Targeting not only distributors but also single downloaders, and pushing for maximum punishments in every viable case.[/QUOTE] So what? Drive the consumer market into the ground with fines, arrests, and fear? Sounds like a great way to make people buy stuff.

[QUOTE=Linelor;21159833]So what? Drive the consumer market into the ground with fines, arrests, and fear? Sounds like a great way to make people buy stuff.[/QUOTE] It's not about making people buy stuff. By your logic developers already have enough buyers to survive. By your logic this would do absolutely no harm to the industry. It's about stopping the people who steal stuff by instilling the serious threat of life-ruining ramifications. And if you want to get seriously vindictive about it you can cut off internet access in addition to ruining any chance of them actually getting a good paying job, given they would be ex-cons. [editline]05:08AM[/editline] And, again, what is my bias specifically?

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159844]It's not about making people buy stuff. By your logic developers already have enough buyers to survive. By your logic this would do absolutely no harm to the industry. It's about stopping the people who steal stuff by instilling the serious threat of life-ruining ramifications. And if you want to get seriously vindictive about it you can cut off internet access in addition to ruining any chance of them actually getting a good paying job, given they would be ex-cons. [editline]05:08AM[/editline] And, again, what is my bias specifically?[/QUOTE] You are thinking that piracy is ONLY bad, and nothing else. It's like people who say NOTHING good ever comes from war, and that it is only bad for society and people. One of my mottoes for life is that light can always be found in the dark, you might just have to look a bit to find it. In this case, the light is not very apparent, but once you really think on it, it's a pretty damn big light.

You are now comparing piracy to the merits of mass death and war. Should I make with the rape comparisons now just to cut you off right there, or do you think you're sabotaging your argument enough on your own?

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159906]You are now comparing piracy to the merits of mass death and war. Should I make with the rape comparisons now just to cut you off right there, or do you think you're sabotaging your argument enough on your own?[/QUOTE] No, I was comparing you to another kind of bias, not the example itself. You are simply twisting my words good sir.

No I don't like pirates (except those from Pirates of the Caribbean). But I can understand if you want a record, but it has gone out of production, and is no longer copyright'd.

I'm going to assume Lankist went to bed, and it's 4:30 AM so I'm doing the same. This is a draw.... for now.

[QUOTE=Linelor;21159970]I'm going to assume Lankist went to bed, and it's 4:30 AM so I'm doing the same. This is a draw.... for now.[/QUOTE] Nope we've won. [url]http://www.facepunch.com/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=3153[/url] [url]http://www.facepunch.com/showpost.php?p=21159719&postcount=36[/url] Did you even see these Lankist?

snip

[QUOTE=Dylanhutch;21159989]Nope we've won. [url]http://www.facepunch.com/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=3153[/url] [url]http://www.facepunch.com/showpost.php?p=21159719&postcount=36[/url] Did you even see these Lankist?[/QUOTE] The poll means nothing. I responded to your post. And I don't care what your friend thinks. [editline]05:41AM[/editline] [QUOTE=starpluck;21159996]Don't think so.[/QUOTE] Yes proclaim victory even though each and every single rationalization has been shot down. That's surely the way to go. Because populism makes you right!

Valve has made a DRM that prevents piracy and is not god damn annoying. Now there are little pirated games from valve. So far I've never pirated any valve game, just because of all the benefits you get when you buy the games (online, proper achievements, wide community, games often updated etc) Other companies that DO have a shitty drm got pirated a lot. It does not work, the developers do not realize/admit this and legit customers have shitty experiences. I don't know about you, but if I hear a lot of comments about how shitty the game becomes with the drm, how unplayable sometimes, then- not trying to start a drm discussion, but for me it plays a huge role in piracy of games.

[QUOTE=Lankist;21160069]The poll means nothing. I responded to your post. And I don't care what your friend thinks. [/QUOTE] It took him 2 minutes to write that. [QUOTE=Lankist;21160069] Yes proclaim victory even though each and every single rationalization has been shot down. That's surely the way to go. Because populism makes you right![/QUOTE] No, you are not rational, you are ignorant. Edit: [sp]And incredibly bad at reading...[/sp]

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159735]I am never going to get a porche. Does that mean it's okay for me to just take a porche? [editline]04:56AM[/editline] If you can't buy it, you don't fucking get it! That is the dumbest fucking rationalization I have ever heard. [editline]04:57AM[/editline] And FYI that IS stealing by every single fucking legal definition of the goddamn word. [editline]04:58AM[/editline] Theft: The illegal taking of property without the proprietor's consent. The ONLY qualification for theft is that the owner did not consent to you having it. Developers have the RIGHT to tell you to go fuck yourself and that you can't play their games. Have you ever read an EULA? Because that's basically everything they say. They can, for any reason or no reason at all, withdraw consent for your use of their software, making any future use a criminal breach of your contract. They are legally binding contracts on an international level, FYI. And you agree to them simply by having the software, legitimately or not.[/QUOTE] Seems you missed this [editline]05:46AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Dylanhutch;21160106]No, you are not rational, you are ignorant.[/QUOTE] You don't know what a rationalization is do you

Whenever I get the urge to illegally download something I think back to my middle school days. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up863eQKGUI[/media]

[QUOTE=Lankist;21160113]Seems you missed this [/QUOTE] No, it does not prove your point at all. [QUOTE=Lankist;21160113] You don't know what a rationalization is do you[/QUOTE] Yes, i do.

[QUOTE=Dylanhutch;21160130]No, it does not prove your point at all.[/QUOTE] Then it shouldn't be too difficult to give a rebuttal. [editline]05:49AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Dylanhutch;21160130]Yes, i do.[/QUOTE] What is a rationalization?

Not this shit again...*retarded dancing*

Pirating is wrong and nobody should do it.

[QUOTE=Lankist;21159735]porche[/QUOTE] It's Porsche, you dipshit :shivdurf: