#ProudToBe [YouTube Spotlight/Huge Shitstorm in the Comments] - General

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569149]I just have a hard time grasping at the invasion of privacy some women might feel. In the case that I would become a father, I would be concerned for my children's privacy if they shared bathrooms and lockerooms with people of opposite sex.[/QUOTE] Why would they feel an invasion of privacy? And [quote]I would be concerned for my children's privacy if they shared bathrooms and lockerooms with people of opposite sex.[/quote] Is an incredibly oversimplified way of looking at the issue. It's either a deliberately loaded premise or demonstrates a severe lack of proper understanding of the situation.

[QUOTE=Rusty100;50566659]i dont get why there would be a shitstorm about this seems like a fairly standard pride video with a positive message[/QUOTE] Because people like to "troll" even though at this point, especially on this video, it's just being a cunt.

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569170]Because there are not male teachers or adults in the female lockerrooms or bathrooms.[/QUOTE] You seem to be under the impression that MtF women are men and FtM men are women. I'd also love for you to elaborate on this supposed "Invasion of privacy" that you keep harping about because the only thing I'm getting right now is "eww penis"

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;50569164]Why? If you are afraid for your children's privacy, why would you not put more scrutiny into their teachers or the adults that they spend time around? Your children would be more at risk from people of authority rather than someone who is transgendered.[/QUOTE] It is the unknown aspects of the bathroom issue that is the real problem. We need more time to observe and document. Until then people are just uncomfortable with the idea of trans - ALL trans because anyone can claim they are trans I think - don't quote me on that - and on the other side people are totally okay with it and are unquestioning. Both sides are right in a regard of caution and acceptance/tolerance.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569218]Shut up and be a good little minority, that way we won't kill you in the street[/QUOTE] [editline]22nd June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=BioWaster;50569222]It is the unknown aspects of the bathroom issue that is the real problem. We need more time to observe and document. Until then people are just uncomfortable with the idea of trans - ALL trans because anyone can claim they are trans I think - don't quote me on that - and on the other side people are totally okay with it and are unquestioning. Both sides are right in a regard of caution and acceptance/tolerance.[/QUOTE] There's caution, then there's bigotry. Given how, as far as I know, there has never been a trans person who used bathroom acceptance as an excuse to rape someone, pretty much all the worry over trans people using the right bathroom is just right wing bigotry and drama over nothing. It's a commonly used argument with absolutely no basis.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569218]I believe violent demonstrations against the LGBT community is through deep hatred. When the LGBT community continues to continually say how proud they are of their sexuality is just going to aggravate those who want to use violence on them. There is really no benefit of this, just being annoying.[/QUOTE] Let's say it's the mid-1960s, we live in the South, and I'm black. If I organized black pride protests and distributed anti-racism pamphlets, would it then be my fault for inciting lynchings? Do you see where your logic falls apart here? Because "Shut up and be a good little minority, that way we won't kill you in the street" is basically what it amounts to.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569260]You're twisting my words. You tell me what benefit has proclaiming pride on the sexuality have done to them? In my observation it seems ever since the LGBT has been pushing their pride movements there has been more violence than ever. I'm not saying "if you shut your mouth no one will hurt you" but it does not help you either.[/QUOTE] That's exactly what you're saying though. If it's not what you're trying to say then you're not doing a very good job of articulating yourself. Like, you wouldn't get as much backlash as you are right now if you just said "I think gay people are weird," and left it at that because you seem to be grasping at straws here.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569218]I believe violent demonstrations against the LGBT community is through deep hatred. When the LGBT community continues to continually say how proud they are of their sexuality is just going to aggravate those who want to use violence on them. There is really no benefit of this, just being annoying.[/QUOTE] so in your mind, they can't speak up or you'll hit them, they can't be quiet or you won't be aware of them and then they'll shock you, so you'll hit them. It literally seems like an excuse, for people who aren't comfortable with LGBT folk like yourself, to be violent. Both paths make you violent, or want violence, or justify the anger, so I don't see how this isn't just essentially, victim blaming. [editline]22nd June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569260]You're twisting my words. You tell me what benefit has proclaiming pride on the sexuality have done to them? In my observation it seems ever since the LGBT has been pushing their pride movements there has been more violence than ever. I'm not saying "if you shut your mouth no one will hurt you" but it does not help you either.[/QUOTE] If they talk, you're saying they're in the wrong. If they're quiet, they're in the wrong. What can you possibly want

Let's make all bathrooms unisex then.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569260]You're twisting my words. [B]You tell me what benefit has proclaiming pride on the sexuality have done to them? [/B]In my observation it seems ever since the LGBT has been pushing their pride movements there has been more violence than ever. I'm not saying "if you shut your mouth no one will hurt you" but it does not help you either.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/26/politics/supreme-court-same-sex-marriage-ruling/"]I dunno, you tell me[/URL] It's either have pride movements, become known, become public and allow your supporters to fight for you, but be attacked by bigots, or stay hidden, stay a downtrodden minority and be attacked by bigots, only this time, there's nobody to fight for you.

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569149]I just have a hard time grasping at the invasion of privacy some women might feel. In the case that I would become a father, I would be concerned for my children's privacy if they shared bathrooms and lockerooms with people of opposite sex. I know plenty of people who are a part of the LGBT community, and although I do not agree with them on everything, I am still accepting of what they identify as.[/QUOTE] I understand your feelings. It's natural to be concerned for the people you care about. But these fears just aren't founded. It simply isn't a thing that happens. There aren't bands of paedophiles dressed up like women going around molesting little girls in bathrooms. And why would they? It's a depressing thought, but there are plenty of other situations where fucked up people can abuse children where they'd gather far less attention. They could pose as janitors and install cameras in the stalls. They could just abduct unaccompanied children off the street. There is no reason for a sexual predator to do the things you're afraid they'd do. And on top of that, if the prime goal of bathrooms is to separate people from those they're sexually attracted to and thus more likely to molest or rape, why aren't there bathrooms for gay people? What do we even do with bisexuals? Anyone can be attracted to anything. With every freedom issue you have people jumping to the worst case scenario. I don't think that's practical. You have to look at the real world, and what actually happens. And in this case, people are afraid of something that just doesn't happen.

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569282]Let's make all bathrooms unisex then.[/QUOTE] Honestly, why not You're saying this sarcastically, to take the piss out of us but why not? It's illegal to harm someone, or assualt them. It's [B]still[/B] illegal to do that in a bathroom. The chances of a trans individual using their position, and gender, to take advantage of a young person, anyone, are astronomical. It has not happened. The thing you are so afraid of, [B]has not happened[/B]

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569282]Let's make all bathrooms unisex then.[/QUOTE] How does that conclusion even remotely follow from any of the arguments that have been presented to you?

[QUOTE=Smug Bastard;50569302]How does that conclusion even remotely follow from any of the arguments that have been presented to you?[/QUOTE] it's sarcasm to attack and deride your point he said that because to him, it's such a far out silly and stupid idea why would you even go for that, so he suggested it as a ridiculous thing to get us to all go "No that's too far" The people who make posts like that have thought about this less than the people who are genuinely okay with these ideas.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;50569301]Honestly, why not You're saying this sarcastically, to take the piss out of us but why not? It's illegal to harm someone, or assualt them. It's [B]still[/B] illegal to do that in a bathroom. The chances of a trans individual using their position, and gender, to take advantage of a young person, anyone, are astronomical. It has not happened. The thing you are so afraid of, [B]has not happened[/B][/QUOTE] I am actually being serious. All of my arguments before were justifying why segregated bathrooms were created to begin with. If everyone has a problem with that and my opinions are so far out there, then I have no problem assimilating. My intentions were only to defend the rights of women and men as I saw fit.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;50569314]it's sarcasm to attack and deride your point he said that because to him, it's such a far out silly and stupid idea why would you even go for that, so he suggested it as a ridiculous thing to get us to all go "No that's too far" The people who make posts like that have thought about this less than the people who are genuinely okay with these ideas.[/QUOTE] I know it is, perhaps I should re-word that post. I'm just pointing out that he's still not doing a good job of making his point.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569335]I am saying that simply saying you're proud of your sexuality over and over again is not going to change anything. There is a difference when protesting or fighting for something politically (like legalizing gay marriage). I don't see the point of the video, what is the argument they are trying to get across? They got gay marriage legalized and people start killing them, what is saying they are proud going to do to help the situation?[/QUOTE] By rallying people to a cause and spreading a message that bigotry is not okay? Plus, people were killing them long before gay marriage. And your argument [I]still [/I]manages to convey the message that it's their fault for the violence being committed against them, even after you attempted to explain yourself like five times.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569335]I am saying that simply saying you're proud of your sexuality over and over again is not going to change anything. There is a difference when protesting or fighting for something politically (like legalizing gay marriage). I don't see the point of the video, what is the argument they are trying to get across? They got gay marriage legalized and people start killing them, what is saying they are proud going to do to help the situation?[/QUOTE] Honestly, everything you're saying is just the result of ignorance of the plights of the LGBT people.

[QUOTE=dimitrik129;50569322]I am actually being serious. All of my arguments before were justifying why segregated bathrooms were created to begin with. If everyone has a problem with that and my opinions are so far out there, then I have no problem assimilating. My intentions were only to defend the rights of women and men as I saw fit.[/QUOTE] I honestly think it depends on the situation. I can think of some places where unisex bathrooms would be fine, and some where they would be a problem. Places like nightclubs and bars where people are intoxicated and more likely to make bad decisions come to mind. I'm not sure though, I think it's something you would have to consult individual establishments about. I just don't think you can justify a universal ban on transgender people using the bathroom of the sex they identify as.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569335]I am saying that simply saying you're proud of your sexuality over and over again is not going to change anything. There is a difference when protesting or fighting for something politically (like legalizing gay marriage). I don't see the point of the video, what is the argument they are trying to get across? They got gay marriage legalized and people start killing them, [B]what is saying they are proud going to do to help the situation?[/B][/QUOTE] It shows that they're not afraid of the violence they face because of their gender or sexuality. Just because gay marriage is legal doesn't mean everyone is okay with it. Violent bigotry is alive and well in the US. Trans people commit suicide a horrifyingly large amount more than cis people. Gay teens are kicked out of their homes. People like that need to see that there are trans and gay/lesbian people, because it normalizes it. They need people to look up to to help them think "I'm not a freak, I'm not a deviant, I'm normal.".

[QUOTE=Hanso;50566856]What are the 8 you have in mind?[/QUOTE] did he say 8 i think he meant 40 :downs: [editline].[/editline] [img]http://puu.sh/pChr1/fd1b3135e7.jpg[/img] [img]http://puu.sh/pChIW/cac7dca40e.jpg[/img] jesus fuck

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569335]I am saying that simply saying you're proud of your sexuality over and over again is not going to change anything. There is a difference when protesting or fighting for something politically (like legalizing gay marriage). I don't see the point of the video, what is the argument they are trying to get across? They got gay marriage legalized and people start killing them, what is saying they are proud going to do to help the situation?[/QUOTE] A lot of hatred directed towards people under the umbrella of LGBT comes from disgust. You mitigate disgust through exposure. Think of how gay people were, and in some cases are, treated like pedophiles and sexual predators. When people who aren't pedophiles or sexual predators proclaim that they're gay, it combats that assumption. Which is an important part of achieving public acceptance. Whether or not you think the action is necessary in the current climate, I think the logic behind it is sound and has proven to be effective thusfar.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569427]People are going to have their own opinions and say what they want to say, it is common sense that bigotry is frowned upon. Saying they are proud is not going to change the opinions of someone who is anti-lgbt. Look at my posts, I never once said that pride messages is the sole cause of violence, I said it is aggravating violence. How is that not true? I don't support violence on the LGBT community nor believe they are the ones causing it, the angry, violent anti-LGBT people do but their "bragging" is not helping.[/QUOTE] So what should they do about it?

[QUOTE=Smug Bastard;50569440]So what should they do about it?[/QUOTE] Not make anti-LGBTQ people hate them more.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569427]People are going to have their own opinions and say what they want to say, it is common sense that bigotry is frowned upon. Saying they are proud is not going to change the opinions of someone who is anti-lgbt. Look at my posts, I never once said that pride messages is the sole cause of violence, I said it is aggravating violence. How is that not true? I don't support violence on the LGBT community nor believe they are the ones causing it, the angry, violent anti-LGBT people do but their "bragging" is not helping.[/QUOTE] Has it ever occurred to you that the violence hasn't increased, its just that the violence is actually being reported now? Yeah we had a major outlier in Orlando, but that's an outlier.

[QUOTE=MaximLaHaxim;50569456]Not make anti-LGBTQ people hate them more.[/QUOTE] .... So what should they do about it? Also this: [QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;50569470]Giving in to intimidation doesn't stop intimidation. It just emboldens the person intimidating you. While I don't think being antagonistic helps, if simply stating your pride in who you are is enough to inspire violence against you, then that's just a reason to speak more loudly.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569427]People are going to have their own opinions and say what they want to say, it is common sense that bigotry is frowned upon. Saying they are proud is not going to change the opinions of someone who is anti-lgbt. Look at my posts, I never once said that pride messages is the sole cause of violence, I said it is aggravating violence. How is that not true? I don't support violence on the LGBT community nor believe they are the ones causing it, the angry, violent anti-LGBT people do but their "bragging" is not helping.[/QUOTE] Giving in to intimidation doesn't stop intimidation. It just emboldens the person intimidating you. While I don't think being antagonistic helps, if simply stating your pride in who you are is enough to inspire violence against you, then that's just a reason to speak more loudly.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569427]People are going to have their own opinions and say what they want to say, it is common sense that bigotry is frowned upon. Saying they are proud is not going to change the opinions of someone who is anti-lgbt. Look at my posts, I never once said that pride messages is the sole cause of violence, I said it is aggravating violence. How is that not true? I don't support violence on the LGBT community nor believe they are the ones causing it, the angry, violent anti-LGBT people do but their "bragging" is not helping.[/QUOTE] Fact There's less violence against LGBT people in 2016 than in 1986 Why? Because Gay people in 86 were considered to be pedofiles and abominations by everyone. That's not the case now. Why? Exposure. You can't silence them to a corner and still be aware of them.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569427]People are going to have their own opinions and say what they want to say, it is common sense that bigotry is frowned upon. Saying they are proud is not going to change the opinions of someone who is anti-lgbt. Look at my posts, I never once said that pride messages is the sole cause of violence, I said it is aggravating violence. How is that not true? I don't support violence on the LGBT community nor believe they are the ones causing it, the angry, violent anti-LGBT people do but their "bragging" is not helping.[/QUOTE] Think of it this way. LGBT people will face violence regardless. That's just the nature of violent bigotry. But if it wasn't for the LGBT rights movement, they would face even more than today, and not only that, but there wouldn't be even a quarter of the acceptance today. We wouldn't have gay marriage legal, or transition surgeries for trans people. So even though yeah, pride parades may bring violence, without them, it'd be worse, and more accepted.

[QUOTE=skatehawk11;50569451]Think about it, those who want to commit violent acts are they going to see the video and think "Yeah they are right, I support them now" or "They are geting on my nerves, I must do something"[/QUOTE] Honestly, you don't know anything about what the LGBT community went through in the 70's and 80's and I recommend you look into it because you might finally have some semblance of understanding of why there are so many "pride" events and the like. It's a response to having literally been killed and stepped on in the past and now they don't have to fear that in anyway near the same context.