[QUOTE=Shadaez;31159284]You have to put a little thought into it, it's NAZI we're talking about, the jews that they bring in are more likely rescued from some horrible living conditions, or they're just generally unfit for life. We don't really know based on the infograph, though. All it does it throw big scary numbers at you.
Oh my god they killed four million jews!
but under what circumstances?
Taking numbers out of context can make anything look bad.
Obviously they're not perfect, and they're basically just there for publicity.[/QUOTE]
I know I use nazis in a lot of my arguments and I'll admit that I'm normally blowing it way out of proportion but in all honesty PETA isn't much better. They kill animals on a similar scale to the mass genocide carried out during the holocaust.
Okay, I'll backpedal a bit and just say that I'm defending PETA based on the points in the infograph, it's really horrible. I just really don't like when people hate something for bad reasons, or post pure propaganda like that image. PETA does do some good things, they don't always go about it right. I've found a lot of their information to be helpful, like their [URL="http://www.peta.org/living/vegetarian-living/accidentally-vegan.aspx"]Accidentally Vegan[/URL] article, how they give out vegan food so that people try it, and promoting veganism in general. I absolutely hated them before I was vegetarian, but now I don't see what's so bad about it. I feel like they want people to hate them. Of course their celebrity spokespeople are hypocrites, they're just doing it to be viewed as 'green', and PETA is just using them for publicity. (they do everything for publicity)
Why should I hate them? I don't really see it. They make useful resources that I use, and I'd like to support them for that. It's the same thing with some vegans and not liking Silk because it's owned by Dean Foods (a really large dairy company), should I not use Silk because of that? I'd rather support them for their vegan products to let them know a market exists for it.
I'll keep defending kill shelters, it's not ideal, but there's not much else you can do in most situations. In a perfect world, No Kill shelters would be the only type, but there's just way too many reproducing animals to do that, and it's not possible to shelter them all indefinitely. If you can provide some evidence that shows that the millions of pets born each year can be easily adopted out, maybe I'll change my mind.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=hexpunK;31161081]So, just like the PETA with all their claims and protests?[/QUOTE]
well duh
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Lord of Ears;31160139]umm
yes we are
i can say we don't have hands but that wouldn't make it true now would it
the human digestive system is tooled around an omnivorous diet, we can process meat just as well if not better than most vegetables[/QUOTE]
you really think that our body is now immune to any negatives that comes with eating meat?
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;31159704]Shadaez I've agreed with you for the most part in this thread but PETA is a disgrace to animal rights[/QUOTE]
tell me why!
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31163220]you really think that our body is now immune to any negatives that comes with eating meat?[/QUOTE]the only real negative to the meats humans eat is from parasites
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31163220]Okay, I'll backpedal a bit and just say that I'm defending PETA based on the points in the infograph, it's really horrible. I just really don't like when people hate something for bad reasons, or post pure propaganda like that image. PETA does do some good things, they don't always go about it right. I've found a lot of their information to be helpful, like their [URL="http://www.peta.org/living/vegetarian-living/accidentally-vegan.aspx"]Accidentally Vegan[/URL] article, how they give out vegan food so that people try it, and promoting veganism in general. I absolutely hated them before I was vegetarian, but now I don't see what's so bad about it. I feel like they want people to hate them. Of course their celebrity spokespeople are hypocrites, they're just doing it to be viewed as 'green', and PETA is just using them for publicity. (they do everything for publicity)
Why should I hate them? I don't really see it. They make useful resources that I use, and I'd like to support them for that. It's the same thing with some vegans and not liking Silk because it's owned by Dean Foods (a really large dairy company), should I not use Silk because of that? I'd rather support them for their vegan products to let them know a market exists for it.
I'll keep defending kill shelters, it's not ideal, but there's not much else you can do in most situations. In a perfect world, No Kill shelters would be the only type, but there's just way too many reproducing animals to do that, and it's not possible to shelter them all indefinitely. If you can provide some evidence that shows that the millions of pets born each year can be easily adopted out, maybe I'll change my mind.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
well duh
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
you really think that our body is now immune to any negatives that comes with eating meat?[/QUOTE]
it's the same reason why I dislike the sea shepards
if you're going to fight for a valiant cause and then fuck it up with corruption, lies, and overreactions then you're not doing a good thing
on the other hand I don't really care about whaling or animal rights that much but i'll admit it's an issue
[QUOTE=TBFundy;31163316]it's the same reason why I dislike the sea shepards
if you're going to fight for a valiant cause and then fuck it up with corruption, lies, and overreactions then you're not doing a good thing
on the other hand I don't really care about whaling or animal rights that much but i'll admit it's an issue[/QUOTE]
they're awesome
I think I'd really hate the people on the boats, though.
I think I'd hate 99% of vegans, which is horrible.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31163220]Okay, I'll backpedal a bit and just say that I'm defending PETA based on the points in the infograph, it's really horrible.[/quote]
The infograph is fine. You find me something falsified about it, then you'll have a point.
[quote]I just really don't like when people hate something for bad reasons, or post pure propaganda like that image.[/quote]
What the fuck is wrong with you? It's facts, pure fucking facts they are presenting. It's not propaganda you dolt.
[quote]PETA[B] does do some good things[/B], they don't always go about it right.[/quote]
Fucking barley.
[quote]I've found a lot of their information to be helpful, like their [URL="http://www.peta.org/living/vegetarian-living/accidentally-vegan.aspx"]Accidentally Vegan[/URL] article, how they give out vegan food so that people try it, and promoting veganism in general.[/quote]
HEY EVERYONE, try out our really unhealthy diet. All in the name of some stupid fanatical idea that eating meat is somehow wrong, because we only care about cute animal and animals are all vegan, yup, true story.
[quote]I absolutely hated them before I was vegetarian, but now I don't see what's so bad about it.[/quote]
Well, you know, the whole domestic terrorism thing is a big mother fucking problem.
[quote]I feel like they want people to hate them.[/quote]
You need to stop making assumptions.
[quote]Of course their celebrity spokespeople are hypocrites, they're just doing it to be viewed as 'green', and PETA is just using them for publicity. (they do everything for publicity)[/quote]
If they are doing wrong shit for publicity, they are still doing wrong shit, I don't give a flying fuck what for.
[quote]Why should I hate them? I don't really see it.[/quote]
Domesti-fucking-terrorism.
[quote]They make useful resources that I use, and I'd like to support them for that.[/quote]
Other groups will help you deprive yourself of necessary nutrients. You don't need to support PETa.
[quote]It's the same thing with some vegans and not liking Silk because it's owned by Dean Foods (a really large dairy company), should I not use Silk because of that?[/quote]
Dean Foods doesn't give money to Gary Yourofsky or firebomb animal labs.
[quote]I'll keep defending kill shelters, it's not ideal, but there's not much else you can do in most situations. In a perfect world, No Kill shelters would be the only type, but there's just way too many reproducing animals to do that, and it's not possible to shelter them all indefinitely. If you can provide some evidence that shows that the millions of pets born each year can be easily adopted out, maybe I'll change my mind.[/quote]
Want evidence? Walk into an actual fucking shelter. It's not a god damn epidemic, sure, a small portion will need to be killed off, but for the most part, a kill shelter will in a year kill about 1% of what PETA does in their shelter. It's excessive what PETA is doing, and any of my ex-coworkers, and anyone else who has worked even NEAR an animal shelter would agree.
[quote]you really think that our body is now immune to any negatives that comes with eating meat?[/quote]
We're more immune to meat issues than nutrient deficiency that Veganism will plague a person with.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31163376]they're awesome
I think I'd really hate the people on the boats, though.
I think I'd hate 99% of vegans, which is horrible.[/QUOTE]
You don't seem to give a fuck about animal rights, so why exactly are you Vegan? Doing it because all the cool kids are doing it?
I think PETA's the reason a lot of vegetarians/vegans get a lot of hate.
All they really do is bitch, pissing off and annoying a lot of people, in turn causing them to hate most vegetarians and vegans.
[QUOTE=amute;31163802]The infograph is fine. You find me something falsified about it, then you'll have a point.
What the fuck is wrong with you? It's facts, pure fucking facts they are presenting. It's not propaganda you dolt.
Fucking barley.
HEY EVERYONE, try out our really unhealthy diet. All in the name of some stupid fanatical idea that eating meat is somehow wrong, because we only care about cute animal and animals are all vegan, yup, true story.
Well, you know, the whole domestic terrorism thing is a big mother fucking problem.
You need to stop making assumptions.
If they are doing wrong shit for publicity, they are still doing wrong shit, I don't give a flying fuck what for.
Domesti-fucking-terrorism.
Other groups will help you deprive yourself of necessary nutrients. You don't need to support PETa.
Dean Foods doesn't give money to Gary Yourofsky or firebomb animal labs.
Want evidence? Walk into an actual fucking shelter. It's not a god damn epidemic, sure, a small portion will need to be killed off, but for the most part, a kill shelter will in a year kill about 1% of what PETA does in their shelter. It's excessive what PETA is doing, and any of my ex-coworkers, and anyone else who has worked even NEAR an animal shelter would agree.
We're more immune to meat issues than nutrient deficiency that Veganism will plague a person with.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
You don't seem to give a fuck about animal rights, so why exactly are you Vegan? Doing it because all the cool kids are doing it?[/QUOTE]
can you back it up with facts now plz rather than 100% angsty teen opinions
[QUOTE=amute;31163802]The infograph is fine. You find me something falsified about it, then you'll have a point. [/QUOTE]
You don't realize that completely factual information can be presented in a way that is biased in one direction. The graph singles out information to make PETA look bad.
[QUOTE=amute;31163802]
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
You don't seem to give a fuck about animal rights, so why exactly are you Vegan? Doing it because all the cool kids are doing it?[/QUOTE]
I have to ask this question as well, Shadez, especially when you're defending an organization that bleeds hypocrisy. PETA runs around freeing farm animals and protesting at fur fashion shows and zoos, yet they euthanize thousands of animals each year under no specific criteria. They propagate themselves to be all about saving animals, protecting animals, and yet they essentially murder thousands of animals each year. There is no specificity in PETA, they don't say they defend only farm animals, or only testing animals, they defend animals and animal rights, but these animals they kill, for no reason, have as much a right to live as any of the animals they supposedly "free" or "save." They absolutely bleed hypocrisy, and I have absolutely no respect for them at all, saying they stand for something and yet, behind people's backs, doing the very thing they THROW BLOOD AT PEOPLE for. Sure, kill a cat or dog for no good reason, and waste the animal completely, but GOD FORBID a hunter should kill a deer and make a coat out of it, feed his family with the meat, and adorn his wall with decorative antlers, essentially using the whole animal so it doesn't go to waste.
Are you vegan because of the whole food shit? You realize that many jobs would be lost and many farmers and migrant workers would be out of a job if the meat farms suddenly disappeared, right? Think of the amount of farms there has to be to feed the animals, as well as the farms the animals live on, and the companies who make the equipment the farms use. Think of how many jobs are created each year around harvest/slaughter season, and how many jobs are created in the meat packing plants, and how many manufacturing jobs are created to make the tools for the farms. Then there's the people refining the raw minerals and the people mining it. Taking away the farms has huge repercussions on the economy and jobs, if there was no demand, there would have to be mass layoffs and closures across many different industries, affecting tens of thousands of people. The lifestyle we live creates jobs, if we were to suddenly shift off of eating meat, thousands would lose jobs, and with the way the economy is now, they wouldn't be able to find new ones.
Fill entire house with various products that a vegan hates and none they like.
Our bodies were designed by evolution to be OMNIVORES for a fucking reason.
Honestly peta putting down animals is good.
Feral cats are destroying the bird populations and they breed like fucking mice in constant heat while filming a porno.
But does she use vegan toothpaste?
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31164783]can you back it up with facts now plz rather than 100% angsty teen opinions[/QUOTE]
Okay darling, which one are we talking about? I made several statements. Can you be so kind and elaborate?
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;31165081]I have to ask this question as well, Shadez, especially when you're defending an organization that bleeds hypocrisy. PETA runs around freeing farm animals and protesting at fur fashion shows and zoos, yet they euthanize thousands of animals each year under no specific criteria. They propagate themselves to be all about saving animals, protecting animals, and yet they essentially murder thousands of animals each year. There is no specificity in PETA, they don't say they defend only farm animals, or only testing animals, they defend animals and animal rights, but these animals they kill, for no reason, have as much a right to live as any of the animals they supposedly "free" or "save." They absolutely bleed hypocrisy, and I have absolutely no respect for them at all, saying they stand for something and yet, behind people's backs, doing the very thing they THROW BLOOD AT PEOPLE for. Sure, kill a cat or dog for no good reason, and waste the animal completely, but GOD FORBID a hunter should kill a deer and make a coat out of it, feed his family with the meat, and adorn his wall with decorative antlers, essentially using the whole animal so it doesn't go to waste.
Are you vegan because of the whole food shit? You realize that many jobs would be lost and many farmers and migrant workers would be out of a job if the meat farms suddenly disappeared, right? Think of the amount of farms there has to be to feed the animals, as well as the farms the animals live on, and the companies who make the equipment the farms use. Think of how many jobs are created each year around harvest/slaughter season, and how many jobs are created in the meat packing plants, and how many manufacturing jobs are created to make the tools for the farms. Then there's the people refining the raw minerals and the people mining it. Taking away the farms has huge repercussions on the economy and jobs, if there was no demand, there would have to be mass layoffs and closures across many different industries, affecting tens of thousands of people. The lifestyle we live creates jobs, if we were to suddenly shift off of eating meat, thousands would lose jobs, and with the way the economy is now, they wouldn't be able to find new ones.[/QUOTE]
I never said anyone should stop eating meat, and I have no problem with hunting. Just because I feel the best way to deal with the whole overpopulation of pets isn't No Kill shelters and that PETA may be justified in killing 20,000 animals doesn't mean I don't care about animal rights. I don't know why they killed them, and your favourite infograph doesn't mention why, at all, and I don't really care enough to look it up. If they were all beautiful puppies and kittens and they euthenized them infront of a bunch of little girls wanting to adopt them, then sure, that's bad. But they could just have easily had to euthenize 20,000 vicious cancer-ridden legless dogs rescued from a dog fighting ring, then you should understand that it's acceptable.
There is absolutely NO justification for killing almost 90% more animals than MOST kill shelters.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And for the record, you can rehabilitate vicious dogs pulled out of abusive homes, I've seen it, many dogs that have been brought in were from abusive homes, and they were trained to be less fearful. You see, you obviously don't understand how shelters work, so stop fucking making assumptions about things you do not understand.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And I'm not sure why you rated me heart, the darling was sardonic. I think you're a daft fuck who blindly defends terrorists.
[QUOTE=amute;31165373]There is absolutely NO justification for killing almost 90% more animals than MOST kill shelters.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And for the record, you can rehabilitate vicious dogs pulled out of abusive homes, I've seen it, many dogs that have been brought in were from abusive homes, and they were trained to be less fearful. You see, you obviously don't understand how shelters work, so stop fucking making assumptions about things you do not understand.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And I'm not sure why you rated me heart, the darling was sardonic. I think you're a daft fuck who blindly defends terrorists.[/QUOTE]
Most of the time, there's no other solution, pet overpopulation is a pretty big issue.
[QUOTE=amute;31165373]There is absolutely NO justification for killing almost 90% more animals than MOST kill shelters.[/QUOTE]
And THIS is why I can't see why you defend them at all, Shadez. I can't see any reason why PETA would be justified in the slaughter of that many animals, and I can't see how you could support them after this blatant hypocrisy and complete ignorance of the rights of those animals, especially considering what they stand for. It's disgusting to try and selectively promote animal rights, no animal is entitles to any more rights than another, and you can't defend the rights of one without defending the right of the others when you stand for a blanket statement such as "animal rights." Groups who stand only for house pet's rights, or only for farm animal rights are different, they specify, but PETA operates on a blanket statement, and this kind of selective euthanasia is disgusting, considering what they're supposed to stand for.
[QUOTE=amute;31165373]There is absolutely NO justification for killing almost 90% more animals than MOST kill shelters.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And for the record, you can rehabilitate vicious dogs pulled out of abusive homes, I've seen it, many dogs that have been brought in were from abusive homes, and they were trained to be less fearful. You see, you obviously don't understand how shelters work, so stop fucking making assumptions about things you do not understand.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And I'm not sure why you rated me heart, the darling was sardonic. I think you're a daft fuck who blindly defends terrorists.[/QUOTE]
woah now calm down, I'm just saying it IS PETA. It's possible that all the animals that they take in are already dying and suffering because they get them from abusive people, I don't think they run a standard shelter.
and I know that dogs can be rehabilitated, I was just thinking of the most unfit animal I could think of, and highly vicious animals is a qualification for euthanization for at least some shelters.
lol
[QUOTE=Sumap;31165449]Most of the time, there's no other solution, pet overpopulation is a pretty big issue.[/QUOTE]
Not at all, it's a case to case issue. If you have a well rounded animal in a shelter, most of the time, the animal will go out, very quickly. Within days at most.
Animals that are rehabilitated, they fall into the category. Now problem animals, are either rehabilitated, or put down if they're too violent. But this is a very rare case. It's all case to case. Adoption happens in scores on a nearly daily basis. There's a lot more adoption then you make it out to be.
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;31165484]And THIS is why I can't see why you defend them at all, Shadez. I can't see any reason why PETA would be justified in the slaughter of that many animals, and I can't see how you could support them after this blatant hypocrisy and complete ignorance of the rights of those animals, especially considering what they stand for. It's disgusting to try and selectively promote animal rights, no animal is entitles to any more rights than another, and you can't defend the rights of one without defending the right of the others when you stand for a blanket statement such as "animal rights." Groups who stand only for house pet's rights, or only for farm animal rights are different, they specify, but PETA operates on a blanket statement, and this kind of selective euthanasia is disgusting, considering what they're supposed to stand for.[/QUOTE]
okay im just saying we do not know the conditions of the animals taken in and you're just assuming the worst of PETA because you don't like them
like I said earlier, the animals could have been perfectly fit for adoption, or could have been on the brink of dying, I'm just trying to stay neutral about it
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31165495]woah now calm down, I'm just saying it IS PETA. It's possible that all the animals that they take in are already dying and suffering because they get them from abusive people, I don't think they run a standard shelter.
and I know that dogs can be rehabilitated, I was just thinking of the most unfit animal I could think of, and highly vicious animals is a qualification for euthanization for at least some shelters.
lol[/QUOTE]
I'm fine, I just like cursing. You on the other hand are ignorant to something you seem to want to propagate knowing so much about.
Yes, if the dog is too much to handle, euthanasia is the last option. It's rare though.
And I'm still waiting for you to tell me what exactly you need a source on.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Shadaez;31165521]okay im just saying we do not know the conditions of the animals taken in and you're just assuming the worst of PETA because you don't like them
like I said earlier, the animals could have been perfectly fit for adoption, or could have been on the brink of dying, I'm just trying to stay neutral about it[/QUOTE]
What PETA does is, they take in animals, healthy or problematic, and try to adopt them out, they give them a short period of time, if no, they kill them. They rarely rehabilitate.
I knew a woman who brought her pitbull to a PETA shelter in New York, they killed the dog a week later. The dog was next to fine. If I recall, Penn And Teller did a pretty big thin on PETA, and lots of people said they kill animals needlessly. This isn't a secret, it's well known. The sheer volume of anecdotal evidence you can pull out is absolutely massive.
[url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/What-is-PETAs-position-on-euthanasia.aspx[/url]
No, they just slaughter pets. Yes, they think it's due to overpopulation, but considering their mission statement;
[quote=PETA's website]PETA focuses its attention on the four areas in which the largest numbers of animals suffer the most intensely for the longest periods of time: on factory farms, in the clothing trade, in laboratories, and in the entertainment industry. We also work on a variety of other issues, including the cruel killing of beavers, birds, and other "pests" [B]as well as cruelty to domesticated animals. [/B][/quote]
I can't think of a more cruel thing to do than arbitrarily kill an animal. I despise them for this because of what they stand for. There may be an overpopulation issue, but an animal rights group should not be the ones killing them, that's blatant hypocrisy and completely against their core ideals.
[QUOTE=Tacosheller;31057685]I'd leave her a note back:
Dear BLANK,
Fuck you.[/QUOTE]
Do it OP
[url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Does-PETA-advocate-spaying-and-neutering-of-companion-animals.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Is-it-OK-to-declaw-cats.aspx[/url]
So no, don't you dare touch the tips of your likely housecat's claws, but go rip it's genitals out, that's perfectly okay.
This kind of hypocrisy is why I have no respect for PETA and can't believe why people could possibly follow them.
[QUOTE=amute;31165537]I'm fine, I just like cursing. You on the other hand are ignorant to something you seem to want to propagate knowing so much about.
Yes, if the dog is too much to handle, euthanasia is the last option. It's rare though.
And I'm still waiting for you to tell me what exactly you need a source on.[/QUOTE]
4 million pets are euthanized in the US each year. It's not rare at all, something like 40% of pets adopted by shelters are euthanized.
Do you think shelters can just handle 4 million more pets or something.
[editline]16th July 2011[/editline]
And I'd like to make it clear that Shadaez isn't blindly defending PETA on everything they do. He's just saying that that graph is biased and we don't know why they euthanize 20,000 pets a year. Everybody knows PETA is stupid.
Spay and Neuter your animals and we wouldn't have to kill so many. Dumbasses.
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;31165688][url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Does-PETA-advocate-spaying-and-neutering-of-companion-animals.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Is-it-OK-to-declaw-cats.aspx[/url]
So no, don't you dare touch the tips of your likely housecat's claws, but go rip it's genitals out, that's perfectly okay.
This kind of hypocrisy is why I have no respect for PETA and can't believe why people could possibly follow them.[/QUOTE]
lol so you don't want them to die but you don't want them to be neutered, either? So you think there should just be hundreds of millions of cats and dogs just freely breeding?
maybe we should sit them down and teach them that abstinence is the way to go!
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;31165688][url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Does-PETA-advocate-spaying-and-neutering-of-companion-animals.aspx[/url]
[url]http://www.peta.org/about/faq/Is-it-OK-to-declaw-cats.aspx[/url]
So no, don't you dare touch the tips of your likely housecat's claws, but go rip it's genitals out, that's perfectly okay.
This kind of hypocrisy is why I have no respect for PETA and can't believe why people could possibly follow them.[/QUOTE]
I think their logic is that neutering is a "necessary evil"
I would think a bit more highly of PETA if they spent less of their cash on ads, and more on it the things they preach, like neutering.
[QUOTE=Darkebrz;31165691]4 million pets are euthanized in the US each year. It's not rare at all, something like 40% of pets adopted by shelters are euthanized.[/quote]
Depends on where you get your statistics. Pets euthanised as in people bring their animals to the shelter to have them put down? Most are due to sickness and old age, if not all.
[quote]Do you think shelters can just handle 4 million more pets or something.[/quote]
If the statistics are for owner surrenders and/or rescues, then that pales in comparison to the amount brought in per day on average.
[quote]And I'd like to make it clear that Shadaez isn't blindly defending PETA on everything they do. He's just saying that that graph is biased and we don't know why they euthanize 20,000 pets a year. Everybody knows PETA is stupid.[/QUOTE]
The graph is pointing out a fact, the fact that is against PETA, of course it's 'bias'.
4 million are killed by shelters.
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