JonTron Megathread: The Most Retarded Thread on Facepunch - General

[QUOTE=Alxnotorious;51739415]Yeah, had to unsub from him because I already have this site for getting my daily dose of idiots. [editline]28th January 2017[/editline] And by idiots I mean shitposters.[/QUOTE] You unsubbed from him because of personal opinions (which besides one or two being a little uninformed arent really that uncommon) completely unrelated to his youtube channel?

[QUOTE=Tudd;51739396]Why is it not worth having a conversation with Sargon?[/QUOTE] Feel free to call me biased, but having listened to a lot of Sargon during GamerGate, I noticed that he argues rather poorly and tends to misinterpret evidence. He also reminds me of when I was way too into ethics in video game journalism, and got dangerously close to turning /pol/lack.

[QUOTE=Alxnotorious;51739415]Yeah, had to unsub from him because I already have this site for getting my daily dose of idiots. [editline]28th January 2017[/editline] And by idiots I mean shitposters.[/QUOTE] Yeah for real. Really hated how he felt the need to rant about politics and women rights in his Christmas with the Kranks video. Oh wait. That doesn't happen.

:snip: wrong thread

[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;51739435]Feel free to call me biased, but having listened to a lot of Sargon during GamerGate, I noticed that he argues rather poorly and tends to misinterpret evidence. He also reminds me of when I was way too into ethics in video game journalism, and got dangerously close to turning /pol/lack.[/QUOTE] Can you give some specific examples? Even if i agree with the point he's trying to make, sometimes his arguments are occasionally unsubstantiated. But i find he's usually on point. I'd really like to hear some specifics on what you object to But surely the entire [I]point[/I] of conversation and sharing of viewpoints is to improve everyone's ideas, understandings and arguments. To say that "he argues rather poorly and tends to misinterpret evidence" means nobody should talk to him or that having unrefined arguments is good grounds to unperson someone is a really pernicious attitude. And the only alternative function to conversation is just to masturbate your own ideas through mutual affirmation, which is both pointless and tends to distort opinions in ways that don't accurately represent reality. And that's a bad habit to form

Im fine with Jon having his own opinions considering none of them are unacceptable; he never makes his videos super political so I think its cool.

[QUOTE=Purple Gecko;51740053]Im fine with Jon having his own opinions considering none of them are unacceptable; he never makes his videos super political so I think its cool.[/QUOTE] I haven't kept up with all the drama lately so I was asking a friend about it all. He made a good point of a concept called 'death of the artist' (rather, [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_the_Author]of the author[/url]). tl;dr, you don't let unrelated knowledge of the author's personal life muddle your enjoyment of the content they make (within reason; sometimes this obviously gives insight into the motivation in their writing, like when things get super political). His example was H.G. Wells, obviously a well known and respected writer, but apparently he was also a prolifically racist asshole who cheated on his wife. Shouldn't change your enjoyment of war of the worlds or the time machine, but it's not like it isn't still acceptable for you to talk about who the author was in his personal life

Problem with that is, Jon isn't a prolifically racist asshole, in fact he's not even all that offensive, he just has some differing views and from what I've seen they aren't necessarily bad. Like it's honestly sort of weird that some people are getting up in his grill, he's always been very level headed in his views, unless something has changed recently, it's like him talking with Sargon or whatever his name is has suddenly changed him into a Right Wing Nazi in peoples eyes, it's odd as fuck behavior from people, especially PBG, that sort of shit is just not on.

[QUOTE=Thlis;51739352]Could be a lot worse, he could be acting like Jesse Cox and just dismissing people's arguments based on follower counts.[/QUOTE] And if I remember right, Jesse made this tweet [IMG]http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/JesseCox.png[/IMG] Hope he enjoyed that boner he got from mocking a 10 year old kid, jesus christ.

Twitter turns even the nicest people and yes, Jessie Cox is a very nice person, despite what you see there, into assholes, news at eleven. [editline]edit[/editline] Seriously, it's like a weird phenomenon I've encountered with Twitter, it's like it really brings out the worst in you. [editline]edit[/editline] Perhaps it's the limited amount of words you have to get your point across that effects people so badly, I'm really not sure, or perhaps the fact that it can become a bit of an eco-chamber in which you can block all opposing opinions, a lot like Tumblr, except dumber because of the word limit, but I dunno, it just feels like there is this specific thing that Twitter does to people. Like I feel crazy pointing it out, but it really does come across like that.

[QUOTE=Alxnotorious;51739415]Yeah, had to unsub from him because I already have this site for getting my daily dose of idiots. [editline]28th January 2017[/editline] And by idiots I mean shitposters.[/QUOTE] Never really understood what people think this kind of thing accomplishes. Like, enable adblock if you feel it's important to you, but don't just block out his work because he said something you think is stupid (and I think is somewhat stupid for the record). H.P. Lovecraft was a real dickhead, but that doesn't mean his books are without value. Not to mention we now live in an age where we are actually in a position to reason with artists that we disagree with, so in the off chance Jontron does start making "Feminism sucks pt1" you can respond and explain to him why you think he's wrong. Heck you could easily respond to the things he's been saying on twitter. And even he doesn't listen, he has an entire audience of people that might. Blocking someone is one of the least effective ways of countering ignorance.

I think Jon's opinions are pretty fucking dumb but that's not gonna stop me from enjoying his content which is completely unrelated to his political stance and which I love. Until he starts messing up and mixing the two I'll stay subbed and not give a damn.

[QUOTE=Limed00d;51740151]I think Jon's opinions are pretty fucking dumb but that's not gonna stop me from enjoying his content which is completely unrelated to his political stance and which I love. Until he starts messing up and mixing the two I'll stay subbed and not give a damn.[/QUOTE] But like, what opinions of his are dumb, could someone explain. [editline]edit[/editline] Because all I'm getting from this is that he talked to this Sargon fellow and that's [I]bad[/I] apparently.

[QUOTE=jonu67;51740126]Twitter turns even the nicest people and yes, Jessie Cox is a very nice person, despite what you see there, into assholes, news at eleven. [editline]edit[/editline] Seriously, it's like a weird phenomenon I've encountered with Twitter, it's like it really brings out the worst in you. [editline]edit[/editline] Perhaps it's the limited amount of words you have to get your point across that effects people so badly, I'm really not sure, or perhaps the fact that it can become a bit of an eco-chamber in which you can block all opposing opinions, a lot like Tumblr, except dumber because of the word limit, but I dunno, it just feels like there is this specific thing that Twitter does to people. Like I feel crazy pointing it out, but it really does come across like that.[/QUOTE] In my honest opinion Twitter is just as much an echo chamber as Tumblr, if not worse.

[QUOTE=jonu67;51740154]But like, what opinions of his are dumb, could someone explain. [editline]edit[/editline] Because all I'm getting from this is that he talked to this Sargon fellow and that's [I]bad[/I] apparently.[/QUOTE] [thumb]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3Oo59lUMAAJuB7.jpg[/thumb] dunno if thats an actual quote but if it is i'd agree that's a pretty shitty thing to say.

[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;51739377]Honestly, the only really objectionable thing about Jon I've seen on that stream is that he feels Sargon is worth having a conversation with.[/QUOTE] Thats a pretty mean thing to say. Sargon is just not a person now and no one should talk to him? I think Jon can talk to whoever the hell he wants, but thats just me.

[QUOTE=elowin;51740190][thumb]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C3Oo59lUMAAJuB7.jpg[/thumb] dunno if thats an actual quote but if it is i'd agree that's a pretty shitty thing to say.[/QUOTE] I can sort of understand what he might be trying to say though, despite it being a tad uncomfortable and a very simple outlook on a very complicated problem, like, people can't stay in a country that's torn up by war, because they very much might die, but Jon might think that perhaps the country won't get better if people leave the country, it's only going to get worse and while that might be an extremely simplified way of thinking about a very multifaceted problem, I really don't think he meant any malice by it. Though apparently he wants to get into these topics a bit more, flesh his opinions out, so I'll wait for that before I make any sort of judgement, even then it would be one opinion that I disagree with out of many that I agree with, but, hell, I've watched bits and pieces of that livestream and his opinions seem very level headed, I really don't see the problems people have with him now, despite the fact that he's apparently associating himself with someone who people seem to disagree with, I mean people are calling him a SEXIST PIG, Racist double crossing nazi for having pretty balanced views on certain heavy topics and even seems mature enough to want to talk about them instead of acting like PBG and trying to completely dissociate with Jontron over one mixed opinion, or like some of his supposed viewer base who are straight up unsubscribing because they caught wind that he was a nazi now apparently. Of which most of them probably didn't even gave enough of a crap to look shit up for themselves and instead turned on him because he was talking to what I hear is the Big Bad right leaning Sargon in certain circles, whomever this Sargon is, he really didn't seem all that bad when talking to Jontron, like I said before, a lot of, if not most of his views are very VERY level headed and he's as left leaning in his political stance as the best of us, but people are turning on him for one or two bad, perhaps misspoken or not as in depth as he would have liked or straight up taken the wrong way opinions. Which to me is ridiculous.

people have idealized jontron for so long its almost a tragedy.

What is it with politics? There are certain topics you don't just randomly bring to the dinner table, aka. your [I]public[/I] profile.

[QUOTE=Talvy;51740380]What is it with politics? There are certain topics you don't just randomly bring to the dinner table, aka. your [I]public[/I] profile.[/QUOTE] Jon's been getting seemingly more and more frustrated with the idea of political correctness for years now, if I recall ever since he originally tweeted about how he thought the idea of PC was silly and some people jumped on him.

[QUOTE=Oizen;51740209]Thats a pretty mean thing to say. Sargon is just not a person now and no one should talk to him? I think Jon can talk to whoever the hell he wants, but thats just me.[/QUOTE] there's a difference between considering someone worthy of conversation as a human being, and worthy of being spotlighted by a prominent youtuber. i'm going to assume he meant the latter

I've just started listening to the stream (the part where Jon signs on), but so far I can't really see what's so awful about Jon going onto Sargon's stream? It's a long stream, but does anyone have any time stamps where Jon says something crazy? Because so far I'm just kinda confused by the backlash.

[QUOTE=jonu67;51740237]I can sort of understand what he might be trying to say though, despite it being a tad uncomfortable and a very simple outlook on a very complicated problem, like, people can't stay in a country that's torn up by war, because they very much might die, but Jon might think that perhaps the country won't get better if people leave the country, it's only going to get worse and while that might be an extremely simplified way of thinking about a very multifaceted problem, I really don't think he meant any malice by it. Though apparently he wants to get into these topics a bit more, flesh his opinions out, so I'll wait for that before I make any sort of judgement, even then it would be one opinion that I disagree with out of many that I agree with, but, hell, I've watched bits and pieces of that livestream and his opinions seem very level headed, I really don't see the problems people have with him now, despite the fact that he's apparently associating himself with someone who people seem to disagree with, I mean people are calling him a SEXIST PIG, Racist double crossing nazi for having pretty balanced views on certain heavy topics and even seems mature enough to want to talk about them instead of acting like PBG and trying to completely dissociate with Jontron over one mixed opinion, or like some of his supposed viewer base who are straight up unsubscribing because they caught wind that he was a nazi now apparently. Of which most of them probably didn't even gave enough of a crap to look shit up for themselves and instead turned on him because he was talking to what I hear is the Big Bad right leaning Sargon in certain circles, whomever this Sargon is, he really didn't seem all that bad when talking to Jontron, like I said before, a lot of, if not most of his views are very VERY level headed and he's as left leaning in his political stance as the best of us, but people are turning on him for one or two bad, perhaps misspoken or not as in depth as he would have liked or straight up taken the wrong way opinions. Which to me is ridiculous.[/QUOTE] I don't know what the context behind that quote is or if it's even real, and honestly don't care nearly enough about this shit to watch a 5 hour long stream of a funny video maker talking to a pretentious vlogger.

I think it's crazy how we're living in this world where you can get lynched for literally saying [I]"If you have different opinions, that's totally fine. But be nice about it. Don't attack each other, sit down and talk it out. Have a conversation."[/I] That's been Jon's overall stance on this. Honestly, I don't care what political views someone has. I'm just not a very political person. But Jon has been incredibly nice, and he's easily one of the most reasonable people I've seen talking about this kind of stuff. I feel like we should be reminded that Jon getting harassed didn't actually start over current political views, it started over him saying that it's frightening how people can be so fine with physically beating the shit out of someone for having different views, and how all these people, who are most definitely, not in fact, [I]"Nazis"[/I], are being labeled as such, and such label is being used as an excuse to gang up on them and beat the shit out of them.

[QUOTE=The Civ;51740831]I think it's crazy how we're living in this world where you can get lynched for literally saying [I]"If you have different opinions, that's totally fine. But be nice about it. Don't attack each other, sit down and talk it out. Have a conversation."[/I] That's been Jon's overall stance on this. Honestly, I don't care what political views someone has. I'm just not a very political person. But Jon has been incredibly nice, and he's easily one of the most reasonable people I've seen talking about this kind of stuff. I feel like we should be reminded that Jon getting harassed didn't actually start over current political views, it started over him saying that it's frightening how people can be so fine with physically beating the shit out of someone for having different views, and how all these people, who are most definitely, not in fact, [I]"Nazis"[/I], are being labeled as such, and such label is being used as an excuse to gang up on them and beat the shit out of them.[/QUOTE] Right, like at the moment I'm about an hour and a half in, and all Jon is saying so far is that we need to be able to have discussions. Immediately jumping up and slapping labels on everyone is not going to help anything. I was expecting a much bigger shit show based on the comments I've read but so far it's all fairly reasonable discussion. Maybe it's because I expected worse that in contrast this seems pretty tame?

Chill, guys. Jon's opinions don't affect anything. He's just a guy on the internet, talking to his friends. Why give a shit? Politics isn't everything.

"oh must be a new jontron lots of posts" nope just arguing

[QUOTE=Elv02;51740847]Right, like at the moment I'm about an hour and a half in, and all Jon is saying so far is that we need to be able to have discussions. Immediately jumping up and slapping labels on everyone is not going to help anything. I was expecting a much bigger shit show based on the comments I've read but so far it's all fairly reasonable discussion. Maybe it's because I expected worse that in contrast this seems pretty tame?[/QUOTE] No, like I said, he's extremely level headed throughout the stream and is very moderate in his views, just as any left leaning person should be but apparently that's not good enough anymore. Apparently that's grounds to be branded as a racist nazi.

I still can't believe how quickly PBG burned bridges with so many YouTubers at once, and tarnished his rep for like, half of his fanbase in just a few posts. He totally refuses to even properly address it. He just keeps trying to change subject with jokes now, and he just gets pissy when someone calls him out for not explaining himself. Dude's gone off the deep end.

[QUOTE=Mkt778;51740921]2:16:33 in Where the fuck is any of that?[/QUOTE] About 2:00:00 in myself, and yeah, I get the feeling that image is a load of bull. Which I'm glad to say, but at the same time, what is the point? Did whoever created that think people weren't going to listen to the stream because of how long it is or something?